Mountaintop Monastery of Dejounte Murray

[Chomag]

This guy is serving me up some major crow and I'm loving it!

[John B]

1489706517582467073

I have a felling Murray will be selected with all other players (and coaches) voicing out for him.

[KobesAchilles]

When are they going to announce the replacement for Green?

[exstatic]

When are they going to announce the replacement for Green?

Whenever Silver stops crying about it needing to be DeJounte Murray….

[Degoat]

Whenever Silver stops crying about it needing to be DeJounte Murray….

I hope I’m wrong, but Ive got a feeling they’re waiting for the dust to settle on DJ being snubbed to replace green with Anthony Davis because players and coaches are supporting DJ as the replacement right now so why not go ahead and name him?

[exstatic]

I hope I’m wrong, but Ive got a feeling they’re waiting for the dust to settle on DJ being snubbed to replace green with Anthony Davis because players and coaches are supporting DJ as the replacement right now so why not go ahead and name him?

If Silver does this, it would be a pure LeBron power play, and I’d dump Klutch the next day, if I were DJ.

[KingKev]

If Silver does this, it would be a pure LeBron power play, and I’d dump Klutch the next day, if I were DJ.

This is a reach. Besides Lebron probably prefers AD healthy and rested and he himself is a huge proponent of DJ.

[exstatic]

This is a reach. Besides Lebron probably prefers AD healthy and rested and he himself is a huge proponent of DJ.

LeBron complains, and suddenly the ASB is a week, instead of 4 days.

You really don’t understand how the league works.

[MultiTroll]

LeBron complains, and suddenly the ASB is a week, instead of 4 days.

You really don’t understand how the league works.
Players had been wanting this for a long time.
If Lebron helped push it thru, good for him.

NBA All-Star Break extended to one week, most teams off 8 or 9 days - ProBasketballTalk | NBC Sports (https://nba.nbcsports.com/2014/08/13/nba-all-star-break-extended-will-be-8-or-9-days-for-teams-this-year/)

[TD 21]

I hope I’m wrong, but Ive got a feeling they’re waiting for the dust to settle on DJ being snubbed to replace green with Anthony Davis because players and coaches are supporting DJ as the replacement right now so why not go ahead and name him?

Of course. As usual, the Spurs won't say a peep.

Ultimately, Wiggins probably took Murray's spot though. Typical Spurs bad luck.

[KobesAchilles]

It is ridiculous how NOW we reward winning. Utah having 3 all stars, the Hawks had 4 one year, GS with 3. But when it was the Spurs doing the winning, not once did the big 3 all make it together. If they choose AD who played half the season and is on a losing team also then that would be a disservice to small market teams. Not that Silver cares.

[XDT76]

It is ridiculous how NOW we reward winning. Utah having 3 all stars, the Hawks had 4 one year, GS with 3. But when it was the Spurs doing the winning, not once did the big 3 all make it together. If they choose AD who played half the season and is on a losing team also then that would be a disservice to small market teams. Not that Silver cares.

GS got 4 twice

[TDomination]

i just read this article from SI.com and truly surprised how many people actually said that Murray got snubbed. Nice to see DJ get some national attention.



Who is the biggest All-Star snub in the West?

Beck: I don’t believe in snubs. There’s only 12 spots, and someone worthy always gets left out. That’s why it’s considered an honor. (Is there an echo in here?) Certainly, some others had a case—Dejounte Murray, Anthony Edwards, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander—but it’s no crime that any were left off, especially given their teams’ records.

Pina: Dejounte Murray, who is a triple-double machine (only Nikola Jokić has more) and has a positive impact on all facets of the game while dictating San Antonio’s tempo and overseeing an offense that falls apart when he’s on the bench (https://www.nba.com/stats/team/1610612759/onoffcourt-summary/?sort=DIFF_OFF_RATING&dir=1). He also leads the NBA in steals and ranks fourth in assists.

Mannix: Dejounte Murray leads the Spurs in like 47 categories. With Draymond bowing out, Silver should plug Murray in.

Herring: I racked my brain to come up with a complaint. But I honestly think the West roster looks about the way it should for now. Would love for Dejounte Murray to replace the injured Draymond Green, though Green is a frontcourt player and Murray is a guard.

Nadkarni: Dejounte Murray. And this is all because of Wiggins starting. Draymond Green or Rudy Gobert should have been a starter, and Murray should have Wiggins’s spot. Murray’s rounded averages are 20/9/9, with two steals a night to boot. And he does this with way more attention from opposing defenses than Wiggins. I’m not trying to tear down anyone—Wiggins has had a really good season and his improvement should be applauded. But if we are splitting hairs among the best of the best, then Murray has a better case to be headed to Cleveland.

Lundberg: I don't think there are any snubs, especially since I'd bet Dejounte Murray will be Green's injury replacement. Murray is the most deserving of those who did not make the initial roster.

Moss: Dejounte Murray. He’s averaging 20 PPG. On top of that, he’s second among guards in the league in RPG and fourth in APG. He also has 10 triple-doubles this season. SNUBBED.

https://www.si.com/nba/2022/02/04/nba-all-star-game-reserves-snubs-surprises-dejounte-murray-lamelo-ball

[John B]

i just read this article from SI.com and truly surprised how many people actually said that Murray got snubbed. Nice to see DJ get some national attention.



Who is the biggest All-Star snub in the West?

Beck: I don’t believe in snubs. There’s only 12 spots, and someone worthy always gets left out. That’s why it’s considered an honor. (Is there an echo in here?) Certainly, some others had a case—Dejounte Murray, Anthony Edwards, Shai Gilgeous-Alexander—but it’s no crime that any were left off, especially given their teams’ records.

Pina: Dejounte Murray, who is a triple-double machine (only Nikola Jokić has more) and has a positive impact on all facets of the game while dictating San Antonio’s tempo and overseeing an offense that falls apart when he’s on the bench (https://www.nba.com/stats/team/1610612759/onoffcourt-summary/?sort=DIFF_OFF_RATING&dir=1). He also leads the NBA in steals and ranks fourth in assists.

Mannix: Dejounte Murray leads the Spurs in like 47 categories. With Draymond bowing out, Silver should plug Murray in.

Herring: I racked my brain to come up with a complaint. But I honestly think the West roster looks about the way it should for now. Would love for Dejounte Murray to replace the injured Draymond Green, though Green is a frontcourt player and Murray is a guard.

Nadkarni: Dejounte Murray. And this is all because of Wiggins starting. Draymond Green or Rudy Gobert should have been a starter, and Murray should have Wiggins’s spot. Murray’s rounded averages are 20/9/9, with two steals a night to boot. And he does this with way more attention from opposing defenses than Wiggins. I’m not trying to tear down anyone—Wiggins has had a really good season and his improvement should be applauded. But if we are splitting hairs among the best of the best, then Murray has a better case to be headed to Cleveland.

Lundberg: I don't think there are any snubs, especially since I'd bet Dejounte Murray will be Green's injury replacement. Murray is the most deserving of those who did not make the initial roster.

Moss: Dejounte Murray. He’s averaging 20 PPG. On top of that, he’s second among guards in the league in RPG and fourth in APG. He also has 10 triple-doubles this season. SNUBBED.

https://www.si.com/nba/2022/02/04/nba-all-star-game-reserves-snubs-surprises-dejounte-murray-lamelo-ball

Murray will be getting in there. When do they announce the replacements?

[DAF86]

Nets open to trading Harden.

Would you? :wakeup

[R. DeMurre]

Nets open to trading Harden.

Would you? :wakeup


I wouldn't. He'll turn 33 this off season and his numbers seem to show at least a steady and subtle decline. He's not enough as your #1, but also seems to have some difficulty not being #1, and will demand a monumental salary. I don't think he'll age as gracefully as Lebron or Duncan, and he wasn't even much of a defender in his absolute prime.

[DAF86]

I wouldn't. He'll turn 33 this off season and his numbers seem to show at least a steady and subtle decline. He's not enough as your #1, but also seems to have some difficulty not being #1, and will demand a monumental salary. I don't think he'll age as gracefully as Lebron or Duncan, and he wasn't even much of a defender in his absolute prime.

Yeah, I don't think I would either. If Harden was a couple of years younger I totally would though.

[John B]

Nets open to trading Harden.

Would you? :wakeup

Nah too old for our young core. I'd rather we build a young team and try to keep them together as long as possible.

[lefty20]

1490792792356007937

[exstatic]

Yeah!!

[TDomination]

NBA All Star Dejounte Murray

Nice!

[RC_Drunkford]

Remember when we drafted him and Manu said „we‘re talking about a potential All-Star“? He actually got there

[Trill Clinton]

Proud of my young pup

[lefty]

Well deserved imo

[Mr. Body]

Nets open to trading Harden.

Would you? :wakeup

If I'm the Nets? Yes.

[exstatic]

Remember when we drafted him and Manu said „we‘re talking about a potential All-Star“? He actually got there

I thought it was an opposing college coach?

[RC_Drunkford]

I thought it was an opposing college coach?

the Spurs said it and even Manu did in an interview. It was actually on video

[exstatic]

Chinook, will you now admit there’s something a cut above in SA’s drafting? We got an AllStar at #29…for the SECOND time.

[PhantomDashCam]

Awesome. What a tremendous story.

A couple of seasons ago I wasn’t sure if he was our starting PG going forward and now he’s considered as one of the game’s elite players, selected by the commish no less.

https://www.spurstalk.com/forums/blob:https://www.spurstalk.com/3e04899a-a10e-45ba-9f06-8060eebd4035
https://www.google.com.au/url?sa=i&url=https%3A%2F%2Ftubitv.com%2Fseries%2F4065%2Fthe-commish&psig=AOvVaw26z07IwOwuSLQGB-KPP_1x&ust=1644357426620000&source=images&cd=vfe&ved=0CAsQjRxqFwoTCOi9oPXK7vUCFQAAAAAdAAAAABAO

[JeffDuncan]

Congratulations Dejounte Murray!

[RC_Drunkford]

Chinook, will you now admit there’s something a cut above in SA’s drafting? We got an AllStar at #29…for the SECOND time.

just thinking about the Suns drafting Dragan Bender at #4 and Georgios Papagiannis at #13 :lmao so many bad picks in this draft

[Chinook]

Chinook, will you now admit there’s something a cut above in SA’s drafting? We got an AllStar at #29…for the SECOND time.

You're being dishonest. I said (multiple times directly to you the last time we talked about it) the Spurs are a good drafting team. Their developmental staff is overrated. There are five players on the original ASG roster drafted after 29th overall (Bulter at 30th, Green, Jokic and Middleton as second-rounders and Van Vleet as a UDFA). I'm really happy Murray got his nod and think his performance in the game might be the single-most important game for the team this whole year. But no, this doesn't show the Spurs are an exceptional developmental staff. They got a good piece and didn't ruin him, but they are far from the only staff who has been able to get results from the bottom of the draft.

[John B]

All-Star, maybe Most Improved Player, then 1st Team All-Defense? Murray will be a household name and maybe help FA’s want to play with him

[RC_Drunkford]

“Very optimistic about his future,” Ginobili said. “It’s hard to tell if he’s going to be a great player and a potential All-Star right now or in five years. It just depends a lot on him. But he’s a very talented kid.”

https://www.expressnews.com/sports/spurs/article/Ginobili-thinks-Spurs-Murray-will-be-All-Star-12263781.php

Manu said this in 2017. Right on the money

[exstatic]

You're being dishonest. I said (multiple times directly to you the last time we talked about it) the Spurs are a good drafting team. Their developmental staff is overrated. There are five players on the original ASG roster drafted after 29th overall (Bulter at 30th, Green, Jokic and Middleton as second-rounders and Van Vleet as a UDFA). I'm really happy Murray got his nod and think his performance in the game might be the single-most important game for the team this whole year. But no, this doesn't show the Spurs are an exceptional developmental staff. They got a good piece and didn't ruin him, but they are far from the only staff who has been able to get results from the bottom of the draft.

