Official 2022 NBA Draft thread

[bluebellmaniac]

Why are we spending so much time on prognosticating the FRP?

We all know the meltdown is going to happen over who we select in the second round.

[BatManu20]

Tari Eason a total non-factor vs Arkansas so far today after playing well against Ole Miss last night. He’s 1/6 for 2 pts halfway through the 2nd half.



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[BatManu20]

Think the Spurs will seriously consider him in that 8-12 range in the draft if that’s where they end up, despite his inconsistencies.

[PhantomDashCam]

Think the Spurs will seriously consider him in that 8-12 range in the draft if that’s where they end up, despite his inconsistencies.

There’s a chance he still goes in the late teens, which I think would be terrific value. I’m not sure the Spurs though, would be interested if they have to use a pick that high on a guy who’s motor reportedly fluctuates as much as his does considering his likely role, initially coming into the NBA.

[Mr. Body]

In a normal draft, Eason seems like a #20-30 pick to me. Does anyone know why he comes off the bench? Is it a Manu thing, or is he really not who they want to start?

[emanueldavidginobili]

1502370697234026502

26-8-2-1-1, his stock is going to rise by the time the draft comes around.

[tonight...you]

There’s a chance he still goes in the late teens, which I think would be terrific value. I’m not sure the Spurs though, would be interested if they have to use a pick that high on a guy who’s motor reportedly fluctuates as much as his does considering his likely role, initially coming into the NBA.
All of a sudden I'm seeing a situation where they keep their first first pick and then trade both last 1st round two picks for something a bit higher to get a guy that intrigues them.

[BackHome]

The problem is were not going to be able to move up that much and most teams won't do a trade with us

[mystargtr34]

I don't get the hype for AJ Griffin. He can barely dribble and he's incredibly slow on defense. Is it because he plays for Duke? I get that he has an exceptional shot so far, but he's often getting ranked top of Tier 2 in many lists. He may be unplayable as a starter.

I’ve been really underwhelmed aswell. Looks like he has concrete feet on defense. Also looks like he’s gonna have a really below average standing reach for this height. Dudes neck is about a foot long. Poor rebounder too, at least from the advanced stats point of view.

[PhantomDashCam]

All of a sudden I'm seeing a situation where they keep their first first pick and then trade both last 1st round two picks for something a bit higher to get a guy that intrigues them.

Yeah I could see that. Hopefully that Rap’s pick conveys…

[mystargtr34]

As of right now I have the draft order something like the below, it will obviously depend on which teams are picking where. I think Tier 3 can be fluid depending on draft order. Chet and Jabari seem locks to go 1 and 2. I could see the Thunder or Rocket picking someone like AJ Griffin above Jaden Ivey given they are both set at the guard position.

Tier 1
Chet
Jabari

Tier 2
Banchero
Ivey

Tier 3
AJ Griffin
Keegan Murray
Shaedon Sharpe
Jalen Duren
Johnny Davis
Ben Mathurin

Tier 4
TyTy Washington
Dyson Daniels
Tari Eason
Ochai Agbaji
EJ Liddell
Marjon Beauchamp
Kendall Brown
Nikola Jovic
Jeremy Sochan
Malaki Branham

I think Murray will be in Tier 2 on a lot of NBA teams draft boards soon. He's already at the top of Tier 3 imo. He might even go 3rd behind Jabari and Chet.

The other problem is the teams that will likely pick in the 4-8 range all have needs for an athletic 4 who can also play some 3. Houston, Orlando and Detroit could all pick him 3rd imo. None of those teams have long term prospects at the 4 spot. Indiana and OKC also don't. Sacramento looks like they see Sabonis as a 5 long term, but they may take a more traditional wing over Murray if they see Sabonis as a 4. Portland literally has no prospects at the 4 spot.

Might be best for Spurs if Iowa gets eliminated early in the tournament lol.

[mo7888]

I think Murray will be in Tier 2 on a lot of NBA teams draft boards soon. He's already at the top of Tier 3 imo. He might even go 3rd behind Jabari and Chet.

The other problem is the teams that will likely pick in the 4-8 range all have needs for an athletic 4 who can also play some 3. Houston, Orlando and Detroit could all pick him 3rd imo. None of those teams have long term prospects at the 4 spot. Indiana and OKC also don't. Sacramento looks like they see Sabonis as a 5 long term, but they may take a more traditional wing over Murray if they see Sabonis as a 4. Portland literally has no prospects at the 4 spot.

Might be best for Spurs if Iowa gets eliminated early in the tournament lol.

I think his age will keep him from reaching the top 4.... 5 is probably his ceiling but more than likely he goes 5-7.... I know he looks great right now but age is a big deal at the top of the draft..

[PhantomDashCam]

I think Murray will be in Tier 2 on a lot of NBA teams draft boards soon. He's already at the top of Tier 3 imo. He might even go 3rd behind Jabari and Chet.

The other problem is the teams that will likely pick in the 4-8 range all have needs for an athletic 4 who can also play some 3. Houston, Orlando and Detroit could all pick him 3rd imo. None of those teams have long term prospects at the 4 spot. Indiana and OKC also don't. Sacramento looks like they see Sabonis as a 5 long term, but they may take a more traditional wing over Murray if they see Sabonis as a 4. Portland literally has no prospects at the 4 spot.

Might be best for Spurs if Iowa gets eliminated early in the tournament lol.

Schmitty obviously one of the best in the business but rarely throws around the ‘no fail’ label. High praise…

1499898118636113922

[BatManu20]

Spurs fall from 7th to 8th in the lottery with tonight’s win, and are only one game up on the Pelicans now. Only 2 games up on the tanking Knicks who lost tonight as well.

[Robz4000]

Spurs will take someone we've never heard of or expected that's two years away from being two years away tbh.

[duncan2150]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2nnPghOZak

Big perfomance from Duren 21 PTS 20 RBS 2 AST 2 STL 2 BLOCKS, he starts to shoot . The body is huge for a 18 yrs old kid ( he'll not be 19 when the season starts).

[mo7888]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g2nnPghOZak

Big perfomance from Duren 21 PTS 20 RBS 2 AST 2 STL 2 BLOCKS, he starts to shoot . The body is huge for a 18 yrs old kid ( he'll not be 19 when the season starts).

If we are in the 8-11 range he could be the BPA left on the board..

[Uriel]

Which player in the draft would be the best fit for our current roster? Smith? Holmgren? Banchero?

[BatManu20]

Which player in the draft would be the best fit for our current roster? Smith? Holmgren? Banchero?

Doesn't matter. Spurs won’t have a shot at any of those guys.

[Russ]

Which player in the draft would be the best fit for our current roster? Smith? Holmgren? Banchero?

Yes.

[BatManu20]

Keegan Murray with another monster performance today. He’s not gonna be available when we select either.

32/9/3, including 8/10 from 3, in a buzzer-beating win over Indiana.


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[BatManu20]

1502738408506019843

[emanueldavidginobili]

Keegan Murray might go top 5 by draft day if he keeps this up.

[mo7888]

Which player in the draft would be the best fit for our current roster? Smith? Holmgren? Banchero?

I'd say Smith, then Chet, then Banchero....if we can get the ping pongs balls to go our way...

[mo7888]

Keegan Murray might go top 5 by draft day if he keeps this up.

I believe he can go #5 as well...i think 5-8 is his range...

I asl think there's a pretty big drop off after pick #8....

My top 8 are Smith, Chet, Banchero, Ivey, Sharpe, Murray, Duren, and Griffin ...in that order..

[exstatic]

Keegan Murray might go top 5 by draft day if he keeps this up.

The one thing working against him is that he will be very close to 22 on draft night. The history of 22 and lottery crossover isn’t good. He’s also only a sophomore. We got two years of college experience from 19 YO Devin Vassell 2 years ago. What folks need to keep in mind is that a more finished product has less room for growth and improvement. If his physical profile isn’t eye popping, he’ll probably stay where he is.

[mo7888]

Another thing to keep in mind is that are a few teams that 'could' trade their picks in the top 10....

Indiana- is Carlise going to want a protracted rebuild or would he trade that pick for a player that can play between Haliburton and Turner next year?

Portland- if they keep Dame then they are probably trading the pick for more immediate help...if they trade him they keep the pick..

Sacramento- the Sabonis trade was a win now move in their minds...they badly want to make the playoffs and a 5-8 pick won't help there...Something like Josh + our 2nd 1st might get us their pick.

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/NBADraftWass/status/1502741674132398081

[Mr. Body]

The one thing working against him is that he will be very close to 22 on draft night. The history of 22 and lottery crossover isn’t good. He’s also only a sophomore. We got two years of college experience from 19 YO Devin Vassell 2 years ago. What folks need to keep in mind is that a more finished product has less room for growth and improvement. If his physical profile isn’t eye popping, he’ll probably stay where he is.

You keep saying this but it's not true.

[Mr. Body]

1. Watch out for Iowa in your brackets. They're playing well down stretches of games.

2. As for who Iowa just beat, Indiana... Trayce Jackson-Davis may not even get drafted -- he has no jumpshot -- but he's worth a look at some point. He's very athletic and a great weakside shot blocker. If he develops a J, he's an NBA player at least off the bench.

[duncan2150]

You keep saying this but it's not true.

they are so little example of 22 yrs old in the lottery that we can't make a generality. I have Mitchell, Duarte last year, Toppin in 2020, Cam Johnson and Hachimura ( 21) in 2019, Kennard (21) in 2017. They were all late lottery and they don't dominate like Murray in College imo ( toppin maybe but in a weak division).

The other thing for Murray is that it's only his second year of NCAA and he made a massive improvement from yr 1 to 2, still i think it's maybe too high to take him at 5 but 9 or 10 he could be a really good.

[exstatic]

You keep saying this but it's not true.

Give me a list of the successful one and done era lottery picks that were 22. I’ll go first with the busts.

2006
Ike Diogo
2007
Al Thornton
Acie Law
2008
Joe Alexander
2009
Hasheem Thabeet
2010
Ekpe Udoh
Wesley Johnson
2011
JIMMER
2012
John Henson
2013
MCW
2014
None
2015
None
2016
Kris Dunn
Taurean Prince
Denzel Valentine
2017
Malik Monk

It got harder to find them as time went on, because TEAMS STOPPED DRAFTING THEM.

Now, you put together your list of really good 22+ YO lottery picks in the one and done era, 2006 to present.

[Mr. Body]

Give me a list of the successful one and done era lottery picks that were 22. I’ll go first with the busts.

2006
Ike Diogo
2007
Al Thornton
Acie Law
2008
Joe Alexander
2009
Hasheem Thabeet
2010
Ekpe Udoh
Wesley Johnson
2011
JIMMER
2012
John Henson
2013
MCW
2014
None
2015
None
2016
Kris Dunn
Taurean Prince
Denzel Valentine
2017
Malik Monk

It got harder to find them as time went on, because TEAMS STOPPED DRAFTING THEM.

Now, you put together your list of really good 22+ YO lottery picks in the one and done era, 2006 to present.

You said the history of the draft, which is hilariously wrong.

And none of this shit has to do with Keegan Murray as a player.

[Mr. Body]

Chris Duarte was 24 when was picked last year in the lottery and he's good.

Derrick White should have been a lottery pick. There are a number of older players who weren't lottery picks that should hav been.

Basically, this is wrong thinking on your part. There's such a lousy sample size that it confuses what you're actually looking at. First, you got to realize most lottery picks turn out to be shit. Then you've got to realize a number of older players are good in this league, and should have been lottery picks.

The next step is questioning what teams are actually doing with their picks in the lottery. The fact that some seniors have been picked in that range and haven't been great isn't necessarily a sign of anything. It definitely doesn't mean anything about whetherh Keegan Murray will be good or not.

[exstatic]

You said the history of the draft, which is hilariously wrong.

And none of this shit has to do with Keegan Murray as a player.

We live and breathe in the one and done era. Bringing up players from the 80s or 90s isn’t germaine to current or recent drafts. So, you’ve got nothing, then…

If we’re looking at 22YO PFs, I’m on team Jalen Smith. He’s 2” taller, has a 3.25” wider span, and is killing it with Indy, shooting 68% from 2 and 42% from 3 in 11 games with Indy. Those are numbers in the NBA.

[PhantomDashCam]

I didn’t know Keegan was capable of that kind of volume, 3 point shooting. :wow Just absurd play with this guy.

In an age of drafts dominated by Guard selections, genuinely refreshing to see 4 legit FC players potentially picked in the top 5 or 6…

[PhantomDashCam]

I believe he can go #5 as well...i think 5-8 is his range...

I asl think there's a pretty big drop off after pick #8....

My top 8 are Smith, Chet, Banchero, Ivey, Sharpe, Murray, Duren, and Griffin ...in that order..

Griffin will be an interesting one to watch on draft day. I’ve read that teams are very interested in seeing his medical due to the litany of injuries for such a young player through his career to date…
I like the list though. :tu

[RC_Drunkford]

would love to get Keegan Murray. Basically the perfect role player we need at the 4. He just doesn't have much iso scoring potential, but you never know

[rankingtear]

Keegan looked better for a translation stand point in that Indiana game. More threes off different actions, played more like an NBA 4 than a college 5.

[BackHome]

I like Murray but let’s realistic he is 6’8 PF he is not going to be able to do a lot of what he does in the NBA still like him but not a top 6 for me.

