Official 2022 NBA Free Agency Thread

[exstatic]

Aldridge also led the 2011 Blazers when Roy was out most of the year. His second best teammate was like Wes Matthews or Andre Miller. I've criticized LMA a lot, but it's not like he was carried on every single year his team was successful.

He also dragged the Kawhi holdout team to the playoffs. That might have been his greatest accomplishment.

[KingKev]

:lmao The guy claiming Aldridge was better than Davis has the audacity to call someone else a "dumbass". Some of you people are so ignorant it's unbelievable. Go to virtually any basketball forum on the internet (social media, message board, whatever), particularly non Spurs centric ones, say something that stupid and see what the response will be.

Holiday has made one All-Star team in his career, in '13 as 76er. The teams with him and the others you named were, as I said, perennially decimated by injury, in a loaded conference no less.

:lmao At comparing those players to the likes of Roy, Lillard, Scumbag. Only Cousins had a similar talent level, but came with baggage and played a whole 65 games for them.

Do you ever get tired of using that emoji?

[RC_Drunkford]

:lmao The guy claiming Aldridge was better than Davis has the audacity to call someone else a "dumbass". Some of you people are so ignorant it's unbelievable. Go to virtually any basketball forum on the internet (social media, message board, whatever), particularly non Spurs centric ones, say something that stupid and see what the response will be.

Holiday has made one All-Star team in his career, in '13 as 76er. The teams with him and the others you named were, as I said, perennially decimated by injury, in a loaded conference no less.

:lmao At comparing those players to the likes of Roy, Lillard, Scumbag. Only Cousins had a similar talent level, but came with baggage and played a whole 65 games for them.

none of those players you mentioned were on the 18 and 19 Spurs and as the poster before me said he dragged the Blazers to the playoffs when Roy was out. Where‘s your evidence that AD was better?

[TD 21]

Do you ever get tired of using that emoji?

Not when I see outrageous comments like "Brown is a borderline superstar". :lmao



none of those players you mentioned were on the 18 and 19 Spurs and as the poster before me said he dragged the Blazers to the playoffs when Roy was out. Where‘s your evidence that AD was better?

We're 2 years removed from Davis being the difference between a team that was a borderline playoff team (non the previous season, but James did miss 27 games) winning a championship, while being the best player in the playoffs. Aldridge could have never done that.

My evidence is a combination of my eyes, knowledge of the game, advanced stats and consensus opinion. I was one of the few non Aldridge haters on this board, but this is a non debate.

[Leetonidas]

AD is clearly a better player than LMA :lol he's just made of glass which negates a lot of his on court value. But his 2020 run was miles better than anything LMA ever did. Can you imagine if we had Nephew and AD instead of LMA? Probably would have won a title in 2016 and 2017 tbh

[tbdog]

AD is clearly a better player than LMA :lol he's just made of glass which negates a lot of his on court value. But his 2020 run was miles better than anything LMA ever did. Can you imagine if we had Nephew and AD instead of LMA? Probably would have won a title in 2016 and 2017 tbh

He was better in a vacuum. And I don't see how the bubble was a playoff run. He got months off rest before the bubble. That's not a playoff run, that's just a stretch.

[Leetonidas]

He was better in a vacuum. And I don't see how the bubble was a playoff run. He got months off rest before the bubble. That's not a playoff run, that's just a stretch.

Not saying the bubble doesn't deserve an asterisk but it doesn't negate the fact that he was playing at a level above LMAs best that season

[TD 21]

He was better in a vacuum. And I don't see how the bubble was a playoff run. He got months off rest before the bubble. That's not a playoff run, that's just a stretch.

So did everyone else.

[Mugen]

What’s kind of ironic is Adam Sandler has been living in Yorkville an upscale downtown neighbourhood in TO all summer. Probs filming a movie.

Yorkville is in Upper East Side tbh, used to live there :lol

[KingKev]

Yorkville is in Upper East Side tbh, used to live there :lol

haha it’s all the same overrated shit.

[Dverde]

Dejounte liked this tweet. Sounds like he is calling ownership the problem.

https://twitter.com/calmp/status/1552347096094855168?s

[slick'81]

Dejounte liked this tweet. Sounds like he is calling ownership the problem.

https://twitter.com/calmp/status/1552347096094855168?s

we have no ownership

[Leetonidas]

DJ still asshurt and being passive aggressive on social media:lol is there any doubt spurs told him they were gonna pay him 42M at this point

[John B]

DJ still asshurt and being passive aggressive on social media:lol is there any doubt spurs told him they were gonna pay him 42M at this point

Agree. He was acting butthurt because he was probably told he wouldn’t get offered the max, and that Spurs are being cheap. Spurs are rebuilding, just not around him :lol.

[Fusternino]

Pretty sure LMA still hasn't bothered to even re-sign with the Nets yet. Can't blame him. I'd wait 'til they work out the KD nonsense.

[Chinook]

There's a real risk the new ownership group is going to try to cut costs as much as possible, especially while the team is tanking. We might see some real penny-pinching shit. The signs are certainly there. This is why I freaked out so much about the Chriss trade a while ago. It's a sign the ownership might be looking to sacrifice investment in their product for short-term gains, which is basically the MO of hedge funds and a lot of VC firms.

[tbdog]

So did everyone else.

Yes, and that benefits some players more than others, especially ones that are injury prone and can't get through an 82 game season. Also, there were reports that Lakers were training together while other teams were in lock downs.

[exstatic]

Agree. He was acting butthurt because he was probably told he wouldn’t get offered the max, and that Spurs are being cheap. Spurs are rebuilding, just not around him :lol.

Not paying DJ does not make the Spurs cheap, it makes them smart.

[exstatic]

There's a real risk the new ownership group is going to try to cut costs as much as possible, especially while the team is tanking. We might see some real penny-pinching shit. The signs are certainly there. This is why I freaked out so much about the Chriss trade a while ago. It's a sign the ownership might be looking to sacrifice investment in their product for short-term gains, which is basically the MO of hedge funds and a lot of VC firms.

An investor, even a hedge fund guy, who buys a piece of a consortium owned team doesn’t set the agenda or call the shots.

[Chinook]

An investor, even a hedge fund guy, who buys a piece of a consortium owned team doesn’t set the agenda or call the shots.

I mean they do. They don't get to override the wishes of the principle owners, but they certainly get a say in return for the "cash" they're providing for the rest of the owners. Moreover, you're assuming that the previous ownership coalition would be against the proposed changes, and I don't believe that at all. I believe they made this stake available to purchase in the first place because they were looking for a different model on how to run the business.

[tbdog]

Not saying the bubble doesn't deserve an asterisk but it doesn't negate the fact that he was playing at a level above LMAs best that season

I can grant you that. But it was one season. KG and Dirk had better one off seasons than TD, heck Dirk carry in 2011 was the greatest carry i've seen, better than 03, and KG DPOY in 07 I think was epic too. There was always an argument if KG had had TP and Manu, would he have won more titles? I say, no, clearly no, and I wouldn't consider putting Dirk and KG above TD. AD hadn't one a playoff series, and he joined the best player in the NBA until he finally did. Props to AD finally rising to the occasion, in front of empty stadiums. Since then, has the lakers won a series?

[JeffDuncan]

Dejounte liked this tweet. Sounds like he is calling ownership the problem.

https://twitter.com/calmp/status/1552347096094855168?s


Well…. The one who writes the paychecks for “other coaches” is Pop, the POBO.

So no, it doesn’t really sound like he’s talking about ownership.

[JeffDuncan]

There's a real risk the new ownership group is going to try to cut costs as much as possible, especially while the team is tanking. We might see some real penny-pinching shit. …


You think this is cost cutting?

https://www.ksat.com/sports/2021/08/10/spurs-unveil-plans-for-massive-new-training-facility-510m-community-development-on-far-nw-side/

Now go ahead and blather “yeah but” all you want. Feel free.



The signs are certainly there. This is why I freaked out so much about the Chriss trade a while ago. …


No, the signs are not there.

The reason you freaked out about the Chriss trade is because there are times you get carried away for no sane reason.

Do you really - really - think Pop made a conference call to the team owners to find out if he was allowed to get some free money for the team?

[offset formation]

AD is clearly a better player than LMA :lol he's just made of glass which negates a lot of his on court value. But his 2020 run was miles better than anything LMA ever did. Can you imagine if we had Nephew and AD instead of LMA? Probably would have won a title in 2016 and 2017 tbh

I remember LMA almost single handedly took the Spurs out the year before he came over. He was a beast in that series. AD has a higher ceiling but what's the use of it if he can't stay healthy. Also, AD only won a ring with the best player on the planet. I doubt he wins shit for us.

[TD 21]

Yes, and that benefits some players more than others, especially ones that are injury prone and can't get through an 82 game season. Also, there were reports that Lakers were training together while other teams were in lock downs.

No one can determine or decipher the former and the latter is mere speculation.

Scumbag rested for 95 games between '17-'19, then tanked his value culmination in an iterating of a team being formed that otherwise wouldn't have been and topped it off by barely beating a decimated Warriors team in the Finals, but somehow he's above reproach.



AD hadn't one a playoff series, and he joined the best player in the NBA until he finally did. Props to AD finally rising to the occasion, in front of empty stadiums. Since then, has the lakers won a series?

:lmao Results without context and not true. The Pelicans swept the Trail Blazers in '18 in what was thought to be a 50/50 series. His only two other playoff series as a Pelican came vs the Warriors, one of which was the Durant version.

Spurs fans like to pick and choose when context applies. When it's Robinson, suddenly there's viable reasons for the relative lack of playoff success pre Duncan.

James was also in decline by '20 and it was Davis who was their best player in the playoffs, as they combined to carry an otherwise underwhelming team to the championship.

[scott]

There's a real risk the new ownership group is going to try to cut costs as much as possible, especially while the team is tanking. We might see some real penny-pinching shit. The signs are certainly there. This is why I freaked out so much about the Chriss trade a while ago. It's a sign the ownership might be looking to sacrifice investment in their product for short-term gains, which is basically the MO of hedge funds and a lot of VC firms.

Absolutely, and why there is a real risk the Spurs might do the least valuable thing with their cap space and simply not use it. The $12MM ownership would save might actually be more valuable to them than adding assets.

[scott]

You think this is cost cutting?

https://www.ksat.com/sports/2021/08/10/spurs-unveil-plans-for-massive-new-training-facility-510m-community-development-on-far-nw-side/

Now go ahead and blather “yeah but” all you want. Feel free.




No, the signs are not there.

The reason you freaked out about the Chriss trade is because there are times you get carried away for no sane reason.

Do you really - really - think Pop made a conference call to the team owners to find out if he was allowed to get some free money for the team?

It is entirely possible for an organization to cut costs in one area while simultaneously making investments in others.