Right. Everyone saw exactly what he was going to be, and 28 teams just said “nah”. Kid couldn’t dribble the ball or shoot when he got here.

[DAF86]

Hey, we got an all-star!

[Chinook]

Right. Everyone saw exactly what he was going to be, and 28 teams just said “nah”. Kid couldn’t dribble the ball or shoot when he got here.

You could use that logic with every player who became an All-Star not taken at the top of the draft. Sometimes like with Giannis and Gobert guys need to grow into their bodies. Sometimes like with Middleton, guys just keep honing their craft well past the point of what teams consider a realistic ceiling. Sometimes like with Green, the NBA game just suits them better. There are stories all over the league of guys who rose up. It's not common, but the pool of potential guys after the lottery is so much bigger than the top guys that it doesn't have to happen frequently to be apparent. And I mean, yeah, Murray fell to the Spurs. It wasn't like no one thought he had talent. Sometimes players with talent fall and then are never heard from again (Deyonta Davis from the same draft for example). Sometimes they fall and then get it together (Wood from the draft before). DeJounte had flaws, but he also had his great rookie games.

Anyway, I don't want to turn this into criticism of Murray, especially in this thread. I think he should be the MIP front-runner right now. But even if you attribute all of his growth directly to the Spurs developmental staff, having one such example doesn't set them apart, given how many other examples one can see pretty easily in the league right now. If this is the only measuring stick you have, then this ASG alone can put six teams above the Spurs.

[lefty]

LeBron will be joining the monastery.

:wow

[emanueldavidginobili]

1490840179543875584

[offset formation]

Well deserved...congrats to DJM

[Atl Spur]

To say the spurs aren’t the best or top 3 in the league at drafting & development is being delusional!

[KingKev]

To say the spurs aren’t the best or top 3 in the league at drafting & development is being delusional!

Who else are in your top 5?

[Mnky]

:wow

:bobo

[RC_Drunkford]

the Spurs have the best development staff in the league and it ain't even close if you ask me. Of course it comes down to the kid's work ethic and character, but the Spurs are one of the few teams who really take these type of things into consideration when drafting. I always thought DJ could be great, but what surprised me is how he developed his playmaking. I didn't see that coming. That's something that you can't really train, though somehow he did.

[Dejounte]

the Spurs have the best development staff in the league and it ain't even close if you ask me. Of course it comes down to the kid's work ethic and character, but the Spurs are one of the few teams who really take these type of things into consideration when drafting. I always thought DJ could be great, but what surprised me is how he developed his playmaking. I didn't see that coming. That's something that you can't really train, though somehow he did.

DJ only makes basic passes

[RC_Drunkford]

DJ only makes basic passes


that's not the point. He was turnover prone and just 2 seasons ago he averaged 4.1 assists on 1.9 TOs. He clearly improved a lot in that area. I don't need him to be Manu, just make the right play

[exstatic]

that's not the point. He was turnover prone and just 2 seasons ago he averaged 4.1 assists on 1.9 TOs. He clearly improved a lot in that area. I don't need him to be Manu, just make the right play

I need him to see guys on the fucking perimeter. He forces passes to Jak in traffic when the help defender digs down, not realizing that means SOMEONE IS WIDE FUCKING OPEN. Fucking Primo sees these passes, and he’s still younger than Dejounte was when he was drafted.

[Trill Clinton]

DJ went from one of spurstalk.com's most hated players to an All Star. He's been proving his doubters wrong his entire life.

[ceperez]

the Spurs have the best development staff in the league and it ain't even close if you ask me. Of course it comes down to the kid's work ethic and character, but the Spurs are one of the few teams who really take these type of things into consideration when drafting. I always thought DJ could be great, but what surprised me is how he developed his playmaking. I didn't see that coming. That's something that you can't really train, though somehow he did.

I used to believe this, but I think there a many teams in the running for this.

The reason the Spurs may not make the playoffs can be due to the league just getting better at finding gems. How did the Spurs miss out on Jokic? We got Kyle Anderson instead ( a slower player with less size).

[Dejounte]

that's not the point. He was turnover prone and just 2 seasons ago he averaged 4.1 assists on 1.9 TOs. He clearly improved a lot in that area. I don't need him to be Manu, just make the right play

I was being sarcastic. Folks keep moving the goal posts for Murray. Remember that guy who complained he wasn’t Kobe in the clutch? Now it’s “he can’t see guys on the perimeter.” I can link here many instances when he has, but it’s not worth the time. You can easily tell who watches the games from the garbage they spout.

[John B]

I need him to see guys on the fucking perimeter. He forces passes to Jak in traffic when the help defender digs down, not realizing that means SOMEONE IS WIDE FUCKING OPEN. Fucking Primo sees these passes, and he’s still younger than Dejounte was when he was drafted.

Kobe wasn’t a PG either, but when he passes to Fisher from a double-team, it’s on the money, literally on Fisher’s hands, ready to shoot. I need DJ to be like that finding an open guy, after he sucks the defenders in, besides finishing hard with contacts and earning FT’s. As I said in the other thread, I think we’re just beginning to see him elevating his game more. The kid has a chip on his shoulder, disproving people. With better players around him, hopefully next season, he’s just going to get open even more and being more creative. It’s crucial for PATFO to ride his momentum. I think Spurs will make moves that we ST fans are not accustomed to, maybe not by tomorrow, but for sure this Summer, to get Murray some help. I just don’t see them tanking another year.

[MannyIsGod]

There's zero doubt Primo has better court vision and is probably already a better 3 point shooter. So? Primo's court vision, IMO, is elite. DJM doesn't have that, and he probably never will. I don't think that's something players really develop. But DJM is averaging nearly double digits in assists meaning he's creating opportunities for his teammates to score. Yes, he does this through the course of the offense, but he's still doing at a very high level. His pull up jumper from the elbow is fucking elite. He needs to go to this more in late game situations, but he'll figure this out. I'm so excited to see him with someone else who can create out there to see how much better he does when the defense doesn't just focus on him.

Yeah, he forces some passes into Jakob, but he completes plenty and its not like he's a turnover machine. Far from it. Imagine if he had a big who was willing to dunk occasionally. DJM is a fantastic player. Just because he's not Jason Kidd doesn't mean shit. He does a certain set of things an an absolutely elite level and it doesn't matter if he fits the mold you think he should or not.

[exstatic]

I was being sarcastic. Folks keep moving the goal posts for Murray. Remember that guy who complained he wasn’t Kobe in the clutch? Now it’s “he can’t see guys on the perimeter.” I can link here many instances when he has, but it’s not worth the time. You can easily tell who watches the games from the garbage they spout.

I watch every game, and Primo has better court vision. Dejounte is mechanical, and locked into the play that is called. A pick and roll results in the roll man with the ball going to the hoop, or Dejounte pulling up for the elbow jumper. People complain that we don’t shoot enough 3s. This is why. Teams know that if they slightly delay the dig down, there will be no consequences at the arc. Once he’s accepted the screen, it’s either him, or the roller, lane traffic be damned.

[RC_Drunkford]

I watch every game, and Primo has better court vision. Dejounte is mechanical, and locked into the play that is called. A pick and roll results in the roll man with the ball going to the hoop, or Dejounte pulling up for the elbow jumper. People complain that we don’t shoot enough 3s. This is why. Teams know that if they slightly delay the dig down, there will be no consequences at the arc. Once he’s accepted the screen, it’s either him, or the roller, lane traffic be damned.

if Primo has better court vision, why does he average more TOs in the G-League than DJ does in the NBA?

[MannyIsGod]

Wait, are you really going to claim that the Spurs dont' shoot enough 3s because DJM in the PnR?

[MannyIsGod]

if Primo has better court vision, why does he average more TOs in the G-League than DJ does in the NBA?

Primo 100% has better court vision than DJM regardless of this stat.

[MannyIsGod]

The idea that we don't take as many 3s as other teams because of DJM not passing out to 3 point shooters on a PnR is one hell of a bad take. Other teams aren't getting open 3s off the PnR on a consistent basis. Definitely not enough to account for a higher volume of 3s. 4 out of the 5 top 3 point shooting teams by volume are in the bottom half of the league in PnR percentage. The exception is the Utah Jazz. The reason the Jazz are so good at the PnR isn't because of the guard, its because of Gobert and how easy he makes it on the guard to get points from that play.

[John B]

if Primo has better court vision, why does he average more TOs in the G-League than DJ does in the NBA?

Primo has better court vision at a young age. The TO was exactly that, young age. Heck, Manu was a TO machine earlier and he was already 24? And who would say Manu didn’t have great court vision because of his TO’s?

But contrary to DJ not getting there. He is a scholar of the game and a gym rat. Kawhi comes to mind.

[KingKev]

I was being sarcastic. Folks keep moving the goal posts for Murray. Remember that guy who complained he wasn’t Kobe in the clutch? Now it’s “he can’t see guys on the perimeter.” I can link here many instances when he has, but it’s not worth the time. You can easily tell who watches the games from the garbage they spout.

and those who on this board just can’t admit they are wrong. Let’s give DJ him some real targets to find. Not to take anything away from Jak but his offensive game is flourishing in part because of DJ.

[KingKev]

Primo has better court vision at a young age. The TO was exactly that, young age. Heck, Manu was a TO machine earlier and he was already 24? And who would say Manu didn’t have great court vision because of his TO’s?

But contrary to DJ not getting there. He is a scholar of the game and a gym rat. Kawhi comes to mind.

Yeah I don’t enjoy the Manu, Leonard and sometimes Parker comparisons that are all too often put forth with new Spurs but I agree here.

Once Primo earns his minutes and his coaches trust he is probably going to be a pretty good
play maker and you will live with some of his turnovers like we did with Manu.

Similarly DJ will continue to chip away at his craft the way Kawhi did.

Tall order for DJ or Primo to replicate Kawhi or Manu’s careers but I see the similarities in the way their development is and will emulate Kawhi and Manu respectively.

[Atl Spur]

Primo has a high bbiq and the talent to cultivate. Murray has come along way and deserves praise/recognition for his work! To me, Murray is still more a sg than pg by skill set.

[exstatic]

Primo has a high bbiq and the talent to cultivate. Murray has come along way and deserves praise/recognition for his work! To me, Murray is still more a sg than pg by skill set.

Oh shit, you’ve just called down the lightning…

[Atl Spur]

Oh shit, you’ve just called down the lightning…

Lol……..not worried at all :)

[MannyIsGod]

The differentiation between PG and SG is stupid, honestly. What you really mean is that Primo might be a better creator for others than Murray. That has nothing to do with a position that has historically be determined by height. Lebron James is not a point guard, yet he has the skills that so many people associate with a PG.

[Atl Spur]

The differentiation between PG and SG is stupid, honestly. What you really mean is that Primo might be a better creator for others than Murray. That has nothing to do with a position that has historically be determined by height. Lebron James is not a point guard, yet he has the skills that so many people associate with a PG.

Just so you know pg is typically the distributor/quarterback; the role is not solely or limited to just him.

[John B]

I think Murray is benefiting from the offense set for Demar as a distributor. Murray is taking it further.

I don't worry about Murray as a distributor. Just maybe the Nash/CP3 ally-op set-ups (possibly to John Collins) or Harden bounce pass in traffic. Again as a gym rat, I think he'll get those, as he becomes a stronger ballhandler and more defense collapse on him.

[XDT76]

No need to peg Murray into a specific role, Tony was not a great playmaker but he is still a HOF and multiple championship starting PG. I rather DjM improve on his handling so that he could take it to the rim more. Every player is unique in their playing style.

[emanueldavidginobili]

No need to peg Murray into a specific role, Tony was not a great playmaker but he is still a HOF and multiple championship starting PG. I rather DjM improve on his handling so that he could take it to the rim more. Every player is unique in their playing style.
I agree, shit DJ could go down as a better play maker than TP when it is all said and done. Tony had much better players around him and his career high in assist per game in a season is 7.7 I think DJ averages 8 for the rest of his career tbh.