[mystargtr34]

I like Murray but let’s realistic he is 6’8 PF he is not going to be able to do a lot of what he does in the NBA still like him but not a top 6 for me.

Very few teams in the modern NBA have the old traditional 4's who are 6'10 or 6'11 and play in the post that would render a 6'8 PF like Murray undersized. Besides, most 4's shoot threes and drive to the rim, as opposed to playing in the post. Murray's game would cause problems for a lot of the bigger 4's due to his ability to space the floor and drive to the basket.

[Mr. Body]

I don't think Murray is a top option in the NBA, but he'll be a Malcolm Brogdan type who just gets shit done.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Most of you don't like to talk about second rounders, but... Johnny Juzang. Just do it.

[Thomas82]

If we are in the 8-11 range he could be the BPA left on the board..

I would love it!!

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

My top 8 are Smith, Chet, Banchero, Ivey, Sharpe, Murray, Duren, and Griffin ...in that order..

Good list. I'd add Johnny Davis and probably remove Duren. Don't see him as more than a rim running big, say someone like Richaun Holmes. Not great value imo. If he's taken in the 14-20 range where the Spurs second first projects to be then it'd be fine but I suppose some team like Portland will reach for him earlier.

I'm also somewhat skeptical of Griffin as well. He has a long injury history and seems quite stiff athletically or more like no functional athleticism, although this might be cause of Duke's poor spacing due to playing Banchero and Williams clogging the paint all the time. He also has a good % from 3 but has a weird, wide frame when shooting it. I think there will be teams higher on Mathurin than Griffin.

[exstatic]

Good list. I'd add Johnny Davis and probably remove Duren. Don't see him as more than a rim running big, say someone like Richaun Holmes. Not great value imo. If he's taken in the 14-20 range where the Spurs second first projects to be then it'd be fine but I suppose some team like Portland will reach for him earlier.

I'm also somewhat skeptical of Griffin as well. He has a long injury history and seems quite stiff athletically or more like no functional athleticism, although this might be cause of Duke's poor spacing due to playing Banchero and Williams clogging the paint all the time. He also has a good % from 3 but has a weird, wide frame when shooting it. I think there will be teams higher on Mathurin than Griffin.

Duren is almost as young as Primo was last year, about 1 month older. He a freakish athlete with great defensive instincts. I’m glad he hasn’t shown a lot yet. He might still be there if we pick 9-10. The Stepien has an article on various types of rim protectors that may interest some of you, and Duren is mentioned in several categories.

[CGD]

Another thing to keep in mind is that are a few teams that 'could' trade their picks in the top 10....

Indiana- is Carlise going to want a protracted rebuild or would he trade that pick for a player that can play between Haliburton and Turner next year?

Portland- if they keep Dame then they are probably trading the pick for more immediate help...if they trade him they keep the pick..

Sacramento- the Sabonis trade was a win now move in their minds...they badly want to make the playoffs and a 5-8 pick won't help there...Something like Josh + our 2nd 1st might get us their pick.

Of those, i only really think Portland is in play since they own the NOLA pick. That would give them potentially 2 top ten picks to play with.

I could maybe see it with Indy, but can also see them targeting Kegan Murray. Like Duarte, an older, plug and play rookie that would fit perfect with Halliburton, Duarte, and Turner.

[R. DeMurre]

If Obi Toppin and Chris Duarte are examples of older draft lottery "successes," then the bar is being set pretty low. Toppin plays 15 mpg for a terrible Knicks team whose starting PF is having a terrible year. Duarte, after a relatively strong start, has leveled off as a slightly net negative impact player on a weak 23-45 Indiana team. Both guys might improve a little over their current showings, and outliers always exist, but I don't think either guy is a very good example of why drafting older players makes sense generally.

[jjspur]

would love to get Keegan Murray. Basically the perfect role player we need at the 4. He just doesn't have much iso scoring potential, but you never know
Totally agree. We probably won't get in the top 5 (odds are against us), so Murray would be be a pretty good pick. I'm just not so confident that the spurs would select him since they tend to pick more for potential than actual talent. Sometimes that strategy works but more often than no it doesn't.

[BatManu20]

Most of you don't like to talk about second rounders, but... Johnny Juzang. Just do it.

Juzang should’ve gone pro after last season. He was a projected mid-1st round pick, maybe mid-20’s at the latest. He came back this season and absolutely tanked his draft stock. Now he’s a mid-to-late 2nd round pick.

[TD 21]

All this time and energy some are spending on this (not a criticism, so relax), yet we all know they're more than likely ending up with the 8th worst record.

With their luck someone from behind will jump them, they'll end up 9th, we'll hear rumors of them trying to trade up for at least Murray if not higher, they'll fail and end up with another middling, unimpressive "SG" prospect who fits their ethos.

Then we'll see flashes of brilliance, delude ourselves into them being a possible future star, only to accept in the end that they're just another guy.

[BatManu20]

All this time and energy some are spending on this (not a criticism, so relax), yet we all know they're more than likely ending up with the 8th worst record.

With their luck someone from behind will jump them, they'll end up 9th, we'll hear rumors of them trying to trade up for at least Murray if not higher, they'll fail and end up with another middling, unimpressive "SG" prospect who fits their ethos.

Then we'll see flashes of brilliance, delude ourselves into them being a possible future star, only to accept in the end that they're just another guy.


https://c.tenor.com/YT-eS99f7-oAAAAC/vince-vaughn-negative-town.gif

[BatManu20]

Tbh you’re probably right but if we end up 9-10, hopefully we take a flyer on Tari Eason or Jalen Duran if they’re still available. This team needs a 4 in a bad way but it looks like 4 of the 5 bigs will be gone in the top 5 or 6 picks which fucks us. Duran is the only one who might be available when we select and he’s a 5. There’s a lot of talented guards in the lottery but that’s the last thing we need right now.

[Mr. Body]

Juzang should’ve gone pro after last season. He was a projected mid-1st round pick, maybe mid-20’s at the latest. He came back this season and absolutely tanked his draft stock. Now he’s a mid-to-late 2nd round pick.

I think he was dropping well out of the 1st round last year and that's why he pulled out.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Definitely will be tuning into the Iowa/Purdue Big Ten Championship game today, should be a good one.

[TD 21]

Tbh you’re probably right but if we end up 9-10, hopefully we take a flyer on Tari Eason or Jalen Duran if they’re still available. This team needs a 4 in a bad way but it looks like 4 of the 5 bigs will be gone in the top 5 or 6 picks which fucks us. Duran is the only one who might be available when we select and he’s a 5. There’s a lot of talented guards in the lottery but that’s the last thing we need right now.

Eason is a four/three defensively, but offensively he needs to play with a stretch five. Neither he nor Duren are Spurs type players.

They have a very narrow lens. Basically anyone who fits a modern archetype (freak athlete, vertical spacer, floor spacer, big wing, pull up volume 3-point shooter, dynamic creator) is out and anyone who's vanilla is in so long as they look and act the part of their preferred stereotype.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Juzang should’ve gone pro after last season. He was a projected mid-1st round pick, maybe mid-20’s at the latest. He came back this season and absolutely tanked his draft stock. Now he’s a mid-to-late 2nd round pick.


Pretty much agree. Except he's far from tanked this year. His draft stock dropped because he didn't have a big numbers increase, and he's a year older. But he's pretty much who he was, and the Bruins overachieved mostly because of him. I figure he goes around 40, and he'll be a good value there. A guy who you figure to get some minutes and 3's out of off the bench, with some upside - on a cheap deal. That's a good outcome for 40.

Mostly, the Spurs have got to have some more 3P punch, and it helps to have some bench players who can toss up 15 or even 20 points on a good night and not raise eyebrows. Those guys are good for some wins in games that would have been L's.

I don't know if you've actually watched him play, but he's got a good motor and doesn't take plays off. Has a good 3P stroke. He probably wouldn't see daylight under Pop, but he'll get 10-12 minutes a game somewhere else, since it will be lottery teams picking 31-40. I like the idea of him better than Langford, for about 1/10th the money.

[Atl Spur]

Pretty much agree. Except he's far from tanked this year. His draft stock dropped because he didn't have a big numbers increase, and he's a year older. But he's pretty much who he was, and the Bruins overachieved mostly because of him. I figure he goes around 40, and he'll be a good value there. A guy who you figure to get some minutes and 3's out of off the bench, with some upside - on a cheap deal. That's a good outcome for 40.

Mostly, the Spurs have got to have some more 3P punch, and it helps to have some bench players who can toss up 15 or even 20 points on a good night and not raise eyebrows. Those guys are good for some wins in games that would have been L's.

I don't know if you've actually watched him play, but he's got a good motor and doesn't take plays off. Has a good 3P stroke. He probably wouldn't see daylight under Pop, but he'll get 10-12 minutes a game somewhere else, since it will be lottery teams picking 31-40. I like the idea of him better than Langford, for about 1/10th the money.

����. Give your boy Langford a fair look before making statements how you prefer this or that collegiate player over him. Low hanging fruit is sometimes poisonous……. In all fairness I like the UCLA kid, the question should be to either draft him or pay Lonnie JS!

[objective]

I haven't seen much, but is Keegan Murray even significantly better than Keldon Johnson? He doesn't look like a legit 6-8 to me in the brief stuff I've seen

[The Truth #6]

In general, I like players from Kentucky, FSU, and Villanova. Don’t trust players from Duke and, I think, Memphis. This a roundabout way to talk about Jalen Duren whom some boards have us taking with our first pick.

Seems like a horrible idea, but does anyone here have any insights on him? I’m sort of opposed in theory to a center who can’t shoot.

[Russ]

In general, I like players from Kentucky, FSU, and Villanova. Don’t trust players from Duke and, I think, Memphis. This a roundabout way to talk about Jalen Duren whom some boards have us taking with our first pick.

Seems like a horrible idea, but does anyone here have any insights on him? I’m sort of opposed in theory to a center who can’t shoot.

Duren is a tough nut. Back and forth on this guy.

Is he the next Ayton or the next DeAndre Jordan?

I was way down on him early on but he looks like he's gotten way better lately (especially on offense).

And he's only 18 which indicates the potential for improvement.

Still haven't finally decided, but he's trending up.

[BacktoBasics]

I think Duren can shoot better than he’s shown and better than people give him credit for.

[mo7888]

In general, I like players from Kentucky, FSU, and Villanova. Don’t trust players from Duke and, I think, Memphis. This a roundabout way to talk about Jalen Duren whom some boards have us taking with our first pick.

Seems like a horrible idea, but does anyone here have any insights on him? I’m sort of opposed in theory to a center who can’t shoot.

I like Duren myself...I don't think his shot is broken and he's shown flashes of a mid range game late in the season. The question for me is where do you pick him? He's a no brainer if he's there with our 2nd 1st... I'd also be fine with him with our first pick if it's in the 7-9 range..

[exstatic]

I like Duren myself...I don't think his shot is broken and he's shown flashes of a mid range game late in the season. The question for me is where do you pick him? He's a no brainer if he's there with our 2nd 1st... I'd also be fine with him with our first pick if it's in the 7-9 range..

The thing about the extra picks is that if we DO jump into the top 4, we may be able to bundle the other two into something in the 8,9,10 range. If Portland gets skunked, they may want quantity, since they seem to be rebuilding everything except Dame. We might be able to grab someone like a Ivey and a Duren.

[BacktoBasics]

The thing about the extra picks is that if we DO jump into the top 4, we may be able to bundle the other two into something in the 8,9,10 range. If Portland gets skunked, they may want quantity, since they seem to be rebuilding everything except Dame. We might be able to grab someone like a Ivey and a Duren.

I think it’s a pipe dream to bundle a late mid and late first into the top 10. Even with a player attached.

Additionally, if you added a player to both those picks to get into the top 10 I’m not sure that you’d be getting a player that would be more interesting than the player you’d have to give up with those two picks to make it work. Maybe Richardson and two picks could entice but anything outside that makes little sense. We’re not giving up Keldon or Vassell with 2 picks to get into the top 10 for a less interesting prospect.

Just doesn’t seem realistic.

[Kevin]

Duran and Jak would be unplayable together on offense. I suppose they could draft Duran and trade away Jak but that feels like a sideways move at best. As others have said if he falls to our later picks sure but otherwise no. Redundant with too much risk.

[Kevin]

If the Spurs want to move into the top 4 its going to require one of Primo, Keldon or Vassel. Cant imagine any team picking the top 4 would have much interest in acquiring Jak or Richardson for that matter with only one year left on their deals. The Raps and Celtics picks wont move the needle much either.

[BatManu20]

Pretty confident most teams would rather have the top-4 pick than our pick + one of our role players. Spurs have a shot at a top-4 pick if they really want it by tanking. It’s their choice. They have no one to blame but themselves if they don’t give themselves an opportunity.

[CGD]

I think it’s a pipe dream to bundle a late mid and late first into the top 10. Even with a player attached.

Additionally, if you added a player to both those picks to get into the top 10 I’m not sure that you’d be getting a player that would be more interesting than the player you’d have to give up with those two picks to make it work. Maybe Richardson and two picks could entice but anything outside that makes little sense. We’re not giving up Keldon or Vassell with 2 picks to get into the top 10 for a less interesting prospect.

Just doesn’t seem realistic.

Depends on the draft and the range. Just last year Memphis moved up to #10 by trading #17, 51 and swapping Valincinious for Adams.