In this case, it is entirely possible for the Spurs to be extremely cost conscious with their Basketball Product while still making a prudent Real Estate investment. And face it, this "Human Performance Complex" is just that - a real estate investment. People want to point to it as some indication that it locks the Spurs into San Antonio forever, but it does nothing of the sort. If the Spurs move, which they might, their real estate investment doesn't instantly become worthless. It is still a smart development in a valuable part of a large (and growing) city.

Cost cutting in one area while making investments in others are by no means mutually exclusive, it's just prudent strategic business management.

[The Truth #6]

AD is overrated for what he has actually delivered. He's not a leader. He's injured easily. The way he bailed on NO was really weak. He's nowhere near Tim Duncan or the all time greats. He had one good run, otherwise it's not crazy to say he was good stats/bad team. Whether or not LMA is properly rated is a separate conversation. I'm biased against AD so I'm probably cherry picking, but I just don't see it with him. Tangent: Maybe it's something in the Mississippi River water, because Zion looks to be another flaky disappointment as well. NO should be looking to sell on Zion when/if he plays again. No way is he sticking around there.

[Dejounte]

Not this stupid shit again.

it isn’t just real estate. It’s being designed as one of the top athletic centers in the world for professional sports, with the Spurs in mind. To think the Spurs FO would put their blood, sweat, and tears into planning a state of the art facility and let it just get rented by whom? There aren’t other athletes from other cities who are going to flock to this center to make that investment worthwhile. It’s intended to be used for the growing developmental program the Spurs are invested in as evidenced by their full belief in the gleague. This is just another step for that. They obviously put a lot of stock in in-house care and training for their players.

[scott]

Not this stupid shit again.

it isn’t just real estate. It’s being designed as one of the top athletic centers in the world for professional sports, with the Spurs in mind. To think the Spurs FO would put their blood, sweat, and tears into planning a state of the art facility and let it just get rented by whom? There aren’t other athletes from other cities who are going to flock to this center to make that investment worthwhile. It’s intended to be used for the growing developmental program the Spurs are invested in as evidenced by their full belief in the gleague. This is just another step for that. They obviously put a lot of stock in in-house care and training for their players.

Read what the facility is in more detail. It is not a $500 million facility to care for 15 people. Yes, those 15 people will get great benefit from it - but it does not need those 15 people for it to be a viable facility. If you think otherwise, you’re a naive fool. Even the world’s best sports surgeon’s don’t make their living exclusively off professional athletes. The Spurs aren’t going to have 1700 professionals in a facility to look after 15 people.

Professional sports teams are in the real estate development business these days. The Star in Frisco and SOFI Stadium are great examples of real estate developments anchored around a professional sports facility - but they don’t exist solely to cater to the team. A practice facility is easily redeveloped into something else, and the rest of the center won’t cease to be viable because it has 15 fewer clients.

[scott]

And to add on to that… it’s not even going to be fully funded or owned by SSE… it’s coming from “private investors”. Those investors aren’t investing in the Spurs, they are investing in a real estate development.

By no means does this mean the Spurs are leaving, but this facility also doesn’t mean they are staying. And it definitely doesn’t mean they might not be cutting costs on their basketball product, which was the original point.

[Chinook]

You think this is cost cutting?

https://www.ksat.com/sports/2021/08/10/spurs-unveil-plans-for-massive-new-training-facility-510m-community-development-on-far-nw-side/

Now go ahead and blather “yeah but” all you want. Feel free.

That's already been addressed.


No, the signs are not there.

Yes, the signs are there, from the Chriss trade, to the decision to eschew getting an asset back for Aldridge in lieu of taking the buyout, to the lack of summer-league investment, to their decision on what coaches to maintain, to their decision to take back the absolute minimum salary for Murray and then sitting on those savings. We don't know how those things will all play out. Hopefully the Spurs find a way to improve the team's long-term position using some of that salary space. But they have about $37 Million to spend to get to the salary floor right now, according to Spotrac. They can't pull the Hinkie move of taking big salaries later on in the year to save cash since the CBA closed that loophole. But whether they find a way to spend over that threshold and thus actually increase their expenses past the minimum remains to be seen.

Another thing to look for going forward is how they treat X-9 and X-10 contracts and in general how much they spend on the Toros going forward. As the summer league suggested, the Spurs might not be making the developmental investment in their players you'd think a tanking team would. Even though they have a lot of young guys, the team should be looking to maximize their avenues for finding talent, and that means actively trying to collect potential NBA players through their program in Austin. Guys like Covington, Tate, Dort and Wood have made their marks on rebuilding teams, and the Spurs could do that if they invest and cycle. But they don't HAVE to spend that kind of money. There's almost certainly a salary expectation in the d-league, but there's way more variability to how much clubs can invest in their infrastructure and staffing. It's a potential area to be cheap, but we won't have a real sense in how they're doing in that regard until later on this year.


The reason you freaked out about the Chriss trade is because there are times you get carried away for no sane reason.

Do you really - really - think Pop made a conference call to the team owners to find out if he was allowed to get some free money for the team?

Why do you think Pop made trade calls? He's not the GM and has never been since he became the coach. While Pop is consulted on moves, he's not the guy who does that dirty work. He's nominally the top decision-maker on the team, but the moves are a collective effort, with ownership also having a seat at the table.

Anyways, the Chriss trade was startling because it was about then purely looking to save money, not cap, not flexibility against their budget. They liquidated basketball flexibility to give their ownership group some cash. It was abnormal and harkened back to the days of Red McCombs. The Holts are not poor, and their decision to be part of the big investment you mentioned shows that. That's why the defense of "They just got some cash to be able to afford to sign Dieng. What's the big deal?" was always wrong. They didn't need the cash -- they got back more than $7 Million against their budget from LMA. It wasn't a tactical financial decision by the team to maintain their budget. It was just a money grab. That wasn't something they had done in many years, and it was something to keep watch for in case it led to more decisions like that. Now we are starting to see more of those decisions come up. The canary is coughing. That doesn't mean the mine is going to blow up, but it does mean that we should be more cautious.

Also, I'm not in on the whole moving to Vegas thing. Maybe it happens. Maybe it doesn't. I don't see the financial decisions the Spurs are making as tied to either outcome.

[rjv]

this is the time of the year where ST morphs from Spurs Talk to Speculation Talk. I can't even imagine the amount of bandwidth that has been wasted on so many well thought out and articulated 'theories' that went nowhere. of course, anything is 'possible'. it's professional sports.

[KingKev]

this is the time of the year where ST morphs from Spurs Talk to Speculation Talk. I can't even imagine the amount of bandwidth that has been wasted on so many well thought out and articulated 'theories' that went nowhere. of course, anything is 'possible'. it's professional sports.

Russ to the Spurs for an unprotected FRP is the 2021/22 Saric + FRP for Thad rumour that starts in July and goes till the trade deadline.

[rjv]

Russ to the Spurs for an unprotected FRP is the 2021/22 Saric + FRP for Thad rumour that starts in July and goes till the trade deadline.

bet on it.

[Mugen]

Sell, Baby, Sell! :hungry::lol

[exstatic]

Russ to the Spurs for an unprotected FRP is the 2021/22 Saric + FRP for Thad rumour that starts in July and goes till the trade deadline.

It was actually Saric + Smith + SRP for Young which is why it didn't happen.

[KingKev]

It was actually Saric + Smith + SRP for Young which is why it didn't happen.

Once Smith’s option was declined it was still Saric plus an FRP almost daily.

[exstatic]

Russ to the Spurs for an unprotected FRP is the 2021/22 Saric + FRP for Thad rumour that starts in July and goes till the trade deadline.

I don't think that rumor will have legs like the Phoenix one. Once training camp starts, it will probably die. I don't see the point of playing most of the season with a misfit, old roster, just to remedy it late in the season when they're probably hot garbage in the standings. If LA doesn't pull the trigger before, or early in training camp, I think it's dead.

[exstatic]

Once Smith’s option was declined it was still Saric plus an FRP almost daily.

That wouldn't work financially. Saric was $9.25M and Thad was $14.1M. I think most of it was Phoenix/ESPN sources, anyway.

[KingKev]

I don't think that rumor will have legs like the Phoenix one. Once training camp starts, it will probably die. I don't see the point of playing most of the season with a misfit, old roster, just to remedy it late in the season when they're probably hot garbage in the standings. If LA doesn't pull the trigger before, or early in training camp, I think it's dead.

I just watched Darvin Ham on All The Smoke and he had me believing they are going to try and make it work and I actually think he is going to have those guys being much more accountable.

Russ really isn’t the problem if he can play a more contained role. Which I’ll concede is a big IF. AD is the bigger problem. Seldom mentally and physically prepared.

Healthy Lakers will be a probable top 6 team in the West.

[Kevin]

It was actually Saric + Smith + SRP for Young which is why it didn't happen.

At the time that looked like a bad deal for the Spurs but in hindsight getting Smith for Young would have been a pretty good deal. Oh well. Smith looked like a bust a year ago at this time anyway. Hindsight 2020.

[exstatic]

At the time that looked like a bad deal for the Spurs but in hindsight getting Smith for Young would have been a pretty good deal. Oh well. Smith looked like a bust a year ago at this time anyway. Hindsight 2020.

Smith looked like a bust AND they didn't pick up his option, which made his contract radioactive since whoever held it at the end of the year could only pay him 4.7M and he would be unrestricted. Two years of Saric by itself is worth more than a SRP. He was out all last year, too.

[KingKev]

Smith looked like a bust AND they didn't pick up his option, which made his contract radioactive since whoever held it at the end of the year could only pay him 4.7M and he would be unrestricted. Two years of Saric by itself is worth more than a SRP. He was out all last year, too.

Which ended up being his market surprisingly.

[Leetonidas]

I remember LMA almost single handedly took the Spurs out the year before he came over. He was a beast in that series.


I assume you mean in 2014 because the Spurs did not play Portland in 2015. And considering SA won that series handily 4-1 and LMA was held in check by Splitter and shot 41%...not really sure I'd call that almost "single handedly" taking out the Spurs at all

[timtonymanu]

I assume you mean in 2014 because the Spurs did not play Portland in 2015. And considering SA won that series handily 4-1 and LMA was held in check by Splitter and shot 41%...not really sure I'd call that almost "single handedly" taking out the Spurs at all

But he did destroy Dwert the series before

[Chinook]

But he did destroy Dwert the series before

Yeah. Aldridge had a ton of individual high points and is one of the top 10 players to ever don a Spurs uniform. I do think Davis has objectively better numbers. But qualitatively, Aldridge has had the better career outside of Davis' ring. He got Portland to the semis in 2014. He got the Spurs to the WCF in 2017. Trying to pretend those aren't his accomplishments is low.

[vy65]

I mean they do. They don't get to override the wishes of the principle owners, but they certainly get a say in return for the "cash" they're providing for the rest of the owners. Moreover, you're assuming that the previous ownership coalition would be against the proposed changes, and I don't believe that at all. I believe they made this stake available to purchase in the first place because they were looking for a different model on how to run the business.