[talkspurs]

When Murray is able to run the offense like Kidd/nash, shoot 3s like curry, play defense like kawhi/bowen, Drive like tp, Rebound like rodman, score in the paint like wilt, Be as high of character like david, quiet assassin like Tim then maybe I will say he is ok.

Who yall kidding you still would find 10 things (you think are) wrong with him and think he is not worth the contract. some of yall just hate on him.

[RC_Drunkford]

I'll never understand how people can hate a guy who when he tied David Robinson for most triple doubles in Spurs history said: "I was horrible". That was literally his first sentence after that question, but some people here think he's a stat padder. And if you think he's not a championship piece, mind you all he has to do is shoot better percentages and his numbers will go up further. He's in the Jrue Holiday category right now, so 3rd wheel at least while still having room to grow.

[emanueldavidginobili]

The kid is special he advanced his offensive game so much and everyone loves offense but on the other side of the ball this kid is one of the most disruptive and best defenders in the NBA. He has a great shot at NBA All-Defensive First team topping his NBA All-Defensive Second team when he was 21 years old lmao. Crazy he actually got that award then now that I think of it.

[John B]

I think Spurs fans have been used to 3 decades of players who just go about their business, and just let their game speak for itself. Then comes DJM and the social media. It’s not that I hated him, and will speak only for myself. But that’s just it. 3 decades of winning. It’s a lifetime. Then we start losing and DJM flexing in Instagram. To me that’s it. I’m happy for DJM. He’s gone a long way, and finally this year. No more Demar. He’s been given the key, averaging almost triple-double, All-Star. He is a Spurs draft at 29 and now sowing all his hard works. It couldn’t be any better than that. Now give this guy his Robin.

[talkspurs]

I think Spurs fans have been used to 3 decades of players who just go about their business, and just let their game speak for itself. Then comes DJM and the social media. It’s not that I hated him, and will speak only for myself. But that’s just it. 3 decades of winning. It’s a lifetime. Then we start losing and DJM flexing in Instagram. To me that’s it. I’m happy for DJM. He’s gone a long way, and finally this year. No more Demar. He’s been given the key, averaging almost triple-double, All-Star. He is a Spurs draft at 29 and now sowing all his hard works. It couldn’t be any better than that. Now give this guy his Robin.

I dont have a problem with you as you have atleast admitted you were wrong on him. The ones that frustrate me are the ones that still act like he is stat padding and would not start on a good team. These are the ones that no matter what he does will always find things wrong with him (instead of saying he is good) because they have something against him.

[Dejounte]

I dont have a problem with you as you have atleast admitted you were wrong on him. The ones that frustrate me are the ones that still act like he is stat padding and would not start on a good team. These are the ones that no matter what he does will always find things wrong with him (instead of saying he is good) because they have something against him.

There are people who think he’s not a star even though he’s literally an all-star now. Insane. I think reality will set in for those people once DJ gradually gets more media attention and you’ll find more fans from other teams give him love. But if even that still doesn’t make people believe he’s a star, then there’s this thing people call people who don’t live in reality…

[HemisfairArena]

Murray is a poor man's Westbrook,,,,and I mean an extremely poor man. If you think this guy is a cornerstone of the Spurs future then sell the team while you can still make a profit, Peter Holt. Murray is a joke. Let me know when he can carry this team to anything.

[Spursfanfromafar]

Boy, Spurs fans here. Are they really Spurs fans? Dejounte Murray has improved in almost every facet of his game except for three point shooting. And he plays hard on defense trying to disrupt ball handlers at point of creation and helping with deflections. He was already a good rebounding guard and is now the best rebounding guard in the league. His court vision is good enough for him to average a near triple double almost every game and he has a low turnover rate and not a very high usage rate a la Westbrick. Plus, his midrange shooting is near elite too. He was lacking in finishing with contact and taking free throws but over the course of the season, that number is edging up too. His finishing has been much better than before. His timing on the passes even in narrow places has been really good and most importantly, his turnover rate is so low that he is as elite as any elite PG today in that respect.

The only knock in his game is his inability to shoot efficiently from the three point range or to take step back jumpers. But knowing how he has improved his shooting ability in leaps and bounds, this is going to come too as he nears his peak. On defense, he gets lost when it comes to screening actions that try to take him out of the play because of his slender frame. But he more than makes for it with disruptive on ball defense.

The Spurs are also lucky to have him locked in to a very reasonable contract in a league where player wages for all Stars/ All-NBA types have skyrocketed because of the new CBA (even as middle class players' salaries have stagnated). Whats not to like about DJM, I dont know!

If anything DJM is an excellent example for any young player .. that player development by sheer hard work can improve one by leaps and bounds. I thought it was Derrick White who would be an All Star, and not DJM but as is his wont since the first day in the league, DJM has the knack of proving doubters wrong. His mental strength is another of his key attributes. In DJM, White, Primo and Vassell, the Spurs backcourt is set for the near future. So is their frontcourt with Poeltl, Johnson and Collins (hopefully). All they lack is a surefire PF who can rebound and shoot. McDermott brings a great catch and shoot ability and constant movement, but his defense and rebounding numbers are poor. I think the Spurs will make a 5-8 place playoff team easily with this current core next year and with a tweak via the draft/ FA to get a good PF.

The Spurs should continue to hit doubles and singles to get to a point of contention in this NBA environment. With their draft picks intact and cap situation in control, they will get a Home run hitting chance in the next couple of years for sure. There is no need to hurry things up.

[Dejounte]

Does anyone remember when they were in 5th grade and there was that kid who would just say things the opposite of you because they were craving attention?

This dumbass troll account makes it so painfully obvious that it’s a blessing he’s exposed himself as an idiot who shouldn’t be taken seriously.

[HemisfairArena]

Spurs are 20-34,,,,5 games away from having the worst record in the West but youre saying Murray is a stud and they have all this great young talent?,,,,LMAO. Good Luck with that.

[HemisfairArena]

You guys dont seem to understand...the Spurs dont have a difference maker. Murray is fools gold. He hasnt done a thing to carry the Spurs this year but you guys are enamored with his stats. When Philly was tanking and grabbing high picks,,,they got the one guy that could get them to the next level,,,,Embiid. Murray is no Embiid. Murray is no Morant. Murray is no Jayson Tatum. Stop overvaluing a player just because he plays on the Spurs.

[JeffDuncan]

Murray is a poor man's Westbrook,,,,and I mean an extremely poor man. If you think this guy is a cornerstone of the Spurs future then sell the team while you can still make a profit, Peter Holt. ...


Peter Holt sell the team… You say. There was something which happened nearly six years ago that I guess you missed. You don’t get out much?

More accurate would be to say Westbrook is a poor man’s Murray. Murray plays excellent defense and has low turnovers. A triple-double threat with low turnovers who plays excellent defense, that is a superior kind of player.

[HemisfairArena]

Peter Holt sell the team… You say. There was something which happened nearly six years ago that I guess you missed. You don’t get out much?

More accurate would be to say Westbrook is a poor man’s Murray. Murray plays excellent defense and has low turnovers. A triple-double threat with low turnovers who plays excellent defense, that is a superior kind of player.


Westbroook,,,9 time All Star,,,2 time All NBA 1st team,,,regular season MVP,,let me know when poor man Murray gets there,,,lmao

[HemisfairArena]

Oh, and Jeff,,,let me add Westbrook 2 time NBA Scoring Champ,,,,you think Murray will ever average over 30 a game?,,,,LMAO.

[HemisfairArena]

And I forgot to mention,,,Westbrook was 3 time NBA assists leader. If you think Murray will do all the things Westbrook did you should stop watching basketball,,,,

[RC_Drunkford]

And I forgot to mention,,,Westbrook was 3 time NBA assists leader. If you think Murray will do all the things Westbrook did you should stop watching basketball,,,,

Westbrook also got multiple Shaqtin A Fool MVPs while not making the playoffs with LeBron on the team. So yeah I agree, I don’t see Murray doing that

[KobesAchilles]

Now everyone is shitting on prime Westbrook :lmao
But we are the trolls. The dude dragged the shitfest Thunder to the playoffs year after year. That itself is impressive. But we all knew his game would fall off a cliff once his athleticism dropped a tiny bit.

Murray does average a lot of assists but saying that he can improve as a passer is now taboo. The dude has several passes that he can’t make. I’m sorry I was blessed by Manu and Tony for so long that I can tell at a glance that Murray isn’t in the same stratosphere as them as a passer. Tony became the best in traffic passer in the game tbh where he would collapse 3 people on him and find the wide open man. It was impressive. Manu was just Manu. His court vision was unreal.

Murray isn’t there yet. But bc he averages 9 assists a game he is a better passer than them :lol he gets his assists Westbrook style. I don’t know what else to tell you.

Also Murray doesn’t collapse the defense enough. Zones really work well on the Spurs bc nobody is good enough to break them. There are countless examples this year of him not being able to get to the paint vs a zone. This is bc his dribbling isn’t up to snuff. But bc he averages less Turnovers than Parker he is a better dribbler than Tony. Who’s really the 5th grader here?

Its not a troll job to say he needs to improve his passing and dribbling even more (when it comes to getting in the paint). It’s part of the reason why he only averages 2.7 free throws a game. Another area he needs to improve on

Which is why I think he should move to SG and we draft a Conley type PG (if available mind you). SG puts all of his best qualities on display. He really would be the best in the league I believe if he just focused on scoring/defense and secondary play making. But that’s being a hater too I suppose by saying a Spur would be the best in the league.

[dbestpro]

What ails the Spurs is three point shooting. Murray, Walker and White are all hovering around 30%. That won't get it done in today's NBA. Murray does the best at making up with his over all game, but his FG% is nothing to brag about either. We, as a team, need to move the ball, and find a way back to the beautiful game or move players and or move coaches

[cjw]

Spurs are 20-34,,,,5 games away from having the worst record in the West but youre saying Murray is a stud and they have all this great young talent?,,,,LMAO. Good Luck with that.

They have an even point differential, so they’re a lot better than the record indicates. I’m fine with a tank job if it nets a guy they really want, but you really can’t be upset here with the young core.

[BatManu20]

They have an even point differential, so they’re a lot better than the record indicates. I’m fine with a tank job if it nets a guy they really want, but you really can’t be upset here with the young core.

Spurs are definitely better than their record indicates. We’ve lost so many close games this season I’ve lost count. But losing games is what’s in the best interest of this team right now. So I hope we continue to do so.

[rankingtear]

goalpost has moved to All-NBA caliber player. Sell high?

[XDT76]

I don't see any one actively saying Murray is a great dribbler or playmaker. The most common praise is he has improved so much from his rookie season that it's not insignificant. No one is saying he is a all nba player or a HOF. However he is also not a stat padder to the detrimental of the team. I have also mentioned a few times that no one on the Spurs has advanced handling and neither do they have a high flying big nor a dead-eye 3 thus the zone kills them. Looking back the years handling could be the worse department of development for the Spurs. It almost seems that only Tony and Many are great at it and they brought their handling with them to the Spurs.

[RC_Drunkford]

Now everyone is shitting on prime Westbrook :lmao
But we are the trolls. The dude dragged the shitfest Thunder to the playoffs year after year. That itself is impressive. But we all knew his game would fall off a cliff once his athleticism dropped a tiny bit.

Murray does average a lot of assists but saying that he can improve as a passer is now taboo. The dude has several passes that he can’t make. I’m sorry I was blessed by Manu and Tony for so long that I can tell at a glance that Murray isn’t in the same stratosphere as them as a passer. Tony became the best in traffic passer in the game tbh where he would collapse 3 people on him and find the wide open man. It was impressive. Manu was just Manu. His court vision was unreal.

Murray isn’t there yet. But bc he averages 9 assists a game he is a better passer than them :lol he gets his assists Westbrook style. I don’t know what else to tell you.

