If the Spurs draft 11th

[DAF86]

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the Spurs get the first pick, right now my gun-to-my-head pick would be Anthony Edwards. Easily the best scoring prospect in the draft, IMO. You don't have to squint too much to see him landing somewhere between Bradley Beal and Eric Gordon. A short shooting guard is literally the position of least need on the Spurs but they have to go with the best player available. Edwards comes across as kinda goofy in interviews but you can chalk that up to youth. You can't teach his natural scoring instincts and he is a good enough passer already that you can project the possibility of building an offense around him. He also has some defensive potential if he decides to buy in on that end.

I like Ball too but he's a terrible fit for the "culture" and he has a much lower floor than Edwards.

Edwards seems dumb and lazy as fuck, tbh. You can teach kids technical aspects, I don't know how possible it is to teach them wits/heart. Deep down, I would prefer the Spurs to remain at 11 so that they don't have to be forced to pick one of these flawed and/or poor fit top 4 prospects, tbh.

[Dejounte]

After watching some tape on Williams, I don't know that he could be playing like Tatum is right now. He doesn't have a bad frame but I just don't see him putting on the muscle and mass that is so necessary for Tatum to shine like he does. I do like the prospect, but I'd prefer a stronger wing. Especially considering Luka might not put all that much weight on, we need some real size at the forward positions.

Really? I don't know, man... I was under the impression that Pat was pretty thick, especially when you look at the dude's thighs in some photos. Also, Pat has a 7'0 wingspan compared to Jayson's 6'11" so length is pretty much the same.

If you're saying he probably doesnt have the work ethic to gain muscle given his current state, I'd say once he meets our young core I think that will change... Whats great about our young group is they seem to have adapted great work ethic.

[R. DeMurre]

I don't get the Lamelo Ball hype. Every scouting report says he has little to no interest in defense, and his 3pt%s in Lithuania and Australia were terrible. An inefficient No D & No 3 combo guard? Sounds like a shorter, less efficient Ben Simmons without the D. I don't think that's a top 4 pick.

[Dejounte]

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the Spurs get the first pick, right now my gun-to-my-head pick would be Anthony Edwards. Easily the best scoring prospect in the draft, IMO. You don't have to squint too much to see him landing somewhere between Bradley Beal and Eric Gordon. A short shooting guard is literally the position of least need on the Spurs but they have to go with the best player available. Edwards comes across as kinda goofy in interviews but you can chalk that up to youth. You can't teach his natural scoring instincts and he is a good enough passer already that you can project the possibility of building an offense around him. He also has some defensive potential if he decides to buy in on that end.

I like Ball too but he's a terrible fit for the "culture" and he has a much lower floor than Edwards.

Funny you bring up Ball... I've felt Anthony Edwards was too Hollywood for this team and will likely leave when his rookie contract expires.

We already had a chance to draft Anthony, his name was Kevin Porter.

[Dejounte]

I don't get the Lamelo Ball hype. Every scouting report says he has little to no interest in defense, and his 3pt%s in Lithuania and Australia were terrible. An inefficient No D & No 3 combo guard? Sounds like a shorter, less efficient Ben Simmons without the D. I don't think that's a top 4 pick.

If no one ends up being better than a Bradley Beal/ Eric Gordon type in this draft then what a shitty draft...

Also I don't look forward to the Spurs future if that's what we're building around.

[Dejounte]

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=anthony-edwards--kevin-porter-jr

Roughly the same size and numbers (Kevin played limited minutes due to an injury, I believe)


https://youtu.be/MvbNwfYhxVc


https://youtu.be/ST7LZPNYEIg

[duncan2150]

I don't get the offensive potential of patrick Williams.
He can shoot the 3 and drive but I don't see the ceilling offensively and he is nowhere like tatum at the same age.

But he is young so we'll see. Imo he could be a decent pick, a good starter or role player.

[Dejounte]

I don't get the offensive potential of patrick Williams.
He can shoot the 3 and drive but I don't see the ceilling offensively and he is nowhere like tatum at the same age.

But he is young so we'll see. Imo he could be a decent pick, a good starter or role player.

I was on the same boat as you until I watched this video


https://youtu.be/GrKHATZ38Gg

His regular highlights don't do him justice

Its also worth noting that Tatum had a way different offensive system on his college team than Pat. Pat's coach refused to allow any of his players to shine. they distributed the ball like 2014 Spurs, an 11 man rotation.

[Dejounte]

In addition to the context I mentioned above,

I believe Pat has a more natural tendency to make the smart pass or drive and pull-up for a mid-range J than Tatum. Because he's less reliant on ISO's and he allows the play to run and knows where to go off the ball makes me think he's great with his X's and O's/ bball IQ. Because of this, i feel his fit with the Spurs will be seamless and opposite of what happened with Lonnie.

Tatum has always had a tendency to drive and get the bump and foul. His handle is a lot more advanced now than his earlier years. Lets not forget the dude trained with Kobe and that probably helped a lot with his development.

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=patrick-williams--jayson-tatum

Similar numbers across the board. Not too shabby considering Pat wasnt a focal point of the offense and Tatum was.

[buttsR4rebounding]

Ah yes, the dynamic duo of Aldridge and Love. We stacked

Starting the Gay Love era in SA.

[MaNu4Tres]

If Spurs land a top 5 pick, shop the pick to trade down and add more draft capital in the upcoming years.

I love Vassell.

Like Patrick Williams and Precious.

[Dejounte]

If Spurs land a top 5 pick, shop the pick to trade down and add more draft capital in the upcoming years.

I love Vassell.

Like Patrick Williams and Precious.

If they trade down for two picks,

Patrick Williams and Isaiah Stewart would be my dream draft

[exstatic]

If Spurs land a top 5 pick, shop the pick to trade down and add more draft capital in the upcoming years.

I love Vassell.

Like Patrick Williams and Precious.

Top 4. It’s impossible for them to land at #5. They can pick 1-4,11-14.

[DAF86]

I'm warming up more and more to the idea of getting Patrick Williams. Like I said on my previous list of favourites, the only reason I initially didn't have him as my number one was because he lacks lateral movement to be a 3 and D player, but I'm thinking "fuck 3 and D", we are selecting higher than ever since getting Tim Duncan, we should be going for highest ceiling possible. I think that, at 11, Patrick Williams seems like the only plausible candidate with a high enough ceiling. Guys like Vassell and Bey might be safer picks, but they have no chance of being anything more than 3 and D guys. Nesmith is another guy I like that could be something more than a 3 and D guy, and the other is Pokusevski, but he seems to be a long 2 or 3 years away from being playable and at 11 might be a bit of reach.

So, as of right now, if we are picking 11, my personal list would go:

1- Patrick Williams
2-Aaron Nesmith
3-Devin Vasseell
4-Saddiq Bey
5-Aleksej Pokusevski

[mo7888]

I'm warming up more and more to the idea of getting Patrick Williams. Like I said on my previous list of favourites, the only reason I initially didn't have him as my number one was because he lacks lateral movement to be a 3 and D player, but I'm thinking "fuck 3 and D", we are selecting higher than ever since getting Tim Duncan, we should be going for highest ceiling possible. I think that, at 11, Patrick Williams seems like the only plausible candidate with a high enough ceiling. Guys like Vassell and Bey might be safer picks, but they have no chance of being anything more than 3 and D guys. Nesmith is another guy I like that could be something more than a 3 and D guy, and the other is Pokusevski, but he seems to be a long 2 or 3 years away from being playable and at 11 might be a bit of reach.

So, as of right now, if we are picking 11, my personal list would go:

1- Patrick Williams
2-Aaron Nesmith
3-Devin Vasseell
4-Saddiq Bey
5-Aleksej Pokusevski

I agree on the top 2.... I like tbe others too but a little than 12...if we ended up 15-20 range through some type of trade I like those names.

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

For the folks who like Achuiwa I feel we could get a similar player in the 2nd round or Un-drafted in Mamadi Diakite out of University of Virginia.

The big differences between them is Achuiwa is 2 years younger And Diakite is the better shooter by a long shot. Both guys are around the same height (Achuiwa might be a bit taller), size, and have similar wingspan. Diakite and Achuiwa both are high energy and defensively versatile players.

I believe Achuiwa has played more like a 5 while Diakite is more a 4

[Dejounte]

For the folks who like Achuiwa I feel we could get a similar player in the 2nd round or Un-drafted in Mamadi Diakite out of University of Virginia.

The big differences between them is Achuiwa is 2 years younger And Diakite is the better shooter by a long shot. Both guys are around the same height (Achuiwa might be a bit taller), size, and have similar wingspan. Diakite and Achuiwa both are high energy and defensively versatile players.

I believe Achuiwa has played more like a 5 while Diakite is more a 4

Fuck that name man. I dont even want to try and pronounce it

You made it up, didnt you. Trying to fuck with us...haha

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

An international scout has been telling me for months that Deni is way overhyped. He says Israel is so desperate for a star that his team is doing everything possible to artificially boost his stock. For example, supposedly his Israeli League MVP was BS.

I'm still working through Deni's tape but I've been pretty whelmed so far. Good size, straight ahead speed, ballhandling and some craft but I haven't come across much depth yet. A perimeter player with low shooting percentages and no real ability to beat defenders in isolation? Meh. I haven't seen his most recent footage yet though so maybe it's in there...

I seen the exact same stuff about Deni and the Israeli league propping him up also from different sources. I even stated as such in this thread.

I think he can be an okay player but he is being a tad bit overhyped due to this draft being looked at as being weak and the success of Doncic in the NBA. The thing the media is overlooking is Doncic played and dominated the 2nd best basketball league in the world before getting drafted to the NBA while Deni won a championship in a weaker league and just started getting consistent minutes in the Euroleague before the pandemic

[D-Robinson 50 fan]

Double post

[cd98]

Just pick someone that won't jump ship after their first contact is up and after the Spurs have heavily invested in them because they want to play in a bigger market.

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ef3r3yMWkAEe_RU?format=jpg&name=large

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/1268544071578062849/QIG6_iqC_normal.jpg
San Antonio Spurs spurs
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It's here! How y'all feeling, #SpursFamily (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23SpursFamily)? https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f3c0.png #NBADraftLottery (https://twitter.com/search?q=%23NBADraftLottery) https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/23f0.png 7:30pm CT https://abs.twimg.com/emoji/v2/72x72/1f4fa.png ESPN

[look_at_g_shred]

Y’all got to remember that Williams was playing like 3rd or 4th fiddle on his team. No telling what he could’ve done if he was the #1 option.

[Dejounte]

Y’all got to remember that Williams was playing like 3rd or 4th fiddle on his team. No telling what he could’ve done if he was the #1 option.

Yeah, like I said earlier, they had an 11 man rotation with ball movement as an emphasis for its offensive scheme. No player averaged more than 12.7 ppg on that roster. Whereas on Tatum's Duke team there were three players over 14.5 ppg.

Pat's team was playing full court press. Since it was an 11 man rotation, each player had to give it their all on defense.

[Leetonidas]

Would be pretty hilarious if spurs ended up with the #1 pick in a weak draft :lol

What happened to wiseman? Noticed he is not getting much talk for a pick in the 1 to 4 range for us

[BackHome]

Wiseman scares me he only played in 3 games so he is either going to be an All Star or out of the League in 3 to 6 years.

But in all honesty I don’t care who they draft they just can’t be an idiot and they gotta have heart I want someone who loves the game and is willing to fight and won’t back down.

[look_at_g_shred]

Would be pretty hilarious if spurs ended up with the #1 pick in a weak draft :lol

What happened to wiseman? Noticed he is not getting much talk for a pick in the 1 to 4 range for us
Building your team around a center in today’s nba is not the smartest thing

[exstatic]

Building your team around a center in today’s nba is not the smartest thing

Not a traditional plodding center, but a long, athletic 19 YO? Draft him, and lock him in the gym with Tim for the rest of the offseason.

[DPG21920]

Take Anthony Edwards or trade back to get Deni, Toppin or Wiseman. Don’t take one of those 3 with #1 imo.

Then can move Murray or White for more capital or other players

[Dejounte]

Not a traditional plodding center, but a long, athletic 19 YO? Draft him, and lock him in the gym with Tim for the rest of the offseason.

You would think that would work but it's not like our current bigs has gained much under Tim. Eubanks, Metu, and even Aldridge.

[ace3g]

Florida State's Patrick Williams, Potential Top-10 Riser

https://img.bleacherreport.net/img/article/media_slots/photos/003/020/040/54447104f6c5d860de91628632adbec3_crop_exact.jpg?h= 533&w=800&q=70&crop_x=center&crop_y=top

Williams has quietly gained serious steam within NBA front offices. His name has come up multiple times in the sleeper-of-the-draft discussion.
One executive admitted to moving him into the top eight of his rankings, citing Williams being the draft's youngest NCAA prospect with "off-the-charts upside."


Another scout floated the idea that when we look back in a few years, we'll question how and why Williams wasn't a top pick more than any other prospect.


He didn't generate national attention, averaging just 9.2 points and 4.0 rebounds. But for a powerful 6'8", 225-pound 19-year-old, scouts have become enticed by his flashes of physical, athletic finishes, shot-making touch off the catch and dribble, pick-and-roll passing skills and defensive playmaking.

Those particular flashes create a unique potential trajectory if they become routine plays for Williams. And considering he only turned 19 on August 6, it seems as if teams will be willing to bet on his development.

https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2905180-2020-nba-draft-lottery-buzz-the-mystery-begins-right-at-the-top

[exstatic]

You would think that would work but it's not like our current bigs has gained much under Tim. Eubanks, Metu, and even Aldridge.

Non of them are 19, 7’1” with a 7’4” wingspan. He’s more like Ayton than any of those guys.

[Dejounte]

Non of them are 19, 7’1” with a 7’4” wingspan. He’s more like Ayton than any of those guys.

What does size have to do with learning skill, though? Look, I get it... But I'm just skeptical players learn much from living legends seeing how Dejounte hasnt learned much from either Manu or TP3. Not just Dejounte, but the others.