Funds are capped at 30% ownership. They necessarily are minority owners so their say is limited. But you may be right about their being alignment of interests in generating "value" by slashing costs.

[KingKev]

Funds are capped at 30% ownership. They necessarily are minority owners so their say is limited. But you may be right about their being alignment of interests in generating "value" by slashing costs.

Where did you read funds can only hold 30% total?

[DMC]

Spurs can't win without (enter random growth spurt kid who dunks in 9th grade here). They need to tank for this person.

[heyheymymy]

lol Zion got that Bobo weight incentives contract

Zion Williamson (https://www.tmz.com/people/zion-williamson/)'s new contract is coming with some hefty demands -- the NBA star will reportedly have to maintain a certain weight and body fat percentage, or will risk losing some of his guaranteed money.
Williamson inked a 5-year extension worth up to $231 million to stay with the New Orleans Pelicans this off-season ... but there's a big catch.
Christian Clark of NOLA.com (https://www.nola.com/sports/pelicans/article_85296674-00a5-11ed-97cb-ef28af9a5590.html?22) says some of that money could be yanked from his pockets if certain health stipulations aren't met.
The report states the 22-year-old will submit to weigh-ins throughout his contract to ensure the sum of his weight and body fat percentage stays below 295 ... and if he doesn't, he'll literally pay for it.

According to The Times-Picayune, the contract stipulates that Williamson must weigh in at below 295 pounds periodically throughout the deal. His body fat percentage will also be monitored.

[JeffDuncan]

That’s already been addressed.


No it has not. What’s above, in this thread, is merely a dishonest dork trying to claim that when the Spurs put half a billion dollars into a new practice and medical facility, that it has nothing to do with the Spurs. He’s only trying to lie his way around it.

You should respond to the point. How is that “cost cutting?”

Hint: If the Spurs were cost cutting they would not be taking on half a billion dollars in new spending. Hint, hint.



Yes, the signs are there, …


No, they are not. You are fabricating. About some things you wrote, my man, you are just plain outright lying. Sad to see.



Why do you think Pop made trade calls? …


What makes you think Pop made trade calls?

You. Don’t. Know. That.

Don’t lie.


Anyways, the Chriss trade was startling …


The Chriss trade was not the least bit “startling” to anybody who has something better than chicken feathers for brains.

The Warriors offered $100,000 - so one story said - of free money to the Spurs for taking Chriss off their hands. And Pop took it. Any team in the NBA would have done the same. Of course. A sane person knows that.

The reason the Spurs got first chance at it is undoubtedly because Kerr and Pop are friends, so Pop was the first one Kerr called.

Tell me, are you so hopelessly crazy that if somebody offered you a hundred thousand bucks, for free, you’d scream and run away in terror?

Are you? Is there truly something mentally wrong with you?



… because it was about then purely looking to save money, …


It absolutely was not, you fruitcake.

It was simply about accepting a hundred thousand in free money that was offered.

And you’re so smart you’d screech hysterically and run away from that in a panic. You say.


It was abnormal …


You must be nuts.


... That's why the defense of "They just got some cash to be able to afford to sign Dieng. What's the big deal?" …


You are lying. You’re just making things up. Stop it.

The Spurs signed Dieng using a small part of their NTMLE. They had over $7M for the Exception, and they used $1M of it on Dieng. Absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Chriss.

Just stop lying. Stop it.


... The canary is coughing. …


That isn’t coughing, it’s laughing, at the crazy, dishonest nonsense you wrote.

[vy65]

Where did you read funds can only hold 30% total?

The NBA doesn't allow private equity to own more than 30% in teams, with a maximum of 20% ownership for one fund. Fernyhough said there are no "ownership accoutrements" with PE stakes. Instead, those perks – like courtside seats – are reserved for limited partners like Michael Dell, who buys direct.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/02/06/private-equity-sports-investments-neared-2-billion-in-2021-nba-hot.html

[TDMVPDPOY]

The NBA doesn't allow private equity to own more than 30% in teams, with a maximum of 20% ownership for one fund. Fernyhough said there are no "ownership accoutrements" with PE stakes. Instead, those perks – like courtside seats – are reserved for limited partners like Michael Dell, who buys direct.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/02/06/private-equity-sports-investments-neared-2-billion-in-2021-nba-hot.html

these fkn clowns equity firms will turn teams to shit, they only care about maximizing shareholders profits then fielding a competitive team to win championships, unless the winning team gets $$$ prize money....look at european football teams own by equity firms = shit

[tbdog]

Spurs fans like to pick and choose when context applies. When it's Robinson, suddenly there's viable reasons for the relative lack of playoff success pre Duncan.
.


DR playoff success was far better than AD in the Pelicans. DR playoffs failures was compared to his regular season dominance, when it appeared like he was on par with hakeem and Shaq, yet he was not. DR was an mvp and scoring champion. DR in today's league would be the greek freak. But bigger with a better shot and better interior defending.

[KingKev]

The NBA doesn't allow private equity to own more than 30% in teams, with a maximum of 20% ownership for one fund. Fernyhough said there are no "ownership accoutrements" with PE stakes. Instead, those perks – like courtside seats – are reserved for limited partners like Michael Dell, who buys direct.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/02/06/private-equity-sports-investments-neared-2-billion-in-2021-nba-hot.html

Cheers.

I don’t think a move is imminent but if/when the tightly held and controlling ownership stake is broken up I’d be more worried. I thought I recall someone on here looking into 6th Street Investment Management as they own other equity positions in professional sports and they have no history in being activists.

[Chinook]

No it has not. What’s above, in this thread, is merely a dishonest dork trying to claim that when the Spurs put half a billion dollars into a new practice and medical facility, that it has nothing to do with the Spurs. He’s only trying to lie his way around it.

You should respond to the point. How is that “cost cutting?”

Hint: If the Spurs were cost cutting they would not be taking on half a billion dollars in new spending. Hint, hint.

You're going to keep calling things dishonest in this thread that you disagree with. The take that the Spurs are building a facility is already not true. The Spurs are one of the investors in a facility, along with private interests. You misunderstood what this says:


Spurs Sports and Entertainment publicly unveiled plans today for a new nearly 50-acre development on the far Northwest Side that includes a state-of-the-art training facility for the San Antonio Spurs (https://www.ksat.com/topic/Spurs/), medical and research offices, retail, park and community space.

You read it as the Spurs are building a bunch of stuff. They are announcing a project that they and others are building, and on it includes a facility for the Spurs. The bulk of the property isn't for them. The Spurs are getting a new building ... great. We have no idea how much they're paying for that, how much they're getting paid to put the Spurs name on it, etc. But even the article says it's mainly a land development project by private investors. This was already addressed, and you just didn't want to hear it. How are the Spurs cutting cost if they're spending half a billion dollars? They aren't spending half a billion dollars. Learn to read what you post as proof and get that arrogant chip off your shoulder.


The Chriss trade was not the least bit “startling” to anybody who has something better than chicken feathers for brains.

It absolutely was not, you fruitcake.

Dude, grow up.


You are lying. You’re just making things up. Stop it.

The Spurs signed Dieng using a small part of their NTMLE. They had over $7M for the Exception, and they used $1M of it on Dieng. Absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Chriss.

Just stop lying. Stop it.

Of course Dieng's signing had nothing to do with the money the Spurs got for Chriss. That was literally my point. All you're doing is showing you have no memory though, because that was a justification used by quite a few posters, especially before the extent of Aldridge's buyout was known. I understand that you were on a different bend back then, trying to twist the conversation into how trades were about liabilities not assets while also admitting they're about both in the same paragraph. It was a weird time for a lot of us.

Though to be fair to the folks saying that, they weren't saying that the payment from GS created the salary slot to pay for Dieng, which is what you seem to be construing. Cash payments are not basketball assets and don't directly increase a team's flexibility to facilitate other moves (which is actually why I was so critical of the compensation in the first place). They were saying the Holts literally needed the cash the Warriors gave them for Chriss to be able to afford to sign Dieng. They didn't, in case anyone is wondering for multiple reasons, and I said this at the time. I'm also not even sure the Spurs used the MLE to sign Dieng rather than just the min.

[The Truth #6]

What I appreciate about Chinook is that he takes the time to have an actual dialogue about all these various topics, no matter how toxic. I can't imagine how even more intense this place will be next year when we actually have to see the rookies play and see what deficiencies they have and the "lil shine" has worn off.

[slick'81]

What I appreciate about Chinook is that he takes the time to have an actual dialogue about all these various topics, no matter how toxic. I can't imagine how even more intense this place will be next year when we actually have to see the rookies play and see what deficiencies they have and the "lil shine" has worn off.

its going to be fucking ugly

[rjv]

its going to be fucking ugly

that's pretty much what ST already is

[tbdog]

Most of us haven't seen a bad spurs team. It's going to be hard to cheer for hit young players to do well but also want to see loses. It's going to be this weird balance.

[KingKev]

Most of us haven't seen a bad spurs team. It's going to be hard to cheer for hit young players to do well but also want to see loses. It's going to be this weird balance.

yessir… check in on the thread about early Spurs memories so we know you’ve experienced real ups and mostly downs.

[dbestpro]

No it has not. What’s above, in this thread, is merely a dishonest dork trying to claim that when the Spurs put half a billion dollars into a new practice and medical facility, that it has nothing to do with the Spurs. He’s only trying to lie his way around it.

You should respond to the point. How is that “cost cutting?”

Hint: If the Spurs were cost cutting they would not be taking on half a billion dollars in new spending. Hint, hint.





No, they are not. You are fabricating. About some things you wrote, my man, you are just plain outright lying. Sad to see.




What makes you think Pop made trade calls?

You. Don’t. Know. That.

Don’t lie.




The Chriss trade was not the least bit “startling” to anybody who has something better than chicken feathers for brains.

The Warriors offered $100,000 - so one story said - of free money to the Spurs for taking Chriss off their hands. And Pop took it. Any team in the NBA would have done the same. Of course. A sane person knows that.

The reason the Spurs got first chance at it is undoubtedly because Kerr and Pop are friends, so Pop was the first one Kerr called.

Tell me, are you so hopelessly crazy that if somebody offered you a hundred thousand bucks, for free, you’d scream and run away in terror?

Are you? Is there truly something mentally wrong with you?




It absolutely was not, you fruitcake.

It was simply about accepting a hundred thousand in free money that was offered.

And you’re so smart you’d screech hysterically and run away from that in a panic. You say.




You must be nuts.




You are lying. You’re just making things up. Stop it.

The Spurs signed Dieng using a small part of their NTMLE. They had over $7M for the Exception, and they used $1M of it on Dieng. Absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with Chriss.

Just stop lying. Stop it.