Also Murray doesn’t collapse the defense enough. Zones really work well on the Spurs bc nobody is good enough to break them. There are countless examples this year of him not being able to get to the paint vs a zone. This is bc his dribbling isn’t up to snuff. But bc he averages less Turnovers than Parker he is a better dribbler than Tony. Who’s really the 5th grader here?

Its not a troll job to say he needs to improve his passing and dribbling even more (when it comes to getting in the paint). It’s part of the reason why he only averages 2.7 free throws a game. Another area he needs to improve on

Which is why I think he should move to SG and we draft a Conley type PG (if available mind you). SG puts all of his best qualities on display. He really would be the best in the league I believe if he just focused on scoring/defense and secondary play making. But that’s being a hater too I suppose by saying a Spur would be the best in the league.

literally nobody has said these things, you just made them up. Given that you were in the trade Murray camp I can see why. Nobody says he's better than Tony or Manu. But DJ is not done improving. He can up his percentage. He can work on getting to the line more often. And he can further improve his handles, giving him even more chances to score on high efficiency. It's pretty clear that he has still a lot of room to grow and hasn't reached his ceiling yet.

Also Westbrick has always been a low efficiency stat padder who shot his own team out of games. Nothing surprises me about him. I was celebrating in October when the Lakers signed him. He's one of the dumbest players in NBA history (if not the dumbest), which is why KD dipped

[BatManu20]

Love this kid. Hope he’s a Spur lifer.


1491197143008555009

[JeffDuncan]

Now everyone is shitting on prime Westbrook :lmao
But we are the trolls. The dude dragged the shitfest Thunder to the playoffs year after year. …


Those Thunder teams had, first, Kevin Durant with a good supporting cast, and then Paul George with, again, good support.

The shitfest is inside your head. You are an ignorant, stupid individual. Or a very dishonest individual.

Having Kevin Durant makes a difference.

You. Stupid. Dolt.


... But we all knew his game would fall off a cliff once his athleticism dropped a tiny bit.


What made the big difference was when the team around Westbrook wasn’t as good.



… I’m sorry I was blessed by Manu and Tony for so long that I can tell at a glance that Murray isn’t in the same stratosphere as them as a passer. Tony became the best in traffic passer in the game tbh where he would collapse 3 people on him and find the wide open man. It was impressive. Manu was just Manu. His court vision was unreal.


The truth is, Tony was never a great player for assists. His season high for assists was in 2011-12 when he had 7.7 per game (versus Murray’s current 9.2.) Tony had 2.6 turnovers per game that year (versus Murray’s current 2.5.)

You are fantasizing about a Tony Parker who never existed. That isn’t how Tony did what he did.

First, in the case of Westbrook, above, you ignore Kevin Durant, and then, in the case of Parker, you ignore Tim Duncan.

You are not bright.

Manu? He was a joy to watch. He’d make a fabulous thread-the-needle pass which would be on the highlight reel, and then on the next possession he’d throw the ball into the stands. Lol. Then he’d get a steal and hit a 3. It was amazing. (Manu also played good defense.) But while Manu was good with assists, overall, he was not one of the greats at it. His best season for assists minus turnovers was 2009-10, when he was 4.9 - 2.1 for a net of 2.8. (Murray’s current stat on that is 9.2 - 2.5 for a net of 6.7.)

Parker and Manu were both outstanding players, but also, they both benefited greatly from being on much better teams than the current Spurs.


... I don’t know what else to tell you.


You could try telling the truth for a change. But of course that would require you knowing the truth, which you apparently do not.


… Who’s really the 5th grader here?


You are.

[Dejounte]

Wait, KobesAchilles thought I was referring to him when I made my post? I was referring to Hemisfair, and I thought that was fucking obvious. I mean, if the post triggered you, then maybe you are a troll. Whoever the fuck the troll account Hemisfair belongs to, that’s the 5th grader who needs mental help. Badly.

You can tell when people are just trying to get a rise out of people, and that loser couldn’t have made it more obvious.

[JeffDuncan]

Westbroook,,,9 time All Star,,,


What’s he done lately, dipshit?

[KobesAchilles]

literally nobody has said these things, you just made them up. Given that you were in the trade Murray camp I can see why. Nobody says he's better than Tony or Manu. But DJ is not done improving. He can up his percentage. He can work on getting to the line more often. And he can further improve his handles, giving him even more chances to score on high efficiency. It's pretty clear that he has still a lot of room to grow and hasn't reached his ceiling yet.

Also Westbrick has always been a low efficiency stat padder who shot his own team out of games. Nothing surprises me about him. I was celebrating in October when the Lakers signed him. He's one of the dumbest players in NBA history (if not the dumbest), which is why KD dipped
Nah people were saying that. Dejounte was taking not so subtle shots at me bc I said DJ needs to improve his passing and handles. He threw a fit about it bringing up his ass/turnover ratio. Then he threw some more shade at me with his "he makes basic passes" line. But DJ does make basic passes! He really does need to improve on his handles and passing.

I know he has improved every year. I wanted him gone last season and some time during the off-season for Simmons I believe. But I jumped right back on his bandwagon once he started playing this season. i am very impressed with him. But I still don't see him as a PG. I think he could be the best SG in the league. But the team is so deprived of talent at every position that it's hard to see. If we can get a top tier PG at the draft then I think we should take the opportunity

**I'm pretty sure the he makes basic passes line was about me Dejounte :lol It could be about someone else but I brought it up first so my bad then
**edit two** Deounte said it wasn't about me so I will take his word for it. But I'm not trolling. I might not be right :lol but imo he is better suited for a SG

[KobesAchilles]

Those Thunder teams had, first, Kevin Durant with a good supporting cast, and then Paul George with, again, good support.

The shitfest is inside your head. You are an ignorant, stupid individual. Or a very dishonest individual.

Having Kevin Durant makes a difference.

You. Stupid. Dolt.




What made the big difference was when the team around Westbrook wasn’t as good.




The truth is, Tony was never a great player for assists. His season high for assists was in 2011-12 when he had 7.7 per game (versus Murray’s current 9.2.) Tony had 2.6 turnovers per game that year (versus Murray’s current 2.5.)

You are fantasizing about a Tony Parker who never existed. That isn’t how Tony did what he did.

First, in the case of Westbrook, above, you ignore Kevin Durant, and then, in the case of Parker, you ignore Tim Duncan.

You are not bright.

Manu? He was a joy to watch. He’d make a fabulous thread-the-needle pass which would be on the highlight reel, and then on the next possession he’d throw the ball into the stands. Lol. Then he’d get a steal and hit a 3. It was amazing. (Manu also played good defense.) But while Manu was good with assists, overall, he was not one of the greats at it. His best season for assists minus turnovers was 2009-10, when he was 4.9 - 2.1 for a net of 2.8. (Murray’s current stat on that is 9.2 - 2.5 for a net of 6.7.)

Parker and Manu were both outstanding players, but also, they both benefited greatly from being on much better teams than the current Spurs.




You could try telling the truth for a change. But of course that would require you knowing the truth, which you apparently do not.




You are.
Ok I got rid of Durant. Then you got rid of the year Durant left him and he dragged OKC to the playoffs. Also he got to the Finals with Durant and had them positioned to beat the Waarriors if not for DURANTS choke job not Westbrooks.

I know that Tony wasn't great for assists per game. That was my whole point. Assists per game is not a metric to how well you run an offense. Westbrook averaged 12 per game once (11?) that doesn't mean he knows how to run an offense. same with Harden. But Tony Parker was amazing at in-traffic passes. He just was. You name-calling me doesn't change that fact. Manu had stupid turnovers for sure, but when you are the artist he is then you take liberties. My point is that Manu is a better passer than DJ and so was Tony. They both had tthe ability to make passes that DJ can't make. Maybe he will one day (with Tony's passes never Manu's) but he isn't there yet

Tony and Manu added to those great Spurs teams tbh. They benefited by having Duncan obviously, but wheen given the reigns of the offense they both took it over and showed they didn't need to be second fiddle in order to win games

[talkspurs]

Nah people were saying that. Dejounte was taking not so subtle shots at me bc I said DJ needs to improve his passing and handles. He threw a fit about it bringing up his ass/turnover ratio. Then he threw some more shade at me with his "he makes basic passes" line. But DJ does make basic passes! He really does need to improve on his handles and passing.

I know he has improved every year. I wanted him gone last season and some time during the off-season for Simmons I believe. But I jumped right back on his bandwagon once he started playing this season. i am very impressed with him. But I still don't see him as a PG. I think he could be the best SG in the league. But the team is so deprived of talent at every position that it's hard to see. If we can get a top tier PG at the draft then I think we should take the opportunity

**I'm pretty sure the he makes basic passes line was about me Dejounte :lol It could be about someone else but I brought it up first so my bad then
**edit two** Deounte said it wasn't about me so I will take his word for it. But I'm not trolling. I might not be right :lol but imo he is better suited for a SG

So you want a player that a lot of people complain about in here about his shooting especially his 3 pt shooting to be a SG as opposed to the PG where he is one of the best in the league? Can you explain that to me.

Even if you want to talk about not seeing the floor as well those harder passes also lead to more turnovers and even fast break points. Some times it is just better to KISS. It also leads to more points and less for the other team. but yes lets make him a SG.

[KobesAchilles]

So you want a player that a lot of people complain about in here about his shooting especially his 3 pt shooting to be a SG as opposed to the PG where he is one of the best in the league? Can you explain that to me.

Even if you want to talk about not seeing the floor as well those harder passes also lead to more turnovers and even fast break points. Some times it is just better to KISS. It also leads to more points and less for the other team. but yes lets make him a SG.
I think his shot is fine tbh. If you look at his assisted 3 point percentage then it’s really high. He just doesn’t have a lot of those opportunities bc nobody else can create for him. If we had a PG that could collapse the D and get into the lane and be able to pass out to a wide open DJ then I expect him to shoot the ball at a high clip. His shot isn’t broken anymore. He can make the 3 pointer. It’s just that we ask him to create for himself and others. It’s too much to ask of him. We give him zero easy shots. That takes a toll on a player. It’s why Durant went to Golden St. He, and literally everybody else, prefers playing where it isn’t tough to put up shots.

I contend that if DJ were moved spots and be replaced by a Mike Conley type player ( a grizzly version not the jazz version) then DJ would have easier shots. He would be able to focus on his own shot creation and not worry about getting everybody else involved, and be spoon fed some easy shots as well. This would, imo, make him average more points, shoot a higher percentage, and even get to the line more bc he can attack a nonset defense rather than constantly attack a defense that is set up to stop him. His defender or help defender will be out of position more often and lead to more FTA per game.

[tim_duncan_fan]

Godly stat line tonight, holy shit!

32, 15, 10, 4, with one turnover

[DAF86]

The efficiency he has displayed in these last couple of games is what will make him a real star for years to come. If he can keep this up, the sky is the limit, since he pretty much can do anything else on a BB court.

It's time to start building the team around him. Vassell seems like a perfect fit at the 2. We have to, once and for all, get that 6'8" forward that can defend and knock down some 3's. I wonder if DJ's raise to stardom will start drawing the interest of big name free agents for next season.

[DAF86]

I think his shot is fine tbh. If you look at his assisted 3 point percentage then it’s really high. He just doesn’t have a lot of those opportunities bc nobody else can create for him. If we had a PG that could collapse the D and get into the lane and be able to pass out to a wide open DJ then I expect him to shoot the ball at a high clip. His shot isn’t broken anymore. He can make the 3 pointer. It’s just that we ask him to create for himself and others. It’s too much to ask of him. We give him zero easy shots. That takes a toll on a player. It’s why Durant went to Golden St. He, and literally everybody else, prefers playing where it isn’t tough to put up shots.