[mo7888]

The thing about the extra picks is that if we DO jump into the top 4, we may be able to bundle the other two into something in the 8,9,10 range. If Portland gets skunked, they may want quantity, since they seem to be rebuilding everything except Dame. We might be able to grab someone like a Ivey and a Duren.

I agree with that...the lottery could change the shape of our landscape if it goes our way...

[exstatic]

If the Spurs want to move into the top 4 its going to require one of Primo, Keldon or Vassel. Cant imagine any team picking the top 4 would have much interest in acquiring Jak or Richardson for that matter with only one year left on their deals. The Raps and Celtics picks wont move the needle much either.

No one is trading out of the top 4.

[MultiTroll]

Greek Freak and Kwa Leonard drafted at #15.
Just saying.

[The Truth #6]

Duran and Jak would be unplayable together on offense. I suppose they could draft Duran and trade away Jak but that feels like a sideways move at best. As others have said if he falls to our later picks sure but otherwise no. Redundant with too much risk.

That’s true. If we’re trading Yak then we’re moving up in the draft so we don’t have to debate Jalen Duren. That said, if he’s a Deandre Jordan that’s probably not horrible at around the 10th pick, but not really what we’re looking for. We need star power that can self create.

[CGD]

The thing about the extra picks is that if we DO jump into the top 4, we may be able to bundle the other two into something in the 8,9,10 range. If Portland gets skunked, they may want quantity, since they seem to be rebuilding everything except Dame. We might be able to grab someone like a Ivey and a Duren.

This has to be the top objective in my view. Obviously we can’t control where spurs land with their natural pick, but using all/some combo of 17, 22, and a player to get to 8-10 would be ideal. Portland is my ideal target if they do get those two picks.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I haven't seen much, but is Keegan Murray even significantly better than Keldon Johnson? He doesn't look like a legit 6-8 to me in the brief stuff I've seen


I said on draft night that I liked Keldon Johnson a LOT more than Samanic, and that if the Spurs had taken him at 19 (instead of Sammich) I wouldn't have complained. Getting him at 29 was a real stroke of luck.

BUT... Murray has played some great ball in the Big 10 tourney, against the better teams. That's the real test. How they perform agains high-level teams, when they've got something on the line. If he continues to play that well in the NCAA, he'll push somebody out of the top 4 in the draft. I think the math is that simple. Keldon was never in the discussion for going that high in the draft. Is Keldon significantly better than Keldon? Meh... they're different players. But I would love to see DJ, Keldon, and Keegan on the court at the same time. The Spurs could start building something around that.

If the Spurs get the ping pong ball and land at 4, I would be happy to see them take him. If he's less than stellar in the NCAA, and falls to where they are naturally, maybe 7-10? I'd still be happy to see them take him with their first pick.

[ZeusWillJudge]

����. Give your boy Langford a fair look before making statements how you prefer this or that collegiate player over him. Low hanging fruit is sometimes poisonous……. In all fairness I like the UCLA kid, the question should be to either draft him or pay Lonnie JS!


If you're a fan of Langford, we're just going to wind up spitting at each other and I don't want to bother doing that. I'm not. This time of year I'm always looking for bargains and diamonds in the rough - not just franchise guys at the top of the draft. I called for the Spurs to throw a second round pick at Kenyon Martin Jr., and to sign undrafted free agent Caleb Martin. Those are the kind of guys who keep you in games when the starters are on the bench. All I'm saying is that Juzang would be a value pick in the mid-second round. I don't know that he would ever be a starter, but I don't think of Langford as ever being a starter.

I did exaggerate. I said Juzang would be 1/10th the salary of Langford, but he would really be about 1/6th. Still, you can't look at second tier guys (especially) in a vacuum, without considering the cap space they eat up. So, yeah, I would rather see rookie Juzang hold a roster spot next season on a min contract vs. Langford at $5.6 M, just on the basis of his 3P stroke and energy. He's a bargain play in the second round, and there's still the possibility of him having a lot more upside.

[T Park]

If the Spurs want to move into the top 4 its going to require one of Primo, Keldon or Vassel. Cant imagine any team picking the top 4 would have much interest in acquiring Jak or Richardson for that matter with only one year left on their deals. The Raps and Celtics picks wont move the needle much either.

I’d move Vassell.

[T Park]

I haven't seen much, but is Keegan Murray even significantly better than Keldon Johnson? He doesn't look like a legit 6-8 to me in the brief stuff I've seen

Hes legit and his offensive game is a little more polished. His jumper is quicker and better as well. Murray has poor mans McDyess vibes

[tbdog]

I’d move Vassell.

Vassell is a future allstar. I am pretty confident on that when all things considering.

[CGD]

Vassell is a future allstar. I am pretty confident on that when all things considering.

Bold take

[John B]

Vassell is a future allstar. I am pretty confident on that when all things considering.

I like Vassell and I agree that he could be a future AS, hence my avatar. But for a shot of a potential tier 1 (top 4 pick), nobody is untouchable. I think Pop would pack his suitcase and drive him to the airport himself, especially for Chet.

[Kevin]

No one is trading out of the top 4.

Probably true and if Keegan Murray continues his accession nobody will trade out of the top 5.

[cd98]

My guess is the Spurs will hope for lottery luck, but will prefer one of their young picks plus whoever is available at 7/8 over trading for a top 4.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1504133674287046659

Some good stuff right here.

[PhantomDashCam]

Again, these are just mocks but it appears now that Dyson Daniels is firming as a lottery talent (and considered the best Ignite prospect from that team), as we get closer to the draft.

“Shades of Derrick White” - no wonder I like him. :lol

[Mr. Body]

Dyson Daniels is a guy I'm interested in but will probably be gone by the end of the lottery. There are so many question marks throughout this draft. Doesn't look like a good one overall.

[TD 21]

Nothing against Daniels specifically, but I'm tired of combo guards or wings who range from non to mediocre shooters and lack a specific physical attribute that prevents them from being switchable (for him it's strength).

If they're going to pick a shaky to non shooter, at least have it be something different like Sochan.

[PhantomDashCam]

Dyson Daniels is a guy I'm interested in but will probably be gone by the end of the lottery. There are so many question marks throughout this draft. Doesn't look like a good one overall.

I'm actually seeing shades of the 2020 draft here, which was considered a weak draft overall but actually contained considerable depth.

You've got two athletic wings from the same school with one coming off the bench, the other starting, where they likely get drafted in opposite order (2020 Devin Vassell, Patrick Williams - 2022 Jeremy Sochan, Kendall Brown), the Enigmatic Big Man (Jalen Duren - James Wiseman), the combo guard from Kentucky (TyTy Washington - Tyrese Maxey), the Senior shooter that slips (Desmond Bane - Ochai Agbaji) etc.

[Mr. Body]

I'm actually seeing shades of the 2020 draft here, which was considered a weak draft overall but actually contained considerable depth.

You've got two athletic wings from the same school with one coming off the bench, the other starting, where they likely get drafted in opposite order (2020 Devin Vassell, Patrick Williams - 2022 Jeremy Sochan, Kendall Brown), the Enigmatic Big Man (Jalen Duren - James Wiseman), the combo guard from Kentucky (TyTy Washington - Tyrese Maxey), the Senior shooter that slips (Desmond Bane - Ochai Agbaji) etc.

I definitely think there will be gems, absolutely. But there's a lot of dross, even more than usual. Fortunately Jalen Duren looks much better than James Wiseman, but I'm baffled by a player like TyTy Washington. How is he even in the conversation for a top 10 pick? Ochai Agbaji is really old. Kendall Brown reminds me of Greg Brown from last year, pretty much only an athlete. Last year it seemed like potential was rolling into the 2nd round. This year not even the top picks seem close to sure things and there's even a heavy drop-off after them. AJ Griffin is a great shooter but lead-footed and can't dribble. Johnny Davis is small and has no real three-ball. There are so many question marks.

[mystargtr34]

Really hope the Spurs can get in the top 8. I think there is a significant drop off in talent and upside potential after Chet, Jabari, Banchero, Ivey, Murray, Griffin, Sharpe, Duren.

Any of these for the Spurs would increase their talent/upside level considerably and allow them to make other roster moves to balance out the team if needed.

[Mr. Body]

I can see Duren in the top five or six very easily. He may not be consistent yet, but he's already a physical marvel with a lot of skills and he'd be the youngest guy in the draft. definitely top ten but probably much better.

[Russ]

Well, looks like the Keegan Murray watch in the NCAA tournament has been truncated by the Richmond Spiders.

[CGD]

Well, looks like the Keegan Murray watch in the NCAA tournament has been truncated by the Richmond Spiders.

Big 10 gonna Big 10… lol

Looks like Gonzaga and Chet are also in a dog fight against a smaller school.

[duncan2150]

Well, looks like the Keegan Murray watch in the NCAA tournament has been truncated by the Richmond Spiders.


That will hurt his stock imo tough he did not have a bad game.

[Russ]

That will hurt his stock imo tough he did not have a bad game.

Looking at the bright side, Keegan Murray is old enough that he can probably put all of this in perspective.

[Mr. Body]

Iowa couldn't figure out the Spider defense at all. The chance for Murray to raise his stock with a deep run is gone. I figure he'll settle around the 7-10 range, but who knows.

[CGD]

Chet is also wetting the bed right now

[Mr. Body]

Both Holmgren and Murray look like complementary players to me. Holmgren is a glue guy on defense, somewhat on offense, and not a guy to start sets or necessarily to get his shot. Murray seems like a third option or maybe even a bench option. I'm not sure he can get points by himself alone in the league but in a right situation will be a problem.

[Russ]

Chet is also wetting the bed right now

No sabe, no creo.

No fucking way.

Chet Holmgren is a bleeping stud.

(As are Jabari Smith and Paolo B.)

[mystargtr34]

If Gonzaga get through this game they’ll play Memphis. Chet and Duren going at it would be good to see.

[TD 21]

No reason to think Murray won't still go 5 or 6. The demand/scarcity of modern fours plus the post '14 Spurs' putrid luck and longstanding inability to competently fill that position will conspire to make sure he doesn't fall to them at 8 or 9.

Trading up is now conceivable, but if they're going to do that, it needs to be for someone with projected star upside.

[PhantomDashCam]

Murray's stock has little do with Iowa failing to advance (there's ample tape on him already), and everything to do with the young guys behind him and their performances/declarations.

Sharpe, Duren, Mathurin, Wesley, Sochan, perhaps even more; could all leap frog him based on versatility, age, upside and a case of recency bias. Keegan has no control of that. Most GMs aren't looking for the safe pick when in the lottery.

Most teams aren't as depleted at the '4' as the Spurs either, especially when arguably 3 of the top 4 picks are likely to be able to play it...

[CGD]

If Gonzaga get through this game they’ll play Memphis. Chet and Duren going at it would be good to see.

Ask and you shall receive. Looks like coach got to his player in the second part of second half. Zags and Chet woke up.

[TD 21]

Maybe one of them leapfrogs him (I did leave wiggle room); I'd be shocked if more did. Every year recently, a modern four shot up between now at the draft (Hunter, Williams, Barnes).

Wrong. Most GM's are looking for safe in the lottery because it's a happy medium where blame can generally be minimized.

Not as depleted as the Spurs at the 4, but in need all the same or even if they're not, looking for reinforcements. Granted, Murray is a true 4 as opposed to the preferred type who'd have played 3 a generation ago, but still.

[mo7888]

Murray's stock has little do with Iowa failing to advance (there's ample tape on him already), and everything to do with the young guys behind him and their performances/declarations.

Sharpe, Duren, Mathurin, Wesley, Sochan, perhaps even more; could all leap frog him based on versatility, age, upside and a case of recency bias. Keegan has no control of that. Most GMs aren't looking for the safe pick when in the lottery.

Most teams aren't as depleted at the '4' as the Spurs either, especially when arguably 3 of the top 4 picks are likely to be able to play it...

I think Sharpe is already ahead of him and Duren is right there with him...

[PhantomDashCam]

I preface this by saying I personally like Keegan, and would be happy taking him 5-6, however...

Going back to the 2015 draft, 5.4% of lottery picks have been sophomores - 18 picks in total. The numbers get even lower for Juniors and Seniors.

Obi Toppin was considered "safe" and has looked far from it in close to his first two seasons. He is sometimes cited in relation to Keegan.
I personally think they're completely different players but it may give some GMs pause.

If you go to Keegan's first year tape, some scouts thought he would have to play "well" to simply compete for a first round spot. Some of that doubt may carry over...

Is a seasoned Keegan Murray a safer player than a current raw Jalen Duren, even at this stage of development, when heading to the NBA? What about AJ Griffin, (assuming no injury red-flags of course)?
The answers may surprise...

[mo7888]

My top 8 are still Smith, Chet, Banchero, Ivey, Sharpe, Murray, Duren, and Griffin ...in that order..

Now that I've reiterated that I'll add...I'd be fine taking Duren or maybe Griffin ahead of Murray if we are high on a darkhorse 4 for our 2nd 1st...

[Mr. Body]

I preface this by saying I personally like Keegan, and would be happy taking him 5-6, however...

Going back to the 2015 draft, 5.4% of lottery picks have been sophomores - 18 picks in total. The numbers get even lower for Juniors and Seniors.

Obi Toppin was considered "safe" and has looked far from it in close to his first two seasons. He is sometimes cited in relation to Keegan.
I personally think they're completely different players but it may give some GMs pause.

If you go to Keegan's first year tape, some scouts thought he would have to play "well" to simply compete for a first round spot. Some of that doubt may carry over...