That isn’t coughing, it’s laughing, at the crazy, dishonest nonsense you wrote.
Just because a person has a different take does not make them a liar. I think you have been watching too many political shows.

[rastaspur]

What I appreciate about Chinook is that he takes the time to have an actual dialogue about all these various topics, no matter how toxic. I can't imagine how even more intense this place will be next year when we actually have to see the rookies play and see what deficiencies they have and the "lil shine" has worn off.
I appreciate his effort as well. No one is always right. We've disagreed before. But he is civil, consistent, puts effort into his thoughts and isn't trying to troll the everybody.

He's a net positive poster. For sure

[Chinook]

The NBA doesn't allow private equity to own more than 30% in teams, with a maximum of 20% ownership for one fund. Fernyhough said there are no "ownership accoutrements" with PE stakes. Instead, those perks – like courtside seats – are reserved for limited partners like Michael Dell, who buys direct.

https://www.cnbc.com/amp/2022/02/06/private-equity-sports-investments-neared-2-billion-in-2021-nba-hot.html

Indeed. I had read that back in the day. To be clear, what I am talking about is not some VC firm making a hostile takeover of the Spurs or forcing their ownership to liquidate assets. I think the Holts and other others were looking at the VC world as a source of fresh cash, and the NBA made rules to allow that while (hopefully) retaining the feel of individual owners. Once they got the go-ahead, I think the Holts made it known they were soliciting offers, and CVC along with other firms made bids, not just for how much they were willing to pay but for other ways their partnership could benefit the ownership group. That includes things like potentially that facility being developed (I haven't looked into it enough to know if CVC is part of that outside of their stake in the Spurs). VC firms by practice have their fingers in a ton of diverse avenues, and opening those doors for the Holts seems like a good incentive.

Not directly talking to you VY, but if folks aren't familiar with how VCs normally work, they typically just buy stakes in companies rather than taking them over, and they set certain standards for the businesses they invest in before giving them money. That can mean some corporate restructures, reducing overhead, switching around processing goals, etc. Especially if the Holts were soliciting offers, they probably made a bunch of data available as part of the vetting process. CVC would've looked at the books and likely had their own ideas on how to increase the profit. Whether those were conditions the Spurs had to agree to to get the funding, or whether there were any particular conditions at all that the Spurs weren't already planning on doing is not known. But I do think there's quite a bit more nuance than we've been looking at. It's definitely the case that the Spurs are changing, regardless of if that's Holt-initiated or from outside pressures/opportunities. We should accept that and be willing to examine what's happening without the baked-in assumption that the Spurs of the 2020's will be particularly similar to the Spurs of the 2000s or even 2010s. From an ownership/front office standpoint, they very well might be as unrecognizable as they are on the court.

[DPG21920]

Well, one thing is for sure, I am not renewing season tickets again unless they come with a much better offer. As of now, they are holding firm on prices/perks which makes little sense given they even acknowledged the team wont be as good.

I can buy my same season tickets on the resale market (on a per game basis) for much, much cheaper than Spurs are trying to sell. Point of that is my guess is it will be a tough revenue year in that regard. They may be making it up on luxury tax payouts and tv deals, but on the ticket front they will struggle IMO

[Robz4000]

Well, one thing is for sure, I am not renewing season tickets again unless they come with a much better offer. As of now, they are holding firm on prices/perks which makes little sense given they even acknowledged the team wont be as good.

I can buy my same season tickets on the resale market (on a per game basis) for much, much cheaper than Spurs are trying to sell. Point of that is my guess is it will be a tough revenue year in that regard. They may be making it up on luxury tax payouts and tv deals, but on the ticket front they will struggle IMO

:lol will also help to show a lack of hometown support when the time to present their reasoning for moving to the league comes

[spurraider21]

:lol will also help to show a lack of hometown support when the time to present their reasoning for moving to the league comes
:tu vegas, baby

[Mugen]

:tu vegas, baby

Let's goooooooooo

[BackHome]

I bought a Taco today it tasted very good

[lefty20]

I bought a Taco today it tasted very good

But it wasn't Tuesday...

[RC_Drunkford]

Most of us haven't seen a bad spurs team. It's going to be hard to cheer for hit young players to do well but also want to see loses. It's going to be this weird balance.

just don’t watch the games. That should make it easier tbh

[tbdog]

just don’t watch the games. That should make it easier tbh

I love basketball and I'm routing for wins. And I'll be disappointed most of the season.

[DPG21920]

:lol will also help to show a lack of hometown support when the time to present their reasoning for moving to the league comes

I cant control that. I am going to the games and spending money….I am just not buying season tickets. Everyone could do what I do and the attendance numbers would be high while still having low season ticket sales

[KingKev]

I love basketball and I'm routing for wins. And I'll be disappointed most of the season.

I’m rooting for meaningful wins also which means losing as many games as possible this year. Every fame we lose is a win. If we can stay competitive and develop some of these young guys great. Whether Primo and Vassell are out the league 2 yrs from now or not I could care less if we are in a position to draft a potential cornerstone players the few drafts.

[Robz4000]

I cant control that. I am going to the games and spending money….I am just not buying season tickets. Everyone could do what I do and the attendance numbers would be high while still having low season ticket sales

Not blaming you my dude. Blaming ownership for charging a crazy amount of money to watch a product they know will be terrible. Either they profit or drag attendance down to help facilitate a move; its win-win for them.

[DPG21920]

Not blaming you my dude. Blaming ownership for charging a crazy amount of money to watch a product they know will be terrible. Either they profit or drag attendance down to help facilitate a move; its win-win for them.

I know you were not blaming me lol - was just outlining the path where attendance may still be ok but ticket sale revenues down. So they may not be able to show a lack of attendance is what I was getting at..

My guess is less people will go to games though when they are not any good. Especially if they do not lower prices.

[BatManu20]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FY93iWqXwAAjETJ?format=jpg&name=large

[AFBlue]

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FY93iWqXwAAjETJ?format=jpg&name=large

I'd take those odds as a Magic fan. Paolo is legit.

[Ice009]

I’m rooting for meaningful wins also which means losing as many games as possible this year. Every fame we lose is a win. If we can stay competitive and develop some of these young guys great. Whether Primo and Vassell are out the league 2 yrs from now or not I could care less if we are in a position to draft a potential cornerstone players the few drafts.

Why would Vassell be out of the league in two years? Do you think that little of him? I don't rate Primo highly, but I do think Vassell will be a very good player. I thought he was one of our two best players in the play-in game.

[slick'81]

Why would Vassell be out of the league in two years? Do you think that little of him? I don't rate Primo highly, but I do think Vassell will be a very good player. I thought he was one of our two best players in the play-in game.

which isn't saying much but on this team vassell will have every opportunity to succeed . If he can be around 15/16 ppg I'll be thrilled

[KingKev]

Why would Vassell be out of the league in two years? Do you think that little of him? I don't rate Primo highly, but I do think Vassell will be a very good player. I thought he was one of our two best players in the play-in game.

I don’t think he will be out the league. I think he probably has a very long and serviceable career. Will
probably help a team win meaningful games one day.

The fact that Vassell was one of our best players in a play-in game isn’t reason for optimism.

[exstatic]

I'd take those odds as a Magic fan. Paolo is legit.

DRob and Duncan have the second (35) and first (36) most wins improvement in NBA history. Neither one rang as a rookie. Paolo may well be legit, but he won’t have the impact of our two HOFers, and he won’t ring this year. Betting Orlando to ring this year is throwing away money.

[exstatic]

which isn't saying much but on this team vassell will have every opportunity to succeed . If he can be around 15/16 ppg I'll be thrilled

Vassell and Keldon will both top 20 ppg. With Lonnie and DJ gone, that’s 33 points worth of touches up for grabs.

[exstatic]

I don’t think he will be out the league. I think he probably has a very long and serviceable career. Will
probably help a team win meaningful games one day.

The fact that Vassell was one of our best players in a play-in game isn’t reason for optimism.

It actually really is. He’s a legit 3 level scorer who kept a cool head under pressure and performed. All he needs is more touches, and with 33 points and associated touches out the door this summer, he’ll get them.

[KingKev]

It actually really is. He’s a legit 3 level scorer who kept a cool head under pressure and performed. All he needs is more touches, and with 33 points and associated touches out the door this summer, he’ll get them.

Someone on this team needs to help these guys get those touches by being a floor leader, offensive threat and capable distributor.

Assuming JRich doesn’t see a material role or traded who will that be?

[exstatic]

Someone on this team needs to help these guys get those touches by being a floor leader, offensive threat and capable distributor.

Assuming JRich doesn’t see a material role or traded who will that be?

Tre.

[Seventyniner]

Tre.

I agree. I think the offense will look drastically different with Tre as the pass-first floor general. He might end up being the 4th option when he's on the floor. Certainly behind Keldon and Vassell, and probably Primo and Zollins too.

[buttsR4rebounding]

It actually really is. He’s a legit 3 level scorer who kept a cool head under pressure and performed. All he needs is more touches, and with 33 points and associated touches out the door this summer, he’ll get them.

I really hope Vassell has a huge breakout year. Otherwise passing on Haliburton will officially become a major drafting error by the Spurs.

[KingKev]

Tre.

I really like Tre and he is my dark horse to have a very meaningful/breakout year but he isn’t much of a scoring threat which makes it harder to open up the game for others.

[exstatic]

I really hope Vassell has a huge breakout year. Otherwise passing on Haliburton will officially become a major drafting error by the Spurs.

Haliburton let teams know that he wanted a Sacto. Having recently had a former draft pick exit the franchise in an ugly fashion, they respected Halliburton’s wishes. Ironic, since Sacto dumped him less than 2 years on. That’s right, Sacramento dumped a player WHO WANTED TO BE THERE.

[exstatic]

I really like Tre and he is my dark horse to have a very meaningful/breakout year but he isn’t much of a scoring threat which makes it harder to open up the game for others.

He never has a problem getting to the rim and scoring when he wants. That’s a high level skill for a non shooter.

[KingKev]

He never has a problem getting to the rim and scoring when he wants. That’s a high level skill for a non shooter.

He gets to the rim admirably. If we could infuse Primo/Tre into one player you’d have something.

[pad300]

Haliburton let teams know that he wanted a Sacto. Having recently had a former draft pick exit the franchise in an ugly fashion, they respected Halliburton’s wishes. Ironic, since Sacto dumped him less than 2 years on. That’s right, Sacramento dumped a player WHO WANTED TO BE THERE.

Anybody who wanted to go to Sacto may have some other issues (as well) exstatic...

[KingKev]

Anybody who wanted to go to Sacto may have some other issues (as well) exstatic...

Probably more about who was drafting around his projected range so city and opportunity.

Just googled him he is cousings with Eddie Jones who is also a cousin of Jalen Suggs. Shit makes my head hurt.

[Dejounte]

The jury on if drafting Vassell over Haliburton isn’t all on Vassell. That’s on Haliburton, too. For all we know, he tapers off and everybody forgets about him just like with what happened with Brogdon.