I contend that if DJ were moved spots and be replaced by a Mike Conley type player ( a grizzly version not the jazz version) then DJ would have easier shots. He would be able to focus on his own shot creation and not worry about getting everybody else involved, and be spoon fed some easy shots as well. This would, imo, make him average more points, shoot a higher percentage, and even get to the line more bc he can attack a nonset defense rather than constantly attack a defense that is set up to stop him. His defender or help defender will be out of position more often and lead to more FTA per game.

Dejounte is not a shooter. It would be a waste to have him play off ball.

[BatManu20]

The efficiency he has displayed in these last couple of games is what will make him a real star for years to come. If he can keep this up, the sky is the limit, since he pretty much can do anything else on a BB court.

It's time to start building the team around him. Vassell seems like a perfect fit at the 2. We have to, once and for all, get that 6'8" forward that can defend and knock down some 3's. I wonder if DJ's raise to stardom will start drawing the interest of big name free agents for next season.

No big names are coming to San Antonio, especially not for a rebuild. Spurs have no choice but to build through the draft, hence why it’s so important to tank for a top-5 pick right now.

[acoelho1]

Is the crow in the oven?

[DAF86]

No big names are coming to San Antonio, especially not for a rebuild. Spurs have no choice but to build through the draft, hence why it’s so important to tank for a top-5 pick right now.

When I said "big name" I wasn't really talking about thd Durants and Lebrons of this world, but mainly about some good role playing veterans. Maybe someone like an Otto Porter Jr. lite, which is exactly what we are needing (aside from another star to pair with Dejounte).

[CGD]

1st in steals, 4th in assists, and 9th in efficiency.

[CGD]

He’s not a perfect player but it has been a joy to watch him grow as a player every single year. It’s a testament to his character.

[Ocotillo]

The efficiency he has displayed in these last couple of games is what will make him a real star for years to come. If he can keep this up, the sky is the limit, since he pretty much can do anything else on a BB court.

It's time to start building the team around him. Vassell seems like a perfect fit at the 2. We have to, once and for all, get that 6'8" forward that can defend and knock down some 3's. I wonder if DJ's raise to stardom will start drawing the interest of big name free agents for next season.

I hope he starts developing some connections at the All Star game. Of course, it could go the other way and they recruit him.

[Atl Spur]

He’s not a perfect player but it has been a joy to watch him grow as a player every single year. It’s a testament to his character.

He is a weapon! They respect him as a leader.

[r0drig0lac]

the same disrespect that Kawhi (pre 2017) received from fans of other franchises, Murray receives (from some) in spurstalk, interesting factor, he is already one of the 30-40 best players in the world

[John B]

I hope he starts developing some connections at the All Star game. Of course, it could go the other way and they recruit him.

I have a feeling DJ is a Spurs lifer. He relishes that leadership and challenge to bring the team back to glory days. He’s a proud man, overcoming obstacles all his life. I don’t he’s the guy who’ll just give up and ally with another team. He has very strong character and pretty vocal about being the best.

[emanueldavidginobili]

The second video is good.

1492401259168555008

[wildbill2u]

He’s not a perfect player but it has been a joy to watch him grow as a player every single year. It’s a testament to his character.

You hit the nail on the head with that one. When he came into the league he had bad handle (dribbling at shoulder height) and his shot was a mess with a sideways twist. He's pretty much corrected both those bad habits to become an excellent two way player.

Time for us arm-chair coaches to admit we were wrong about his chances to last in the NBA with those issues--and to give some props also to the drafting brain trust and coaches who saw what he could be with some good coaching. Kudos all around on this.

[Atl Spur]

Any rooms available? This dude is NASTY!!

[emanueldavidginobili]

1492685357992878080

[TDomination]

1492685357992878080

sick!

[ceperez]

You hit the nail on the head with that one. When he came into the league he had bad handle (dribbling at shoulder height) and his shot was a mess with a sideways twist. He's pretty much corrected both those bad habits to become an excellent two way player.

Time for us arm-chair coaches to admit we were wrong about his chances to last in the NBA with those issues--and to give some props also to the drafting brain trust and coaches who saw what he could be with some good coaching. Kudos all around on this.

I'm surprised that he's developed a lot from when he first came in the league. Corrected many flaws.

[barakz21]

One thing that’s impressed me about DJ besides the obvious stuff is how has matured. I remember how quick he was to flex anytime he had a highlight play when he first returned from that injury. He also seemed to have that a belief in himself that his play couldn’t back up. Now, it’s the other way around. He’s become a silent killer who knows when and where to strike without any flexing.

[skin27]

IS THIS VERSION OF MURRAY BETTER THAN ANY SEASIN OF PARKER? LOL.. BUT MURRAY ISN'T EVEN ON THE TOP 15 FOR MVP WITH THE NUMBERS HIS PUTTING RIGHT NOW.

[skin27]

the same disrespect that Kawhi (pre 2017) received from fans of other franchises, Murray receives (from some) in spurstalk, interesting factor, he is already one of the 30-40 best players in the world

Kawhi was on the mvp conversation that season while murray isnt..

[Leetonidas]

IS THIS VERSION OF MURRAY BETTER THAN ANY SEASIN OF PARKER? LOL.. BUT MURRAY ISN'T EVEN ON THE TOP 15 FOR MVP WITH THE NUMBERS HIS PUTTING RIGHT NOW.

idk about that. 2009-2013 Parker was a beast, and TP was a legit MVP candidate in 2013. of course, put this DJ on those Spurs teams in his place and I bet he's getting MVP talk too

[rjv]

Is the crow in the oven?
Crow is an ST favorite

[SPURt]

It’s definitely nice to have a franchise type player on the roster. The starting lineup with Keldon, Vassell, Jakob has been a joy to watch. I’m excited to see how the Spurs can build around him!

[Dejounte]

The more I think about it, I realize that Murray’s rise further grows the Spurs’ reputation for developing players. Think about it: MANY young players would point to Kawhi being their favorite player and attributed his success to the Spurs. I recall many videos of prospects coming out of college stating that they wouldn’t mind being drafted by the Spurs because of how Kawhi developed. Murray would be another example for young kids. I think it will cause future players drafted by the Spurs to believe in the program even more, and the fact that Murray was a 29th pick will strengthen that. This is a very good thing.

[Atl Spur]

The more I think about it, I realize that Murray’s rise further grows the Spurs’ reputation for developing players. Think about it: MANY young players would point to Kawhi being their favorite player and attributed his success to the Spurs. I recall many videos of prospects coming out of college stating that they wouldn’t mind being drafted by the Spurs because of how Kawhi developed. Murray would be another example for young kids. I think it will cause future players drafted by the Spurs to believe in the program even more, and the fact that Murray was a 29th pick will strengthen that. This is a very good thing.

I concur! Langford is the next project…. Hopefully he’s ready for the challenge! He appears intelligent & crafty

[couchman]

DJM is already better than Parker was.
A truly phenomenal rise in his development as a player.
It is reminiscent of Kawhi’s development.
The “supporting” players are there.
Now we just need to give DJM another great player and we’ll be dangerous.

[Atl Spur]

DJM is already better than Parker was.
A truly phenomenal rise in his development as a player.
It is reminiscent of Kawhi’s development.
The “supporting” players are there.
Now we just need to give DJM another great player and we’ll be dangerous.
Sir slow down!!! Two different playing styles

[KobesAchilles]

Parker would average 30 in todays NBA

[KobesAchilles]

Btw as soon as I say we should move him he has these 2 games clearly showing he is a point guard :lol
Dude was making tough ass passes in traffic. His passing out of his post up and spin moves are deadly. I love the offball movement of our players which shows they believe DJ will get them the ball.

Watching DJ now I do wonder if Manu is teaching him his bag of tricks bc I see a very distinctive Manu move by DJ when it comes to his behind the back. That’s exactly how Manu used to do it which is an original and different than everybody else’s behind the back. Also DJs positioning in his spin move is amazing too. I think he’s been learning one on one from Manu. Dude knows where to spin to get that second defender and exactly when to pass or go up with the shot. Murray has such a beautiful game

[kjhip1]

What I love about his game is his sense of getting to the space he wants to get his jumper off. Every shot he takes from the elbow or free throw line barely hits any part of the rim when it goes in. He’s def putting in work on his midrange. Additionally, he has worked on keeping his handles being more disciplined. I love that he wants to attack as soon as he sees a big on him or a mismatch. His spin move creates so much space for him to get the the shot he wants. It’s been awesome to see his game grow. Of course his passing is much improved and he is a terror when he drives and kicks.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1492700741626216448

[DAF86]

https://youtu.be/oBptn_ls9S8

[DAF86]

DJM is already better than Parker was.
A truly phenomenal rise in his development as a player.
It is reminiscent of Kawhi’s development.
The “supporting” players are there.
Now we just need to give DJM another great player and we’ll be dangerous.

lol son, slow down.

Everybody's numbers in today's NBA are inflated. Averaging a 30 pts triple double is almost like averaging 20, 5 and 5 in the mid 2000's.

Parker is a HoF, Dejounte isn't anywhere near that level yet.

[DAF86]

I haven't been paying much attention to the NBA outisde the Spurs this season. Does DJ have MIP on lock or is there anyone that the voters can snub him for?

[Chinook]

I haven't been paying much attention to the NBA outisde the Spurs this season. Does DJ have MIP on lock or is there anyone that the voters can snub him for?

Thinking it'll be Garland, but besides him, Poole and Edwards have their cases. Apparently Ja is the favorite on some sites, but he was already a star before this season and will probably make an All-NBA team. We'll see. Murray didn't get voted in an All-Star, so he didn't initially have the name recognition. If he shows out in the ASG and afterwards, he might get the narrative on his side to win.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I haven't been paying much attention to the NBA outisde the Spurs this season. Does DJ have MIP on lock or is there anyone that the voters can snub him for?
On Fanduel Sportsbook

Ja -350
Garland +1000
Bridges +1000
DJ +1400

On December 5th I put 100 bucks on DJ to win MIP and it was +1000. First time checking since I placed the bet and now his odds have gone down from then some how :rollin

[offset formation]

Parker would average 30 in todays NBA

Especially as the best player on the roster.

[lefty20]

Yeah prime TP would absolutely feast as a scorer in todays NBA.

That being said, I can see DJ reaching that lvl as well. He needs to learn how to absorb contact and sell fouls, instead of going for high degree of difficulty shots while trying to avoid the said contact when challenged at the rim.

[talkspurs]

Thinking it'll be Garland, but besides him, Poole and Edwards have their cases. Apparently Ja is the favorite on some sites, but he was already a star before this season and will probably make an All-NBA team. We'll see. Murray didn't get voted in an All-Star, so he didn't initially have the name recognition. If he shows out in the ASG and afterwards, he might get the narrative on his side to win.

Ja really was not that good and has improved a lot this year. This is people watching what media says and goes from there. he was not bad but Murray was better then him last year. This is why I think it is so interesting when people were talking about how bad murray was. He has been better then several of the people list above him. Just like when people wanted to say Ben was better. he wasnt but had the media hype.

[PhantomDashCam]

The even mentioning of DJ's game in the same breath as one of the all time great PGs in Tony Parker would've felt blasphemous as little as a season ago.

He has a long way to go, (obviously), but the fact being that if people even feel slightly comfortable in putting out those type of opinions on a Spur-centric board, it perhaps shows how much much he has grown as a player and the potential path he is on moving forward...

(And FWIW, Tony Parker is my favourite player of all time).

If DJ's ceiling truly is what we have witnessed in these last two games (Hawks and Pels), further all-time great comparisons are likely to follow...

[Dejounte]

Yeah, accolades-wise Murray has a long way to go. Personally though, I am finding Murray’s game more aesthetically pleasing. That would have been very hard for me to say before this season, as his efficiency wasnt there. But now? He’s added a little flavor to it and APPEARANCE-wise, his mid range game is Jordanesque to me. A thing of beauty.

[Dejounte]

Credit has to go to Chip for pumping out not one, but two, MJ-like archetypes.

[Atl Spur]

The kid has truly gotten better; big time competitor .