In my opinion, any young player who expects to grow cant just be blank canvas (an athletic big with no fundamentals) , thats how you end up with your Tyrus Thomases. There's got to be a foundation already there. I'm not just talking about Wiseman here...

[BackHome]

So he played in 3 games average 23 minutes and averaged 10.7 rebounds and 19.7pts but he was suspended due to family taking money from school to help with his move. Is he worth the risk maybe a lot will have to depend on players measurements and also interviews and background checks. One thing for sure he is could definitely help us out in defense something we need to dramatically improve upon.

[ace3g]

Spurs Draft Cap

https://fanatics.frgimages.com/FFImage/thumb.aspx?i=/productimages/_3813000/altimages/ff_3813990-66cc44d305466b506a1falt1_full.jpg&w=900

https://store.nba.com/san-antonio-spurs/mens-san-antonio-spurs-new-era-heather-gray-2020-nba-draft-official-on-stage-9fifty-snapback-adjustable-hat/t-58038605+p-037589700940+z-8-2775828661?_ref=p-CLP:m-GRID:i-r4c1:po-13

[exstatic]

What does size have to do with learning skill, though? Look, I get it... But I'm just skeptical players learn much from living legends seeing how Dejounte hasnt learned much from either Manu or TP3. Not just Dejounte, but the others.

In my opinion, any young player who expects to grow cant just be blank canvas (an athletic big with no fundamentals) , thats how you end up with your Tyrus Thomases. There's got to be a foundation already there. I'm not just talking about Wiseman here...

You almost never get even partially finished players in the draft anymore. Everyone is a project. James was also handcuffed by only playing 3 games with Memphis. Every player in this draft is a project. I’d rather take a flyer on Wiseman than any 6’5” guard, except maybe Halliburton.

[exstatic]

So he played in 3 games average 23 minutes and averaged 10.7 rebounds and 19.7pts but he was suspended due to family taking money from school to help with his move. Is he worth the risk maybe a lot will have to depend on players measurements and also interviews and background checks. One thing for sure he is could definitely help us out in defense something we need to dramatically improve upon.

They’ll do their due diligence, like always. Nothing you’ve said is an automatic disqualification. Pop hired Quin Snyder into the organization to coach Austin, and he cheated like a MF on recruiting in the NCAA. The NCAA has a rule system that can only be described as Byzantine, and it’s not some moral code. If he really did just take some money for moving expenses, I don’t see that as a show stopper with the Spurs if everything else checks out OK.

[ace3g]

Segment starts at 4:30


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjJIfgzie-0

[timvp]

My order right this second would:

1) Edwards. Most offensive upside. Best chance of developing into a high usage focal point of a potent offense.
2) Wiseman. Seven-foot-1, ultra athletic, ultra long, left handed center who studies tape of David Robinson? That's not a bad package, tbh.
3) Ball. Best passer with the most creativity of any prospect. Probably has the highest ceiling in the draft but is definitely a risk on multiple fronts.


The good news is that, while the top of this draft looks pretty damn weak, it's deep enough that the Spurs should get a good player at 11. In fact, you can make the case that the No. 11 pick is better bang for the buck than the No. 1 pick -- and that's almost never the case.

[Trill Clinton]

Patrick Williams me, please.

[timvp]

They’ll do their due diligence, like always. Nothing you’ve said is an automatic disqualification. Pop hired Quin Snyder into the organization to coach Austin, and he cheated like a MF on recruiting in the NCAA. The NCAA has a rule system that can only be described as Byzantine, and it’s not some moral code. If he really did just take some money for moving expenses, I don’t see that as a show stopper with the Spurs if everything else checks out OK.

Yeah, I care 0% about the NCAA violations regarding Wiseman. It's a corrupt system. Everyone is guilty of something if you look hard enough.

Good point about Snyder ... and also remember that Pop gave Kelvin Sampson a job literally a couple days after he was forced to resign due to breaking NCAA regulations at Indiana.

[Ed Helicopter Jones]

My order right this second would:

1) Edwards. Most offensive upside. Best chance of developing into a high usage focal point of a potent offense.
2) Wiseman. Seven-foot-1, ultra athletic, ultra long, left handed center who studies tape of David Robinson? That's not a bad package, tbh.
3) Ball. Best passer with the most creativity of any prospect. Probably has the highest ceiling in the draft but is definitely a risk on multiple fronts.


The good news is that, while the top of this draft looks pretty damn weak, it's deep enough that the Spurs should get a good player at 11. In fact, you can make the case that the No. 11 pick is better bang for the buck than the No. 1 pick -- and that's almost never the case.

Agreed. Probably a decent year to (likely) be drafting in the latter half of the lottery.

[james evans]

We could end up with All of the picks 1-5 and Popovich would just pick a bunch of guys no one has ever heard of(or slow euro players)and sit them on the bench for 2 years while signing washed up free agents

[BatManu20]

Everyone talking about us moving into the Top-4 and watch us fall to 13 or 14 :lol


Seriously though I think Williams will be gone by 11 when it’s all said and done. Vassell and Nesmith seem like the most likely targets for us imo.

[BatManu20]

ESPN’s Top-10 Mock. They don’t know about the Williams hype yet. Replace Precious with Williams and not a bad mock tbh.



https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EfuBCPCWAAQGSFw?format=jpg&name=medium

[ace3g]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Ef4haaPU0AAFrrB?format=jpg&name=large

[Dejounte]

The amount of people who still want that fucking scrub Devin Vassell is exhausting smh. But I guess I can't keep this up for two months, so I'm just going to let it be.



https://youtu.be/z40CqOGzBrE
Mr. Overrated Anthony Edwards off-court issues at 7:53

[BatManu20]

The amount of people who still want that fucking scrub Devin Vassell is exhausting smh. But I guess I can't keep this up for two months, so I'm just going to let it be.



https://youtu.be/z40CqOGzBrE
Mr. Overrated Anthony Edwards off-court issues at 7:53

I know you don’t like him as a prospect but there’s a good chance he’s gonna be there at 11 and there’s a good chance the Spurs are going to seriously consider him.

[BatManu20]

The amount of people who still want that fucking scrub Devin Vassell is exhausting smh. But I guess I can't keep this up for two months, so I'm just going to let it be.



https://youtu.be/z40CqOGzBrE
Mr. Overrated Anthony Edwards off-court issues at 7:53

I know you don’t like Vassell as a prospect but there’s a good chance he’s gonna be there at 11 and there’s a good chance the Spurs are going to seriously consider him.

[Russ]

Might be an unpopular opinion but if the Spurs get the first pick, right now my gun-to-my-head pick would be Anthony Edwards. Easily the best scoring prospect in the draft, IMO. You don't have to squint too much to see him landing somewhere between Bradley Beal and Eric Gordon. A short shooting guard is literally the position of least need on the Spurs but they have to go with the best player available. Edwards comes across as kinda goofy in interviews but you can chalk that up to youth. You can't teach his natural scoring instincts and he is a good enough passer already that you can project the possibility of building an offense around him. He also has some defensive potential if he decides to buy in on that end.

I like Ball too but he's a terrible fit for the "culture" and he has a much lower floor than Edwards.

This draft goes 7 deep -- of those top 7, Edwards and Ball are the only two that I believe might be a bad fit for the Spurs.

Edwards may be the next Dwyane Wade but probably not. And if not, he's probably more trouble than he's worth. Ball is almost certainly more trouble than he's worth (especially for a club like the Spurs).

My top tiers (for the Spurs) are:

Tier One:
1. James Wiseman
2. Onyeka Okongwu
3. Deni Avdija

Tier Two:
4. Obi Toppin
5. Killian Hayes


An international scout has been telling me for months that Deni is way overhyped. He says Israel is so desperate for a star that his team is doing everything possible to artificially boost his stock. For example, supposedly his Israeli League MVP was BS.

I hate to disagree timvp, but to a suspicious paranoid dude like me, this sounds like possible disinformation -- especially if this "scout" is somehow associated with the Spurs. Does he know you run a fairly popular website?

When I watch Deni he looks very smooth going to the hole. Sometimes when we yanks see that in a Euro (let's not debate whether he's a Euro) we think he's slow -- "He'll never do that in the NBA," we say. But more often than not, they do, we just don't believe it until we see it. Remember way back -- Laker fans were adamant that Manu could never use those Euro moves to get to the hoop in the NBA. They were laughing about it (for a while).

[exstatic]

Everyone talking about us moving into the Top-4 and watch us fall to 13 or 14 :lol


Seriously though I think Williams will be gone by 11 when it’s all said and done. Vassell and Nesmith seem like the most likely targets for us imo.

I think the odds of 13 or 14 are longer than winning the top pick. Two teams, with longer odds than us, would BOTH have to jump into the top4, and that’s for 13. All three teams behind us would have to jump in for us to fall to 14. I think the only drop that is really a possibility is 12.

[BatManu20]

Of the frequently toted Top-10 guys, Tyrese Haliburton is the guy who I think has a chance of falling to the Spurs at 11. He’s basically Dejounte with a handle, much better passing and a jump shot.

[exstatic]

Of the frequently toted Top-10 guys, Tyrese Haliburton is the guy who I think has a chance of falling to the Spurs at 11. He’s basically Dejounte with a good jump shot.

It’s fucking ugly looking, but his damn range is nearly limitless. He seems kind of like late career JKidd, with that weird 3 pointer and the 360:court vision.

[Fusternino]

Patrick Williams currently projected to go to us. He's listed as a SF/PF but has the size of a straight up 3. Might have grown the past year though, we'll see. Good shooter apparently.

[timvp]

If my math is right, the No. 1 pick would get about $32 million over three years, while the No. 11 would get about $13 million over three years. Shiiiiii ... I'm not saying I'm rooting for No. 11 but it looks like better value on paper.

[BatManu20]

Patrick Williams currently projected to go to us. He's listed as a SF/PF but has the size of a straight up 3. Might have grown the past year though, we'll see. Good shooter apparently.

Phoenix needs a PG but if Ball an Hayes are both gone, I think Williams will be their target. Don’t see him getting past 10 tbh.

[timvp]

If you add in the fourth year option, a No. 1 pick would cost ~$47 million over four years. I don't know if anyone in this draft is worth that money, tbh. If the Spurs get the top pick, I think the first thing you do is call the Knicks (so they can get Ball) and the Hawks (so they can get Edwards) to see if they'll trade their lottery pick and a future first for the No. 1 pick.

[Robz4000]

If my math is right, the No. 1 pick would get about $32 million over three years, while the No. 11 would get about $13 million over three years. Shiiiiii ... I'm not saying I'm rooting for No. 11 but it looks like better value on paper.

Fuck that. You land the #1 pick you can trade it.

[exstatic]

If you add in the fourth year option, a No. 1 pick would cost ~$47 million over four years. I don't know if anyone in this draft is worth that money, tbh. If the Spurs get the top pick, I think the first thing you do is call the Knicks (so they can get Ball) and the Hawks (so they can get Edwards) to see if they'll trade their lottery pick and a future first for the No. 1 pick.
Yeah, I was thinking that, too. If you can get back a lottery pick in the top 5-6, and either a future #1 or a nice young asset, you trade back. At that point, I’m picking Halliburton.

[exstatic]

If you add in the fourth year option, a No. 1 pick would cost ~$47 million over four years. I don't know if anyone in this draft is worth that money, tbh. If the Spurs get the top pick, I think the first thing you do is call the Knicks (so they can get Ball) and the Hawks (so they can get Edwards) to see if they'll trade their lottery pick and a future first for the No. 1 pick.
Yeah, I was thinking that, too. If you can get back a lottery pick in the top 5-6, and either a future #1 or a nice young asset, you trade back. At that point, I’m picking Halliburton.

[Russ]

If Halliburton and/or Okoro and/or Williams and/or Vassell and/or Achiuwa get picked in the top 10 in some combination, it may allow a top 7 player to fall to the Spurs (although unlikely).

The more likely scenario would be for the Spurs to trade up from 11 or 12 to 8 or 9 if their player is still there. Kind of like the Kawhi draft day trade in 2011. But I don't know what asset the Spurs would use to do this.

[objective]

I think a big concern for Wiseman is his missing the year. Young bigs on the raw side missing a year of their teens makes me very nervous. Mitchell Robinson not making a sizeable leap his second year, Enes Kanter never reaching the potential people foresaw for him, it gets me worried.

[ace3g]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lHpmxKg2Os

[Spursfanfromafar]

One candidate for a trade for a top 4 pick would be Sacramento. If the Spurs can trade it's no 1 to 4 pick for Nemanja Bjelica and a future first rounder.. it would be a great trade..

[BWS-1994]

One candidate for a trade for a top 4 pick would be Sacramento. If the Spurs can trade it's no 1 to 4 pick for Nemanja Bjelica and a future first rounder.. it would be a great trade..

With Vlade out, would Dumars do it?

[Dejounte]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lHpmxKg2Os

"Kawhi is my favorite player and who I try to model my game after"

Also mentions Paul George and Jimmy Butler...

If you close your eyes, his voice and diction kinda sounds like DeMar..

[Ignazzz]

No chance for deal 1/4 & 1rd & Bjelica
not in this Draft

[objective]

All aboard the Patrick Williams hype train

For anyone new to the thread, I had numerous posts with time stamped video links earlier in the thread

I think I'd want him if the Spurs moved to #3 or #4. #1 or #2, I'd try to trade down like Boston for Tatum and still take him.

Offensively I see the Kawhi potential. I might have Kawhi goggles on and he's really Earl Clark, but the dream lives on

[DPG21920]

If you add in the fourth year option, a No. 1 pick would cost ~$47 million over four years. I don't know if anyone in this draft is worth that money, tbh. If the Spurs get the top pick, I think the first thing you do is call the Knicks (so they can get Ball) and the Hawks (so they can get Edwards) to see if they'll trade their lottery pick and a future first for the No. 1 pick.

1) Agree. I spoke about trading back and SA should be looking to money ball. Problem is they seem borderline incompetent with regards to trades and free agency so it’s hard to see them being smart and cutthroat when needed.