Is a seasoned Keegan Murray a safer player than a current raw Jalen Duren, even at this stage of development, when heading to the NBA? What about AJ Griffin, (assuming no injury red-flags of course)?
The answers may surprise...

This has come up before, but in my view there are flaws in this approach. Basically, it's this: for a good number of years, the draft culls any young players that are likely to be drafted by the time they were juniors or seniors much earlier than those years. It usually wasn't that case, but now it is. A player like Josh Primo goes in the lottery, or a Duren, and so on; teams are likely to grab them very early and spend money/years training them.

Good enough. The problem, now, is in assuming that any player that gets through this gauntlet, i.e. is a senior by the time hits the draft, is therefore not very good or cannot improve. Basically, because he has not been drafted yet.

That makes sense, but in this case, this is actually only Keegan Murray's second year of playing college basketball. And he made a terrific leap between years.

So... we're (potentially) punishing him for his age, but not recognizing his experience. He can definitely not pan out, but my point is that he's more like an older sophomore in college than a senior.

[mo7888]

This has come up before, but in my view there are flaws in this approach. Basically, it's this: for a good number of years, the draft culls any young players that are likely to be drafted by the time they were juniors or seniors much earlier than those years. It usually wasn't that case, but now it is. A player like Josh Primo goes in the lottery, or a Duren, and so on; teams are likely to grab them very early and spend money/years training them.

Good enough. The problem, now, is in assuming that any player that gets through this gauntlet, i.e. is a senior by the time hits the draft, is therefore not very good or cannot improve. Basically, because he has not been drafted yet.

That makes sense, but in this case, this is actually only Keegan Murray's second year of playing college basketball. And he made a terrific leap between years.

So... we're (potentially) punishing him for his age, but not recognizing his experience. He can definitely not pan out, but my point is that he's more like an older sophomore in college than a senior.

That makes sense if teams are judging him on his experience. If however, teams are looking at it from the perspective of how old he'd be at the end of his first contract (after his rookie contract) then you're evaluating on how many years you control him while he's in his prime. In some cases players may be towards the end of their prime at that point. Now, in Murray's case I don't necessarily think it's a big knock on him because he doesn't rely on athleticism as much as some players. For instance, if Duren were 22 he'd be knocked much harder because his athleticism is such a large part of his game.

[PhantomDashCam]

This has come up before, but in my view there are flaws in this approach. Basically, it's this: for a good number of years, the draft culls any young players that are likely to be drafted by the time they were juniors or seniors much earlier than those years. It usually wasn't that case, but now it is. A player like Josh Primo goes in the lottery, or a Duren, and so on; teams are likely to grab them very early and spend money/years training them.

Good enough. The problem, now, is in assuming that any player that gets through this gauntlet, i.e. is a senior by the time hits the draft, is therefore not very good or cannot improve. Basically, because he has not been drafted yet.

That makes sense, but in this case, this is actually only Keegan Murray's second year of playing college basketball. And he made a terrific leap between years.

So... we're (potentially) punishing him for his age, but not recognizing his experience. He can definitely not pan out, but my point is that he's more like an older sophomore in college than a senior.

I agree with this and that is flawed. But Keegan took such a massive leap already, is it unreasonable to think another is likely required to justify a 5th-6th selection on a draft revision in a few years?

The data seems to show that Sophomores are on the rise in regards to lottery prognostications most likely for the reasons you have sighted. (2019, 2020 accounted for 50% of Sophomores taken in that time and there maybe another 4-6 taken this year).

I wouldn’t want to penalise him but I think his selected position is still extremely fluid based on the reasons I’ve cited.

[KobesAchilles]

Keegan reminds me of Channing Frye. So the question I have is how good would Channing Frye be in todays NBA. And I have no idea lol

[exstatic]

The problem with most juniors and seniors is that the players who would have been their junior or senior quality competition are gone already, so they’re playing against meh upperclassman and players who are younger and less physically developed, so they can usually physically dominate them. They won’t be able to do that in the NBA. It leads to, in most cases, a false evaluation of value. Most draft analysts, starting way back with Chad Ford like 15 years ago, assess a penalty for age.

[Mr. Body]

Yet another touted prospect, TyTy Washington, also had a pretty lousy game. But then I'm not even sure why he's been suggestd as a top 10 pick other than going to UK and being pretty much the only PG in the draft.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Yet another touted prospect, TyTy Washington, also had a pretty lousy game. But then I'm not even sure why he's been suggestd as a top 10 pick other than going to UK and being pretty much the only PG in the draft.


I absolutely hate TyTy Washington as a draft pick. Always have. His performance doesn't surprise me.

Gonzaga played against a very weak 4.24 SOS this season. There are a lot of guys in the D-League who could look like potential Top 5 picks, if they got to play against weak college competition. I think Holmgren has very little to gain, and a lot to lose. If he comes up weak against the better teams that are in the tourney, I could see him slipping as low as 5, depending on how the other top guys play.

Iowa played a much better SOS, compared to Zaga, and Murray was consistently good for the last month and a half. He had another good game, even though they lost. The early exit only means that he doesn't have any more chances to wow scouts. If the Spurs get the ping pong ball, I would be happy to hear them call his name. I think he is probably the best that the Spurs can reasonably hope to get out of their pick. (And that's only if last night's stupid win didn't mess it up.)

[BatManu20]

My top 8 are still Smith, Chet, Banchero, Ivey, Sharpe, Murray, Duren, and Griffin ...in that order..

Now that I've reiterated that I'll add...I'd be fine taking Duren or maybe Griffin ahead of Murray if we are high on a darkhorse 4 for our 2nd 1st...

Spurs aren’t going to have a shot at any of these dudes tbh.

[BatManu20]

Yea Chet will go #1.


1504589859536711685

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[Biggems]

latest NBADraftRoom mock

7 - PF Keegan Murray
17 - SF Kendall Brown
20 - C Walker Kessler
45 - SF Caleb Houston

IMO, that would be a pretty nice haul.

[Biggems]

PF Oscar Tshiebwe - Kentucky

I want him in the 2nd Round.....his rebounding numbers remind me of Dennis Rodman.....I don't care if he is only 6'9, he has had 5 games of over 20 rebounds, maxing out at 28. He only had 2 games of less than 10 rebounds and in those he had 7 and 8.

[Mr. Body]

latest NBADraftRoom mock

7 - PF Keegan Murray
17 - SF Kendall Brown
20 - C Walker Kessler
45 - SF Caleb Houston

IMO, that would be a pretty nice haul.

Yeah, that would be next to ideal.

I just know the Spurs will do something wild and unexpected. If they get a top 4 pick it wouldn't surprise me if they traded it away.

[dbestpro]

Big ten players for the most part are over rated. The tournament proves this.

[mo7888]

Spurs aren’t going to have a shot at any of these dudes tbh.

Possibly....but I think we stay in the top 8 so we'd be able to get in of them..

[duncan2150]

Yeah, that would be next to ideal.

I just know the Spurs will do something wild and unexpected. If they get a top 4 pick it wouldn't surprise me if they traded it away.

Interesting. They will pass on Banchero or Ivey for you ? don't see a team drafting Murray with a pick 4 to 6.

[CGD]

Murray should not go before 7 if the spurs move up. You take the younger Griffin or Sharpe ahead of him.

[John B]

Spurs aren’t going to have a shot at any of these dudes tbh.

If they don’t let Lonnie mess it up. The guy is playing for his next contract, while Murray has a shot at MIP. J-Rich is auditioning for a permanent gig :lol:lol. Spurs have players like Zollins and Landale who are hungry for the NBA. While Keldon is Keldon. It’s difficult to tank with these guys tbh :lol

[exstatic]

Interesting artical on the distribution of players who could be drafted. The etch-a-Sketch art is pretty awful, but his point is good.

https://www.thestepien.com/2018/02/10/draft-philosophy-talent-curve/

[Robz4000]

Yea Chet will go #1.


1504589859536711685

1504593776597217284

:lol he was being guarded by a 5'11" dude when he did most of that, I shit you not

[CGD]

:lol he was being guarded by a 5'11" dude when he did most of that, I shit you not

Yes, and he didn’t really get going until the last 10m or so of game. The Memphis game will be the better test. I’m sure Duren will want to prove something too.

[Mr. Body]

Interesting. They will pass on Banchero or Ivey for you ? don't see a team drafting Murray with a pick 4 to 6.

Yes, I can see the Spurs trading out of a top 4 pick, absolutely.

The reason why? The real reason why?

Money. Those picks earn so much money right off the bat, their contracts are really pretty high. Initially aren't terrible, but to keep that player, they really start getting up there. This is one thing that really starts choking perinnially terrible franchises -- they get stacked with top picks that kill their cap.

Also, the Spurs have hidden evaluation processes and interests. I can totally see them taking Smith or Holmgren. After that, who knows. I almost feel they're much more comfortable taking later picks, getting guys they can mold, and most importantly are not as expensive.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Interesting artical on the distribution of players who could be drafted. The etch-a-Sketch art is pretty awful, but his point is good.

https://www.thestepien.com/2018/02/10/draft-philosophy-talent-curve/


That's a good article, even with the kindergarten drawings. Stepien has some of the best draft analysis on the internet overall. That article boils down to one thing - there is a MUCH higher chance of drafting a star-level player in the Top 5. The chance of drafting one in the second 5 (6-10) is about one-third as high. People love to point out stars that have been drafted at 17, or in the second round like Jokic. But the chance of drafting a star below the Top 10 is very small, and only in the Top 5 is it pretty good. That's why if you tank, you freaking TANK. And if you're going to be bad, like the Spurs are this year? The smart play is to tank. It may not be as fun for the fans, but it's the better long term strategy. I've read countless people here who said things like, "8 isn't that much different from 5". That kind of thinking is the reason casinos continue to rake in billions of dollars, year after year. I think the Spurs draft position will get worse, but even if they remain in the 8 position, they have zero chance of getting the 5,6, or 7 draft slots. And they have almost an equal chance of landing at 9 vs 8.

What I don't understand is how many of you will sit here and say that players who rack up bigger numbers on lousy teams are "empty calories", but don't care that Chet Holmgren has feasted on mostly below-par college teams, but struggled in three games against St. Mary's and looked pretty soft against Texas and T Tech. I think he'll do well enough in the NCAA, but IF he doesn't, he could definitely fall to 2 or even 3. Both Smith and Banchero are 6'10 with 7'+ wingspans, and NBA-ready bodies. Not all the scouts are as in love with Holmgren as the talking heads - I just don't have any feel for how Houston or Orlando feel about him.

Keegan Murray doesn't have any more chances to excel or disappoint. Unless a couple of guys go nuts in the tourney, he won't fall below 6.

[Mr. Body]

That's a good article, even with the kindergarten drawings. Stepien has some of the best draft analysis on the internet overall. That article boils down to one thing - there is a MUCH higher chance of drafting a star-level player in the Top 5. The chance of drafting one in the second 5 (6-10) is about one-third as high. People love to point out stars that have been drafted at 17, or in the second round like Jokic. But the chance of drafting a star below the Top 10 is very small, and only in the Top 5 is it pretty good. That's why if you tank, you freaking TANK. And if you're going to be bad, like the Spurs are this year? The smart play is to tank. It may not be as fun for the fans, but it's the better long term strategy. I've read countless people here who said things like, "8 isn't that much different from 5". That kind of thinking is the reason casinos continue to rake in billions of dollars, year after year. I think the Spurs draft position will get worse, but even if they remain in the 8 position, they have zero chance of getting the 5,6, or 7 draft slots. And they have almost an equal chance of landing at 9 vs 8.

What I don't understand is how many of you will sit here and say that players who rack up bigger numbers on lousy teams are "empty calories", but don't care that Chet Holmgren has feasted on mostly below-par college teams, but struggled in three games against St. Mary's and looked pretty soft against Texas and T Tech. I think he'll do well enough in the NCAA, but IF he doesn't, he could definitely fall to 2 or even 3. Both Smith and Banchero are 6'10 with 7'+ wingspans, and NBA-ready bodies. Not all the scouts are as in love with Holmgren as the talking heads - I just don't have any feel for how Houston or Orlando feel about him.

Keegan Murray doesn't have any more chances to excel or disappoint. Unless a couple of guys go nuts in the tourney, he won't fall below 6.

I don't think this is a right analysis, or at least there is a lot that you're missing with it. I don't have time to really get into it, but going into a hard tank is not what you want to do, and there are many reasons why. Oh, yes, there's the big 'wow' factor in drafting high, but getting there carries significant negative externalities. It's the reason why you continue to see non-winning franchises continue to circle around the bottom of the standings. Some of that has to do with poor leadership, to be sure, but mostly it has to do with other consequences that don't make the headlines. For every crap franchise like Washington, there's a Utah. The former has gone into full tank for years and still sucks, the latter never went into a full tank and recovered.

Obviously those are anecdotal, but there are severe costs in going into full tank mode. They include:

1. Setting-in of a losing mindset
2. Incurring of awful contracts

This is aside from erosion of fanbase, etc. The losing mindset is severe. Good players don't come out of the draft fully formed, especially nowadays. And it's a myth that good prospects will always become good players. On the contrary, potential kings get strangled in the crib all the time. With a losing culture, one where it's clear the franchise doesn't care about winning, you're souring the patch for every player you have.