[Ice009]

The more I think about it, I realize that Murray’s rise further grows the Spurs’ reputation for developing players. Think about it: MANY young players would point to Kawhi being their favorite player and attributed his success to the Spurs. I recall many videos of prospects coming out of college stating that they wouldn’t mind being drafted by the Spurs because of how Kawhi developed. Murray would be another example for young kids. I think it will cause future players drafted by the Spurs to believe in the program even more, and the fact that Murray was a 29th pick will strengthen that. This is a very good thing.

I haven't kept up with young prospects since Kawhi was traded. Are you sure it's not just one or two that have mentioned that, or are there a few prospects that have said the Spurs were a big part of Kawhi's development?

[Ice009]

DJM is already better than Parker was.
A truly phenomenal rise in his development as a player.
It is reminiscent of Kawhi’s development.
The “supporting” players are there.
Now we just need to give DJM another great player and we’ll be dangerous.

I don't know about that. Murray has been great this season, however, Parker tore up defenses that were more physical than today's that were designed to stop him, and he played in an era where rules weren't as geared/as favourable to the offensive player as they are today.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I don't know about that. Murray has been great this season, however, Parker tore up defenses that were more physical than today's that were designed to stop him, and he played in an era where rules weren't as geared/as favourable to the offensive player as they are today.
While I completely agree, TP was light years more experienced coming into the league than DJ even at 18 and DJ blew his knee out. DJ is on a hell of a trajectory right now. DJ could be better overall when it’s all said and done. Everyone saying TP would average 30 today which could be possible but DJ is light years a head of him on the defensive end and is slowly becoming very good on offense. This season he has shown flashes of being an actual true PG something TP really never was he was always a score first player. I honestly think DJ enjoys getting his teammates involved. DJ still has a ways to go to be in the Parker conversation but damn this kid is getting me excited for his future.

[KobesAchilles]

While I completely agree, TP was light years more experienced coming into the league than DJ even at 18 and DJ blew his knee out. DJ is on a hell of a trajectory right now. DJ could be better overall when it’s all said and done. Everyone saying TP would average 30 today which could be possible but DJ is light years a head of him on the defensive end and is slowly becoming very good on offense. This season he has shown flashes of being an actual true PG something TP really never was he was always a score first player. I honestly think DJ enjoys getting his teammates involved. DJ still has a ways to go to be in the Parker conversation but damn this kid is getting me excited for his future.
DJ shoots more than Parker ever did. It’s not really fair to say Parker didn’t get his teammates involved bc he really did. It was just that second pass to get that wide open shot. He led the league in hockey assists a couple times. If you give Parker the ball with that much open lane and 18+shots a game, then he is gonna score at a ridiculous clip.

[emanueldavidginobili]

DJ shoots more than Parker ever did. It’s not really fair to say Parker didn’t get his teammates involved bc he really did. It was just that second pass to get that wide open shot. He led the league in hockey assists a couple times. If you give Parker the ball with that much open lane and 18+shots a game, then he is gonna score at a ridiculous clip.
Parker has averaged 18 FGA before just as DJ is now. DJ has to take these shots. I never said TP didn’t get his teammates involved he sure did I just said he was a score first player which he was. I just said DJ enjoys getting his teammates involved and inferior teammates at that. TP had no choice to pass it to TD and Manu.

Also just like I said it’s more about scoring I never once disputed TP being able to score at a great rate.

[objective]

Hopefully he gets an above the rim big to play with so his alley oop passing skill isn't stunted like Parker's was, I remember him throwing the ball all kinds of out of bounds in the all star game trying to throw lobs.

Look at Derrick White today. His whole life throwing bounce passes because he's with Poeltl, Pau, Aldridge, Joffrey, Dieng, and Eubanks so he's not used to having someone like Robert Williams, nearly threw that guys shoulder out of socket with how he had to reach to catch a Derrick lob.

[spurraider21]

But but he posts videos on Instagram :cry

[XDT76]

Hopefully he gets an above the rim big to play with so his alley oop passing skill isn't stunted like Parker's was, I remember him throwing the ball all kinds of out of bounds in the all star game trying to throw lobs.

Look at Derrick White today. His whole life throwing bounce passes because he's with Poeltl, Pau, Aldridge, Joffrey, Dieng, and Eubanks so he's not used to having someone like Robert Williams, nearly threw that guys shoulder out of socket with how he had to reach to catch a Derrick lob.

After watching Jones and Murray alley hoop to Walker, I think it's better for Murray to keep to simple passes which he is effective at.

[r0drig0lac]

But but he posts videos on Instagram :cry
and that stupidity was never seen here again.

[KingKev]

After watching Jones and Murray alley hoop to Walker, I think it's better for Murray to keep to simple passes which he is effective at.

it was one “alley-hoop” probably shouldn’t make too many conclusions on that.

[SpurSpike]

I think some credit has to go to DeRozan for teaching DJ the midrange.

[rankingtear]

Relax he is no Danny Green.

[Leetonidas]

Dejounte Murray had 32 points, 15 assists and 10 rebounds against Atlanta on Friday night, and he followed that up the next night with 31 points and 12 assists against the Pelicans. He had just one turnover in each game. According to ESPN Stats & Information research, Murray is the first player to record back-to-back games with at least 30 points and 10 assists with one or fewer turnovers since turnovers were tracked in 1977-78. -- Lopez

Pretty impressive stuff

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/andrewdbailey/status/1492628316150325251?s=21

[KingKev]

^ some pretty good company there

[XDT76]

https://twitter.com/andrewdbailey/status/1492628316150325251?s=21

2 top 30s for the Spurs, but we are fighting for lottery. So we should trade the whole team except these 2?

[Atl Spur]

The kid deserves his new found success! He’s a keeper.

[RC_Drunkford]

DJ was nominated for Western Conference player of the week. Doncic won though

[Ocotillo]

Ahead of Demar interestingly enough.

[PhantomDashCam]

Joker being an "average" of 1.0 in catch-alls would have to be some kind of record, no?
DJ's is obviously impressive but that is straight absurd that a guy finished number 1 in each of those 10 rankings.

[BatManu20]

1493327646276698114

[r0drig0lac]

1493327646276698114

https://c.tenor.com/wC1SbgEZLVcAAAAM/training-day.gif

[DAF86]

1493327646276698114

The boards going down, while the efficiency and assists going up. Showing what's really valuable about DJ, tbh. :wakeup

[XDT76]

The boards going down, while the efficiency and assists going up. Showing what's really valuable about DJ, tbh. :wakeup

It is no surprise that he will be more efficient with lesser board especially if he fight less for it. As he will be more fatigue with all those jumping, we really need a competent PF, regardless of winning last 2 we are still killed on the boards.

[DAF86]

Needs to work on that clutch time execution.

[CGD]

Came down to earth some tonight

[XDT76]

Came down to earth some tonight

Well that is the next step he needs to take when he gets all the attention of the defense in clutch time.

[BatManu20]

1492876229527187458

[Ice009]

The more I think about it, I realize that Murray’s rise further grows the Spurs’ reputation for developing players. Think about it: MANY young players would point to Kawhi being their favorite player and attributed his success to the Spurs. I recall many videos of prospects coming out of college stating that they wouldn’t mind being drafted by the Spurs because of how Kawhi developed. Murray would be another example for young kids. I think it will cause future players drafted by the Spurs to believe in the program even more, and the fact that Murray was a 29th pick will strengthen that. This is a very good thing.

I haven't heard anyone say this. I don't keep up with young college player/prospects, but just wondering if more than 1-2 players have said this? If so, that may be a good thing if some of these young kinds actually want to be drafted by the Spurs. I thought most of them wanted to avoid playing in SA. I didn't expect hardly any to attribute Kawhi's success as much to the Spurs and his own work ethic and desire to do whatever it takes to be great.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I honestly think DJ is going to will this team to the Play-In Tournament. It's going to come down to March 23rd to April 3rd when they play the Blazers 3 times in that 12 day time span.

[B1gduff]

If Murray can get his 3pt % to around 35% and increase his effiency, league better watch out. He could be a perennial all star.

[lefty20]

Upping that FTA wouldn't hurt either, tbh.

[CGD]

Upping that FTA wouldn't hurt either, tbh.

This. I think this is the next step for him, drawing contact, and finishing on contact.

[emanueldavidginobili]

This. I think this is the next step for him, drawing contact, and finishing on contact.
Yup he's already working on that too I feel like. Last season he had six games with 5 or more FTA this year he's already at twelve games with 5 or more at the ASB and 6 FTA behind Keldon to lead the team. Hopefully he starts to get those star calls as well.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1495091457614622720

1495083084907225097

1495082392473808911

1495092989709979653

[talkspurs]

1495091457614622720

1495083084907225097

1495082392473808911

1495092989709979653

one mentioned Sept 19th for his birthday. I wouldnt do it then as during season. I do like June 25th though which would be offseason and the day the Spurs won their first championship. It also is a Saturday this year.

[KingKev]

The love DRob showing DJ tells me DJ is a Spurs for life

[Proxy]

https://www.instagram.com/tv/CaLwcwugqep/?utm_medium=copy_link

crazy how small the Admiral makes him look. Been doubting Murray for years now, happy to see the selection give him a boost in confidence lately

[Atl Spur]

Hopefully this really push’s him to dominance in this league ( a Greek freak type mentality )

[KingKev]

Hopefully this really push’s him to dominance in this league ( a Greek freak type mentality )

Yes hopefully’s a spiritual awakening ( Michael Jordan , Kobe Bryant , Alex Caruso )

[talkspurs]

dont know how to delete post.

[talkspurs]

The love DRob showing DJ tells me DJ is a Spurs for life

I thought the interaction said it. Each one showed respect to each other. I have been on of murrays biggest supports here for awhile so I am glad that it is looking like he will be here awhile. I will also be glad when we get him someone to play with.

[KingKev]

I thought the interaction said it. Each one showed respect to each other. I have been on of murrays biggest supports here for awhile so I am glad that it is looking like he will be here awhile. I will also be glad when we get him someone to play with.

David Robinson still has a majour influence on our organization behind closed doors. Best believe that.

[BatManu20]

1495421906907975680

[KingKev]

https://twitter.com/GQSports/status/1495542865690341379?s=20&t=LwW21Hy4PQGVpX_sJqYhKg

[Dejounte]

https://twitter.com/josh810/status/1495637067539361795?s=21

[KingKev]

Love seeing DJ cut loose. Pop was probably the absolute best coach he could have had for his development but that comment about playing for Pop isn’t for everybody is so true and I wonder what DJ will be like under his next coach.

[BatManu20]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FMIZRiGWQAEHB2V?format=jpg&name=large

[BatManu20]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FMFPQ1lX0AUzdVY?format=jpg&name=900x900

[lefty]

https://twitter.com/projectspurs/status/1495227860507844609

[superbigtime]

The love DRob showing DJ tells me DJ is a Spurs for life

Gave me a million goosebumps. David is incomparable.

[superbigtime]

DJ totally belonged in the ASG and he PROVED IT.

[KingKev]

Gave me a million goosebumps. David is incomparable.

Yeah man, David Robinson is just one of those ppl when he talks you listen.

[Sugus]

Yeah man, David Robinson is just one of those ppl when he talks you listen.

Unless you're a specific kind of motherfucker, and then you don't even pick up his phone calls....... :rolleyes

[KingKev]

Unless you're a specific kind of motherfucker, and then you don't even pick up his phone calls....... :rolleyes

Yeah jeeze, to not even pick the phone up and have a convo. I still respect Kahwi in many regards and think PATFO bear some accountability in a bad situation but when DRob reached out, obviously he wanted Kawhi to stay but I’m sure he was ready to listen and help best he could. Kawhi was too immature or stubborn to take a call.