Especially if they like wiseman or Toppin they can’t use #1 pick on that. Trade back, get your guy and the extra draft capital. Again, tall task for this FO though.

2) Valid point about the money but even having said that is cap space going to be an issue next 4 years? I don’t see it being an issue even if it’s a better “value”


Get a top 3 pick and trade away and save the money hopefully

[DPG21920]

Wiseman makes a lot of sense on paper for this team. Whether Sa thinks he’s good/worth it but he is the guy along with Toppin that fit without worrying about other moves naturally.

Even if SA gets 11 - 13, they should be aggressive in trading up if they like him.

[Gibbz]

I would guess they take best Euro available, especially since there was no NCAA tournament. Probably Killian Hayes.

[spurspl]

pls no kilian hayes

[Chinook]

If you add in the fourth year option, a No. 1 pick would cost ~$47 million over four years. I don't know if anyone in this draft is worth that money, tbh. If the Spurs get the top pick, I think the first thing you do is call the Knicks (so they can get Ball) and the Hawks (so they can get Edwards) to see if they'll trade their lottery pick and a future first for the No. 1 pick.

Honestly, this is ridiculous. Like you trade back if you can get the guy you want while picking up value. You don't worry about money. There's going to be someone worth $45M/4 in this draft, and it's SA's job to find that guy. That'd be some Divac-level mess to dodge a superstar for a reason like that. Now if you get the team behind you wanting to move up for a different guy, or a team a couple of picks behind you wants to do so but you know the team(s) in between won't take that player, that's one thing. But hopping from 1 to 5 or 6 for a nebulous future pick is dumb.

[DAF86]

All aboard the Patrick Williams hype train

For anyone new to the thread, I had numerous posts with time stamped video links earlier in the thread

I think I'd want him if the Spurs moved to #3 or #4. #1 or #2, I'd try to trade down like Boston for Tatum and still take him.

Offensively I see the Kawhi potential. I might have Kawhi goggles on and he's really Earl Clark, but the dream lives on

I'm on board. Best case scenario would be getting a top 4 pick and trade it for a future first and a pick around #8 this year so you can go a grab Williams.

[timvp]

Honestly, this is ridiculous. Like you trade back if you can get the guy you want while picking up value. You don't worry about money. There's going to be someone worth $45M/4 in this draft, and it's SA's job to find that guy. That'd be some Divac-level mess to dodge a superstar for a reason like that. Now if you get the team behind you wanting to move up for a different guy, or a team a couple of picks behind you wants to do so but you know the team(s) in between won't take that player, that's one thing. But hopping from 1 to 5 or 6 for a nebulous future pick is dumb.

Obviously that trade assumes the Spurs don't see a clear cut superstar and don't believe the flawed top prospects are worth gambling on. If they see a superstar or even a star, draft him. Otherwise, I like the idea of swinging for the fences by getting a future first from a bad franchise.

[DAF86]

Honestly, I like the 8 to 15 range guys more than the top 8. Trade away if we get a top 4.

[Joe Schmoogins]

All aboard the Patrick Williams hype train

For anyone new to the thread, I had numerous posts with time stamped video links earlier in the thread

I think I'd want him if the Spurs moved to #3 or #4. #1 or #2, I'd try to trade down like Boston for Tatum and still take him.

Offensively I see the Kawhi potential. I might have Kawhi goggles on and he's really Earl Clark, but the dream lives on

I like Williams, but after seeing some tape I wonder if he's really 6'-8". Looks about the same height to me as Vassell. Maybe 6'-7" Which is still OK, but if he's closer to 6'-6" he loses a little of his appeal.

[objective]

I like Williams, but after seeing some tape I wonder if he's really 6'-8". Looks about the same height to me as Vassell. Maybe 6'-7" Which is still OK, but if he's closer to 6'-6" he loses a little of his appeal.

I have watched I don't know how many games of Williams, maybe 20?, And I never questioned his height. Unlike say Okoro who I just watched 1 game and would swear he's not 6-5.

Williams has other issues with his body. If you search Twitter you can find posts discussing possible leg issues with him with video clips. He does have massive thighs and probably needs some through attention from the trainers to maximize his physical potential

[DAF86]

I have watched I don't know how many games of Williams, maybe 20?, And I never questioned his height. Unlike say Okoro who I just watched 1 game and would swear he's not 6-5.

Williams has other issues with his body. If you search Twitter you can find posts discussing possible leg issues with him with video clips. He does have massive thighs and probably needs some through attention from the trainers to maximize his physical potential

What leg issues? Him having thick legs is actually a good thing to avoid injuries, tbh.

[objective]

What leg issues? Him having thick legs is actually a good thing to avoid injuries, tbh.

I don't remember exactly and would have to look it up later.

But I think the gist was a muscle imbalance, that his knee and foot would turn in on landing when jumping. I think there was something about this sort of thing explaining why his lateral speed or hip flipping was slow. I *think* some draftnik or physio suggested him decreasing the muscle mass in his legs.

Don't quote me on it, but it's out there

[Dejounte]

All aboard the Patrick Williams hype train

For anyone new to the thread, I had numerous posts with time stamped video links earlier in the thread

I think I'd want him if the Spurs moved to #3 or #4. #1 or #2, I'd try to trade down like Boston for Tatum and still take him.

Offensively I see the Kawhi potential. I might have Kawhi goggles on and he's really Earl Clark, but the dream lives on

I'm co-captain ;) spent a lot of time defending Pat and convincing people on here that he's better than the shittier Devin fucking Vassell.

[BatManu20]

11 it is. Devin Vassell is gonna be the pick.

[DPG21920]

Would GS trade #2 for LMA

[Dejounte]

I don't remember exactly and would have to look it up later.

But I think the gist was a muscle imbalance, that his knee and foot would turn in on landing when jumping. I think there was something about this sort of thing explaining why his lateral speed or hip flipping was slow. I *think* some draftnik or physio suggested him decreasing the muscle mass in his legs.

Don't quote me on it, but it's out there

So we're trusting internet doctors?

[Dejounte]

11 it is. Devin Vassell is gonna be the pick.

Nahhhhh I swear to you it wont be.

[Chinook]

Would GS trade #2 for LMA

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.

[Dejounte]

I like Williams, but after seeing some tape I wonder if he's really 6'-8". Looks about the same height to me as Vassell. Maybe 6'-7" Which is still OK, but if he's closer to 6'-6" he loses a little of his appeal.

https://www.instagram.com/p/B8g5YIQlOEs/?igshid=1frclqebw8our

Pat is clearly taller than Devin fuckin scrub Vassell

[DAF86]

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.

Would the Spurs do that, though?

[200 miles]

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.
Initially I fully supported that scenario but you have to wonder if Murray goes out in favor of drafting a big or a 3, it's an open guard spot that would tempt PATFO to re-sign Forbes.

[Dejounte]

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.

Warriors will laugh and hang up

[Dejounte]

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.

Warriors will laugh and hang up

[ace3g]

https://www.instagram.com/p/B8g5YIQlOEs/?igshid=1frclqebw8our

Pat is clearly taller than Devin fuckin scrub Vassell

I wish teams were required to post stock photos of players both in college/NBA so you can compare heights that way instead of by "listed height."

https://scontent-lax3-1.cdninstagram.com/v/t51.2885-15/e35/82888916_482358636003804_1451321858237909413_n.jpg ?_nc_ht=scontent-lax3-1.cdninstagram.com&_nc_cat=100&_nc_ohc=JIoJAw0XivMAX8Nivsl&oh=20d00c7dc37ba5d1aa08174c0c3a0fc4&oe=5F67BF23

[KobesAchilles]

I like Vessell. He has size, shooting, and moves well on defense. All I can ask for at the 11th pick

[Dejounte]

I like Vessell. He has size, shooting, and moves well on defense. All I can ask for at the 11th pick

He doesnt have size. He would be guarding 1 to 3. We need someone to guard 2 to 4 or at least 3 to 4. Arent you fucking tired of opposing forwards towering our midgets?

[Dejounte]

For instance, Michael Porter Jr would still have no problem abusing us like he did in the bubble game because Vassell is about 3" to 4" shorter than him.

[Dejounte]

Biggest fucking myth that needs to be plastered everywhere: "Vassell has size". No. He doesn't.

[DAF86]

Biggest fucking myth that needs to be plastered everywhere: "Vassell has size". No. He doesn't.

Vassell length is reported to be anywhere from 6'10" to 7 feet. That isn't small, tbh. For instance, Williams is reported to be only a foot longer, both in terms of height and wingspan.

[KobesAchilles]

He doesnt have size. He would be guarding 1 to 3. We need someone to guard 2 to 4 or at least 3 to 4. Arent you fucking tired of opposing forwards towering our midgets?
I guess. He’s listed 6’7 which is Klay Thompson size. Idgaf about 4’s :lol
Dame, CJ, Steph, Klay, Harden, Westbrook, Mitchell, Kawhi, George (he plays small), Shay, CP3. These are the players I care about guarding. AD and Jokic are nothing to me. Lebron is now a 1 :lol

[Dejounte]

I guess. He’s listed 6’7 which is Klay Thompson size. Idgaf about 4’s :lol
Dame, CJ, Steph, Klay, Harden, Westbrook, Mitchell, Kawhi, George (he plays small), Shay, CP3. These are the players I care about guarding. AD and Jokic are nothing to me. Lebron is now a 1 :lol

Wtf? Theres a difference between what position they play and what size their position usually is. Im referring to the latter. LeBron is a 1 but you shouldnt have fucking Murray guarding him. Weird argument you have here. Vassell doesnt have the size is my clear point. He cant guard Kawhi, George, or LeBron. Not Giannis, Siakam, and more.

[Dejounte]

Vassell length is reported to be anywhere from 6'10" to 7 feet. That isn't small, tbh. For instance, Williams is reported to be only a foot longer, both in terms of height and wingspan.

We've gone over this argument before and we probably will again until we receive the combine measurements.

My points have been:

1. He's 30 lb lighter than probably the average 3.5. He will get pushed around. And no, i dont believe in the mythical "he will gain muscle" argument. That's rare and he doesnt have the frame.
2. College tape shows his defense has been effective against shorter players. Not bigger ones. That was Pat's job.
3. As I said earlier, I think there's a bigger difference in size from Pat than you think.

Lets wait until the official combine numbers.

[DAF86]

Are there going to be combine numbers?

[Chinook]

You don't have to be the same size as a guy to guard him. I know nothing about Vassell. I'm not sure I even want to know. But we're talking about perimeter players here. Positioning, instincts and tenacity go way more important. Plus, the idea of checking stars with guys one-on-one went away six years ago. Run good, switchable defenders and help.

[DAF86]

And, fwiw, I already said I changed my tune about Vassell and Williams, I would rather draft Patrick. But if he's no longer available by the time the Spurs have to pick, Vassell is still a pretty solid get. The kid seems like a sure thing as a 3 and D guy for years to come in the NBA. He has almost no weaknesses on defense, aside from the fact that he could put on a bit more weight, but taking that away, he has everything on that side of the floor: lateral movement, awareness, active hands, relentless motor. Pop would cream himself over Vassell's defensive rotations.

[KobesAchilles]

Wtf? Theres a difference between what position they play and what size their position usually is. Im referring to the latter. LeBron is a 1 but you shouldnt have fucking Murray guarding him. Weird argument you have here. Vassell doesnt have the size is my clear point. He cant guard Kawhi, George, or LeBron. Not Giannis, Siakam, and more.
To me, this is kinda the whole football mindset. I get we have different povs but mine is more you plan for your division and then you're conference. Siakam and Giannis are non-factors to me. We play them twice a year and Giannis is MVP so nobody is really guarding him. Vassell totally can guard George Paul. If the random no-name Mavs wing players can hold him to 4-17 and Portland the year before kept him in check then I have faith. The Lebron comment was a joke btw and no rookie wil be able to guard Kawhi anyway.

The majority of the best players in our division are shorter than Vassell. The majority of the conferences best players are shorter than him and his lack of weight won't be an issue. Though he should put on 15 pounds by the time he's 23-24. He's a stick, I will give you that, but he has length to help him. I'm not expecting an All-star. Honestly I want our role players filled in first before we pull of KA's "luck into a superstar draft pick plan."

[daslicer]

I would like a 3-D guy like a few other posters have mentioned. The Spurs defense has been terrible the last few years and a lot of it has to do with not having a legit 3. If the Spurs get a good 3-D defender than the Spurs can start to become a good defensive team again.

[Dejounte]

You don't have to be the same size as a guy to guard him. I know nothing about Vassell. I'm not sure I even want to know. But we're talking about perimeter players here. Positioning, instincts and tenacity go way more important. Plus, the idea of checking stars with guys one-on-one went away six years ago. Run good, switchable defenders and help.

Sure, but I dont know about you but for the last several years we havent had a competent switchable defender who can effectively guard the Giannises, Siakams, LeBrons.

Are you telling me size doesnt matter to guard these guys and its just positioning, instincts, and tenacity? They will literally shoot over Vassell or play bully ball and cause him to fall over. I just disagree, strength and length matters a bunch and im tired of seeing an undersized team. Look at the Clips, size helps them defend because they have all these lengthy defenders. Marcus Morris is not some defensive stud but he can check Doncic because he wont be bodied by him. Doncic absolutely abuses Patrick Beverley... Who is an example of what you describe here of "positioning, instinct, and tenacity".

[Chinook]

I think the Spurs need to be willing to trade up to get their guy, whether than's Toppin or Neismith or Okongwu or Williams or whomever else. I'd prefer to get a pick if the team is trading any of their rotation players as opposed to just moving up, but for the right guy you do it. I wouldn't be opposed to moving down if the team's guy is taken, but only if the deal gets the team a second first-rounder this year. I like the middle of the draft for front-court depth. Ideally, such a pick comes for a DeRozan trade, with the Spurs getting their guy with the higher pick. But you do what you can.

[lmbebo]

Seems like a lot could change. Heard chatter that teams may draft more known prospects, like a Tobbin or Vassell, because of the virus and changes its caused. May cause some prospects to drop that may not have in previous years...