[KingKev]

He probably didn’t want to go somewhere flooded with guards especially a place like San Antonio where Brynn Forbes might play ahead of you nightly. Worked out damn well for him. This is the part of player empowerment I respect and something PATFO need to adapt to.

[spurs10]

I know you were not blaming me lol - was just outlining the path where attendance may still be ok but ticket sale revenues down. So they may not be able to show a lack of attendance is what I was getting at..

My guess is less people will go to games though when they are not any good. Especially if they do not lower prices. I joked to a friend in the Spurs organization that 'tickets to see a game against the Kings on the 20th row on a Tuesday are more than front row tickets to see the Stones.' Perhaps a bit of an exaggeration, but maybe not. I gave up my season tickets for a variety of reasons and also find it hard to believe as many people will spend money on a team that frequently loses, even if enjoying watching the rebuild. My tickets for the 15th row by the tunnel were > $200 a game.

[The Truth #6]

Sounds like getting tix from Stubhub is going to be the way to go. And hopefully the ushers let people sneak down but I doubt it.

[rjv]

i like a lot about tre. it'd be great if his three point shooting % shows improvement this season (as well as his volume of three point attempts).

[spurs10]

Sounds like getting tix from Stubhub is going to be the way to go. And hopefully the ushers let people sneak down but I doubt it. Yeah coming down from the balcony to floor seats ain't easy....but sometimes you can go to the ticket desk inside and ask for an upgrade...if they are nice and there are a lot of empty seats they might go for it. I've been upgraded several times.

[TD 21]

I really hope Vassell has a huge breakout year. Otherwise passing on Haliburton will officially become a major drafting error by the Spurs.

It was the second it happened. Haliburton's preference was irrelevant and the only logical explanation was that, give how they operate, Murray and White weren't going anywhere for a while. That not being the case, there's no excuse especially considering he's clearly Spurs material.



The jury on if drafting Vassell over Haliburton isn’t all on Vassell. That’s on Haliburton, too. For all we know, he tapers off and everybody forgets about him just like with what happened with Brogdon.

No, it isn't and Haliburton, 2 seasons in, is still almost 2 years younger than Brogdon's drafted age yet is already superior offensively.

Brogdon hasn't tapered off. The reason why he fetched relatively little is because his extensive injury history made his contract undesirable.

[BackHome]

I think Vassell is going to make a jump he is never going to be the first or second go to guy but I think he can be a very good third option for a good team.

[heyheymymy]

Haliburton had his preferences but you also had perceptions to consider if you're SA.

Maybe Murray was the type of personality to get rubbed the wrong way by the implications of SA picking Haliburton and even if Haliburton was cool with it there's maybe even more at play to consider. This isn't digital OVRs on 2k real kids have chemistry issues.

[tbdog]

I think Vassell is going to make a jump he is never going to be the first or second go to guy but I think he can be a very good third option for a good team.

I still think that vassell could be a Paul George from the pacers days. He'll be our best player next season.

[Dejounte]

Just because Vassell is skinny and lanky-looking doesn’t mean he’s Paul George. They barely have anything in common. Paul was smooth with the ball a la T-Mac. Like a 6’8” guard. Vassell doesn’t have those skills and looks infinitely more comfortable taking as little dribbles as possible and getting many assisted shots.

[KingKev]

I still think that vassell could be a Paul George from the pacers days. He'll be our best player next season.

This is a redic comparison.

[slick'81]

This is a redic comparison.


its what he does. Vassell could very well be our best player and that says alot about the st of our team

[KingKev]

its what he does. Vassell could very well be our best player and that says alot about the st of our team

It’s our sad reality. Nothing wrong with Vassell but I firmly believe he is on a similar path of that of Keldon and D White and just don’t see him becoming anything more than a high end role player for another team.

[TD 21]

Haliburton had his preferences but you also had perceptions to consider if you're SA.

Maybe Murray was the type of personality to get rubbed the wrong way by the implications of SA picking Haliburton and even if Haliburton was cool with it there's maybe even more at play to consider. This isn't digital OVRs on 2k real kids have chemistry issues.

Current Murray isn't good enough to pass up superior talent for, let alone '20 Murray. It's also not like they couldn't have played some together.

[buttsR4rebounding]

Current Murray isn't good enough to pass up superior talent for, let alone '20 Murray. It's also not like they couldn't have played some together.

Exactly. The best player available.

[tbdog]

It’s our sad reality. Nothing wrong with Vassell but I firmly believe he is on a similar path of that of Keldon and D White and just don’t see him becoming anything more than a high end role player for another team.

Keldron took us from suprised and I am not sure how he will ever go in a playoff series. I think Vassell will be a dependable playoff starter.

[John B]

Most of us haven't seen a bad spurs team. It's going to be hard to cheer for hit young players to do well but also want to see loses. It's going to be this weird balance.

It would be like 1987-88 with Willie Anderson, Alvin Robertson, Cadillac. The only difference is Spurs fans knew it wasn’t for long and an athletic-freakish Center is just finishing his tour and soon will play. This time is still a lot of uncertainties which top draft Spurs get next season. And back then, Spurs fans were not the spoiled fans right now who not so long ago watched the Spurs dominate for 2 decades, or 3 decades minus one season of injury. Spurs fans still remember an all-time best 40-1 record at home tied only with the Celtics, just a few seasons back, but now even Thunder and lowly Kings get their way at our home court. Yup it’s goingbto be a long 2-3 years before Spurs fans could start crawling up from their cave.

[rankingtear]

Current Murray isn't good enough to pass up superior talent for, let alone '20 Murray. It's also not like they couldn't have played some together.

Is he better than Vassell if you consider positions? Hali is a weird player he does not affect wins as much as you think. That was the main red flag in college when his team won more when he got injured. He is a secondary with bad defense i don't get the hype.

[Dejounte]

The only reason Keldon took anyone by surprise is because most folks foolishly think players don’t develop after 1 or 2 years and they trust their own player evals fueled by their bias against the team.

[TimDunkem]

TBH, when all is said and done, Vassell AND Haliburton will probably be looked at as nothing more than run-of-the-mill role players.

[exstatic]

Current Murray isn't good enough to pass up superior talent for, let alone '20 Murray. It's also not like they couldn't have played some together.

I’m not sure how much more clearly this could be stated:

He
Didn’t
Want
To
Be
Here

This was barely two years after a player forced his way out of SA, ripping the team off for $19M in the process and costing us any decent immediate return, because he wanted to be somewhere else. There’s no way we’re drafting a player at that point who wants to be somewhere else.

[Chinook]

Writing
Like
This
Does
Not
Make
Your
Point
Better

Also, who cares what Haliburton wanted? Not Sacramento. It's one thing if a player has a blood feud with an individual team. But thinking a late-lotto pick can choose his destination (even leaving out that that's apparently Sacramento) is lunacy. We don't even know if he would've hated being in SA anyway. We have good reasons as to why SA didn't pick up already without having to invent more.

[exstatic]

Writing
Like
This
Does
Not
Make
Your
Point
Better

Also, who cares what Haliburton wanted? Not Sacramento. It's one thing if a player has a blood feud with an individual team. But thinking a late-lotto pick can choose his destination (even leaving out that that's apparently Sacramento) is lunacy. We don't even know if he would've hated being in SA anyway. We have good reasons as to why SA didn't pick up already without having to invent more.

Kobe Bryant. 1996. Late lottery pick. Chose where he wanted to go, out of HS.

[Leetonidas]

Steph Curry wanted to go to NY but got drafted by GS. Where a rookie wants to go, unless he is a top 1-2 pick, is largely irrelevant imo

[TD 21]

Kobe Bryant. 1996. Late lottery pick. Chose where he wanted to go, out of HS.

1. His supposed preference being the Kings didn't mean he was opposed to being a Spur, but even if that were the case, who cares?

2. Bryant didn't choose anything. His agent bluffed the Nets and was fortunate the Hornets were trying to win now. Neither had to capitulate to his wishes.

3. Even if it came to that, the Kings and Mavericks, at the very least, supposedly wanted him badly so you still pick the superior asset and if they wanted Vassell so badly, slide down a spot to do so.



Is he better than Vassell if you consider positions? Hali is a weird player he does not affect wins as much as you think. That was the main red flag in college when his team won more when he got injured. He is a secondary with bad defense i don't get the hype.

Better/more versatile shooter, significantly better creator/play maker and though a worse defender, at least he's not a small guard and it's not like Vassell has been all league himself.

The most likely ceilings here are probably complementary/fringe star for the former and high end/elite role player for the latter.

[Ariel]

Kobe Bryant. 1996. Late lottery pick. Chose where he wanted to go, out of HS.
Curry made sure everyone knew he wanted to go to NY @ 8, and Golden State took him @ 7. Worked out fine for them. Point being, most of the time if you're convinced the player in question is a much better talent, you take him and hope for the best. And if not, trade him later on for a higher price.

[The Truth #6]

He went from Sacramento to Indiana. But San Antonio is a problem? Not sure why they didn’t draft him, but I look back at those years with confusion. It seems like the focus was getting Pop the record, but even that doesn’t explain everything. I think they just liked Vassel more, for whatever reason.

[slick'81]

He went from Sacramento to Indiana. But San Antonio is a problem? Not sure why they didn’t draft him, but I look back at those years with confusion. It seems like the focus was getting Pop the record, but even that doesn’t explain everything. I think they just liked Vassel more, for whatever reason.

this notion halliburtion said no to sa seems silly. Sounds like spur fan making excuses for not drafting him

[JuneJive]

Kobe Bryant. 1996. Late lottery pick. Chose where he wanted to go, out of HS.

Arn Tellem arranged a tryout in front of Jerry West.
Kobe hadn't even considered the Lakers as they had the 24th pick.

West stopped the 2nd workout after about twenty minutes and said he'd take him.

After that Tellem / West orchestrated a tale in which Kobe wouldn't agree to play with the Nets, saying he would go to Italy. Also, they had to look not interested in Kobe to outside eyes.

Nets reluctantly picked Kittles. The deal with the Hornets was set as they, HC Cowens said that they don't pick high school kids. They wanted immediate help.

[rankingtear]

this notion halliburtion said no to sa seems silly. Sounds like spur fan making excuses for not drafting him

He said no to CLE ( agent told them not to draft him and did not give them his medicals ) with 2 young guards in the roster, it is not that silly.

[rankingtear]

^ Nvm he is fine being drafted by SA

Let’s go backwards a bit. I’ve been really fascinated by all the different machinations that led to you landing in Sacramento. You’re one of the bigger draft surprises in the past few years in terms of being a guy who was widely seen as a top five talent, and then next thing you know the Kings are ecstatic to be getting you at No. 12. On that day, where did you think you might land on the high end? Where were the surprises, if any, for you? What’s the real story on your side about how you got to Sac (https://theathletic.com/team/sac-kings/)?