Then you have the expense of high draft picks year after year. The Spurs haven't faced this conundrum at all, but those top picks really add up. At first they may not so, but they quickly get stupidly bad. When you have middling top picks, it's hard to tell when to cut loose and when you do, you're back to the start without anything to show. The big cap hits make it hard to sign good vets -- you know, the guys who can teach young players how to be professionals.

No, the hard tank is a really bad idea.

[bluebellmaniac]

Yes, I can see the Spurs trading out of a top 4 pick, absolutely.

The reason why? The real reason why?

Money. Those picks earn so much money right off the bat, their contracts are really pretty high. Initially aren't terrible, but to keep that player, they really start getting up there. This is one thing that really starts choking perinnially terrible franchises -- they get stacked with top picks that kill their cap.

Also, the Spurs have hidden evaluation processes and interests. I can totally see them taking Smith or Holmgren. After that, who knows. I almost feel they're much more comfortable taking later picks, getting guys they can mold, and most importantly are not as expensive.

Mr. Body dropping some Truth!

[The Truth #6]

The counter is that we have no pecking order, but I suppose that’s also because we only draft shooting guards.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Ivey killing it early on.

[R. DeMurre]

Obi Toppin was considered "safe" and has looked far from it in close to his first two seasons. He is sometimes cited in relation to Keegan.
I personally think they're completely different players but it may give some GMs pause.

If you go to Keegan's first year tape, some scouts thought he would have to play "well" to simply compete for a first round spot. Some of that doubt may carry over...

Is a seasoned Keegan Murray a safer player than a current raw Jalen Duren, even at this stage of development, when heading to the NBA? What about AJ Griffin, (assuming no injury red-flags of course)?
The answers may surprise...


I didn't like Obi Toppin at all out of college because in addition to the eye test every scouting report on him talked about how he wouldn't be a good defender in the NBA, and he very rarely addressed that point. Almost every interview inevitably turned to dunking, which I found pretty annoying. So, in addition to being a poor defender, he also seemed/seems to have little interest in becoming a better defender either. Murray at least plays D and has defensive versatility. For me, that's a big difference.

[exstatic]

No one, including the Spurs, is trading out of the top 4. The money doesn't matter. SA collectively paid Al Farouk Aminu and Chandler Hutchison $14.5M to just go away last summer. They're not going to balk at a top 4 salary if there's a chance to grab a star or a super star.

[exstatic]

I preface this by saying I personally like Keegan, and would be happy taking him 5-6, however...

Going back to the 2015 draft, 5.4% of lottery picks have been sophomores - 18 picks in total. The numbers get even lower for Juniors and Seniors.

Obi Toppin was considered "safe" and has looked far from it in close to his first two seasons. He is sometimes cited in relation to Keegan.
I personally think they're completely different players but it may give some GMs pause.

If you go to Keegan's first year tape, some scouts thought he would have to play "well" to simply compete for a first round spot. Some of that doubt may carry over...

Is a seasoned Keegan Murray a safer player than a current raw Jalen Duren, even at this stage of development, when heading to the NBA? What about AJ Griffin, (assuming no injury red-flags of course)?
The answers may surprise...

As I remember it, Toppin was one of the dreaded high ceiling, low floor guys. He was a phenomenal athlete, but lacked fundamentals. For a jumping jack, I'm remembering concerns about weak rebounding.

[Mr. Body]

No one, including the Spurs, is trading out of the top 4. The money doesn't matter. SA collectively paid Al Farouk Aminu and Chandler Hutchison $14.5M to just go away last summer. They're not going to balk at a top 4 salary if there's a chance to grab a star or a super star.

Spurs would absolutely trade down or out if their players aren't there. Absolutely.

[exstatic]

Spurs would absolutely trade down or out if their players aren't there. Absolutely.

What players aren't going to be there for them in the top 4? And didn't you just say a few posts ago that the reason would be money? Moving goalposts are moving...

[PhantomDashCam]

As I remember it, Toppin was one of the dreaded high ceiling, low floor guys. He was a phenomenal athlete, but lacked fundamentals. For a jumping jack, I'm remembering concerns about weak rebounding.

Here was two mocks I found by googling ‘Obi Toppin Safe Pick’:
https://www.sportingnews.com/ca/nba/news/nba-draft-2020-obi-toppin-scouting-report-strengths-weaknesses-and-player-comparison/17xgbpjulp22613erolxqvmrsd


One of the questions surrounding Toppin will be his ceiling. He’s already 22 years old and looks to have cultivated a lot of his skills and for that reason, there will be a question of if he has another level to get to. For organizations that love safe picks, Toppin will be their guy but if a team is looking to take a home run swing he may not offer enough charm.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2905299-projecting-where-obi-toppin-will-be-selected-after-2020-nba-draft-lottery


Every squad drafting early could use the 22-year-old as someone who could contribute immediately, but the teams closer to competing might be the best options.
The Golden State Warriors (No. 2), Washington Wizards (No. 9) and Phoenix Suns (No. 10) could each compete for playoff spots if they are healthy next season, and adding a ready-made starter like Toppin could be huge.

[PhantomDashCam]

I didn't like Obi Toppin at all out of college because in addition to the eye test every scouting report on him talked about how he wouldn't be a good defender in the NBA, and he very rarely addressed that point. Almost every interview inevitably turned to dunking, which I found pretty annoying. So, in addition to being a poor defender, he also seemed/seems to have little interest in becoming a better defender either. Murray at least plays D and has defensive versatility. For me, that's a big difference.

Spot on. I’m in total agreement here.

The only reason I brought up the comparison is the position of play, the age - being relatively older for a sophomore, and the giant leap in production from freshman to sophomore seasons.

[R. DeMurre]

I agree on the probabilities/percentages of draft successes being presented here, which only makes what the Warriors have accomplished all the more impressive, building a dynasty with a #7 (Steph), a #11 (Klay), and a #35 (Draymond). Moses Moody was my pick for the Spurs in the last draft, so it'll be interesting to watch how his career unfolds vs Primo.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I don't see how anyone drafts Chet over Jabari, this kid can do it all and more than an entire year younger than him.

[buttsR4rebounding]

I don't see how anyone drafts Chet over Jabari, this kid can do it all and more than an entire year younger than him.

Earlier in the season I liked Holmgren over Jabari, but have come around to your position. I'd love to have Holmgren on the team, but I would definitely take Jabari over him and maybe pick up Kessler from Auburn as well. Especially if you think his 3 point shot would develop he would give you most of what Holmgren would plus has a body that would work in the post.

[TD 21]

I agree on the probabilities/percentages of draft successes being presented here, which only makes what the Warriors have accomplished all the more impressive, building a dynasty with a #7 (Steph), a #11 (Klay), and a #35 (Draymond). Moses Moody was my pick for the Spurs in the last draft, so it'll be interesting to watch how his career unfolds vs Primo.

:lmao In '15, they beat zero elite teams thanks to unprecedented opponent injury luck (not their fault obviously, but still), then forfeited the opportunity to have a chance to become a dynasty by begging the second best player of this generation to join them and turn the league into men against boys to win '17 and '18.

They had a relatively short period where they played at a dynastic level, but despite the media propaganda, they're not the genuine article.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Earlier in the season I liked Holmgren over Jabari, but have come around to your position. I'd love to have Holmgren on the team, but I would definitely take Jabari over him and maybe pick up Kessler from Auburn as well. Especially if you think his 3 point shot would develop he would give you most of what Holmgren would plus has a body that would work in the post.
Yeah Smith is shooting 43% on 5.5 shot attempts a game not bad at all, and yeah I like Kessler as well he had 13-10 and 9 blocks today.

[lmbebo]

Spurs would absolutely trade down or out if their players aren't there. Absolutely.

They would trade down if they didn't feel like they would get a player they wanted at that position. But I don't think they would shy away from drafting someone in the top 4 because of salary. They've paid players more for much less. They aren't hurting for money, especially Dell, Air bnb CEO? and that PE group investing in the Spurs ...

[BackHome]

Yeah Smith is shooting 43% on 5.5 shot attempts a game not bad at all, and yeah I like Kessler as well he had 13-10 and 9 blocks today.

That's my boy I am all in on the Kessler Train so much that I don't mind trading Poodle because I think it does two things - Yeah will probably be worse in 2023 which is good cause Lort we need a top 4 pick and two I think he can and will be a good center for us in year two. So hopefully we get either a good PF or a good draft pick for Poodle and then we get hopefully a top 4 pick in next draft -Praying for Kessler will be there for us with our second pick

[BackHome]

I didn't like Obi Toppin at all out of college because in addition to the eye test every scouting report on him talked about how he wouldn't be a good defender in the NBA, and he very rarely addressed that point. Almost every interview inevitably turned to dunking, which I found pretty annoying. So, in addition to being a poor defender, he also seemed/seems to have little interest in becoming a better defender either. Murray at least plays D and has defensive versatility. For me, that's a big difference.

I agree Murray is way better defender then Obi will ever be but one thing he is a PF he is not a tweener like Eli meaning he can't guard Centers nor can he stay in front of SF but he is still a good player a High Floor kinda guy

[mo7888]

That's my boy I am all in on the Kessler Train so much that I don't mind trading Poodle because I think it does two things - Yeah will probably be worse in 2023 which is good cause Lort we need a top 4 pick and two I think he can and will be a good center for us in year two. So hopefully we get either a good PF or a good draft pick for Poodle and then we get hopefully a top 4 pick in next draft -Praying for Kessler will be there for us with our second pick

I don't want you tank for a top pick next season but, if we do please trade DJ. No, I don't want to trade him (I want to put players along side him) but, we would lose him for nothing if we tanked again next year so trade him for value while it's high if we choose that route..

[exstatic]

I agree Murray is way better defender then Obi will ever be but one thing he is a PF he is not a tweener like Eli meaning he can't guard Centers nor can he stay in front of SF but he is still a good player a High Floor kinda guy

High floor guys are ready to play out of the box. He wasn’t in the rotation as a rookie, and I’m not sure 15 minutes qualifies this year. High ceiling? Sure, but the bottom could still drop out. His career is bordering on scrub territory.

[Ditty]

Saw on a mock draft of Spurs taking Ousman Dieng from France with one of the later first round picks. Anyone seen him play? Seen him in some 2023 mock drafts. He could possibly declare for this upcoming draft.

[mo7888]

Saw on a mock draft of Spurs taking Ousman Dieng from France with one of the later first round picks. Anyone seen him play? Seen him in some 2023 mock drafts. He could possibly declare for this upcoming draft.

I think he could be in the discussion for the Celtics pick...

[BatManu20]

Raptors choke a big lead at home and lose in OT to the Lakers smh. Both those picks take a hit.

[mystargtr34]

Looks like the Bulls are slumping also they will only be 2 losses ahead of the Raptors after tonight’s L against Phoenix. Looks like it’s Toronto Cleveland and Chicago fighting for 5 and 6 spots in the East.

[rankingtear]

Dark horse picks 8-10 :

TOR type prospects Dyson Daniels and Jeremy Sochan ( young enough that shot can be fixed in 2 - 3 years , playmaking+ , high level role players )

SAS type prospects Malakhi Branham and Blake Wesley ( productive young potential 2 way shot creators )

[objective]

My first draft fancy might be Matteo Spagnolo. Tankathon has him mocked to SA in the second now, and after I watch some more I might even want him in the first. Haven't watched his defense yet, so I might end up hating him anyway.

[R. DeMurre]

:lmao In '15, they beat zero elite teams thanks to unprecedented opponent injury luck (not their fault obviously, but still), then forfeited the opportunity to have a chance to become a dynasty by begging the second best player of this generation to join them and turn the league into men against boys to win '17 and '18.

They had a relatively short period where they played at a dynastic level, but despite the media propaganda, they're not the genuine article.


:lol so you agree they played at a dynastic level... They won three championships and posted seasonal win totals of 67/73/67.... That's dynastic. I'm sure if Durant had decided to join the Spurs in 2017, you wouldn't've had a problem with it. Geez, even if they don't win multiple championships their draft analysis is still impressive. Only a blind homer would say otherwise.

[duncan2150]

Saw on a mock draft of Spurs taking Ousman Dieng from France with one of the later first round picks. Anyone seen him play? Seen him in some 2023 mock drafts. He could possibly declare for this upcoming draft.

He's a late first round for me, he starts to shows some good things after a really bad start. Still a lot of work but the tools are there : 6'9 with a 7'0 wingspan, can drive, shoot. I have questions about the motor tough.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OvzqgWppEmU

One of his last games highlights


Another guy we talked about, Jeremy Sochan. He was good in the first game of the MM for Baylor. Really Interesting prospect.

https://twitter.com/fra_sempru/status/1504796042298073097
Some video clips of the game in this tweet.

[The Truth #6]

If Keegan Murray is gone, Sochan is damn interesting. The way he’s described, loosely speaking, has some Bobo qualities. I know we need a scorer, but Sochan seems to understand basketball and could still have value on offense.

[BatManu20]

Sochan with our 1st pick would be pretty depressing tbh as he projects as nothing more than a role-player at the next level. But our choices may be limited since it doesn’t look like we’ll be selecting any higher than 8th and could drop to 9 or 10.

[R. DeMurre]

Geez, with Brown, Sochan, and Mayer at 6'8", 6'9", & 6'9", Baylor actually has better size at their wing/forward positions than the Spurs.

[Ditty]

My guess right now is going to be Chet, Smith, Banchero, Ivey and Sharpe will go in that order for the top 5.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Kendall Brown and Jeremy Sochan have been very disappointing. Getting their asses kicked.