[Degoat]

Surprised more people aren’t on the Precious Achiuwa hype train, I think he’s exactly what we need

[Dejounte]

This is gonna be a long two months

[DAF86]

Surprised more people aren’t on the Precious Achiuwa hype train, I think he’s exactly what we need

He looks like an undersized center to me.

[DAF86]

Surprised more people aren’t on the Precious Achiuwa hype train, I think he’s exactly what we need

He looks like an undersized center to me.

[lmbebo]

This is gonna be a long two months

Yep ..

[daslicer]

Sure, but I dont know about you but for the last several years we havent had a competent switchable defender who can effectively guard the Giannises, Siakams, LeBrons.

Are you telling me size doesnt matter to guard these guys and its just positioning, instincts, and tenacity? They will literally shoot over Vassell or play bully ball and cause him to fall over. I just disagree, strength and length matters a bunch and im tired of seeing an undersized team. Look at the Clips, size helps them defend because they have all these lengthy defenders. Marcus Morris is not some defensive stud but he can check Doncic because he wont be bodied by him. Doncic absolutely abuses Patrick Beverley... Who is an example of what you describe here of "positioning, instinct, and tenacity".

Doncic has owned Morris one on one. He's torched everybody on the Clippers the last two games including PG,#2.

[Dejounte]

I just miss being able to say... "We have a LeBron stopper"

Fuck you Kawhi

[Dejounte]

Doncic has owned Morris one on one. He's torched everybody on the Clippers the last two games including PG,#2.

Doncic would score double that on DeMar (close to the same size as Vassell)

[Holden_Caulfield]

LA + #11 for #2

[daslicer]

Doncic would score double that on DeMar (close to the same size as Vassell)

Doncic got over 40 in game 1 against the Clippers and would have had another 40 point game had he not gotten in foul trouble.

[Degoat]

He looks like an undersized center to me.

Yeah your right from what I’ve heard he wants to be more of a forward tho but I do think he would be best as a small ball center. Seen a lot of people compare him to Bam Adebayo. I mean having a big forward like pat Williams would be good too

[DAF86]

I agree with Dejounte (see? It can happen!), even though one on one defense isn't as important as it used to be, that doesn't mean size and length aren't as important as they used to be on defense. Those things will always be part of the game in close outs, grabbing contested rebounds, getting to lose balls, blocking vision, disrupting passing lanes, etc.

You can have the grittiest, smartest defenders of all time but if they are all under 6'6" you are going to get torched.

[Dejounte]

Doncic got over 40 in game 1 against the Clippers and would have had another 40 point game had he not gotten in foul trouble.

Doncic's breaking Kobe's record against us then...

I just want someone to show me tape of Vassell guarding a legit >6'7" and >220 lb forward (or guard, whatever) because Spurs fans really think he's good at doing that.

[DAF86]

LA + #11 for #2

To get whom? It's not worth it, imho.

[Dejounte]

Yeah your right from what I’ve heard he wants to be more of a forward tho but I do think he would be best as a small ball center. Seen a lot of people compare him to Bam Adebayo. I mean having a big forward like pat Williams would be good too

Precious is my 1B. He's one of the strongest players in the draft and wont be bullied by the players I'm mentioning here. His lateral quickness is good, too.

[Chinook]

Sure, but I dont know about you but for the last several years we havent had a competent switchable defender who can effectively guard the Giannises, Siakams, LeBrons.

Are you telling me size doesnt matter to guard these guys and its just positioning, instincts, and tenacity? They will literally shoot over Vassell or play bully ball and cause him to fall over. I just disagree, strength and length matters a bunch and im tired of seeing an undersized team. Look at the Clips, size helps them defend because they have all these lengthy defenders. Marcus Morris is not some defensive stud but he can check Doncic because he wont be bodied by him. Doncic absolutely abuses Patrick Beverley... Who is an example of what you describe here of "positioning, instinct, and tenacity".

Four inches is not a foot. They'd shoot over a 6-1 guy, not a 6-7 guy.

Keldon Johnson and Derrick White are both good Doncic defenders, and White's shown to be a perfectly fine Leonard defender for two years in a row. You're not going to stop stars in today's league, but you certain can blunt their impact enough to allow your offensive players to win.

I don't prefer a shorter guy over a taller one. I prefer a good defender over a bigger body, though. You don't not draft a player because there might be a guy too big for him to guard. That's especially true when you're talking about drafting a three to guard a four.

[Chinook]

You can have the grittiest, smartest defenders of all time but if they are all under 6'6" you are going to get torched.

Tony Allen?

[boutons_deux]

This is gonna be a long two months

which 2 months?

Silver says he's thinking 1 Dec is too early, but no decision.

Probably 300K+ dead from Trash-Made Pandemic by 3 Nov,

maybe more when the flu season is supposed to make it all worse.

[daslicer]

Doncic's breaking Kobe's record against us then...

I just want someone to show me tape of Vassell guarding a legit >6'7" and >220 lb forward (or guard, whatever) because Spurs fans really think he's good at doing that.

Doncic has been amazing the first two games against the Clippers. They have played him dirty and have thrown everybody at him but he continues to get wherever he wants to go on the court and whatever shot he wants. If he scorches the Clippers again in game 3 then it will show the Clippers have no answer for him.

Anyways I don't know much about Vassell or any of these other prospects. I just want a legit 3-D guy at the SF spot.

[TheCerebral1]

Trade - everyone. Do not continue next season with the same garbage veterans struggling to fight for an 8th seed. Accept the reality that you're done, and get ahead of the curve. Do not settle and buy into low rate chuckers with no spine. Sorry Aldridge, you are as soft as a babies diaper. DeRozan, you're not the face of a franchise, you're barely a 7th option for a quality team. GET OUT!

[DAF86]

Tony Allen?

If you have 5 Tony Allens on defense you are getting torched, imho.

[Dejounte]

which 2 months?

Silver says he's thinking 1 Dec is too early, but no decision.

Probably 300K+ dead from Trash-Made Pandemic by 3 Nov,

maybe more when the flu season is supposed to make it all worse.

What? I thought it was already set that the NBA draft was in October. Thats what I was referring to.

Theres going to be a lot of back and forth about prospects from now and until then

From now on, my automatic response for Vassell fans will be this:

Show me tape of Vassell guarding a >6'7" and >220 lb player and being good at it.

Spurs fans really believe he is good 3 and D vs small forwards. He isnt.

[ginobilized]

If you have 5 Tony Allens on defense you are getting torched, imho.

But what if the opponent also has 5 Tony Allens?

[Holden_Caulfield]

To get whom? It's not worth it, imho.
i honestly just want LA traded lol. GS are the only ones in the top 5 that would rather have a veteran imo than a rookie so they can compete. maybe phoenix will trade LA for #10. a new direction with the franchise is needed with DW as the centerpiece. being mediocre with LA and DeMar isnt what im used to as a spurs fan

[DAF86]

What? I thought it was already set that the NBA draft was in October. Thats what I was referring to.

Theres going to be a lot of back and forth about prospects from now and until then

From now on, my automatic response for Vassell fans will be this:

Show me tape of Vassell guarding a >6'7" and >220 lb player and being good at it.

Spurs fans really believe he is good 3 and D vs small forwards. He isnt.

All of Vassell's defensive metrics are elite, tbh. I made a comparisson of my favourite targets at 11. Vassell came up on top.

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=saddiq-bey--aaron-nesmith--devin-vassell--patrick-williams

[Dejounte]

All of Vassell's defensive metrics are elite, tbh. I made a comparisson of my favourite targets at 11. Vassell came up on top.

http://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=saddiq-bey--aaron-nesmith--devin-vassell--patrick-williams

Elite metrics by defending guards.

[Dejounte]

If people would stop calling Vassell the "SF we need" and instead the "Guard we need" maybe I'd be more fine with it. People need to be honest. You might as well call Vassell a guard because he defends guards, not forwards.

[DAF86]

Elite metrics by defending guards.

I've started watching some Florida State full games. I've seen 3 or 4, they play a lot of full court press zone defense which means they end up match crossing all around the court. When they play man they also switch a lot. Many times Vassell would end up in the post guarding a guy much bigger than him and he more than holds his own with those longs arms, quickness and leaping ability. Per 36 minutes he averaged only 0.1 less rebounds than Williams and only 0.5 less blocks. So, if there's such a length difference, as you seem to believe, it isn't reflected on the numbers.

The way I see it, Vassell > Williams in terms of defense. Whatever advantage Patrick might have banging down low, Vassell more than makes up for it with his great perimeter defense and crisp defensive rotations (Williams is very shaky on these two areas). What makes Williams a better prospect than Vassell is his offensive potential.

[DAF86]

If people would stop calling Vassell the "SF we need" and instead the "Guard we need" maybe I'd be more fine with it. People need to be honest. You might as well call Vassell a guard because he defends guards, not forwards.

Wait, you were arguing with me that Keldon could play SF, but don't think Vassell can?

[Dejounte]

I've started watching some Florida State full games. I've seen 3 or 4, they play a lot of full court press zone defense which means they end up match crossing all around the court. When they play man they also switch a lot. Many times Vassell would end up in the post guarding a guy much bigger than him and he more than holds his own with those longs arms, quickness and leaping ability. Per 36 minutes he averaged only 0.1 less rebounds than Williams and only 0.5 less blocks. So, if there's such a length difference, as you seem to believe, it isn't reflected on the numbers.

The way I see it, Vassell > Williams in terms of defense. Whatever advantage Patrick might have banging down low, Vassell more than makes up for it with his great perimeter defense and crisp defensive rotations (Williams is very shaky on these two areas). What makes Williams a better prospect than Vassell is his offensive potential.

Show me links and if youre too lazy to give a time stamp, tell me the quarters where you say hes defending forwards and being proficient at it. By hold his own, you probably mean stays in position? Does he cause them to miss? These are things I doubt you saw thats why Im asking you for links. Vassell's decent defensive stats come from switching onto the guards, not the taller players.

Comparing per 36 matters much less as the minutes played goes down. Thats such an unreliable stat between these two players (and especially Pat) because of that reason and the offensive/ defensive schemes they were playing it. Not sure why you are bothering with it

You can literally make a 10 minute player look elite using per 36. Just like how Spurs fans did with Boban.

[TheDoctor]

So we're trusting internet doctors?
Yes.

[Dejounte]

Wait, you were arguing with me that Keldon could play SF, but don't think Vassell can?

What Keldon lacks in length or size he makes up with his strength and standing reach. Im not sure if youve noticed but the way Keldon defends is always with his hands up, instead of horizontal like with Kawhi. Thats because of his above average standing reach. As far as strength goes, we all know Keldon's nickname...

Vassell has neither of these things. (Standing reach TBD). But even then i dont expect Keldon to guard forwards full time. My argument then was just that he CAN. Unlike Vassell.

[DAF86]

Show me links and if youre too lazy to give a time stamp, tell me the quarters where you say hes defending forwards and being proficient at it. By hold his own, you probably mean stays in position? Does he cause them to miss? These are things I doubt you saw thats why Im asking you for links. Vassell's decent defensive stats come from switching onto the guards, not the taller players.

Comparing per 36 matters much less as the minutes played goes down. Thats such an unreliable stat between these two players (and especially Pat) because of that reason and the offensive/ defensive schemes they were playing it. Not sure why you are bothering with it

Dude, I'm not taking the time to re-watch the games just to give you exact time stamps :lol. Just Youtube "Floride State basketball full games" and watch a little. If you fast forward through all the stops and the moments Vassell isn't on the court, it won't take you more than half an hour to watch his full game. Take advantage of these COVID times son. :lol

[Dejounte]

Dude, I'm not taking the time to re-watch the games just to give you exact time stamps :lol. Just Youtube "Floride State basketball full games" and watch a little. If you fast forward through all the stops and the moments Vassell isn't on the court, it won't take you more than half an hour to watch his full game. Take advantage of these COVID times son. :lol

I see you won't do what I would do for you. I see how it is...

[DAF86]

What Keldon lacks in length or size he makes up with his strength and standing reach. Im not sure if youve noticed but the way Keldon defends is always with his hands up, instead of horizontal like with Kawhi. Thats because of his above average standing reach. As far as strength goes, we all know Keldon's nickname...

Vassell has neither of these things. (Standing reach TBD). But even then i dont expect Keldon to guard forwards full time. My argument then was just that he CAN. Unlike Vassell.

Standing reach is pretty much height + wingspan (arms length). Seeing how Vassell has Keldon beat on those two aspects, I'm gonna go ahead and safely assume that Vassell's standing reach > Keldon's. And I don't think it's particularly close.

[Dejounte]

Dude, I'm not taking the time to re-watch the games just to give you exact time stamps :lol. Just Youtube "Floride State basketball full games" and watch a little. If you fast forward through all the stops and the moments Vassell isn't on the court, it won't take you more than half an hour to watch his full game. Take advantage of these COVID times son. :lol

Yeah, so I just skimmed through full games against North Carolina and Louisville and there are literally no instance where Devin made an impact against forwards. There was an instance where he was being shoved around. Did you seriously just say you saw him holding his own for the sake of replying to me? I dont know how you were watching these and tell me that he holds his own and cant come up with any examples. You cant even tell me a team. I smell bullshit...

[BackHome]

So we gonna draft Beverly or the Unicorn Alex.

[Dejounte]

Standing reach is pretty much height + wingspan (arms length). Seeing how Vassell has Keldon beat on those two aspects, I'm gonna go ahead and safely assume that Vassell's standing reach > Keldon's. And I don't think it's particularly close.

This is all moot point when you refer to listed height as your trusted source, when Keldon has said he was 6'6" and growing, you've refused to acknowledge it and kept saying he's 6'5"... So i think we're going to end up in another rabbit hole here that we don't need to further our conversation in this subject.