You know, I think there were a lot of emotions going into the day. A lot of ideas. A lot of questions. On draft day, specifically, I thought I could go as high as (No.) 2 to Golden State. The realistic spots I was thinking were Golden State at 2, Chicago at 4, maybe Atlanta at 6, Detroit at 7, San Antonio at 11 and Sacramento at 12. This, of course, was without any trades happening. But I knew the floor was Sacramento. That was the discussion I had with my agent (Aaron Mintz of CAA). He was like, ‘Sacramento is going to pick you at 12 if you’re there.’ So that day — and I’m going to be honest with you — I keep my expectations low in basically everything I do so I don’t end up ever disappointing myself. I was like, ‘Alright I’m probably going to wind up going 12. I doubt they’re going to pick me at 2. I doubt I’m going to get picked at 4 — whatever, whatever.’ So that night comes around, and the picks keep happening. And I wasn’t surprised by any. To be honest, for a second I thought I was going to Washington (at No. 9). They were like, ‘Alright, you’re going to go to Washington.’ And I was like, ‘Oh, ok. I haven’t even met with them, but that works.’


From what I heard, they (the Wizards (https://theathletic.com/team/wizards/)) thought Deni (Avdija, who they ultimately picked) was going to the Knicks (https://theathletic.com/team/knicks/) (at No. 8), but when they went with Obi (Toppin) that meant it would be Deni because he was higher on their board than you. But it sounds like you might have been next on their board.


Yeah, so I thought for a second I was going to go nine. Then shortly thereafter I thought that they were like, ‘Nah, you’re not going nine.’ Now I’m like, ‘Alright, I’m either going 11 or 12.’ But me and Dev (Devin Vassell (https://theathletic.com/player/nba/spurs/devin-vassell/), who the Spurs (https://theathletic.com/team/spurs/) picked at No. 11) have a good relationship, and I knew that San Antonio was really high on Dev. So I didn’t foresee them drafting another guard, so I was like, ‘They’re probably just going to pick Dev,’ and then Sac is going to pick me at 12. I had heard some trade rumors about Sac’s pick at 12, so now I’m like, ‘Well, is Sac going to pick me at 12, or are they going to trade it? What are they going to do?’ But I had one conversation with Sacramento leading up to the draft, and that was a couple days before the draft. And they were like, ‘Man, we absolutely love you.’ So I was like, ‘I’d really be surprised if Sacramento traded out this pick.’ …Then I got scooped up at 12, so it kind of worked itself out there.

[Mnky]

Think Vassell has plenty of potential as a volume scorer. He was one being held back quite a bit by opportunity. I do believe him and Murray's leadership kind of didn't flow together particularly optimal.

I think Vassell will have plenty to show with more experience with the ball in his hand and noone to keep it from him when he gets hot. The kid always had the team slow him down when he would get hot in a game. That's on the PG as much as anyone not recognizing this.

Sean Elliot pointed it out on multiple broadcasts. He would get going and the team wouldn't bring the ball back to him. The Paul George comparisons are valid. Vassell attacks like George and has a jumpshot that's very difficult to alter. I think Vassell has the ability to develop into more of a Curry, Allen, Durant type shooter. Not hall of fame here, clearly, but the mindset of off the ball offense and the drives they create with defenders closing.

[exstatic]

Think Vassell has plenty of potential as a volume scorer. He was one being held back quite a bit by opportunity. I do believe him and Murray's leadership kind of didn't flow together particularly optimal.

I think Vassell will have plenty to show with more experience with the ball in his hand and noone to keep it from him when he gets hot. The kid always had the team slow him down when he would get hot in a game. That's on the PG as much as anyone not recognizing this.

Sean Elliot pointed it out on multiple broadcasts. He would get going and the team wouldn't bring the ball back to him. The Paul George comparisons are valid. Vassell attacks like George and has a jumpshot that's very difficult to alter. I think Vassell has the ability to develop into more of a Curry, Allen, Durant type shooter. Not hall of fame here, clearly, but the mindset of off the ball offense and the drives they create with defenders closing.

We lost one of the Dallas games by 1 point, because he was red hot, but DJ never went back to him on his next rotation. Froze him out.

[The Truth #6]

I suppose I’m ok with DJ calling his number last year if that allowed his trade value to get inflated. Next year is when I hope we get to see Keldon and Vassel take more of a role. For various reasons I hope Jones gets a chance to see court time and make the opportunities more balanced.

[rjv]

Think Vassell has plenty of potential as a volume scorer. He was one being held back quite a bit by opportunity. I do believe him and Murray's leadership kind of didn't flow together particularly optimal.

I think Vassell will have plenty to show with more experience with the ball in his hand and noone to keep it from him when he gets hot. The kid always had the team slow him down when he would get hot in a game. That's on the PG as much as anyone not recognizing this.

Sean Elliot pointed it out on multiple broadcasts. He would get going and the team wouldn't bring the ball back to him. The Paul George comparisons are valid. Vassell attacks like George and has a jumpshot that's very difficult to alter. I think Vassell has the ability to develop into more of a Curry, Allen, Durant type shooter. Not hall of fame here, clearly, but the mindset of off the ball offense and the drives they create with defenders closing.

it's always interesting to listen to sean on a broadcast because you can feel his angst while he's commenting on the game. but since he has to reign in his emotions somewhat, you can only get a fraction of what he wants to say. it's like you can hear him thinking "get the fucking ball to devin you dipshits!"

[Mnky]

it's always interesting to listen to sean on a broadcast because you can feel his angst while he's commenting on the game. but since he has to reign in his emotions somewhat, you can only get a fraction of what he wants to say. it's like you can hear him thinking "get the fucking ball to devin you dipshits!"

:lol poetically said.

[KingKev]

Weiskamp got married this past weekend. His chick is nice. Interesting how that 1.5mm hasn’t been signed. Can’t see him getting more elsewhere.

[Mnky]

We lost one of the Dallas games by 1 point, because he was red hot, but DJ never went back to him on his next rotation. Froze him out.

Yea I saw DJ do that a few times last year. They stood out. I started learning towards him being traded at that point. Felt as much as he improved, he was holding teammates back. He's a great player, think his situation in Atlanta is much better where he can comfortably be a second or third option.

[slick'81]

It's obvious spurs loved devin. His shooting & defensive potential was too much to pass up

[rascal]

Think Vassell has plenty of potential as a volume scorer. He was one being held back quite a bit by opportunity. I do believe him and Murray's leadership kind of didn't flow together particularly optimal.

I think Vassell will have plenty to show with more experience with the ball in his hand and noone to keep it from him when he gets hot. The kid always had the team slow him down when he would get hot in a game. That's on the PG as much as anyone not recognizing this.

Sean Elliot pointed it out on multiple broadcasts. He would get going and the team wouldn't bring the ball back to him. The Paul George comparisons are valid. Vassell attacks like George and has a jumpshot that's very difficult to alter. I think Vassell has the ability to develop into more of a Curry, Allen, Durant type shooter. Not hall of fame here, clearly, but the mindset of off the ball offense and the drives they create with defenders closing.

Vassell isn't explosive to the rim enough or shoots lights out to be a high volume scorer. What you see now is what you'll be getting from him moving forward.

[exstatic]

Vassell isn't explosive to the rim enough or shoots lights out to be a high volume scorer. What you see now is what you'll be getting from him moving forward.

I’ll bet you thought that about Keldon last summer.

[Mr. Body]

Vassell isn't explosive to the rim enough or shoots lights out to be a high volume scorer. What you see now is what you'll be getting from him moving forward.

I have this vision of you getting on the city bus mumbling, "This bus, it's not explosive enough. That bus driver, not explosive enough. Can't get to the rim." You sit down in the back seats next to a puddle of vomit. "That old lady isn't explosive enough to get to the rim. She's what you see now."

[rjv]

I have this vision of you getting on the city bus mumbling, "This bus, it's not explosive enough. That bus driver, not explosive enough. Can't get to the rim." You sit down in the back seats next to a puddle of vomit. "That old lady isn't explosive enough to get to the rim. She's what you see now."

:rollin

[Dverde]

I more got the feeling that Vassell was a safe pick in what was seen as a bad draft. Spurs knew Vassell was going to be a serviceable player with a low downside. Next year was the opposite and made a huge swing taking Primo hoping they can make him great.

[Mnky]

I have this vision of you getting on the city bus mumbling, "This bus, it's not explosive enough. That bus driver, not explosive enough. Can't get to the rim." You sit down in the back seats next to a puddle of vomit. "That old lady isn't explosive enough to get to the rim. She's what you see now."

:lol

Devin did shoot over 40% 3P the last 20 games. I'm excited to see him get a primary role on the offense. See what he can do with primary defenders hounding him. This team will be fun to watch even with the tank mode going.

[rjv]

:lol

Devin did shoot over 40% 3P the last 20 games. I'm excited to see him get a primary role on the offense. See what he can do with primary defenders hounding him. This team will be fun to watch even with the tank mode going.

i've prepped myself to take on a certain mind set for this season. i hope to see a competitive team, younger players develop and signs from some of our younger players, such as devin, taking that leap to the next level. it'll be ugly sometimes and there will be some painful losses but if it get the spurs in the bottom three or four by the end of the season, i'll be good with it.

[The Truth #6]

Random tangent: how ridiculous is it that the Ringer NBA writers keep mentioning the Thunder in their daily musings as if they are a prestige organization that we need to follow closely? JFC. Durant is gone. They suck like us.

Anyway. As you were.

[exstatic]

i've prepped myself to take on a certain mind set for this season. i hope to see a competitive team, younger players develop and signs from some of our younger players, such as devin, taking that leap to the next level. it'll be ugly sometimes and there will be some painful losses but if it get the spurs in the bottom three or four by the end of the season, i'll be good with it.

I want more ball movement. It seemed like we went from ISO DeMar directly to ISO Dejounte.

[exstatic]

Random tangent: how ridiculous is it that the Ringer NBA writers keep mentioning the Thunder in their daily musings as if they are a prestige organization that we need to follow closely? JFC. Durant is gone. They suck like us.

Anyway. As you were.

I think they actually had a terrible offseason. They burned 5 FRPs for 3 players. You only do that if you’re trading into the top 2-3 slots, not fucking #11. Their best acquisition was probably Chip Englland.

[The Truth #6]

Seriously. Didn’t they trade three picks (?) for Dieng? I don’t follow them closely but that seems like horrible utilization of resources.

[rjv]

I want more ball movement. It seemed like we went from ISO DeMar directly to ISO Dejounte.

and i'm hoping that this was one of the reasons for moving on from DJ because i'm right there with you. i'm sick of ISO ball. if the spurs can't get too many wins, at least show me that they're moving towards a far more aesthetic brand of basketball.