[Mr. Body]

My guess right now is going to be Chet, Smith, Banchero, Ivey and Sharpe will go in that order for the top 5.

I think Duren will be in the mix in that range. He looks super promising, if still raw in areas.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

What an awesome comeback from Butler. Sochan’s defense a big part of their 38-13 run.

[SPURt]

Kendall Brown and Jeremy Sochan have been very disappointing. Getting their asses kicked.
Crazy game going on right now

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Crazy game going on right now

Crazy indeed. I liked Sochan's defense and general demeanor.

[Mr. Body]

Sochan is a beast on defense, has a foreign pedigree, and is already used to having to live in Texas.

[TD 21]

Sochan with our 1st pick would be pretty depressing tbh as he projects as nothing more than a role-player at the next level. But our choices may be limited since it doesn’t look like we’ll be selecting any higher than 8th and could drop to 9 or 10.

This is why they need to attempt to trade up for Banchero. It's rare they might have the assets to trade up that high, he's the caliber of prospect where it's conceivable and he's a good theoretical fit.

If not, it's time to consider trading Murray. Not so much because he might not want to wait through a full scale re-build, but to maximize value. He'll be 26 at the start of next season and doesn't have the type of game that generally ages well. It doesn't make sense to continue to surround him with low ceiling role players and projects, who basically play the same position.



:lol so you agree they played at a dynastic level... They won three championships and posted seasonal win totals of 67/73/67.... That's dynastic. I'm sure if Durant had decided to join the Spurs in 2017, you wouldn't've had no problem with it. Geez, even if they don't win multiple championships their draft analysis is still impressive. Only a blind homer would say otherwise.

There's a distinction there, in a similar vein to players who were clearly on a Hall of Fame trek only to be derailed by injury.

:lmao Completely different circumstances. Had the mid aughts Spurs (closest to the biggest three being in their collective prime) begged let's say Garnett (you could argue O'Neal, Bryant, McGrady, Nowitzki) and coasted to two uncontested championships, I'd absolutely call them illegitimate.

Beyond that, the Warriors just didn't have a long enough run at or near the top to earn dynasty status.

[SPURt]

Crazy indeed. I liked Sochan's defense and general demeanor.
I’m with you on that! Not a fan of him being a top 10 pick, but I would be pretty happy if he does the Keldon dive to one of the later picks.

[Kurik]

If we traded down or up with our picks to be around 12-16 I would love Sochan. If we are at 8-10 I still prefer Mathurin, Eason, or Duren. I’d draft Kendall Brown with the third first round pick, I imagine his stock has taken a hit if he remains in the draft but the potential is there.

[MultiTroll]

What an awesome comeback from Butler. Sochan’s defense a big part of their 38-13 run.
Carolina ahead by 3 nearing the end of reg and allowing a 2+1 shot by fouling Baylor shooter.

Is high BBIQ simply dead and gone from college BB?
(NBA too for that matter) :lol

[MultiTroll]

What an awesome comeback from Butler. Sochan’s defense a big part of their 38-13 run.


Crazy game going on right now
Either of you catch the super obvious out of bounds off North Carolina guy who dribbled it off himself?....
No challenge by Baylor.
Super key possession either end of reg or end of OT can't remember, but Baylor would get ball back down 3 or 2 (def chance to win or tie).
I heard announcer point it out. Did not hear, is this one of those super lame *cannot challenge* rules?

[Atl Spur]

Sochan is a keeper, brown is Lonnie walker reboot!

[emanueldavidginobili]

Sochan stood out to me wow that kid was every where and an absolute beast. He moved incredibly well for a guy 6'9 230, he's one of the younger guys in the draft as well. I wouldn't mind getting him if he is still around for our later pick in the 1st.

[emanueldavidginobili]

Either of you catch the super obvious out of bounds off North Carolina guy who dribbled it off himself?....
No challenge by Baylor.
Super key possession either end of reg or end of OT can't remember, but Baylor would get ball back down 3 or 2 (def chance to win or tie).
I heard announcer point it out. Did not hear, is this one of those super lame *cannot challenge* rules?
It had to be under 2:00 for them to be able to challenge it and the play happened at the 2:02 mark I think

[duncan2150]

Sochan with our 1st pick would be pretty depressing tbh as he projects as nothing more than a role-player at the next level. But our choices may be limited since it doesn’t look like we’ll be selecting any higher than 8th and could drop to 9 or 10.

I think with respect that it's a bold statement. Sochan could be the pick if the spurs are something like 10-11, i don't see them going too high with him but in this range 9-11 with his youth, versatility, body ( 6'9 230 lbs 7'0 wingspan) he could be a very good pick imo. Lot of uspide.


Sochan is a beast on defense, has a foreign pedigree, and is already used to having to live in Texas.

Agree and we are not alone

https://twitter.com/matt_pennie/status/1505258451244625926

[BatManu20]

Sochan wants to be Dennis Rodman the way he plays kinda dirty and likes to get under people’s skin. He was definitely pissing everyone off that game and was even trending on Twitter for it. He even trips people like Rodman used to :lol. Even his hair looks like Rodman’s. He was definitely public enemy #1 today but I kinda dig it tbh :lol

That 2nd half was legit one of the worst officiated halves of basketball I’ve ever seen though tbh.

[Mr. Body]

Sochan doesn't seem like a dickhead off the court. Actually seems like a sweet guy. His mom's Polish and he grew up in the UK. There's a video of his family coming to visit him in Waco for the first time.

[Mr. Body]

And, yes, the officiating in the UNC was atrocious. That call on the flopped three by the Carolina guard was one of those pivotal terrible calls.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I think with respect that it's a bold statement. Sochan could be the pick if the spurs are something like 10-11, i don't see them going too high with him but in this range 9-11 with his youth, versatility, body ( 6'9 230 lbs 7'0 wingspan) he could be a very good pick imo. Lot of uspide.



Agree and we are not alone

https://twitter.com/matt_pennie/status/1505258451244625926
I agree, and he can guard multiple positions and he's a dog. He has massive potential and he's going to turn 19 a month before the draft. He might not do all the flashy things but he for sure looks like a game changer, could be a Draymond type of player but even bigger and stronger with the same speed on the perimeter if not better imo. He has legit 2 way player potential and I wouldn't be surprised if the Spurs have their eye on him.

[Mr. Body]

Hell, I wouldn't bat an eye if the Spurs selected him with their first pick.

[Atl Spur]

I like Sochan too��. I love defense and he give effort unlike his teammate brown!

[BackHome]

The only thing I don't like is he is not a shot blocker but he is a very good defender keeping his feet moving and understanding angles and schemes. It just depends on what the Spurs think and off course where we draft will determine a lot will see who keeps moving up in the mock drafts as March madness continues

[SPURt]

Either of you catch the super obvious out of bounds off North Carolina guy who dribbled it off himself?....
No challenge by Baylor.
Super key possession either end of reg or end of OT can't remember, but Baylor would get ball back down 3 or 2 (def chance to win or tie).
I heard announcer point it out. Did not hear, is this one of those super lame *cannot challenge* rules?
I didn’t start watching until 2 mins before the ejection. I don’t know if they used their one challenge before that. The out of bounds play happened at the 2:02 mark so the refs couldn’t look. NCAA refs are the worst. College sports is such a gross industry, I generally only watch March madness to look at Spurs prospects. Every time I do, the refs make NBA refs look so so much better.

[SPURt]

Is there anyway we can put the mind of Memphis’s Tyler Harris in Lonnie Walker’s body?

[GAustex]

This.
Lol

[Mr. Body]

I don't think Duren is as tall as he's listed.

[PhantomDashCam]

I don't think Duren is as tall as he's listed.

Yeah I’ve wondered about that too.

A weird thing I’d like to know is what is his hand size?
There were multiple plays to start the game where he could have dunked with his left
but kept forcing the ball to his right hand where he was stuffed at the ring by Chet.

Combine measurements could play a huge role for some of these guys.

[mystargtr34]

I don't think Duren is as tall as he's listed.

Yeah he’s been touted as a 6’11 guy mostly but during this season a few scout/analysts have said he looks closer to 6’9. My guess is that the combine measurements will reveal he’s about 6’9 without shoes which would make him 6’10 in the old NBA height. Apparently his wingspan is 7’5 so he should have a good standing reach.

I don’t think he’ll have a problem playing C in today’s NBA. Also I think he’s the type that will thrive more with better players around him, especially good passers who would allow
him to be a lob threat and above the rim floor spacer. He reminds me a bit of Robert Williams from Boston.

[BackHome]

Well we don’t have those players on our team only reason I am a hard pass on him.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Hell, I wouldn't bat an eye if the Spurs selected him with their first pick.



You really like him that much? I assume you're talking about the 8 or 9 pick. Would you still be okay with him if they got the 4 pick, knowing who all would be on the board? I'm just curious how much you like him.

I said before that I wasn't crazy about Eason with the Spurs' pick because he's been a me-first player, IMO. But I have to say, if it was a choice between him and Sochan my gut says Eason.

[Mr. Body]

You really like him that much? I assume you're talking about the 8 or 9 pick. Would you still be okay with him if they got the 4 pick, knowing who all would be on the board? I'm just curious how much you like him.

I said before that I wasn't crazy about Eason with the Spurs' pick because he's been a me-first player, IMO. But I have to say, if it was a choice between him and Sochan my gut says Eason.

I'm not saying I would select Sochan at 7 or 8. I'm saying I can totally see the Spurs taking him there even if draft boards are showing him lower.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I'm not saying I would select Sochan at 7 or 8. I'm saying I can totally see the Spurs taking him there even if draft boards are showing him lower.


Okay, I get that. I confess I didn't pay that much attention to him this year. I spent more time deciding I didn't like Kendall Brown as much as a lot of the mocks. But I wouldn't mind seeing someone who plays defense being drafted with one of those later picks.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

My board right now.

Tier 1: Holmgren, Ivey, Smith, Banchero - generally weaker top tier compared to most drafts but pretty equal in terms of quality and projection. Wouldn't surprise me if Ivey goes 2nd, even 1st, depending on which team gets the number 1 pick.
Wild card: Sharpe - no idea where to put him, his stock will depend a whole lot on workouts, but he seems the kind of player who'd excel in an empty gym. If the Spurs pick around 7th/8th/9th and he's still there I'd be totally fine rolling the dice.
Tier 2: Davis, Mathurin, Griffin, Murray - again, not great mid-lottery talent compared to past drafts. Currently I like Davis and Mathurin the most, both projecting to be good NBA scorers and decent defenders, i.e. high floors.
Tier 3: Sochan, Duren, Eason, Hardy, Baldwin Jr, Daniels, Kessler, Washington, Branham - yet again, not impressive. I believe Hardy and Baldwin will be selected higher than currently projected based on talent rather than production just like Ziaire Williams last year. Same with Houstan, Christie, Watson if they declare. Major questions about literally everyone's ability to score efficiently on the NBA level, bar Branham, who seems to have a low-ish ceiling.

[objective]

I've watched everything on Spagnolo except the full games, that's still to come, but I really like what I've seen.

He's decently young, 19 and a half at draft time, turns 20 in January. He's allegedly 6-4, but I think he's closer to 6-3. Eye test looks like he does not have long arms, which does contribute to his lack of steals and watching some clips suggests he won't be a plus defender.

But damn he can be fun to watch. His handle is pretty slick and he can get downhill at the current level of competition. He has the pull up 3 and overall hits 3s at a good clip, though the attempts per game are low. His passing in the pick and roll is promising, and in general his use of fakes I think is advanced for his age. There's some Manu-type flashes with his passing, it's that fun. But lots of turnovers too, and if there's Manu flashes in passing there might be Marco flashes on defense.

I also like how he is able to seek out contact and use use it to score at that level, something that has been missing from the Spurs backcourt for years now

On to the full games if they're on YouTube

[duncan2150]

Yeah he’s been touted as a 6’11 guy mostly but during this season a few scout/analysts have said he looks closer to 6’9. My guess is that the combine measurements will reveal he’s about 6’9 without shoes which would make him 6’10 in the old NBA height. Apparently his wingspan is 7’5 so he should have a good standing reach.

I don’t think he’ll have a problem playing C in today’s NBA. Also I think he’s the type that will thrive more with better players around him, especially good passers who would allow
him to be a lob threat and above the rim floor spacer. He reminds me a bit of Robert Williams from Boston.


I also think he's close to 6'10 than 6'11.

I like your comp with Rob Williams, i think he's a better version of him with more upside.

[R. DeMurre]

There's a distinction there, in a similar vein to players who were clearly on a Hall of Fame trek only to be derailed by injury.



Beyond that, the Warriors just didn't have a long enough run at or near the top to earn dynasty status.


I'd agree with you that it was a shorter run than the 60s Celtics, 80s Lakers, 90s Bulls, etc., but I still think having a five year run with a 73 win season sandwiched in between two 67 win seasons plus three titles is good enough material for a modern day NBA dynasty. It seems this debate got a little off track though-- the original point was that they built the core of their team primarily through the relatively ordinary draft picks of a #7 + a #11 + a #35, and I'd still say that's pretty impressive. Teams like Sacramento, the Knicks, and quite a few others have consistently had similar or better chances and not even produced playoff teams.