[SpurPadre]

SI just released their latest mock draft and they have us getting Patrick Williams:
"11. Spurs: Patrick Williams, F, Florida State
Height: 6’8” | Weight: 225 | Age: 18 | Freshman

With several promising perimeter players already on the roster, the Spurs can focus on the frontcourt here. Scouts are enticed by Williams’ physical tools, shooting potential and all-around upside, despite a lack of consistent production in his lone college season. He’s one of the youngest players in the draft, but still a ways off from being a significant contributor. Teams with strong reputations for player development should feel comfortable with Williams in this range, and San Antonio would be a pretty ideal landing spot."


https://www.si.com/nba/2020/08/21/nba-mock-draft-2020-timberwolves-win-lottery

[DAF86]

Yeah, so I just skimmed through full games against North Carolina and Louisville and there are literally no instance where Devin made an impact against forwards. There was an instance where he was being shoved around. Did you seriously just say you saw him holding his own for the sake of replying to me? I dont know how you were watching these and tell me that he holds his own and cant come up with any examples. Not even a team. I smell bullshit...

Skimmed through two games worth of sample in a 10 minutes period? That's how you do your scouting son? :lol

Look, this seems like another instance in which we won't be seeing eye to eye. Don't take it personal, breathe, take your time and focus your attention to other more productive actions. :lol

[DAF86]

This is all moot point when you refer to listed height as your trusted source, when Keldon has said he was 6'6" and growing, you've refused to acknowledge it and kept saying he's 6'5"... So i think we're going to end up in another rabbit hole here that we don't need to further our conversation in this subject.

Not true, I conceded he might be 6'6". That's still not as tall as Vassell.

[Thomas82]

No, but they might do Murray and Gay along with 11 for 2 and Wiggins.


Would the Spurs do that, though?

In my opinion, that trade would make sense for the Spurs......if they can move DeRozen.

[DAF86]

SI just released their latest mock draft and they have us getting Patrick Williams:
"11. Spurs: Patrick Williams, F, Florida State
Height: 6’8” | Weight: 225 | Age: 18 | Freshman

With several promising perimeter players already on the roster, the Spurs can focus on the frontcourt here. Scouts are enticed by Williams’ physical tools, shooting potential and all-around upside, despite a lack of consistent production in his lone college season. He’s one of the youngest players in the draft, but still a ways off from being a significant contributor. Teams with strong reputations for player development should feel comfortable with Williams in this range, and San Antonio would be a pretty ideal landing spot."


https://www.si.com/nba/2020/08/21/nba-mock-draft-2020-timberwolves-win-lottery

At that spot, Williams is starting to become more and more like a no-brainer, tbh.

[DAF86]

In my opinion, that trade would make sense for the Spurs......if they can move DeRozen.

To be completely honest, I would rather draft Patrick at 11 than having to take on Wiggings and draft either Wiseman or Edwards, tbh.

[Thomas82]

To be completely honest, I would rather draft Patrick at 11 than having to take on Wiggings and draft either Wiseman or Edwards, tbh.

I feel you on that, but if taking on Wiggins meant a chance to get Wiseman (who is my top choice), I would do it.

[Dejounte]

Skimmed through two games worth of sample in a 10 minutes period? That's how you do your scouting son? :lol

Look, this seems like another instance in which we won't be seeing eye to eye. Don't take it personal, breathe, take your time and focus your attention to other more productive actions. :lol


https://youtu.be/9etTegNFBvg

Nah, I'll tell you for this video. I went through every defensive possession when Devin's in the game. Still no evidence of Devin making any impact against forwards. You made it up son. Ill go through another video where I look at every defensive possession like this one.

[FireMicoHalili]

Best Player Available, ALWAYS

[SpurPadre]

At that spot, Williams is starting to become more and more like a no-brainer, tbh.

I definitely like Williams at 11 from the video I've seen and from what I've been reading about him but at this stage in his life, does Pop want to draft a project like him or someone more NBA-ready?

[Dejounte]

Skimmed through two games worth of sample in a 10 minutes period? That's how you do your scouting son? :lol

Look, this seems like another instance in which we won't be seeing eye to eye. Don't take it personal, breathe, take your time and focus your attention to other more productive actions. :lol


https://youtu.be/AMzqrPUCMEM

This is my second video where I looked at every defensive possession that included Vassell. Still no evidence of him truly defending forwards. I'm going to go through more videos and post them here to prove a fucking point until someone shows me Vassell is a player who is good at guarding >6'7" and >220 lbs. He isnt a forward. He's a guard. Hes only being called a forward because his offense sucks. His best skill is defending guards, and he is not the "SF we need".

[Dejounte]

I definitely like Williams at 11 from the video I've seen and from what I've been reading about him but at this stage in his life, does Pop want to draft a project like him or someone more NBA-ready?

The schemes run by Florida State are VERY similar to the Spurs' style. This isnt another Lonnie situation. Pat will understand the X's and O's and the feel for the game.

[FireMicoHalili]

Also lmao at posters who base assessments on highlight vids. “He’s a good shooter” of course he makes almost all of his shots in his highlight videos. Nuts

[Dejounte]

Also lmao at posters who base assessments on highlight vids. “He’s a good shooter” of course he makes almost all of his shots in his highlight videos. Nuts

Pretty much 90% of people

[tim_duncan_fan]

Unless he's a dumbass or can't defend the perimeter, I see no reason not to pick Precious, which means he will probably be gone before 11.

Dude is big and fluid. He is going to get buckets.

[DAF86]

https://youtu.be/9etTegNFBvg

Nah, I'll tell you for this video. I went through every defensive possession when Devin's in the game. Still no evidence of Devin making any impact against forwards. You made it up son. Ill go through another video where I look at every defensive possession like this one.

3:50 vs a 6'8" 244 lbs player.
8:20 he's in the paint guarding the opossing center, then contests and blocks the slashing guard.
19:17 wins contested rebound over 6'9" guy.
43:12 not a defensive play but still a display of the impact he can have around the basket
47:02 another tipped rebound vs opposing towers
1:04:40 another great contest
1:04:55 look at the arms length on that rebound

[DAF86]

Also lmao at posters who base assessments on highlight vids. “He’s a good shooter” of course he makes almost all of his shots in his highlight videos. Nuts

Who says "X" player is a good shooter based on highlights? There are shooting stats for that. :lol

[DAF86]

Pretty much 90% of people

Including you. Outside of me and objective I haven't seen anyone saying they have taken the time to watch full games.

[MannyIsGod]

Aaron Nesmith. He's gonna be Danny Green part two.

[ragas]

If Spurs want a Top3 pick, they could trade with the Hornets.

Derozan, #11 -> Batum, #3

Hornets need a SG (Derozan sign&trade), a SF (good options at #11) and a C
Batum has a player option and would be off the books after this season. With the 3rd pick the Spurs could go for a valuable young big and could also sign&trade Poeltl to the Hornets for a pick.

[TDMVPDPOY]

spurs need to select a scoring alpha ballhog to replace the lack of scoring from DD, LMA, patty, forbes...

[exstatic]

Tony Allen?

Marcus Smart?

[Dejounte]

Including you. Outside of me and objective I haven't seen anyone saying they have taken the time to watch full games.

Fuck off. Youre not going take away from me the time ive spent watching games. My wife will fucking tell you how pissed she is with me spending time examining players. Just because i watch condensed games doesnt negate my ability to scout or evaluate players better than you. Now that really pissed me off. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck you. Ive spent too much time on this shit to be put on the level of most people who just watch highlights. Youre a piece of shit to go that low. Bitchass. Fuck you and your vanilla ass takes. Ive made more useful observations in this thread than your stupidass. I said Florida State had a full court press before you did. The bar isnt set at watching full games. I did the ones last night to appease you. i regret it now since clearly your fucking eyes are biased towards one thing and one thing only... never admitting youre wrong. Your ass sets the bar at watching full games because youre a dumb fuck who gives shallow ass statements and crowns yourself when you become right a tenth of the time. You dont take away the countless hours of time Ive spent on this. You just fucking dont. If I knew your dumbass in real life, man....

[Dejounte]

3:50 vs a 6'8" 244 lbs player.
8:20 he's in the paint guarding the opossing center, then contests and blocks the slashing guard.
19:17 wins contested rebound over 6'9" guy.
43:12 not a defensive play but still a display of the impact he can have around the basket
47:02 another tipped rebound vs opposing towers
1:04:40 another great contest
1:04:55 look at the arms length on that rebound

Hey mother fucker, this will be my last response to you because I don't take your ass seriously anymore since youre just trying to instigate shit. If you want to talk about this in person, you can tell me where you live and we can share our notes and have a friendly chat?

Out of all these time stamps, 3:50 is the only valid one. (Even Bryn Forbes stays in front of a big and made them miss once before)

The rest of these time stamps are bullshit to even mention, and you did it why?

1:04:40 was literally against a guard.
The ones you mention where he's out rebounding a big... We dont call Murray a great defender (if we ever did) against bigs and forwards when he outrebounds them, so why should we do it here? Your logic fucking stinks.

Youre full of shit. Fuck you.

[exstatic]

Pokuševski, unless they can do a significant salary dump this summer. He’s #10 on Tankathons big board, and he’s young enough that he was barely eligible to declare this year, by just days. He’d probably be amenable to staying overseas, and off our cap, for a year. For a 7 footer, he’s got basketball skills, all around ones.

[objective]

I actually think Vassell is okay, I just wouldn't take him over Williams, probably not over Achiuwa, undecided on Nesmith. Probably would like him more than Saddiq Bey.

The unfortunate thing is that pick #11 is dangerously close to the "6-3 and under" trench zone where Cole Anthony, Kira Lewis, Tyrese Maxey, Tyrell Terry etc all live.

I don't want anyone at 11 that's 6-3 or 6-4. I just don't think any stand out enough to get time, and that's without pretending that Mills or Forbes were off the roster.

So if Williams and Precious are off the board, maybe Nesmith also ... I'd be okay with Vassell.

I wouldn't love it. I don't think he's a SF. But it's more of a case of drafting the tallest most skilled player left.

I haven't watched any full Poku games but I might even want him before Vassell, if it's a swing for the fences.

[objective]

So we're trusting internet doctors?

I don't necessarily look at it as a bad thing, more like an opportunity.

If there's something with his body that can be addressed and fixed, and that can increase his effective athleticism with lateral speed on defense, then that's a great thing. That means he could be undervalued because he has hidden potential to improve movement on defense that may be unaccounted for.

And I think I trust the Spurs to fix it. With Kawhi they went out of house to fix his issues, and they would do whatever they could to maximize Williams.

[Dejounte]

Here's an interesting thing about Pat I've noticed from following his social media:

He doesn't follow thots. He follows and supports women's basketball. Unlike the many other prospects I see on social media where theyre following hundreds of thots, Pat is different. I think where your dick is, usually is where your head is. So this bodes well for Pat... Being half serious here.

[objective]

Vecenie at The Athletic had a new mock drop after the lottery last night. He had Vassell at 10 and:

11. Nesmith
12. Williams
13. Saddiq Bey
14. Pokusevski
15. Hampton
16. Achiuwa

I've watched the games I had dvr-d for Williams, Vassell, Achiuwa and Nesmith, guess I need to watch some the 24 games of Saddiq Bey I have on there. I only have 3 of Obi but I do have 18 of Okongwu. I have 10 of Halliburton.

I'll try to crash through as many of those this weekend.

[Chinook]

Pokuševski, unless they can do a significant salary dump this summer. He’s #10 on Tankathons big board, and he’s young enough that he was barely eligible to declare this year, by just days. He’d probably be amenable to staying overseas, and off our cap, for a year. For a 7 footer, he’s got basketball skills, all around ones.

I literally can't think of a reasoning structure that'd be worse than that. If the Spurs used the 11th pick on a guy they could stash so they could save a bit of money, I might legit stop being a Spurs fan. That would be like Ultra Instinct Miluntov

[objective]

Here's an interesting thing about Pat I've noticed from following his social media:

He doesn't follow thots. He follows and supports women's basketball. Unlike the many other prospects I see on social media where theyre following hundreds of thots, Pat is different. I think where your dick is, usually is where your head is. So this bodes well for Pat... Being half serious here.

Sounds good to me. Feels like every other month there was some Murray on social rumor that turned out to be nothing, that stuff gets old.

[objective]

So if Williams and Precious are off the board, maybe Nesmith also ... I'd be okay with Vassell.

I wouldn't love it. I don't think he's a SF. But it's more of a case of drafting the tallest most skilled player left.


Let me also add this about Vassell and his ability to play SF or not:

Pop had no problem playing Marco at SF. Or running Marco out there with Forbes and Mills. Or having Mills cover Durant.

Whatever his shortcomings with size, strength, or possibly length may be, I think Vassell should be an upgrade defensively at the least over Marco.

And I've long argued that Marco is an overrated shooter, so I think Vassell could hold his own there as well, at least on spot ups. I don't remember his movement shooting at all.

I'd rather have Williams and I think I'd rather have the energy and raw athleticism of Achiuwa and hope he can be refined.

[mo7888]

I literally can't think of a reasoning structure that'd be worse than that. If the Spurs used the 11th pick on a guy they could stash so they could save a bit of money, I might legit stop being a Spurs fan. That would be like Ultra Instinct Miluntov

I'd be ok with stashing him (or some other player) if we somehow ended up with a send pick in the 20's... but 11 is to valuable for that, especially where we are as a rebuilding team.

[spurspl]

due to tankathon we are one spot behind obi toppin...thats a shame. trade up or trade down

[Dejounte]

Let me also add this about Vassell and his ability to play SF or not:

Pop had no problem playing Marco at SF. Or running Marco out there with Forbes and Mills. Or having Mills cover Durant.

Whatever his shortcomings with size, strength, or possibly length may be, I think Vassell should be an upgrade defensively at the least over Marco.

And I've long argued that Marco is an overrated shooter, so I think Vassell could hold his own there as well, at least on spot ups. I don't remember his movement shooting at all.

I'd rather have Williams and I think I'd rather have the energy and raw athleticism of Achiuwa and hope he can be refined.

Agreed

[Chinook]

I'd be ok with stashing him (or some other player) if we somehow ended up with a send pick in the 20's... but 11 is to valuable for that, especially where we are as a rebuilding team.