[Poolboy5623]

Very fitting that his coming out game is an ASG LOL

[TD 21]

Yeah jeeze, to not even pick the phone up and have a convo. I still respect Kahwi in many regards and think PATFO bear some accountability in a bad situation but when DRob reached out, obviously he wanted Kawhi to stay but I’m sure he was ready to listen and help best he could. Kawhi was too immature or stubborn to take a call.

:lmao At a supposed Spurs fan saying this.

As an aside, the hypocrisy of the biased national media once again denigrating the latest superstar to throw a tantrum (Harden), while ostensibly absolving by ignoring the one who emboldened them by going about it in an unethical manner, in their retellings of the recent history with this.

[KingKev]

:lmao At a supposed Spurs fan saying this.

As an aside, the hypocrisy of the biased national media once again denigrating the latest superstar to throw a tantrum (Harden), while ostensibly absolving by ignoring the one who emboldened them by going about it in an unethical manner, in their retellings of the recent history with this.

Kawhi handled the situation terribly from my perspective. He did however bounce back in a way Harden has never been able to. Harden had little to hold his head high for to begin with. Kawhi gave the media reasons to give him the benefit of the doubt. Harden has never done that. Never played defense, continues to bail on his teammates, has never showed out when it mattered. Leonard has always played hard on both sides of the ball and is clearly a hard worker. His work ethic alone is admirable even for a douche.

[TD 21]

Kawhi handled the situation terribly from my perspective. He did however bounce back in a way Harden has never been able to. Harden had little to hold his head high for to begin with. Kawhi gave the media reasons to give him the benefit of the doubt. Harden has never done that. Never played defense, continues to bail on his teammates, has never showed out when it mattered. Leonard has always played hard on both sides of the ball and is clearly a hard worker. His work ethic alone is admirable even for a douche.

:lmao Only if exaggerating a chronic condition/resting 95 games over 2 seasons, successfully tanking his value to such an extent that the team he was eventually "traded" to was handed the league's most complete, having the overwhelming favorite decimated by injury and still barely eking out a tainted championship, is what you call "bounce back".

Harden at least showed up to work. He didn't hide across the country while his sleazebag uncle attempted to destroy the hard earned reputation of his current employer, nor withhold medical information from said employer paying him $18.6M or say he'd only re-sign in one city, leaving them only able to recoup pennies on the dollar.

[KingKev]

B
:lmao Only if exaggerating a chronic condition/resting 95 games over 2 seasons, successfully tanking his value to such an extent that the team he was eventually "traded" to was handed the league's most complete, having the overwhelming favorite decimated by injury and still barely eking out a tainted championship, is what you call "bounce back".

Harden at least showed up to work. He didn't hide across the country while his sleazebag uncle attempted to destroy the hard earned reputation of his current employer, nor withhold medical information from said employer paying him $18.6M or say he'd only re-sign in one city, leaving them only able to recoup pennies on the dollar.

I find it ironic you show some support for Rodman in one thread and so much disdain for Leonard in another.

I enjoy watching Leonard suffer, don’t get me wrong but I still see him as an incredible talent. Harden is less impressive as a basketball player in my eyes.

[TD 21]

B

I find it ironic you show some support for Rodman in one thread and so much disdain for Leonard in another.

I enjoy watching Leonard suffer, don’t get me wrong but I still see him as an incredible talent. Harden is less impressive as a basketball player in my eyes.

? I never commented on Rodman, but since you brought him up, I will now: he's overrated too.

He's not an incredible talent. He's an incredible worker who's leveraged his physical tools to carve out the (overrated) career he's had, but he's nowhere near as talented as someone like Harden.

For as much flak as the latter gets for his off court lifestyle/conditioning, you don't get to be that skilled without an immense work ethic. He's also had to carry far heavier a load in the past decade than the former's affluenza, pristine circumstances reliant ass ever has.

[KingKev]

? I never commented on Rodman, but since you brought him up, I will now: he's overrated too.

He's not an incredible talent. He's an incredible worker who's leveraged his physical tools to carve out the (overrated) career he's had, but he's nowhere near as talented as someone like Harden.

For as much flak as the latter gets for his off court lifestyle/conditioning, you don't get to be that skilled without an immense work ethic. He's also had to carry far heavier a load in the past decade than the former's affluenza, pristine circumstances reliant ass ever has.

Sht my bad I thought you were getting flamed for sticking up for Rodman in the AS thread.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1495556009015787520

[exstatic]

One of the things that disturbed me about Kawhi long before Uncle made the scene was that he didn’t know who David WAS.

[R. DeMurre]

For as much flak as the latter gets for his off court lifestyle/conditioning, you don't get to be that skilled without an immense work ethic. He's also had to carry far heavier a load in the past decade than the former's affluenza, pristine circumstances reliant ass ever has.


Do you think some of Harden's troubles are self inflicted? OKC offered him a hair below the max and he rejected it, preferring to be the main guy in Houston. There he had trouble time after time getting along with teammates... In retrospect, Harden probably would've made more money accepting OKC's 4 year contract over Houston's 5 year. The Houston contract only paid a few million more per season, while the OKC contract would've ended a year earlier and given him an extra year at a higher salary, which would've more than covered the small difference between the two offers... though admittedly, that would've been tough to predict at the time.

[TD 21]

Do you think some of Harden's troubles are self inflicted? OKC offered him a hair below the max and he rejected it, preferring to be the main guy in Houston. There he had trouble time after time getting along with teammates... In retrospect, Harden probably would've made more money accepting OKC's 4 year contract over Houston's 5 year. The Houston contract only paid a few million more per season, while the OKC contract would've ended a year earlier and given him an extra year at a higher salary, which would've more than covered the small difference between the two offers... though admittedly, that would've been tough to predict at the time.

Definitely and I'm not absolving him nor am I a fan. I'm just saying, the criticism is disproportionate (just like it was with Davis) in comparison to Scumbag, who did far worse than either or anyone else yet somehow mostly evaded criticism and is now endlessly praised. It's disgusting.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1495937780819632132

[exstatic]

Do you think some of Harden's troubles are self inflicted? OKC offered him a hair below the max and he rejected it, preferring to be the main guy in Houston. There he had trouble time after time getting along with teammates... In retrospect, Harden probably would've made more money accepting OKC's 4 year contract over Houston's 5 year. The Houston contract only paid a few million more per season, while the OKC contract would've ended a year earlier and given him an extra year at a higher salary, which would've more than covered the small difference between the two offers... though admittedly, that would've been tough to predict at the time.

When the Heatles were assembled in 2010. Mickey Arison asked each to take a haircut of like $1M to sign Mike Miller. They agreed. After their 3rd season together, and the 2013 Finals, Miller was stretched to avoid the tax. LeBron and the others were livid, and one year later, the Heatles were history. Harden was probably right to reject less, and his proof came from Miami.

[PhantomDashCam]

1493306549917335555

[R. DeMurre]

When the Heatles were assembled in 2010. Mickey Arison asked each to take a haircut of like $1M to sign Mike Miller. They agreed. After their 3rd season together, and the 2013 Finals, Miller was stretched to avoid the tax. LeBron and the others were livid, and one year later, the Heatles were history. Harden was probably right to reject less, and his proof came from Miami.


Maybe... but if Harden retires ringless, maybe not. They won two rings in Miami. I think in the long run, championships are more satisfying than, say, the difference between $195mil and $210mil. It'd be different if we were talking about the difference between 35k and 80k, but once modern day athletes are in the upper stratosphere of earnings, it becomes more ego driven than reason driven, especially if they keep repeating the mantra that championships are what matter. A perfect example is Tim Duncan. He gave the Spurs "discounts," and won a late career ring, and it's not like he has had to sacrifice anything at all in terms of luxury.

[JeffDuncan]

Do you think some of Harden's troubles are self inflicted? OKC offered him a hair below the max and he rejected it, preferring to be the main guy in Houston. …


Which was the right career decision for Harden. In OKC Harden played a total of 220 regular season games but only started seven. His first Houston season he started in all seventy eight r.s. games he played, and he got his first all-star nod. He’s been an all star every season since. Harden had to get away from Westbrook.

But this is a thread about DJM. There’s no player on the Spurs that DJ would take steps to get away from. It also seems unlikely the Spurs would bring in such a player. I sure hope they have enough sense not to do that.

[R. DeMurre]

Which was the right career decision for Harden. In OKC Harden played a total of 220 regular season games but only started seven. His first Houston season he started in all seventy eight r.s. games he played, and he got his first all-star nod. He’s been an all star every season since. Harden had to get away from Westbrook.

.

True, but Harden was only 22 in his last season at OKC, and on the precipice of winning an NBA championship with a supremely talented team. If he re-signs with them, there's a good chance he gets a ring, and still has a chance to do other things, like lead his own team, by age 26. He's 32 now, and seems to be in a state of decline. In another season or two, his dreams of winning a championship-- like Westbrook's-- might be gone for good.

[exstatic]

Maybe... but if Harden retires ringless, maybe not. They won two rings in Miami. I think in the long run, championships are more satisfying than, say, the difference between $195mil and $210mil. It'd be different if we were talking about the difference between 35k and 80k, but once modern day athletes are in the upper stratosphere of earnings, it becomes more ego driven than reason driven, especially if they keep repeating the mantra that championships are what matter. A perfect example is Tim Duncan. He gave the Spurs "discounts," and won a late career ring, and it's not like he has had to sacrifice anything at all in terms of luxury.

Tim didn’t give the Spurs a discount until 2009-2010. That’s with 4 rings and 13 seasons under his belt. That’s not even remotely the same as Hardens situation, a player who just finished his THIRD season, and was still on his rookie deal, seeking his extension. I’d have told OKC to pound sand,too. Every contract you sign is based on a set of raises at a certain percentage of what you were making, so that would have had a ripple effect for his whole career.

[R. DeMurre]

Tim didn’t give the Spurs a discount until 2009-2010. That’s with 4 rings and 13 seasons under his belt. That’s not even remotely the same as Hardens situation, a player who just finished his THIRD season, and was still on his rookie deal, seeking his extension. I’d have told OKC to pound sand,too. Every contract you sign is based on a set of raises at a certain percentage of what you were making, so that would have had a ripple effect for his whole career.


once modern day athletes are in the upper stratosphere of earnings, it becomes more ego driven than reason driven, especially if they keep repeating the mantra that championships are what matter.

I still think a 50 year old ringless retired Harden will look back with regrets... who knows, maybe not. I know I would. There are very few things you can do in this world with $300 million that you can't also do with $250 million.

[offset formation]

One of the things that disturbed me about Kawhi long before Uncle made the scene was that he didn’t know who David WAS.

Wait, wut?

[KobesAchilles]

OKC is a shithole. I wouldn’t take a pay cut to live there either. Plus they still wanted him to come off the bench.

[JeffDuncan]

True, but Harden was only 22 in his last season at OKC, and on the precipice of winning an NBA championship with a supremely talented team. …


It was a team more talented on paper than in reality, tho. Westbrook and Harden are too much the same kind of player. Neither is a good defender. They are both high usage players who need a lot of time on the court. Looking at some stats for USG%:

Westbrook’s career high is in 2016-17, 34.6 min/gm, and a USG% of 41.7

Harden’s career high is in 2018-19, 36.8 min/gm, and a USG% of 40.5

And there’s only one basketball, and only 48 minutes in a game. You can’t make the best use of those two on the same team. Their abilities are not complementary, they’re in conflict.

I don’t think that OKC team was going to beat LeBron’s Heat. (It took the Spurs with a different kind of team to do that.) And I have to suspect it was driving Harden nuts to play second fiddle to Westbrook.

[Ice009]

:lmao Only if exaggerating a chronic condition/resting 95 games over 2 seasons, successfully tanking his value to such an extent that the team he was eventually "traded" to was handed the league's most complete, having the overwhelming favorite decimated by injury and still barely eking out a tainted championship, is what you call "bounce back".

Harden at least showed up to work. He didn't hide across the country while his sleazebag uncle attempted to destroy the hard earned reputation of his current employer, nor withhold medical information from said employer paying him $18.6M or say he'd only re-sign in one city, leaving them only able to recoup pennies on the dollar.