Durant's a whole other topic, but I've always sided with him & the Warriors on that one. Staying with Westbrook would've simply been a bad basketball decision on Durant's part, and I think more & more people are seeing that. I can't fault a guy for wanting to play with guys who play the right way fundamentally over anchoring himself to Russ. People were dazzled by Westbrook's number for a while, but most have come around now to the opinion that his style of play-- low efficiency shooting, poor shot selection, laziness on defense, high usage rate, high turnovers-- is not conducive to winning championships. I'd judge Durant more harshly if he'd stayed in OKC for sentimental reasons, ignoring the fact that it wasn't the best move to make at the time.

[PhantomDashCam]

A quick 7 - 8 minute video where Ryan puts forward what he has heard from 5 different NBA FO types from 5 different teams…
One even has Shaedon Sharpe as number deuce on his board…


https://youtu.be/EWNxSz39eT8

[Mr. Body]

Taking a guy who you don't even know if he can play college ball with a #2 pick seems insane. It's not like you're picking Kemp or Bryant or some other dude straight out of high school. He wasn't that good in high school.

[CGD]

Liking EJ Lindell the more I watch. Wouldn’t be bad with one of the later picks

[TD 21]

I'd agree with you that it was a shorter run than the 60s Celtics, 80s Lakers, 90s Bulls, etc., but I still think having a five year run with a 73 win season sandwiched in between two 67 win seasons plus three titles is good enough material for a modern day NBA dynasty. It seems this debate got a little off track though-- the original point was that they built the core of their team primarily through the relatively ordinary draft picks of a #7 + a #11 + a #35, and I'd still say that's pretty impressive. Teams like Sacramento, the Knicks, and quite a few others have consistently had similar or better chances and not even produced playoff teams.

Durant's a whole other topic, but I've always sided with him & the Warriors on that one. Staying with Westbrook would've simply been a bad basketball decision on Durant's part, and I think more & more people are seeing that. I can't fault a guy for wanting to play with guys who play the right way fundamentally over anchoring himself to Russ. People were dazzled by Westbrook's number for a while, but most have come around now to the opinion that his style of play-- low efficiency shooting, poor shot selection, laziness on defense, high usage rate, high turnovers-- is not conducive to winning championships. I'd judge Durant more harshly if he'd stayed in OKC for sentimental reasons, ignoring the fact that it wasn't the best move to make at the time.

I agree the standards should be shorter for a modern day dynasty, but 3 (one highly questionable, two tainted) in 5 years is still not enough and the regular season wins only mean so much.

Yeah, impressively lucky . . . and yes, I consider the Spurs and all the others luck too. Other than generational prospects like Robinson and Duncan, the idea that any of those teams had a clue that the majority of their core would become the players/fit they became, is absurd.

Durant could have played anywhere and in addition to those two teams, had meetings with the Celtics, Clippers, Heat and Spurs. If he were leaving the Thunder for so called altruistic basketball reasons, he could have come to the Spurs.

Instead, it was about taking the easy way out. I agree that he shoulders too much of the blame though. Their core (particularly golden boy) deserve their fair share.

[wildbill2u]

What does our group of draft gurus think about New Mexico State player Teddy Allen. Saw him in the tournament and was impressed by how he took over the game on offense for the Lobos in their upset win.

I know, I know, we already have plenty of 6'6" players, but he looks like a natural shooter and none of them are. He's also pretty damn burly although listed at only 212 lbs..

He was WAC player of the year.

[Kurik]

Liking EJ Lindell the more I watch. Wouldn’t be bad with one of the later picks

Liddell is my favorite for the 3rd FRP, he needs to work on his ball security though he was pretty rough at the end of the game and lost a couple critical possessions. Would love to see him off the bench as a scorer in a sort of Spurs Rudy Gay role plus the ability to block on the weak side.

[tonight...you]

Lord. Chet looks like a tired, withered husk of a human.
Dude can ball though.

[PhantomDashCam]

What does our group of draft gurus think about New Mexico State player Teddy Allen. Saw him in the tournament and was impressed by how he took over the game on offense for the Lobos in their upset win.

I know, I know, we already have plenty of 6'6" players, but he looks like a natural shooter and none of them are. He's also pretty damn burly although listed at only 212 lbs..

He was WAC player of the year.

I think he's tough as nails and plays with an edge. I also think he's probably as anti-Spur as it gets when I've seen him interviewed multiple times. Here's an example:

https://youtu.be/8zAOkF5ftqM

My thinking is he'll go the P.J Tucker route.
Play overseas for a bit and then some team will take a flyer on him and may play a role in the future.

[PhantomDashCam]

1505672446397014028

Zeus' boy...Does that mean his nickname should be Hercules??

May not make it to late teens...

[objective]

Watched 6 quarters of Spagnolo ... based on that tiny sample, he's an atrocious defender. Eaten alive by nobodies.

He's like a combination of Forbes and Marco. Physically weak, upright, just bad.

[Kurik]

Johnny Davis is out of the top 10 for me, I think he is a good player but he has definitely struggled with tougher competition and the 3pt shot may be a struggle for him. If he fell to the second first round pick it would be a no brainer to pick him.

[CGD]

Liddell is my favorite for the 3rd FRP, he needs to work on his ball security though he was pretty rough at the end of the game and lost a couple critical possessions. Would love to see him off the bench as a scorer in a sort of Spurs Rudy Gay role plus the ability to block on the weak side.

I like him in that range. Will need to work on his body though (seems a little squishy).

[CGD]

Johnny Davis is out of the top 10 for me, I think he is a good player but he has definitely struggled with tougher competition and the 3pt shot may be a struggle for him. If he fell to the second first round pick it would be a no brainer to pick him.

It’s always hard to tell if it’s the player or the team when it comes to Wisconsin players. They play an atrociously painful to watch brand of defensive basketball that results in looooooow scoring games.

[Maddog]

It’s always hard to tell if it’s the player or the team when it comes to Wisconsin players. They play an atrociously painful to watch brand of defensive basketball that results in looooooow scoring games.

Man First time in a long time watching college basketball
It's sorta of painful.
I'm checking Davis off, was unimpressed. Caveat is I'm really bad at evaluating potential draftees

[CGD]

Man First time in a long time watching college basketball
It's sorta of painful.
I'm checking Davis off, was unimpressed. Caveat is I'm really bad at evaluating potential draftees

The Duke/MSU game was excellently played and the closest I’ve seen so far to “nba speed.” But the gulf is still big. These tourneys reminds me just how talented the pros are.

[Mr. Body]

Man First time in a long time watching college basketball
It's sorta of painful.
I'm checking Davis off, was unimpressed. Caveat is I'm really bad at evaluating potential draftees

College basketball is clearly played by amateurs. Guards who can barely bring the ball up the court. Poor shooters.

[MultiTroll]

Another meaningless win to move the Spurs draft chances back.

Yah!

[BackHome]

Yep, were going to draft a great bench warmer but at least wont hurt our draft chances in 2023

[Mr. Body]

He hasn't been on my radar as I don't think the Spurs need a SG or swing, but Mathurin is making big plays in an intense game between AZ and TCU.

[Mr. Body]

Holy shit, Mathurin's awesome.

[Drewlius]

Ya dude Mathurin is the play if he is still going to fall to our range, he might be shooting up after this tourny is all said and done though.

[Mr. Body]

Imagine having a guy who wants the ball in the clutch and works to get things done.

[Kurik]

Mathurin has been playing at a high level for most of the year and has the character the Spurs covet. He's a few steps above any wing the Spurs have offensively.

[mystargtr34]

Yeah I've liked Mathurin this year, he may not be a bad consolation prize if the Spurs end up in the 8-10 range of the draft. It still leaves the Spurs with a big hole at the 4 spot.

Assuming Smith, Holmgren, Banchero, Ivey are gone in the first 4 picks, you are left with Murray, Griffin, Sharpe, Duren, Mathurin, Sochan.

That's 6 guys I could live with with the Spurs first pick depending on where that pick is. Some are higher risk and higher potential (Sharpe) while others have higher floors and lower ceilings (Sochan).

[mystargtr34]

Im intrigued by Mark Williams from Duke with the later first round pick. Would probably have to be the Toronto pick in the 18-20 range. 7 footer with a reported 7-8 wingspan. Mike Schmitz on twitter said he apparently has a 9'8 standing reach which is ridiculous. That's Rudy Robert type length. Even a super long guy like Javale McGee 'only' has a 9'5 standing reach, which would be one of the longest in the entire league. He could backup Jakob for a season or two while he develops and would make Jakob a good trade option to improve the team in other areas.

[BatManu20]

Im intrigued by Mark Williams from Duke with the later first round pick. Would probably have to be the Toronto pick in the 18-20 range. 7 footer with a reported 7-8 wingspan. Mike Schmitz on twitter said he apparently has a 9'8 standing reach which is ridiculous. That's Rudy Robert type length. Even a super long guy like Javale McGee 'only' has a 9'5 standing reach, which would be one of the longest in the entire league. He could backup Jakob for a season or two while he develops and would make Jakob a good trade option to improve the team in other areas.

Agreed. He’s got size & length you can’t teach. Plus he’s a solid FT shooter, which is a huge plus. He and Walker Kessler from Auburn are trending upwards though so not sure either would be available at 17-18.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Agreed. He’s got size & length you can’t teach. Plus he’s a solid FT shooter, which is a huge plus. He and Walker Kessler from Auburn are trending upwards though so not sure either would be available at 17-18.

Pretty sure between them 2 and Duren, at least one would be available before pick 20. Even in a weak draft rim running bigs aren't likely to be in high demand.

[duncan2150]

Im intrigued by Mark Williams from Duke with the later first round pick. Would probably have to be the Toronto pick in the 18-20 range. 7 footer with a reported 7-8 wingspan. Mike Schmitz on twitter said he apparently has a 9'8 standing reach which is ridiculous. That's Rudy Robert type length. Even a super long guy like Javale McGee 'only' has a 9'5 standing reach, which would be one of the longest in the entire league. He could backup Jakob for a season or two while he develops and would make Jakob a good trade option to improve the team in other areas.


I really think, like i said a few days ago, that the Spurs could find a quality back up big with one of their last picks.

Williams is one of my favourite in this idea, with Kessler and Koloko/Kamagate ( a little bit later). They can give you some quality 15-20 minutes per game and replace Poetl in a few years for cheap.

I'm with you on this.

[dbestpro]

I continue to say Big Ten players are over rated.

[KobesAchilles]

I really think, like i said a few days ago, that the Spurs could find a quality back up big with one of their last picks.

Williams is one of my favourite in this idea, with Kessler and Koloko/Kamagate ( a little bit later). They can give you some quality 15-20 minutes per game and replace Poetl in a few years for cheap.

I'm with you on this.
We already have a quality back up big in Poeltl. Is there a starting big man in this draft?

[duncan2150]

We already have a quality back up big in Poeltl. Is there a starting big man in this draft?

When i said "back up big" it's because they could be back up first and then better than Poetl.

If we talk about C's the number one and capable starter for sure is Duren and maybe Kessler.


After them, i have Mark Williams and Christian Koloko.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8owJP3W6SVY
Williams vs Mich State yesterday

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yKknftHhq0A
Kessler did not play too much yesterday in Auburn loss but he was good a few days ago against jacksonville


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNga8rKBs4g
Monster game by Koloko yesterday 28 pts 12/13 shooting 12 rebounds 3 blocks

Don't know what people think about this C position on this Spurs team, as we often say that C are not that valuable nowadays but if we have a shot at a legit C who can protect the rim with one of our last picks, i'm in. I think that's a must need for the Spurs.

[KobesAchilles]

Don't know what people think about this C position on this Spurs team, as we often say that C are not that valuable nowadays but if we have a shot at a legit C who can protect the rim with one of our last picks, i'm in. I think that's a must need for the Spurs.
We are in full agreement here

[Thomas82]

We already have a quality back up big in Poeltl. Is there a starting big man in this draft?

I still think he gets traded this summer.

[MultiTroll]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wNga8rKBs4g
Monster game by Koloko yesterday 28 pts 12/13 shooting 12 rebounds 3 blocks

Don't know what people think about this C position on this Spurs team, as we often say that C are not that valuable nowadays but if we have a shot at a legit C who can protect the rim with one of our last picks, i'm in. I think that's a must need for the Spurs.
Very impressed with Koloko esp given his retard coach who hardly ever works to offense to get K a shot, that is including Euro point guard who is trash.

Kessler another victim of retard offensive strategy. Would be happy if Spurs got either one late.

[TD 21]

If it goes according to projections, I've settled on Mathurin (he's a foreign 2.5; if he were bi-racial, he'd be a virtual lock) as the most likely pick.

After they try and fail to move up for Banchero at probably 3 (some combination of the 3 1sts, Poeltl and Richardson, should be in play, as well as a third team like the Hornets, which would add Washington, Jones+, if a team prefers that to Poeltl), of course.

[PhantomDashCam]

If it goes according to projections, I've settled on Mathurin (he's a foreign 2.5; if he were bi-racial, he'd be a virtual lock) as the most likely pick.

After they try and fail to move up for Banchero at probably 3 (some combination of the 3 1sts, Poeltl and Richardson, should be in play, as well as a third team like the Hornets, which would add Washington, Jones+, if a team prefers that to Poeltl), of course.

I’m still really high on Kai Jones and would prefer for the Spurs to keep him and reroute any other collateral from a proposed Charlotte deal.
He’s already ahead of where most pundits thought he would be and I maintain he’ll be a starter by the end of his second season, perhaps even earlier than that.