I should clarify: If it's a case like with Saric where the guy is highly regarded but isn't able to come over for a year or two, and you think he's BPA, you can do it. But if you're thinking "Well we're up against tax and need to find a way to shave off some salary. Oh I know, let's take our highest pick in almost a quarter-century and pick a guy we don't have to bring over right away," it's literally indefensible. Like my brain would completely melt just seeing it. It was bad enough when the Spurs pissed away their first in 2015 for Milutinov to save $300-500k (when they ended up spending more than that on Boban anyway). But like, just cut Lyles. Just let Poeltl walk. Just literally anything else besides pissing away a lottery pick.

And I probably don't need to say it, but the guy being 18 really doesn't mean anything to me. I'm about to make a case for the Spurs not needing to worry about drafting a compliment for their young players in another post, but they also need to stop looking at guys they hope put it together three or four years down the line.

[objective]

I literally can't think of a reasoning structure that'd be worse than that. If the Spurs used the 11th pick on a guy they could stash so they could save a bit of money, I might legit stop being a Spurs fan. That would be like Ultra Instinct Miluntov

The other big risk is the European scheduling might really throw a wrench into any plans the Spurs had about stashing.

Some of those leagues are on pace to still start on time. Guys are going to be playing because they need to get paid before they can even sign a rookie deal. And not just for 20-21, it could bleed over into 21-22, then things really get screwed up because if a euro is any good after 2 years they'll just wait until 3 to not be locked into the rookie salary scale. Saric kept his word about coming over, but for every Saric you have a Splitter.

[Chinook]

If people would stop calling Vassell the "SF we need" and instead the "Guard we need" maybe I'd be more fine with it. People need to be honest. You might as well call Vassell a guard because he defends guards, not forwards.

I don't think the goal should be to worry about what the team needs. They are still at the point where they should be collecting talented players. Like it or not, the Spurs have been starting 6-7 guys at SF for almost two decades outside of the RJ years. There's no reason why the Spurs can't play Vassell there. Ideally the team could get a defensive four who can guard bigger forwards. But that doesn't have to happen in this draft. If Vassell works out and Walker or Johnson don't then you still get your perimeter trio set up. If everyone works out, you can make a trade or get a good bench culture going. Regardless, you just go for the PF next year. Or maybe you draft someone like Reed or Tillman in the second round, and they step into that role. The team shouldn't be thinking about filling holes at this point, because that implies they have a structure around those holes. They don't yet have that, even if it looks like one could be forming with White and Johnson.

[DAF86]

Fuck off. Youre not going take away from me the time ive spent watching games. My wife will fucking tell you how pissed she is with me spending time examining players. Just because i watch condensed games doesnt negate my ability to scout or evaluate players better than you. Now that really pissed me off. Fuck you. Fuck you. Fuck you. Ive spent too much time on this shit to be put on the level of most people who just watch highlights. Youre a piece of shit to go that low. Bitchass. Fuck you and your vanilla ass takes. Ive made more useful observations in this thread than your stupidass. I said Florida State had a full court press before you did. The bar isnt set at watching full games. I did the ones last night to appease you. i regret it now since clearly your fucking eyes are biased towards one thing and one thing only... never admitting youre wrong. Your ass sets the bar at watching full games because youre a dumb fuck who gives shallow ass statements and crowns yourself when you become right a tenth of the time. You dont take away the countless hours of time Ive spent on this. You just fucking dont. If I knew your dumbass in real life, man....

Dude, you have some problems. :lol

[Chinook]

The other big risk is the European scheduling might really throw a wrench into any plans the Spurs had about stashing.

Some of those leagues are on pace to still start on time. Guys are going to be playing because they need to get paid before they can even sign a rookie deal. And not just for 20-21, it could bleed over into 21-22, then things really get screwed up because if a euro is any good after 2 years they'll just wait until 3 to not be locked into the rookie salary scale. Saric kept his word about coming over, but for every Saric you have a Splitter.

That's true. I think the NBA will do something about that to allow teams to commit to overseas prospects during the season. Maybe they'll let them commit money against the following season's cap, or maybe they'll let them just bring the guy over in the middle of the season. Either way, it's tricky, and I'd have negative interest in stashing a first-rounder.

[objective]

I don't think the goal should be to worry about what the team needs. They are still at the point where they should be collecting talented players. Like it or not, the Spurs have been starting 6-7 guys at SF for almost two decades outside of the RJ years. There's no reason why the Spurs can't play Vassell there. Ideally the team could get a defensive four who can guard bigger forwards. But that doesn't have to happen in this draft. If Vassell works out and Walker or Johnson don't then you still get your perimeter trio set up. If everyone works out, you can make a trade or get a good bench culture going. Regardless, you just go for the PF next year. Or maybe you draft someone like Reed or Tillman in the second round, and they step into that role. The team shouldn't be thinking about filling holes at this point, because that implies they have a structure around those holes. They don't yet have that, even if it looks like one could be forming with White and Johnson.

There probably are some guys in the second round that will be decent gambles. Reed for sure, Killian Tillie if his body doesn't collapse. Woodard as a defensive SF. I kind of like Malik Fitts who could go undrafted. Cassius Stanley is like a Jonathan Simmons type, not a SF but fun to watch dunk. N'Doye or Eboua. Maybe even Kalaitzakis, though without doing too much research into him I'm suspicious of a Greek who is loaned out to outside of the motherland to play.

[objective]

And a caution for my opinions such as they are:

Usually, my picks aren't that much better than the next guy, if at all. I wanted Gary Payton II over Dejounte Murray, I had huge, huge problems with Murray's defensive IQ. Now, what I didn't know was how bad a coach Romar was, because I don't watch college ball until the draft. And Zach Lowe in the last month was praising Payton II as a premier point guard defender so I wasn't all the way dumb. I thought Brogdon was a SG, most of the scouting clips on YouTube had him as a SG so I never looked at him.

I had Bell and Bolden over White. I still liked White, but I had Bell and Bolden first. I've learned since then to appreciate how much size and length really matters at the NBA big level, and of course Bolden had not just the small sample size for shooting but the personality red flags for quitting on UCLA. I also didn't think White had any chance of playing as a rookie no matter how good he was because Pop.

Now, for this year, I think I'm better informed for 2 reasons: cloud DVR recording every college team, and the covid shutdown increasing the amount of time I have to check those games out. Normally Spurs fans have what, 0.5-2 months to check out prospects? This year we have months and months to go over things. I think I've watched more this year than any other year and there's still like 2 more months until the draft.

[pad300]

I'm going to go through more videos and post them here to prove a fucking point until someone shows me Vassell is a player who is good at guarding >6'7" and >220 lbs...

I have my own opinions about who we should draft, but you realize that you have a "method" problem here: how many >6'7" > 220 lbs players, on the perimeter (ie not playing as PF/C), in college? Answer: almost none, because we aren't talking grown men here... I'm pretty sure Kawhi was under 220 at the time of the draft; he's grown some since. Guys that big, Pat Williams in the current draft for example, are played as PF's and C's...

[Dejounte]

And a caution for my opinions such as they are:

Usually, my picks aren't that much better than the next guy, if at all. I wanted Gary Payton II over Dejounte Murray, I had huge, huge problems with Murray's defensive IQ. Now, what I didn't know was how bad a coach Romar was, because I don't watch college ball until the draft. And Zach Lowe in the last month was praising Payton II as a premier point guard defender so I wasn't all the way dumb. I thought Brogdon was a SG, most of the scouting clips on YouTube had him as a SG so I never looked at him.

I had Bell and Bolden over White. I still liked White, but I had Bell and Bolden first. I've learned since then to appreciate how much size and length really matters at the NBA big level, and of course Bolden had not just the small sample size for shooting but the personality red flags for quitting on UCLA. I also didn't think White had any chance of playing as a rookie no matter how good he was because Pop.

Now, for this year, I think I'm better informed for 2 reasons: cloud DVR recording every college team, and the covid shutdown increasing the amount of time I have to check those games out. Normally Spurs fans have what, 0.5-2 months to check out prospects? This year we have months and months to go over things. I think I've watched more this year than any other year and there's still like 2 more months until the draft.

Ditto. This is why you are much more respectable than that douchebag. I've made my share of bad takes as well and I learn from them every year. Last year I had Isaiah Roby, Nicolas Claxton, Eric Paschall, Bol Bol, Darius Bazley as players I wanted over Keldon. I can dig up the thread where I was putting these guys in a tier list. It may be because I didn't want to look at players that were undersized as a SF. So same reason this year, except I've spent my time on Vassell whereas with Keldon I didn't.

Main thing I learned last year was not center my evaluation of players around their statistics in college, and to pay more attention to their current set of offensive / defensive skills. Kawhi already had most of the moves he had now in college, it was just obviously raw and unrefined. Derrick White's already had this capability because he was doing it in college (he had good stats but if you watched him you could see his skills were translatable)

[Dejounte]

I have my own opinions about who we should draft, but you realize that you have a "method" problem here: how many >6'7" > 220 lbs players, on the perimeter (ie not playing as PF/C), in college? Answer: almost none, because we aren't talking grown men here... I'm pretty sure Kawhi was under 220 at the time of the draft; he's grown some since. Guys that big, Pat Williams in the current draft for example, are played as PF's and C's...

There was quite a bit last year: Cam Reddish, DeAndre Hunter, Sekou, KZ Okpala, Eric Paschall.

I think this year is an outlier... Not many standard size forwards who play on the perimeter this year.

[pad300]

There was quite a bit last year: Cam Reddish, DeAndre Hunter, Sekou, KZ Okpala, Eric Paschall.

I think this year is an outlier... Not many standard size forwards who play on the perimeter this year.

Certainly, this year, there aren't many of them... Last year,
https://www.nbadraft.net/2019-nba-draft-combine-measurements/

Sekou was in a pro league in France (and got drafted on freak size measurements basically), Hunter and Paschall were PF's (and although Hunter wasn't measured at the combine, I'm not to sure he was 220 - I'd say borderline). Okpala and Reddish were both under 210... after spending a pre-draft process trying to bulk.

[pad300]

There was quite a bit last year: Cam Reddish, DeAndre Hunter, Sekou, KZ Okpala, Eric Paschall.

I think this year is an outlier... Not many standard size forwards who play on the perimeter this year.

Certainly, this year, there aren't many of them... Last year,
https://www.nbadraft.net/2019-nba-draft-combine-measurements/

Sekou was in a pro league in France (and got drafted on freak size measurements basically), Hunter and Paschall were PF's (and although Hunter wasn't measured at the combine, I'm not to sure he was 220 - I'd say borderline). Okpala and Reddish were both under 210... after spending a pre-draft process trying to bulk.

[exstatic]

I literally can't think of a reasoning structure that'd be worse than that. If the Spurs used the 11th pick on a guy they could stash so they could save a bit of money, I might legit stop being a Spurs fan. That would be like Ultra Instinct Miluntov

You may have to do that, then. This is no longer a playoff team. Other than the time late at there tenure at the Alamo Dome, the Spurs have ponied up and paid the tax when they had to, because they were contenders. That’s no longer the case. They’re still a small market team, though. That fact will never change.

He’s not Mulitinov. Kid takes the ball off the glass and brings it up the floor, and he should. He’s got the handles for it. He’s 7’0” and has a 7’3” wingspan. He blocks shots, rebounds, and shoots the ball pretty well. Tankathon as him at #10 on their big board.

[Dejounte]

Certainly, this year, there aren't many of them... Last year,
https://www.nbadraft.net/2019-nba-draft-combine-measurements/

Sekou was in a pro league in France (and got drafted on freak size measurements basically), Hunter and Paschall were PF's (and although Hunter wasn't measured at the combine, I'm not to sure he was 220 - I'd say borderline). Okpala and Reddish were both under 210... after spending a pre-draft process trying to bulk.

I think whether SF or PF was the position they played is not that relevant...Hunter, Paschall being listed as PF when the role they played would be of a perimeter forward in college and it translates to the NBA.... I think it would just be semantics at that point. Now the weight thing, sure. Maybe I should reduce the criteria to 210 lb? I dont know... Bottom line is, i don't think Vassell would be as effective against these types of players and there's not enough evidence that he has. Match Vassell against Eric Paschall for example and I think he would get destroyed...

We need a 3.5 better than we need a 2.5 (though Vassell is probably just straight up a 2)

I think the current Spurs would benefit more from an improved version of Rudy Gay (one who can play defense) vs a Danny Green. That's my opinion.

I'm not saying Pat Williams is Rudy Gay, but he would probably be the true "next man up" to Rudy similar to how Keldon is likely the "next man up" to DeMar. He would slowly take that role on the current Spurs. Given how much of a black hole and dumb player Rudy can be at times, that would be a HUGE improvement.

[buttsR4rebounding]

You may have to do that, then. This is no longer a playoff team. Other than the time late at there tenure at the Alamo Dome, the Spurs have ponied up and paid the tax when they had to, because they were contenders. That’s no longer the case. They’re still a small market team, though. That fact will never change.

He’s not Mulitinov. Kid takes the ball off the glass and brings it up the floor, and he should. He’s got the handles for it. He’s 7’0” and has a 7’3” wingspan. He blocks shots, rebounds, and shoots the ball pretty well. Tankathon as him at #10 on their big board.

This is who I think the Spurs will target at 11. Pop will not pass on the chance to scream at someone in Serbian.

[exstatic]

I should clarify: If it's a case like with Saric where the guy is highly regarded but isn't able to come over for a year or two, and you think he's BPA, you can do it. But if you're thinking "Well we're up against tax and need to find a way to shave off some salary. Oh I know, let's take our highest pick in almost a quarter-century and pick a guy we don't have to bring over right away," it's literally indefensible. Like my brain would completely melt just seeing it. It was bad enough when the Spurs pissed away their first in 2015 for Milutinov to save $300-500k (when they ended up spending more than that on Boban anyway). But like, just cut Lyles. Just let Poeltl walk. Just literally anything else besides pissing away a lottery pick.

And I probably don't need to say it, but the guy being 18 really doesn't mean anything to me. I'm about to make a case for the Spurs not needing to worry about drafting a compliment for their young players in another post, but they also need to stop looking at guys they hope put it together three or four years down the line.