[Mr. Body]

Random tangent: how ridiculous is it that the Ringer NBA writers keep mentioning the Thunder in their daily musings as if they are a prestige organization that we need to follow closely? JFC. Durant is gone. They suck like us.

Anyway. As you were.

For some reason I missed how popular the Thunder are because of the Durant/Westbrook/Harden era. Lots of kids falling in love with them, including many in this rookie class. Imagine a shit city like OKC becoming popular like that, but it happened.

So I think the Thunder are like the Raptors, Celtics, etc. Maybe a tier down. But they have a rabid fanbase that overrates what they have constantly. Drafting those big three more than a decade ago were masterstrokes (if some of them were obvious). Drafting Giddey and Holmgren were good. Not on the same level at all. SGA can win some games but isn't a world-killer. I broke down in a post a while back how legitimately awful Presti has been drafting for years otherwise. Just pretty spectacularly bad.

[The Truth #6]

Yeah, I hear you. I think the ringer continued their love affair when Westbrook was there by himself putting up ridiculous numbers, and he of course is a polarizing figure which I suppose media types love to talk about and debate among themselves, which all of us have to bear. And Presti trades a lot so he’s good for content. But still…

In reality they’re more of a copycat of the spurs andcSan Antonio. Not just stealing chip, but the city erecting their own Riverwalk etc. About 15 years ago I had to go to OKC for business and it was one of the most depressing cities I’ve ever seen.

[KobesAchilles]

I think they actually had a terrible offseason. They burned 5 FRPs for 3 players. You only do that if you’re trading into the top 2-3 slots, not fucking #11. Their best acquisition was probably Chip Englland.
Don’t they have like 17 more picks or something ridiculous like that? I actually like their roster. They just need a 3D player for them to be taken seriously as a playoff team. Maybe they get that next year?

[exstatic]

Don’t they have like 17 more picks or something ridiculous like that? I actually like their roster. They just need a 3D player for them to be taken seriously as a playoff team. Maybe they get that next year?

Not anymore. Nine, and a swap. They’re also out of cap-room to rent, with SGA now getting paid.

We have four, two completely unprotected, two swaps, plus whatever we pull for cap room in the next couple of summers, Jak and JRich.

[Chinook]

The Thunder traded three poor firsts for a player they wanted. It was an easily justifiable move. Dieng might bust, but there's no issue with the price, just as there was none for Houston trading for Sengun.

[RC_Drunkford]

I want more ball movement. It seemed like we went from ISO DeMar directly to ISO Dejounte.

where did DJ get isos? Spurs were 2nd in assists, how much more ball movement do you want :lol

[slick'81]

where did DJ get isos? Spurs were 2nd in assists, how much more ball movement do you want :lol

spur fans are going to be disappointed this season expecting this team to get better because dejounte Murray was holding them back

[KobesAchilles]

Not anymore. Nine, and a swap. They’re also out of cap-room to rent, with SGA now getting paid.

We have four, two completely unprotected, two swaps, plus whatever we pull for cap room in the next couple of summers, Jak and JRich.
9 is still a shit ton of picks. And SGA, Giddy, and Chet is a pretty good nucleus to build around

[exstatic]

9 is still a shit ton of picks. And SGA, Giddy, and Chet is a pretty good nucleus to build around

I think their problem is that I don’t see any of them being a franchise guy, and they’re burning through picks without a good way to refresh the stash. SGA just went from $5.4M to $29.7M. That’s cap space they can no longer rent to get picks. By next year, we could well may pass them on # of FRPs.

[BackHome]

Yeah OK can only tank so long and getting all those picks you eventually need to start paying those players. I keep seeing them and Houston with the first pick in 2023 but I just don’t see that as both teams just have to much talent and players playing for new contracts to be that bad

[slick'81]

Yeah OK can only tank so long and getting all those picks you eventually need to start paying those players. I keep seeing them and Houston with the first pick in 2023 but I just don’t see that as both teams just have to much talent and players playing for new contracts to be that bad

Spurs definitely should be in that conversation

[Mnky]

i've prepped myself to take on a certain mind set for this season. i hope to see a competitive team, younger players develop and signs from some of our younger players, such as devin, taking that leap to the next level. it'll be ugly sometimes and there will be some painful losses but if it get the spurs in the bottom three or four by the end of the season, i'll be good with it.

Feel like this will be the first year the spurs aren't forcing a ball to someone and the team can play like a team. It'll be good for all of their development. Tre Jones is built for this type of team, so he should be a good tank commander.

[slick'81]

Feel like this will be the first year the spurs aren't forcing a ball to someone and the team can play like a team. It'll be good for all of their development. Tre Jones is built for this type of team, so he should be a good tank commander.


nope, you want primo as the main pg to assure those losses

[Mr. Body]

9 is still a shit ton of picks. And SGA, Giddy, and Chet is a pretty good nucleus to build around

They're good players, but I don't know if any of them is a franchise guy. Giddey is a terrible shooter and needs shooters around him. The first might be fixed, but Presti hasn't put any shooters around him to find.

Holmgren could improve their defense dramatically, but needs some beef to play alongside, and instead they went to get Dieng.

Their 3&D guy is supposedly Dort, who the fanbase is huge on, but his advanced numbers are really awful.

SGA is a great player... every few games.

I just don't get the roster. It's kind of a mess.

[rascal]

The Thunder traded three poor firsts for a player they wanted. It was an easily justifiable move. Dieng might bust, but there's no issue with the price, just as there was none for Houston trading for Sengun.

The Thunder have assembled a nice team and are ahead of the spurs in development.

[slick'81]

The Thunder have assembled a nice team and are ahead of the spurs in development.

they will eventually turn that corner. Presti is building a nice young core regardless of what spur fan thinks

[The Truth #6]

I suppose the Spurs still have Pop and his gravity, which helps in getting players to follow a system, though not sure what iteration we’ll see next year. But other than that, we are definitely lacking players with big star potential. After fucking around for four years or so now after Kawhi, they have to get a big talent. And signs indicate they will be in the running. But those last few months of a season is what gives me pause. I just don’t see Pop not putting out his best players, and the egregious tanking will likely be more “competitive”.

It’s going to be a weird season.

[Mr. Body]

they will eventually turn that corner. Presti is building a nice young core regardless of what spur fan thinks

They might win as many as 30 games this year.

[slick'81]

They might win as many as 30 games this year.

definitely more then our spurs

[KingKev]

I’m very interested to see if LBJ extends at full max. Will be like watching a 3 year long train wreck that I’m very happy to root for.


Does that make the 2027 unprotected more valuable? Less time they have to rebuild the better no?

[exstatic]

definitely more then our spurs

Spurs last 3 seasons: 32,33,34 wins. Two of those seasons were shortened.

[KobesAchilles]

They're good players, but I don't know if any of them is a franchise guy. Giddey is a terrible shooter and needs shooters around him. The first might be fixed, but Presti hasn't put any shooters around him to find.

Holmgren could improve their defense dramatically, but needs some beef to play alongside, and instead they went to get Dieng.

Their 3&D guy is supposedly Dort, who the fanbase is huge on, but his advanced numbers are really awful.

SGA is a great player... every few games.

I just don't get the roster. It's kind of a mess.
Isn’t Chet a good shooter tho? He isn’t a franchise guy but he really does look like he could be a great player. If he stays healthy. I like his game as a rim protector and a shooter.

I also like Giddy. He’s got a great feel for the game and just knows how to play. He has weaknesses like you say but if he does learn how to shoot (cough cough Chip hiring cough cough) then he will be a very good player. SGA I feel like is going to be traded this year to the Lakers for Westbrook and 2 picks

[exstatic]

Isn’t Chet a good shooter tho? He isn’t a franchise guy but he really does look like he could be a great player. If he stays healthy. I like his game as a rim protector and a shooter.

I also like Giddy. He’s got a great feel for the game and just knows how to play. He has weaknesses like you say but if he does learn how to shoot (cough cough Chip hiring cough cough) then he will be a very good player. SGA I feel like is going to be traded this year to the Lakers for Westbrook and 2 picks

That would be an incredibly dumb trade for OKC. Two FRPs, even unprotected, aren’t enough for SGA, let alone eating Westbrook’s $47M.

DJ’s deal set the bar: 2 unprotected FRPs, another FRP, and an unprotected swap. And that’s JUST for a promising young player, cap rental not included.

[slick'81]

That would be an incredibly dumb trade for OKC. Two FRPs, even unprotected, aren’t enough for SGA, let alone eating Westbrook’s $47M.

DJ’s deal set the bar: 2 unprotected FRPs, another FRP, and an unprotected swap. And that’s JUST for a promising young player, cap rental not included.


hornets haven't made the playoffs in 6 seasons. Hopefully spurs get that pick

[KingKev]

hornets haven't made the playoffs in 6 seasons. Hopefully spurs get that pick

Still pretty useless. Hopefully they move it for a future, far out pick with less protection.

[exstatic]

hornets haven't made the playoffs in 6 seasons. Hopefully spurs get that pick

People were freaking out about the Toronto pick only having 2 years as a first, and we got it in year one. Charlotte’s current coach, Steve Clifford, has eight years experience, 4 in Charlotte previously, and 4 in Orlando. He took each team to the playoffs twice.

We have 3 years to get the pick as a first rounder. Charlotte cannot afford to miss the playoffs the next 3 years, or they’re going to have LaMelo problems. Big problems.

[exstatic]

Still pretty useless. Hopefully they move it for a future, far out pick with less protection.

No first round pick is useless to a rebuilding team. It’s probably going to be a pick between 17-20 this year if it conveys, or 15-20 the next two years. If nothing else, you get a rotation player at a cheap 4 year controlled price.

[KingKev]

No first round pick is useless to a rebuilding team. It’s probably going to be a pick between 17-20 this year if it conveys, or 15-20 the next two years. If nothing else, you get a rotation player at a cheap 4 year controlled price.

They don’t become rotational players till year 2-3. Only going to take longer with the logjam of young guys of similar talent.

[exstatic]

They don’t become rotational players till year 2-3. Only going to take longer with the logjam of young guys of similar talent.

Rotation, year 2, breakout, year 3. There’s always a chance of a whiff, but you don’t quit accumulating picks because of a few misses.

That logjam is also much smaller with our 2016, 2017, and 2018 picks no longer on the roster.

I also think we’ll trade one of our 2022 selections either next summer, or summer 2024. Even with friendly extensions like we usually get, we can’t afford 3 at one time.

[Seventyniner]

Rotation, year 2, breakout, year 3. There’s always a chance of a whiff, but you don’t quit accumulating picks because of a few misses.

That logjam is also much smaller with our 2016, 2017, and 2018 picks no longer on the roster.

I also think we’ll trade one of our 2022 selections either next summer, or summer 2024. Even with friendly extensions like we usually get, we can’t afford 3 at one time.