Here he is going up against Jordan Bell, still a noted defender, and just goes right at him on several occasions. Greensboro is a terrible team and I believe that it’s one of the reasons his play is flying under the radar.


https://youtu.be/nCJRUFL5O1k

[mystargtr34]

honest quesiion who the hell is Kai Jones?

[bluebellmaniac]

We already have a quality back up big in Poeltl. Is there a starting big man in this draft?

Chet... But he'll need a couple years.

[ZeusWillJudge]

Very impressed with Koloko esp given his retard coach who hardly ever works to offense to get K a shot, that is including Euro point guard who is trash.

Kessler another victim of retard offensive strategy. Would be happy if Spurs got either one late.


I agree with both of those. Both are more "old school" big men, but they're both big and strong and you need a guy like that on the roster to keep teams with legit bigs from crushing you in the paint. I think Koloko will get more attention, but that could make Kessler a late bargain.

I don't think Koloko has ever made a 3, even in practice. Kessler launched quite a few this year. His percentage sucked, but at least there's some promise. But Koloko got to the line a lot more and made a massive improvement in his FT%, which is never an accident.

People talk a lot about trading Poeltl for value. Either one of them might make that a little more palatable. It would probably take a couple of years for either one to learn the NBA game enough to be as good as he is right now. But if the Spurs keep Poeltl, those guys would be great to hold down the middle while he gets rest.

But a couple of months ago I mentioned Hunter Di(kinson. He may go higher than I thought back then, because he's played consistently well, and he's been good in the tourney. But he's one of the guys who makes me wish the Spurs still had their own second rounder as well as the Lakers'. I know he's not as athletic but he's a good passer, he is the best of the three from the arc, and he gets to the line and knocks them down. He also sets good picks, which is a dying art. In two years time, I really do think he could be the most complete C of the three.

[PhantomDashCam]

honest quesiion who the hell is Kai Jones?

He was the 19th pick in the draft last year. 6"10, 220 lbs, plays the 4/5. He was linked to the Spurs on draft day (who ultimately selected Josh Primo), and then again at the trade deadline (where a package of Poeltl for PJ Washington + Kai Jones was supposedly discussed).
He would likely go Top 10 in this draft based on his current G-League play and considering the age of the prospects around where he would be selected... No Hyperbole.

He's still a little raw right now but has grown tremendously in the last 6 months and further still from his first year at Texas in 2020.
Honestly, a very rare combination of elite athleticism, High Motor-Hard worker who is starting to scratch the surface of what he may become.

Second last game he played...


https://youtu.be/ua01Zd9BdKM

[duncan2150]

But a couple of months ago I mentioned Hunter Di(kinson. He may go higher than I thought back then, because he's played consistently well, and he's been good in the tourney. But he's one of the guys who makes me wish the Spurs still had their own second rounder as well as the Lakers'. I know he's not as athletic but he's a good passer, he is the best of the three from the arc, and he gets to the line and knocks them down. He also sets good picks, which is a dying art. In two years time, I really do think he could be the most complete C of the three.

I like dickison, he's good on the offensive end but i think he could be a liability on defense. We'll see but he has talent for sure.

[ZeusWillJudge]

I like dickison, he's good on the offensive end but i think he could be a liability on defense. We'll see but he has talent for sure.


I think his problem on defense is range, more than IQ. All three of those guys, really, are interior defenders. That's why I said that they would all be situational. (My opinion - I get that.) But if the Spurs are ever going to be serious contenders again, they will have to be able to compete against the teams who play big.

Even if the Spurs' rebuild efforts, draft/trade etc., go pretty perfect it will still be a couple of years before they start to gel. So having a young big man in the pipeline seems like a good thing. Let em all grow up together. I don't know that I would do it this draft, but I wouldn't complain if they decided to do it.

[TD 21]

I’m still really high on Kai Jones and would prefer for the Spurs to keep him and reroute any other collateral from a proposed Charlotte deal.
He’s already ahead of where most pundits thought he would be and I maintain he’ll be a starter by the end of his second season, perhaps even earlier than that.

Here he is going up against Jordan Bell, still a noted defender, and just goes right at him on several occasions. Greensboro is a terrible team and I believe that it’s one of the reasons his play is flying under the radar.


https://youtu.be/nCJRUFL5O1k

Yeah, I wrote it somewhat convolutedly, but I'd prefer and suspect they would retain him too.

I'm not as high on him as you, but he is interesting and would fill a developmental need.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1506395294254129161

[BackHome]

Nice article thanks for posting it.

[BacktoBasics]

1506395294254129161

Drew Timme looks like a 46 year old dad that’s had enough of his kids bullshit.

[PhantomDashCam]

Updated Mock from Mike Schmitz and Jonathon Giovony heading into the Sweet 16. Not sure what to make of Griffin atm but would love the Wesley pick...

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/insider/story/_/id/33546525/2022-nba-mock-draft-how-top-prospects-fared-ncaa-men-basketball-tournament

1. Houston Rockets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/hou/houston-rockets)
Chet Holmgren (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433255/chet-holmgren) | Gonzaga | 7-0 | PF | Age: 19.8

2. Orlando Magic (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/orl/orlando-magic)
Jabari Smith (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432639/jabari-smith) | Auburn | 6-10 | SF/PF | Age: 18.8

3. Indiana Pacers (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/ind/indiana-pacers)
Paolo Banchero (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432573/paolo-banchero) | Duke | 6-10 | PF/C | Age: 19.3

4. Oklahoma City Thunder (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/okc/oklahoma-city-thunder)
Jaden Ivey (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433218/jaden-ivey) | Purdue | 6-4 | PG/SG | Age: 20.0

5. Detroit Pistons (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/det/detroit-pistons)
Keegan Murray (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4594327/keegan-murray) | Iowa | 6-9 | PF/C | Age: 21.5

6. Sacramento Kings (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/sac/sacramento-kings)
Shaedon Sharpe (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4914336/shaedon-sharpe) | Kentucky | 6-6 | SG | Age: 18.8

7. Portland Trail Blazers (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/por/portland-trail-blazers)
Jalen Duren (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433621/jalen-duren) | Memphis | 6-10 | C | Age: 18.3

8. San Antonio Spurs (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/sa/san-antonio-spurs)
AJ Griffin (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432585/aj-griffin) | Duke | 6-6 | SF/PF | Age: 18.5

9. New Orleans Pelicans (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/no/new-orleans-pelicans) (from Lakers)
Johnny Davis (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432356/johnny-davis) | Wisconsin | 6-5 | PG/SG | Age: 20.0

10. Washington Wizards (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/wsh/washington-wizards)
Dyson Daniels | G League Ignite | 6-6 | PG/SG | Age: 19.0

11. New York Knicks (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/ny/new-york-knicks)
Bennedict Mathurin (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683634/bennedict-mathurin) | Arizona | 6-6 | SF | Age: 19.7

12. Portland Trail Blazers (from Pelicans)
Ochai Agbaji (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4397018/ochai-agbaji) | Kansas | 6-6 | SF | Age: 21.9

13. Atlanta Hawks (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/atl/atlanta-hawks)
Jeremy Sochan (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4610139/jeremy-sochan) | Baylor | 6-9 | PF | Age: 18.8

14. Charlotte Hornets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/cha/charlotte-hornets) (Hawks if 19-30)
TyTy Washington Jr. (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683749/tyty-washington-jr) | Kentucky | 6-4 | PG/SG | Age: 20.3

15. Oklahoma City Thunder (from Clippers)
Tari Eason (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433192/tari-eason) | LSU | 6-8 | PF | Age: 20.8

16. Houston Rockets (from Nets)
Malaki Branham (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4565201/malaki-branham) | Ohio St. | 6-5 | SG | Age: 18.8

17. Indiana Pacers
Kennedy Chandler (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432646/kennedy-chandler) | Tennessee | 6-1 | PG | Age: 19.5

18. Chicago Bulls (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/chi/chicago-bulls)
E.J. Liddell (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432821/ej-liddell) | Ohio St. | 6-7 | PF | Age: 21.2

19. Minnesota Timberwolves (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/min/minnesota-timberwolves)
Ousmane Dieng | NZ Breakers | 6-10 | SF/PF | Age: 18.8

20. San Antonio Spurs (from Raptors)
Blake Wesley (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683935/blake-wesley) | Notre Dame | 6-5 | SG | Age: 19.0

21. Brooklyn Nets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/bkn/brooklyn-nets) (from 76ers)
Mark Williams (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4701232/mark-williams) | Duke | 7-1 | C | Age: 20.2

22. San Antonio Spurs (from Celtics)
Nikola Jovic | Mega Mozzart | 6-10 | SF | Age: 18.7
...

[CGD]

^ I would be very happy if we land Griffin with our natural pick.

[CGD]

I think Sochan is getting overhyped right now, but no brainer if he’s available with the TOR pick. Also liked what I saw from Branham from OSU and Moore from Duke.

[Atl Spur]

Sochan or Ben

[Mr. Body]

Updated Mock from Mike Schmitz and Jonathon Giovony heading into the Sweet 16. Not sure what to make of Griffin atm but would love the Wesley pick...

https://www.espn.com/nba/insider/insider/story/_/id/33546525/2022-nba-mock-draft-how-top-prospects-fared-ncaa-men-basketball-tournament

1. Houston Rockets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/hou/houston-rockets)
Chet Holmgren (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433255/chet-holmgren) | Gonzaga | 7-0 | PF | Age: 19.8

2. Orlando Magic (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/orl/orlando-magic)
Jabari Smith (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432639/jabari-smith) | Auburn | 6-10 | SF/PF | Age: 18.8

3. Indiana Pacers (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/ind/indiana-pacers)
Paolo Banchero (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432573/paolo-banchero) | Duke | 6-10 | PF/C | Age: 19.3

4. Oklahoma City Thunder (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/okc/oklahoma-city-thunder)
Jaden Ivey (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433218/jaden-ivey) | Purdue | 6-4 | PG/SG | Age: 20.0

5. Detroit Pistons (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/det/detroit-pistons)
Keegan Murray (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4594327/keegan-murray) | Iowa | 6-9 | PF/C | Age: 21.5

6. Sacramento Kings (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/sac/sacramento-kings)
Shaedon Sharpe (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4914336/shaedon-sharpe) | Kentucky | 6-6 | SG | Age: 18.8

7. Portland Trail Blazers (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/por/portland-trail-blazers)
Jalen Duren (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433621/jalen-duren) | Memphis | 6-10 | C | Age: 18.3

8. San Antonio Spurs (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/sa/san-antonio-spurs)
AJ Griffin (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432585/aj-griffin) | Duke | 6-6 | SF/PF | Age: 18.5

9. New Orleans Pelicans (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/no/new-orleans-pelicans) (from Lakers)
Johnny Davis (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432356/johnny-davis) | Wisconsin | 6-5 | PG/SG | Age: 20.0

10. Washington Wizards (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/wsh/washington-wizards)
Dyson Daniels | G League Ignite | 6-6 | PG/SG | Age: 19.0

11. New York Knicks (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/ny/new-york-knicks)
Bennedict Mathurin (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683634/bennedict-mathurin) | Arizona | 6-6 | SF | Age: 19.7

12. Portland Trail Blazers (from Pelicans)
Ochai Agbaji (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4397018/ochai-agbaji) | Kansas | 6-6 | SF | Age: 21.9

13. Atlanta Hawks (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/atl/atlanta-hawks)
Jeremy Sochan (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4610139/jeremy-sochan) | Baylor | 6-9 | PF | Age: 18.8

14. Charlotte Hornets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/cha/charlotte-hornets) (Hawks if 19-30)
TyTy Washington Jr. (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683749/tyty-washington-jr) | Kentucky | 6-4 | PG/SG | Age: 20.3

15. Oklahoma City Thunder (from Clippers)
Tari Eason (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4433192/tari-eason) | LSU | 6-8 | PF | Age: 20.8

16. Houston Rockets (from Nets)
Malaki Branham (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4565201/malaki-branham) | Ohio St. | 6-5 | SG | Age: 18.8

17. Indiana Pacers
Kennedy Chandler (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432646/kennedy-chandler) | Tennessee | 6-1 | PG | Age: 19.5

18. Chicago Bulls (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/chi/chicago-bulls)
E.J. Liddell (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4432821/ej-liddell) | Ohio St. | 6-7 | PF | Age: 21.2

19. Minnesota Timberwolves (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/min/minnesota-timberwolves)
Ousmane Dieng | NZ Breakers | 6-10 | SF/PF | Age: 18.8

20. San Antonio Spurs (from Raptors)
Blake Wesley (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4683935/blake-wesley) | Notre Dame | 6-5 | SG | Age: 19.0

21. Brooklyn Nets (https://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/bkn/brooklyn-nets) (from 76ers)
Mark Williams (https://www.espn.com/mens-college-basketball/player/_/id/4701232/mark-williams) | Duke | 7-1 | C | Age: 20.2

22. San Antonio Spurs (from Celtics)
Nikola Jovic | Mega Mozzart | 6-10 | SF | Age: 18.7
...


I believe Toronto and Boston are at 17 and 23 right now, but maybe ESPN has the final standings from the NBA already? The fix is in? :lol

[exstatic]

I believe Toronto and Boston are at 17 and 23 right now, but maybe ESPN has the final standings from the NBA already? The fix is in? :lol

They’ve got the current position of pick 12, Portland from New Orleans, is two picks off, low.