Okay, do that, and you’re sitting on only 11 players, and you’re still at $115M in salary, with two more slots to fill, and you’ve dumped an elite screener, defender, former lottery pick, and LMA replacement sometime in the next 10-12 months. Oh, and you still have to pay one more guy, minimum, who won’t be as good as Lyles, because you’ve decided that $5.5M is expendable.

This is a shitty draft, and it’s our bad luck that this is our lottery year. I’m sorry to say that there’s no savior at 11, no super wing. Barring that, I don’t have a problem with a top 10 talent spending a year in Europe as opposed to Austin, and on our cap.

Look on the bright side: he ain’t 6’3”.

[DPG21920]

If Spurs want a Top3 pick, they could trade with the Hornets.

Derozan, #11 -> Batum, #3

Hornets need a SG (Derozan sign&trade), a SF (good options at #11) and a C
Batum has a player option and would be off the books after this season. With the 3rd pick the Spurs could go for a valuable young big and could also sign&trade Poeltl to the Hornets for a pick.

I agree with CHA being a potential trade partner. Regarding this, going from Batum to DeRozan (so getting the better player and taking the extra year of a deal) is worth 3 for CHA if they want to “win now”.

We shouldn’t have to give up 11 for that. But overall, I think a deal can be done with CHA/DET/NY/ORL

[Excessive Egotist]

I'm confident one of Toppin, Okongwu, or Wiseman will be available at 11. Three bigs won't go top ten, and a few wings/points will move up draft board.

[ace3g]

Bounce & Brains: The Off-Ball Movement that Helps Make FSU's Patrick Williams So Good
https://www.si.com/college/fsu/basketball/bounce-brains-off-ball-movement-helps-make-fsu-patrick-williams-analysis-seminoles-video-highlights

[Chinook]

You may have to do that, then. This is no longer a playoff team. Other than the time late at there tenure at the Alamo Dome, the Spurs have ponied up and paid the tax when they had to, because they were contenders. That’s no longer the case. They’re still a small market team, though. That fact will never change.

He’s not Mulitinov. Kid takes the ball off the glass and brings it up the floor, and he should. He’s got the handles for it. He’s 7’0” and has a 7’3” wingspan. He blocks shots, rebounds, and shoots the ball pretty well. Tankathon as him at #10 on their big board.

The issue isn't that the can't afford him. They can. They absolutely can. There's no universe in which they can't. Under no circumstances should the team want to stash their first-rounder. It should literally be the guy they hope is the best player. No other contract on the team is worth getting in the way of it. As I said below, if it's the right player and that player can't come over, that's one thing. Even then, as Objective said, it's dicey and should be Plan Z.


Okay, do that, and you’re sitting on only 11 players, and you’re still at $115M in salary, with two more slots to fill, and you’ve dumped an elite screener, defender, former lottery pick, and LMA replacement sometime in the next 10-12 months. Oh, and you still have to pay one more guy, minimum, who won’t be as good as Lyles, because you’ve decided that $5.5M is expendable.

This is a shitty draft, and it’s our bad luck that this is our lottery year. I’m sorry to say that there’s no savior at 11, no super wing. Barring that, I don’t have a problem with a top 10 talent spending a year in Europe as opposed to Austin, and on our cap.

Look on the bright side: he ain’t 6’3”.

The draft isn't shitty. That's just the perception of it. Every draft has good players coming out. Even that "horrible" 2013 draft had two HOFers, another All-Star, a borderline All-Star and multiple other max players or solid rotation players. And that's the hindsight worst draft, not the worst draft in terms of expectations. The Spurs need to find the good players in the draft, not just punt because they think it's a crap shoot. We as fans can think that. It's their jobs to make it work.

As far as the money goes, the tax line is projected at $132 Million. They'd easily have enough space to fit everyone in. As you said, the Spurs are a non-playoff team, so why do they care that they have some more holes? If they are really that bad, they should be looking to move guys for parts, which will fill up the roster spots without adding much salary. Moreover, that range is enough to where they don't need to let both Lyles and Poeltl go to get under the tax (they don't actually need to let either go if they don't want to use the MLE).

It's bonkers, man. Of course Lyles is expendable if the alternative is stashing a lottery pick. To say otherwise just doesn't make sense. I don't hate him, but he's just a guy. Hopefully the Spurs draft a PF at 11 and just start him anyway. Push comes to shove, I'd rather keep Lyles and move on from DeRozan, but letting him go along with letting Forbes and Beli walk isn't the worst thing in the world.

[Dejounte]

Bounce & Brains: The Off-Ball Movement that Helps Make FSU's Patrick Williams So Good
https://www.si.com/college/fsu/basketball/bounce-brains-off-ball-movement-helps-make-fsu-patrick-williams-analysis-seminoles-video-highlights

Yes! I've said this over and over. My observations have been that Pat's BBall IQ is great.

[Chinook]

And to add to this real quick: I don't know enough about Aleksej Pokuševski to know if I like him as a prospect. The little I've seen of him haven't impressed me (people overrate the skill level of guys playing against lesser competition; most NBA players are highly skilled in terms over average non-NBA players but look bad when compared to the absolute elite players), but I'm not saying he'd be a bad pick as a player. What I am saying is that if the Spurs draft him, if at all possible, they need to bring him over. I have had my issues with Samanic, but I am really happy he's in Austin and not Europe. I don't care about wasting a few hundred k on a 15th man. I do care about the team having direct control over his development. So there's no place in the drafting process for a lottery pick for worrying about savings. That goes for Ex's comment on stashing for LJ's about trading down. Spend the freaking money. Literally nothing else on the team is more important.

[DPG21920]

Agree. The draft and stash unless its very specific should be dead for SA. Like if it’s a #1 pick clear cut that falls because you need to stash? Sure. But other than that, it’s dead. Kill it.

[DPG21920]

Also, if the perception of this draft is bad, Sa should be using LMA and hopefully DDR to gain extra shots. Get the lottery picks while you can, even if it means taking on a bad contract or two for an extra year.

Get PF/F/C pipeline built up with as much cheap lottery assets as you can if there is a real opportunity. Now is the time.

[exstatic]

“A man should look for what is, and not for what he thinks should be.”
Albert Einstein

[Dejounte]

https://youtu.be/0yF3Q0Ig8aw

Big body, 7'4" wingspan

[spurspl]

when teams can start tradin their picks?

[mo7888]

There probably are some guys in the second round that will be decent gambles. Reed for sure, Killian Tillie if his body doesn't collapse. Woodard as a defensive SF. I kind of like Malik Fitts who could go undrafted. Cassius Stanley is like a Jonathan Simmons type, not a SF but fun to watch dunk. N'Doye or Eboua. Maybe even Kalaitzakis, though without doing too much research into him I'm suspicious of a Greek who is loaned out to outside of the motherland to play.

A couple 2nd rd guys I like are Robert Woodard and Reggie Perry (although Woodard might go in the late 1st)

[JuneJive]

There is skepticism among team executives that this draft will take place as scheduled on Oct. 16 -- in part because there is even more skepticism across every sector of the league that free agency will begin as scheduled two days later. (See more in this report from ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski.) Obviously, everything about this situation is fluid.

from

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/page/zachlowe29702176/behind-scenes-weirdest-nba-draft-lottery-ever

There is a bit about R.C. as well.

[exstatic]

The issue isn't that the can't afford him. They can. They absolutely can. There's no universe in which they can't. Under no circumstances should the team want to stash their first-rounder. It should literally be the guy they hope is the best player. No other contract on the team is worth getting in the way of it. As I said below, if it's the right player and that player can't come over, that's one thing. Even then, as Objective said, it's dicey and should be Plan Z.



The draft isn't shitty. That's just the perception of it. Every draft has good players coming out. Even that "horrible" 2013 draft had two HOFers, another All-Star, a borderline All-Star and multiple other max players or solid rotation players. And that's the hindsight worst draft, not the worst draft in terms of expectations. The Spurs need to find the good players in the draft, not just punt because they think it's a crap shoot. We as fans can think that. It's their jobs to make it work.

As far as the money goes, the tax line is projected at $132 Million. They'd easily have enough space to fit everyone in. As you said, the Spurs are a non-playoff team, so why do they care that they have some more holes? If they are really that bad, they should be looking to move guys for parts, which will fill up the roster spots without adding much salary. Moreover, that range is enough to where they don't need to let both Lyles and Poeltl go to get under the tax (they don't actually need to let either go if they don't want to use the MLE).

It's bonkers, man. Of course Lyles is expendable if the alternative is stashing a lottery pick. To say otherwise just doesn't make sense. I don't hate him, but he's just a guy. Hopefully the Spurs draft a PF at 11 and just start him anyway. Push comes to shove, I'd rather keep Lyles and move on from DeRozan, but letting him go along with letting Forbes and Beli walk isn't the worst thing in the world.

OK, 2013 was probably the worst draft since 2000. I can’t see more than 1 HOF player, the Greek Freak, and one late blooming All Star in Oladipo Let’s talk about the Freak. Skinny young kid, lots of talent, playing low level Euro ball. In other words, a pick you would have hated, preferring something more conventional.

Who’s your other HOF player? Just curious....

[TD 21]

Presuming the top 10 more or less goes according to projections and they stick at 11, it probably comes down to Vassell, Nesmith, Bey and Williams and I suspect they zero in specifically on the middle two. The dynamic shooter or the 3 and D combo forward. Either would fill a specific need.

As an aside, the Pistons falling to 7 is probably good news. No chance of Ball, limited chance of Haliburton, increased chance of Okongwu (otherwise loom as a potential Poeltl offer sheet team). If Avdija gets to 7, along with Hayes and Okongwu and they're not particularly high on any, it could put a DeRozan or Murray + 11 for 7 trade in play.

Could just be front office speak, but Weaver (GM) did say "you could get same quality player between 3-13". He also came from the Thunder, who are obsessed with athleticism.

[keithington1]

I’m coming around to the idea of Precious at 11. 22 rebounds in a game is ridiculous. He does also have shooting potential. I see him as a 3-4-5. He’d fit in nicely with this current roster. Spurs need hustle, energy, and someone to matchup with the 6’8”+ stars. Might as well just keep our shooters. I feel like he’d baby Vassel, Williams, Bey 1 on 1. He’s a mismatch.

[Chinook]

OK, 2013 was probably the worst draft since 2000. I can’t see more than 1 HOF player, the Greek Freak, and one late blooming All Star in Oladipo Let’s talk about the Freak. Skinny young kid, lots of talent, playing low level Euro ball. In other words, a pick you would have hated, preferring something more conventional.

What difference does it make if I wouldn't've loved the pick? You might've preferred Jan Vesely to Kawhi for all I know. It's not my job as a random chode to pick the right guys. It is my job as a person with common sense to know that drafts all contain good players. Will it be Toppin? Will it be Williams? Will it be Pokuševski? Who knows? Maybe they all succeed or they all bust. But regardless of our different philosophies, it's going to be someone, and the Spurs need to know how that is.

I do think Giannis' growth surprised everyone, just like Leonard's did. Jason Kidd, for all the shit he gets, put Giannis on the path to be a star by making him handle the ball. My initial point that you're still steaming about wasn't even about not liking raw players. It was about the idea that immediate value is more important than future value, so you need more future value to make up for the time you had to wait. That's not even philosophical. That's basic economics. If you have to wait four years for a guy to become MVP, that's worth four lost years of a rotation player. If you have to wait three years for a guy to become a meh starter, that's not necessarily worth the three years you spent not having a good bench player.

Anyways


Who’s your other HOF player? Just curious....

I think Gobert will get it. In the very least, he's another All-Star.

Even if we're talking about a guy like Schroeder though, he's worth enough to move on from Lyles, especially if it's the PF version of him.

[Chinook]

Presuming the top 10 more or less goes according to projections and they stick at 11, it probably comes down to Vassell, Nesmith, Bey and Williams and I suspect they zero in specifically on the middle two. The dynamic shooter or the 3 and D combo forward. Either would fill a specific need.

As an aside, the Pistons falling to 7 is probably good news. No chance of Ball, limited chance of Haliburton, increased chance of Okongwu (otherwise loom as a potential Poeltl offer sheet team). If Avdija gets to 7, along with Hayes and Okongwu and they're not particularly high on any, it could put a DeRozan or Murray + 11 for 7 trade in play.

Could just be front office speak, but Weaver (GM) did say "you could get same quality player between 3-13". He also came from the Thunder, who are obsessed with athleticism.

The Spurs aren't going to trade DeRozan to move up four spots. Unless they legit consider Murray negative value, they definitely aren't going to be adding him into the deal. I get that Spurs fans are down on their players, but neither of those guys really has that low of stock around the league.

[mo7888]

The Spurs aren't going to trade DeRozan to move up four spots. Unless they legit consider Murray negative value, they definitely aren't going to be adding him into the deal. I get that Spurs fans are down on their players, but neither of those guys really has that low of stock around the league.

What do you think it would take to move up 4 spots vs moving up into the top 3?

[tim_duncan_fan]

I’m coming around to the idea of Precious at 11. 22 rebounds in a game is ridiculous. He does also have shooting potential. I see him as a 3-4-5. He’d fit in nicely with this current roster. Spurs need hustle, energy, and someone to matchup with the 6’8”+ stars. Might as well just keep our shooters. I feel like he’d baby Vassel, Williams, Bey 1 on 1. He’s a mismatch.

Yep. Work on his jumper with chip and he will get buckets.

Sky's the limit if he has the mental will to become great. He has the physical tools to do alot of damage.

[BackHome]

I wish I can agree with you regarding his shooting but history says that if you have a terrible percentage in free throws the chances of you developing an outside shoot is almost nil. His mid shoot is bad his three ball is terrible and even his free throw percentage will remind you of Shaq I think he is averaging 47% on his free throws.

But on the flip side he will be a defensive stud who can rebound and guard almost anyone and he can dunk the ball. Lol.