Wasn't that the season the Rockets choked a 3-2 series lead against the Warriors? If so, it's not Kawhi's fault that he won the ring that year. Rockets could have won it, but as usual, Harden disappeared when he needed to step up the most. Say what you want about Kawhi sitting out, but when he does play, Kawhi usually shows up in the biggest games.


One of the things that disturbed me about Kawhi long before Uncle made the scene was that he didn’t know who David WAS.

What do you mean he didn't know who David was? Do you mean he just didn't recognize him when he met him, or did he literally have no clue who he was?

[exstatic]

Wasn't that the season the Rockets choked a 3-2 series lead against the Warriors? If so, it's not Kawhi's fault that he won the ring that year. Rockets could have won it, but as usual, Harden disappeared when he needed to step up the most. Say what you want about Kawhi sitting out, but when he does play, Kawhi usually shows up in the biggest games.



What do you mean he didn't know who David was? Do you mean he just didn't recognize him when he met him, or did he literally have no clue who he was?

No clue. Seemed extremely odd at the time, not so much now. He’s just an extremely weird, inwardly focused individual. Even in the aftermath of all his shit, the other players, including the big three, said he really never talked to anyone.

[Trill Clinton]

But but he posts videos on Instagram :cry

One of the WOAT takes in Spurstalk history tbh

[R. DeMurre]

No clue. Seemed extremely odd at the time, not so much now. He’s just an extremely weird, inwardly focused individual. Even in the aftermath of all his shit, the other players, including the big three, said he really never talked to anyone.

I've always assumed Kawhi was somewhere on the autism spectrum, with at least a touch of Asperger's Syndrome.

[R. DeMurre]

It was a team more talented on paper than in reality, tho. Westbrook and Harden are too much the same kind of player. Neither is a good defender. They are both high usage players who need a lot of time on the court. Looking at some stats for USG%:

Westbrook’s career high is in 2016-17, 34.6 min/gm, and a USG% of 41.7

Harden’s career high is in 2018-19, 36.8 min/gm, and a USG% of 40.5

And there’s only one basketball, and only 48 minutes in a game. You can’t make the best use of those two on the same team. Their abilities are not complementary, they’re in conflict.

I don’t think that OKC team was going to beat LeBron’s Heat. (It took the Spurs with a different kind of team to do that.) And I have to suspect it was driving Harden nuts to play second fiddle to Westbrook.


I agree completely, and I think people will look at Westbrook's style of play more & more as time passes and see that it caused a ton of problems everywhere he went. This is one of the reasons I never found fault with Durant leaving OKC. It was the right basketball move, and Durant saw it (or at least acted on it) before Presti did, but Presti still gets the props as the great evaluator of talent while KD is called a traitor.

[lefty]

One of the things that disturbed me about Kawhi long before Uncle made the scene was that he didn’t know who David WAS.
Fuck him tbh, David Wingate is a Spurs legend

[Portnoy1000]

Fuck him tbh, David Wingate is a Spurs legend

I think he was referring to the great David Greenwood

[KingKev]

I think he was referring to the great David Greenwood

David West has entered the chat.

[exstatic]

I've always assumed Kawhi was somewhere on the autism spectrum, with at least a touch of Asperger's Syndrome.

I agree with that.

Now I’m not sure that DJ was really aware of DRob growing up, but he took the time to find out about the franchise when he got here. He went and found Ice, too, in the crowd.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1496279575839612930

[TD 21]

Wasn't that the season the Rockets choked a 3-2 series lead against the Warriors? If so, it's not Kawhi's fault that he won the ring that year. Rockets could have won it, but as usual, Harden disappeared when he needed to step up the most. Say what you want about Kawhi sitting out, but when he does play, Kawhi usually shows up in the biggest games.

Nah, the Paul hamstring injury was '18 and the Scumbag tainted championship was '19.

Harden could have played an all-time great game and they still would have had no chance against the Durant version of the Warriors with Paul injured.

Scumbag has only thrived in pristine circumstances. He's cowered in the face of adversity.

[daslicer]

I agree with that.

Now I’m not sure that DJ was really aware of DRob growing up, but he took the time to find out about the franchise when he got here. He went and found Ice, too, in the crowd.

Most guys don't really know about past players if they didn't grow up watching them or if they are not iconic like Jordan, Magic, Shaq, Kobe, AI, etc. Dejounte was born in September of '96 so he would have been 6 years old when Drob won his last title in '03. So, at that age he probably wouldn't know any of the top guys outside of Kobe, Shaq who were marketed.

[KingKev]

Most guys don't really know about past players if they didn't grow up watching them or if they are not iconic like Jordan, Magic, Shaq, Kobe, AI, etc. Dejounte was born in September of '96 so he would have been 6 years old when Drob won his last title in '03. So, at that age he probably wouldn't know any of the top guys outside of Kobe, Shaq who were marketed.

Disagree. I grew up in Toronto in the early 90s. We only had 1-2 basketball games a week on NBC Sunday and only after football season was over but I grew up with a ball in my hand and a love for the game and I knew players well before my era. You have to be pretty simple to not know the generation of folks only 10 years behind you. Especially when you were in college in the days of full blown internet, social media, youtube etc

[daslicer]

Disagree. I grew up in Toronto in the early 90s. We only had 1-2 basketball games a week on NBC Sunday and only after football season was over but I grew up with a ball in my hand and a love for the game and I knew players well before my era. You have to be pretty simple to not know the generation of folks only 10 years behind you. Especially when you were in college in the days of full blown internet, social media, youtube etc

I was born and raised in America and got into basketball also during the early 90's and was just like you when it came to learning about the game and players before my era. I have observed the younger generations are different. I play basketball 2-3 times a week and it's mainly against young 20 something year old. A lot of them don't know the players of previous eras unless it's the iconic guys like Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, etc. For example, I have worn a David Robinson jersey one time and a lot of guys straight up asked me who Robinson was. I have also worn other retro jerseys and guys don't have a clue of who these old school players are and these players are from the 90's and early '00s.

[emanueldavidginobili]

I was born and raised in America and got into basketball also during the early 90's and was just like you when it came to learning about the game and players before my era. I have observed the younger generations are different. I play basketball 2-3 times a week and it's mainly against young 20 something year old. A lot of them don't know the players of previous eras unless it's the iconic guys like Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, etc. For example, I have worn a David Robinson jersey one time and a lot of guys straight up asked me who Robinson was. I have also worn other retro jerseys and guys don't have a clue of who these old school players are and these players are from the 90's and early '00s.
And those 20 something year olds you play against are most likely casual fans, and I agree the casual fan won't know players outside of the absolute main players but if you're an actually hoop fan and play in the NBA you have to be a certain type of special to not know the greats 10 years before your time.

[KingKev]

I was born and raised in America and got into basketball also during the early 90's and was just like you when it came to learning about the game and players before my era. I have observed the younger generations are different. I play basketball 2-3 times a week and it's mainly against young 20 something year old. A lot of them don't know the players of previous eras unless it's the iconic guys like Jordan, Shaq, Kobe, etc. For example, I have worn a David Robinson jersey one time and a lot of guys straight up asked me who Robinson was. I have also worn other retro jerseys and guys don't have a clue of who these old school players are and these players are from the 90's and early '00s.

Well ignorance doesn’t discriminate I guess. I just feel like in an era of 2k, youtube, bleacher etc you should know who most top players of past generations are. With that being said there are ppl on this board who don’t even watch their own team let alone other teams.

For the record i’m 5’9, 33 and never could get up but I just rekindled my love for actually hooping and 20 yr old kids are throwing lobs to other 20 yr old guys while I try and take the charge LOL.

[Ice009]

Nah, the Paul hamstring injury was '18 and the Scumbag tainted championship was '19.

Harden could have played an all-time great game and they still would have had no chance against the Durant version of the Warriors with Paul injured.

Scumbag has only thrived in pristine circumstances. He's cowered in the face of adversity.

Got the years wrong, so thanks for the correction, but still, Klay had another one of his classic game 6s in high pressure road playoff performance like he did in OKC game 6. If Harden stepped up and played a great game, maybe it would have been enough to win game 6 even without Paul. The Warriors needed another Thompson classic to win it. The fact is, Thompson stepped up bigtime on the road and Harden did not step up at home with his home crowd there. Even if he played much better and if they didn't win, at least he could hold his head up high after the series. Harden has vanished in the biggest playoff games as a leader of a team. It's why I rate Manu as a much better playoff player to Harden. Harden is the better player, but in the playoffs, I'd take Manu over him any day of the week.

Harden has a chance to do something this season in the playoffs. He's gotta try and take advantage of it. Maybe I'm being too harsh on the guy, but I believe he's had some decent teams that could have gone further if not for himself faltering in must win games.

[BatManu20]

1496279946314268673

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FMParMUUYAIP-Ci?format=jpg&name=large

[BatManu20]

1495937780819632132

[BatManu20]

1495567883778379779

[Ocotillo]

So, does DJ get along with his father or not? I thought I had read they didn't speak.

[emanueldavidginobili]

1495567883778379779
Man what a weekend for him, happy for him. Can't wait to see how the rest of the season plays out for him.

[emanueldavidginobili]

So, does DJ get along with his father or not? I thought I had read they didn't speak.
1495537255934578691
Thought the same but it looks like they're on much better terms now.

[KingKev]

1495537255934578691
Thought the same but it looks like they're on much better terms now.

Doesn't look like DJ had much to work with as a kid; further testament to the person we are watching grow every day.

[TD 21]

Got the years wrong, so thanks for the correction, but still, Klay had another one of his classic game 6s in high pressure road playoff performance like he did in OKC game 6. If Harden stepped up and played a great game, maybe it would have been enough to win game 6 even without Paul. The Warriors needed another Thompson classic to win it. The fact is, Thompson stepped up bigtime on the road and Harden did not step up at home with his home crowd there. Even if he played much better and if they didn't win, at least he could hold his head up high after the series. Harden has vanished in the biggest playoff games as a leader of a team. It's why I rate Manu as a much better playoff player to Harden. Harden is the better player, but in the playoffs, I'd take Manu over him any day of the week.

Harden has a chance to do something this season in the playoffs. He's gotta try and take advantage of it. Maybe I'm being too harsh on the guy, but I believe he's had some decent teams that could have gone further if not for himself faltering in must win games.

Thompson made catch and shoot 3s created by Curry, Durant and Green, while Harden had to create virtually everything on his own.

There's no question Harden's performance in most of the biggest games of his career has been poor, but as ever context is important.

Anyway, my point was more so about the biased national media picking and choosing who they give free passes to for behavior.

[exstatic]

Most guys don't really know about past players if they didn't grow up watching them or if they are not iconic like Jordan, Magic, Shaq, Kobe, AI, etc. Dejounte was born in September of '96 so he would have been 6 years old when Drob won his last title in '03. So, at that age he probably wouldn't know any of the top guys outside of Kobe, Shaq who were marketed.
I wasn’t criticizing him for not knowing, I was lauding him for digging in and finding out. It’s something Kawhi never bothered with.

[skin27]

I wonder how murray is averaging 9 assist per game? Did the spurs system change? Tp never averaged 9 assist per game in his nba career.

[KingKev]

I wonder how murray is averaging 9 assist per game? Did the spurs system change? Tp never averaged 9 assist per game in his nba career.

Stat padding.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

I wonder how murray is averaging 9 assist per game? Did the spurs system change? Tp never averaged 9 assist per game in his nba career.

It has changed significantly from the Tim Duncan post up days. TP would throw the ball to TD , who'd go to work in the post, which wouldn't be credited as an assist. Besides the offensive possessions were fewer and tempo slower.

[r0drig0lac]

I wonder how murray is averaging 9 assist per game? Did the spurs system change? Tp never averaged 9 assist per game in his nba career.

he's good, very good as a point guard, and he makes the simplest pass most of the time.