[Sugus]

I wish I can agree with you regarding his shooting but history says that if you have a terrible percentage in free throws the chances of you developing an outside shoot is almost nil. His mid shoot is bad his three ball is terrible and even his free throw percentage will remind you of Shaq I think he is averaging 47% on his free throws.

But on the flip side he will be a defensive stud who can rebound and guard almost anyone and he can dunk the ball. Lol.

The Spurs as currently constructed (and their young core) can perfectly live with a non-shooting 4/5 hybrid, to be honest. I'm hopeful Achiuwa can learn how to shoot, and at the very least be a solid FT and/or midrange shooter, but even if that wasn't the case, we have a plethora of guards to take on the scoring load; hell, if Precious goes on to develop at the level where he becomes a future building block, you surround him with a stretch 4-5, depending on which position Achiuwa ends up playing most comfortably at, and that's a straight up solid team to me.

What the Spurs can't live by with, is their horrid defense, non-existant rebounding besides the occasional DJ board, and lack of size all around. All of these things, Precious would instantly help with, and he seems mobile enough to keep up with our guards and be part of a faster offense. He also seems to be a high-character and high-motor guy, two things the Spurs are also sorely lacking right now. If he never develops a 3 point shot, oh well... You work around it, IMO, not discard the prospect just because of it.

[Biggems]

I am sure I will get a bit of flack for this, but one player I really like is Vernon Carey Jr. I feel his game would fit nicely with our style of play. I am not saying use 11 on him, far too high. But, I would love to find a reasonable scenario to get him on draft night.

[Thomas82]

I am sure I will get a bit of flack for this, but one player I really like is Vernon Carey Jr. I feel his game would fit nicely with our style of play. I am not saying use 11 on him, far too high. But, I would love to find a reasonable scenario to get him on draft night.

I wouldn't be upset if we got him, but I'm leary of Duke players in the NBA.

[Spurtacular]

I guess nobody had to create a new thread. Fun and boring at the same time. :lol

[DAF86]

The Spurs as currently constructed (and their young core) can perfectly live with a non-shooting 4/5 hybrid, to be honest. I'm hopeful Achiuwa can learn how to shoot, and at the very least be a solid FT and/or midrange shooter, but even if that wasn't the case, we have a plethora of guards to take on the scoring load; hell, if Precious goes on to develop at the level where he becomes a future building block, you surround him with a stretch 4-5, depending on which position Achiuwa ends up playing most comfortably at, and that's a straight up solid team to me.

What the Spurs can't live by with, is their horrid defense, non-existant rebounding besides the occasional DJ board, and lack of size all around. All of these things, Precious would instantly help with, and he seems mobile enough to keep up with our guards and be part of a faster offense. He also seems to be a high-character and high-motor guy, two things the Spurs are also sorely lacking right now. If he never develops a 3 point shot, oh well... You work around it, IMO, not discard the prospect just because of it.

What? :lol Their star perimeter player is the most averse three point shooter in the league, they can't afford a single more position to don't shoot 3's.

[DAF86]

Precious is an undersized center in today's NBA. Stop asking for him.

[duncan2150]

I’m coming around to the idea of Precious at 11. 22 rebounds in a game is ridiculous. He does also have shooting potential. I see him as a 3-4-5. He’d fit in nicely with this current roster. Spurs need hustle, energy, and someone to matchup with the 6’8”+ stars. Might as well just keep our shooters. I feel like he’d baby Vassel, Williams, Bey 1 on 1. He’s a mismatch.

I'm with you plus that his shoot is Not so bad 32.5 % 3pt with more than 1 attempt per game same as Williams, 60% ft is Not that good but not unfixable.

[duncan2150]

Precious is an undersized center in today's NBA. Stop asking for him.

That's why he is a PF and could be a small ball 5.

[rankingtear]

That's why he is a PF and could be a small ball 5.

A non shooter at PF is he the next Giannis?

[Dejounte]

Don't listen to false statements about Precious being an undersized center from these liars. Only reason they would say that is because of his offense, not his defense. But they'll spin it like they always do because they hate to admit they're wrong.

I bring you the truth:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1ha3IZCJRaMr-nTbxPMI_KBqUOQhYmnBTyD4QWrBZ3uY/htmlview#gid=0

Look at spot-up, ISO PPP allowed, and peak D-PIPM. He defends non bigs well.

As far as his offense goes, before Wiseman went out, he was the designated SF/PF. He was forced to play C for his team, a position he had not played ever because he was the tallest talented player on the team. Name me a player today who is a strict center who can go coast to coast on a fast break like Precious can. Name me an NBA player who plays strictly center who has the ability in a half court setting to attack the basket off the dribble all the way from the 3 pt line.

[Rummpd]

https://www.si.com/nba/2020/08/21/nba-mock-draft-2020-timberwolves-win-lottery

Patrick Williams of FSU? Yes or no?

[ZeusWillJudge]

Just for laughs, I'd like to make a list of all the players that people say are going to be off the board by the time the Spurs pick. It's way more than 10.

[itzsoweezee]

A team has nearly zero chance of being competitive in this league without an athletic, long wing that can defend and shoot. The spurs have exactly 0 of these on the roster.

Of course, I'm sure they'll user this first likely pick in 20 years to pick another big man or undersized two guard.

[Dennis the Menace]

A team has nearly zero chance of being competitive in this league without an athletic, long wing that can defend and shoot. The spurs have exactly 0 of these on the roster.

Of course, I'm sure they'll user this first likely pick in 20 years to pick another big man or undersized two guard.


If there’s a Rui Hachimura clone in the draft that would be FANTASTIC

[Biggems]

I wouldn't be upset if we got him, but I'm leary of Duke players in the NBA.

I understand that, and our history with them isn't great, actually poor.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

So do we all agree the Spurs should draft Pat Williams, else Pop should be waived, the FO sacked and Bryn's head chopped in an ISIS style reenactment live on TV?

[Dejounte]

Precious studies LeBron

https://instagram.com/stories/precious/2381394238341693063?utm_source=ig_story_item_share&igshid=1cz37axrwe9yx

[DAF86]

That's why he is a PF and could be a small ball 5.

Can't shoot and, as louded as he is for his athleticism and agility, he doesn't seem able to stay in front of players that aren't bigmen.

[ace3g]

Aleksej Pokusevski Is A Potential Gem In The 2020 NBA Drafthttps://uproxx.com/dimemag/aleksej-pokusevski-2020-nba-draft-scouting-report/

[Dejounte]

Don't listen to false statements about Precious being an undersized center from these liars. Only reason they would say that is because of his offense, not his defense. But they'll spin it like they always do because they hate to admit they're wrong.

I bring you the truth:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/0/d/1ha3IZCJRaMr-nTbxPMI_KBqUOQhYmnBTyD4QWrBZ3uY/htmlview#gid=0

Look at spot-up, ISO PPP allowed, and peak D-PIPM. He defends non bigs well.

As far as his offense goes, before Wiseman went out, he was the designated SF/PF. He was forced to play C for his team, a position he had not played ever because he was the tallest talented player on the team. Name me a player today who is a strict center who can go coast to coast on a fast break like Precious can. Name me an NBA player who plays strictly center who has the ability in a half court setting to attack the basket off the dribble all the way from the 3 pt line.

Again, for idiots spreading misinformation. See above for facts.

[Chinook]

Dejounte, dude, take a chill pill. It's getting weird at this point how triggered you seem to be by DAFfy disagreeing with you.

[Capt Bringdown]

Spurs need an impact player, like, yesterday. Impact players aren't usually found at 11. Spurs need to make a deal somehow.

[Dejounte]

Dejounte, dude, take a chill pill. It's getting weird at this point how triggered you seem to be by DAFfy disagreeing with you.

It's my absolute pet peeve when someone spreads misinformation and lies. I'm legitimately sorry to anyone bothered by this. Someone needs to tell liars to fuck off. There's people I disagree with on here and we get along okay (for example, you lmao), and then there's people that spew nonsense and then it spreads...

[tim_duncan_fan]

Can Precious defend the perimeter?

[Dejounte]

Can Precious defend the perimeter?

The answer is yes. Please see video below:




https://youtu.be/YVi5x0TCOqc



I can’t recommend enough this channel. Please avoid videos containing strictly highlights and find full games of the prospect your interested in or condensed videos like this one showing both good and bad.



Busting the lie that Precious can’t defend perimeter players, I present you examples of his capability in that area.



Time stamps are as follows:

28:32

29:10

29:29

33:24

35:54

37:06

39:10

39:26



These time stamps provide ACTUAL examples, and no bullshit like “oh, he can rebound over them. That counts!”.



If there’s anything to criticize Precious for, it’s the mental lapses he has on defense which can be attributed to lack of discipline on the defensive end. You will see him bite on fakes, give players too much space, etc. You will find it in the same video. His fundamentals are not as polished as say, Patrick Williams. Then again, if he didn’t have these flaws, he would be a top 5 pick. If you draft Precious, you go in with hopes of developing and instilling solid fundamentals. His athleticism and versatility are the top two reasons why you draft him.

[Chinook]

I'm not going to lie: The very little I just saw of Achiuwa makes him seem like a 4/5 rather than a 3/4. That's not ideal, but it's what it is. He looks like he can defend a switch ... as well as you can expect a big to. He looks like he has the makings of a perimeter game ... for a big. He seems like he'll be able to develop a good enough shot ... for a big. I think he can be a PF in the league, but he may need to play next to a center who can space the floor to help out the rest of the team. I wouldn't love him and Poeltl in the starting unit, especially if one of DeRozan or Murray is also there. But at 11, or hopefully at 14 because SA traded down and picked up 27 or 30 from Boston, I can see it. Even in the context of the trade, I'd consider one of the wings we've talked about at 14 and hope one of the defensive front-court guys like Reed or Tillman is there at 30. Again, this is from little evidence, but those two just seem like what you want if you're really trying to get a defender, not Precious.

[pad300]

Aleksej Pokusevski Is A Potential Gem In The 2020 NBA Drafthttps://uproxx.com/dimemag/aleksej-pokusevski-2020-nba-draft-scouting-report/

I don't know where Pokusevski ends up in this draft, but if he's there at 11, he needs to be seriously considered. It's pretty rare to get a shot at potentially the best player in a draft at 11; Poku might very well be the best player in this draft when all is said and done.

[Dejounte]

I'm not going to lie: The very little I just saw of Achiuwa makes him seem like a 4/5 rather than a 3/4. That's not ideal, but it's what it is. He looks like he can defend a switch ... as well as you can expect a big to. He looks like he has the makings of a perimeter game ... for a big. He seems like he'll be able to develop a good enough shot ... for a big. I think he can be a PF in the league, but he may need to play next to a center who can space the floor to help out the rest of the team. I wouldn't love him and Poeltl in the starting unit, especially if one of DeRozan or Murray is also there. But at 11, or hopefully at 14 because SA traded down and picked up 27 or 30 from Boston, I can see it. Even in the context of the trade, I'd consider one of the wings we've talked about at 14 and hope one of the defensive front-court guys like Reed or Tillman is there at 30. Again, this is from little evidence, but those two just seem like what you want if you're really trying to get a defender, not Precious.

I agree, the game he displayed most in college was that of a 4/5 but it's the flashes of perimeter play and ball handling in transition makes me see his potential at 3/4. This dude is a unicorn, and is probably a good fit with Samanic if Samanic ever comes close to half his potential.

[Chinook]

I also think there might some confusion on what everyone means by "defending on the perimeter". There's a difference between being switchable and able to execute a gameplan against a guard to get him to go where you want him to go and being legit able to go up and down the court with a perimeter player and check them. The former is plenty valuable in the modern NBA, but I wonder how many folks on here are looking for a 6-8 guy whom the Spurs can put on the opposing star and have them shut the star down no matter who it is ala Bowen or Leonard. That's a way higher standard, and with the little I know of college basketball, I haven't heard of any of these prospects having the assignment to guard guys at other positions outside of switches and how those guys did. Basically don't know if anyone had their moment of shutting down this year's Jimmer like Kawhi did back in the day.

[tim_duncan_fan]

My thing with Precious is all looking at potential. I haven't studied really, as you guys can tell lol. I don't want to pick a fricking Pat Beverly or yet another small-for-his-position guy out of this lottery.

I was in on Pat Williams for a bit, but seems like he lacks lateral quickness at like 19 years old. Sad.

I want to murder this unathletic midget syndrome the team has been stricken with.

[Chinook]

I agree, the game he displayed most in college was that of a 4/5 but it's the flashes of perimeter play and ball handling in transition makes me see his potential at 3/4. This dude is a unicorn, and is probably a good fit with Samanic if Samanic ever comes close to half his potential.

I don't see Samanic as a three either, and I'm not sure if both of those guys are fours who can slide down in certain situations could make it worth. I think it would be more possible for one to move to the five for stretches while the rest of the time one's a bench player. But Pop loves playing a big as possible (which is something a lot of folks here seem to forget), so if he's still coaching in a couple of years, we could see it.

[Chinook]

My thing with Precious is all looking at potential. I haven't studied really, as you guys can tell lol. I don't want to pick a fricking Pat Beverly or yet another small-for-his-position guy out of this lottery.

I was in on Pat Williams for a bit, but seems like he lacks lateral quickness at like 19 years old. Sad.

I want to murder this unathletic midget syndrome the team has been stricken with.

Real talk: When was the last time the Spurs actually drafted someone too small for their position? Maybe DeShaun Thomas in 2013 or Denmon in 2012? Just seems like a weird accusation.

[Dejounte]

I don't see Samanic as a three either, and I'm not sure if both of those guys are fours who can slide down in certain situations could make it worth. I think it would be more possible for one to move to the five for stretches while the rest of the time one's a bench player. But Pop loves playing a big as possible (which is something a lot of folks here seem to forget), so if he's still coaching in a couple of years, we could see it.

Yeah I was thinking more along the lines of either one switching to the 5. I was focusing more on how their games compliment each other well if we ignore positions. Precious is strong, rebounds really well, hustles, gets put back shots in while Luka is a sharpshooter, passes well, and has diversified skillset on offense. The synergy there just seems like it would be strong.