It's also possible that one or more of the 2022 picks just doesn't pan out and is let go like Walker or Samanic. Far too early to tell, of course, but going 3/3 on picks being worth an extension is less likely than 2/3 imo.

[offset formation]

Yeah OK can only tank so long and getting all those picks you eventually need to start paying those players. I keep seeing them and Houston with the first pick in 2023 but I just don’t see that as both teams just have to much talent and players playing for new contracts to be that bad

Very doubtful OKC finishes below us outside of injuries. I think it's possible Houston does, but with Jabari on the team moving forward, it's unlikely. He plays defense very well and is a good perimeter scorer, which is what they needed to start becoming a good team.

[Mr. Body]

Isn’t Chet a good shooter tho? He isn’t a franchise guy but he really does look like he could be a great player. If he stays healthy. I like his game as a rim protector and a shooter.

I also like Giddy. He’s got a great feel for the game and just knows how to play. He has weaknesses like you say but if he does learn how to shoot (cough cough Chip hiring cough cough) then he will be a very good player. SGA I feel like is going to be traded this year to the Lakers for Westbrook and 2 picks

I like both Holmgren and Giddey. I just don't see them as franchise players and like I said, I think they need the proper players around them to be activated fully. Could be wrong, but I don't see these as Durant/Westbrook kinds of picks.

[Atl Spur]

I like both Holmgren and Giddey. I just don't see them as franchise players and like I said, I think they need the proper players around them to be activated fully. Could be wrong, but I don't see these as Durant/Westbrook kinds of picks.

Hard to tell…..no one saw harden & Westbrook in that light initially either.

[K...]

1556709715266134016

If the nets offered to trade nash and marks for pop and wright would you call that a fair trade?

[Atl Spur]

1556709715266134016

If the nets offered to trade nash and marks for pop and wright would you call that a fair trade?

Don’t be that guy……

[cd98]

Shams said it so it must be true... If true, man, no way they can have KD on that roster day one of camp. But to throw HOF Nash under the bus like that, I hope KD has to play under Nash for at least a few months.

[timtonymanu]

Durbeta, Harden, Kyrie, Nephew. This generation can fuck off already.

[Mr. Body]

Hard to tell…..no one saw harden & Westbrook in that light initially either.

Sure they did.

[Degoat]

Wow pretty crazy, they hired Nash because that was KDs guy while he was in GSW.

[exstatic]

It's going to be funny when none of these guys coaches or FO personnel will attend, or in the case of HOFers, induct them into the HOF.

[Atl Spur]

Sure they did.

You’re joking….right? Initially is the key word big dog!

[wildbill2u]

The NBA is now a league where super stars dictate what teams they will play for, who teams will add to the roster, and what coaches they will play for. Kinda weird, but that is the power of a superstar today. And once they realize they have the power, they will use it.

The question is always whether they use the power for themselves or for the team.

[Leetonidas]

Tsai will not bend the knee imho...Durbeta will be traded within in the next few weeks. Hopefully to Boston since he's made it known he doesnt want to play there :lol

[Mr. Body]

You’re joking….right? Initially is the key word big dog!

Harden yes, Westbrook yeah. Had their detractors, but they were drafted extremely high for a reason. Neither Giddey nor Hlolmgren have franchise potential unless they really change. They're both high end complementary players.

[Mr. Body]

Looking back, 2008:

Westbrook was picked #4. Only Derrick Rose deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between were Michael Beasley and OJ Mayo, both pretty bad picks even at the time.

Looking back, 2009:

Harden was picked #3. Only Blake Griffin (possibly) deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between was Hasheem Thabeet, an absurdly stupid pick at the time.

Where's the 30 for 30 or miniseries for how Seattle/OKC tanked so hard to get Durant, Westbrook, Harden in three years in a row and Presti fucked things up so bad he couldn't get a championship out of them? It is mindblowing what a massive failure that is.

[exstatic]

Looking back, 2008:

Westbrook was picked #4. Only Derrick Rose deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between were Michael Beasley and OJ Mayo, both pretty bad picks even at the time.

Looking back, 2009:

Harden was picked #3. Only Blake Griffin (possibly) deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between was Hasheem Thabeet, an absurdly stupid pick at the time.

Where's the 30 for 30 or miniseries for how Seattle/OKC tanked so hard to get Durant, Westbrook, Harden in three years in a row and Presti fucked things up so bad he couldn't get a championship out of them? It is mindblowing what a massive failure that is.

Presti was just a good soldier. It was their ownership that fucked things up. They held the line on Harden, not wanting to pay the luxury tax. The annual salary difference between the sides was $2M. Over that, they traded Harden for trash.

[spurraider21]

Presti was just a good soldier. It was their ownership that fucked things up. They held the line on Harden, not wanting to pay the luxury tax. The annual salary difference between the sides was $2M. Over that, they traded Harden for trash.
still falls on presti. same guy gave Perkins 5/40 before they were unable to come to terms with harden. same goes for giving ibaka 4/48. ibaka deal was fine, but lmao at paying perkins 8 mil per year then not being able to come to terms with harden over 2 mil.

if the owner had set a particular budget including tax, its on presti to prioritize harden over fucking perkins

[Dex]

1556709715266134016

1556791235427405824

Tsai basically just told Durant to fuck off

[Dex]

Durant and Irving were the ones who wanted Nash...they basically said "we don't need a coach"

I have a feeling Durant doesn't like Marks because he stood up against Kyrie's anti-vax bullshit

[Mr. Body]

Presti was just a good soldier. It was their ownership that fucked things up. They held the line on Harden, not wanting to pay the luxury tax. The annual salary difference between the sides was $2M. Over that, they traded Harden for trash.

The Harden trade was forced by ownership, yeah. But Presti was awful putting together support for his players. Other than Adams and Ibaka, his draft picks were straight toilet water and he wasn't great at picking up vets or side players to help. They only made the Finals once. One time.

[Atl Spur]

Looking back, 2008:

Westbrook was picked #4. Only Derrick Rose deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between were Michael Beasley and OJ Mayo, both pretty bad picks even at the time.

Looking back, 2009:

Harden was picked #3. Only Blake Griffin (possibly) deserved to go higher, at #1, and in between was Hasheem Thabeet, an absurdly stupid pick at the time.

Where's the 30 for 30 or miniseries for how Seattle/OKC tanked so hard to get Durant, Westbrook, Harden in three years in a row and Presti fucked things up so bad he couldn't get a championship out of them? It is mindblowing what a massive failure that is.

Holmgren was drafted #2 and Giddy #6….. I suspect the org has the same expectations as they did for Westbrook & Harden ( be productive players and maybe catch lightning in a bottle again!). The draft as we all know is a crapshoot, best player in 2009 draft was taken #7 go figure!

[Mr. Body]

Holmgren was drafted #2 and Giddy #6….. I suspect the org has the same expectations as they did for Westbrook & Harden ( be productive players and maybe catch lightning in a bottle again!). The draft as we all know is a crapshoot, best player in 2009 draft was taken #7 go figure!

Holmgren and Giddey simply are not those types of players. They are both complementary. I can't imagine MVP level production from either of them as they got from the previous three.

[BG_Spurs_Fan]

Joe Tsai going scorched earth. He can afford it.

You love to see it.

[jjspur]

For once I'm glad someone sided with the coaches and GM. Durant is a very good player but he did sign a contract and he is not that young any more. His days of acting like a diva and bluffing ownership are almost over. Right now ownership is looking good and Durant is looking like a spoiled child throwing a loud tantrum . He may get his trade eventually, but this stain on his reputation may not go away easily or at all. He just shot himself in the foot and it doesn't look good.

[Dex]

For once I'm glad someone sided with the coaches and GM. Durant is a very good player but he did sign a contract and he is not that young any more. His days of acting like a diva and bluffing ownership are almost over. Right now ownership is looking good and Durant is looking like a spoiled child throwing a loud tantrum . He may get his trade eventually, but this stain on his reputation may not go away easily or at all. He just shot himself in the foot and it doesn't look good.

Tsai basically gave them the keys for a couple years, and they drove the car into a ditch. Now they're asking for an upgrade and Tsai doesn't seem to want to hear it.

We'll see if he sticks to his word. We've seen people make these kind of statements before and then cave...I wouldn't be surprised if Nash gets moved, but firing Marks would be a mistake.

[Leetonidas]

Spurs officially announced signing of Dieng. Wonder what took so long to make it official

[Seventyniner]

Spurs officially announced signing of Dieng. Wonder what took so long to make it official

I believe Dieng agreed to a minimum contract, meaning the Spurs could potentially use up all their cap space first and then sign him. Signing him now takes his salary away from cap space (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone who knows more).

That means the Spurs most likely won't use all their cap space this summer, and would also explain why they waited so long to sign Dieng.

[Chinook]

I believe Dieng agreed to a minimum contract, meaning the Spurs could potentially use up all their cap space first and then sign him. Signing him now takes his salary away from cap space (correct me if I'm wrong, anyone who knows more).

That means the Spurs most likely won't use all their cap space this summer, and would also explain why they waited so long to sign Dieng.

Cap space, and also roster space.

Jones, Primo, Wesley
Vassell, Richardson, Branham, Edwards
McDermott, KBD, Langford, Hall,
Johnson, Sochan, Roby
Poeltl, Collins, Dieng, Barlow

They only have two spots left now without having to waive someone they at least intend on not cutting before camp.

[jjspur]

Tsai basically gave them the keys for a couple years, and they drove the car into a ditch. Now they're asking for an upgrade and Tsai doesn't seem to want to hear it.

We'll see if he sticks to his word. We've seen people make these kind of statements before and then cave...I wouldn't be surprised if Nash gets moved, but firing Marks would be a mistake.

You're right owners talk loudly but mostly cave in. I'm surprised that Nash has done as well as he has for a first time coach. Marks is a lot smarter than people give him him credit for. Tsai would be dumb to get rid of either just to please Durant. No matter how talented he is, Durant is still a crybaby diva in my eyes.

[Seventyniner]

Cap space, and also roster space.

Jones, Primo, Wesley
Vassell, Richardson, Branham, Edwards
McDermott, KBD, Langford, Hall,
Johnson, Sochan, Roby
Poeltl, Collins, Dieng, Barlow

They only have two spots left now without having to waive someone they at least intend on not cutting before camp.

The Spurs have the "depth" (they're still gonna really suck) to afford losing Poeltl and Richardson. I'd imagine the Spurs are still heavily shopping them, perhaps weighing offers right now, and I doubt they're looking for a player in return. One that they wouldn't immediately waive, that is.

[exstatic]

The Spurs have the "depth" (they're still gonna really suck) to afford losing Poeltl and Richardson. I'd imagine the Spurs are still heavily shopping them, perhaps weighing offers right now, and I doubt they're looking for a player in return. One that they wouldn't immediately waive, that is.

timvp said something like they have at least one offer of picks, plural, but they were trying to work Jak into a larger deal for an unprotected pick. If that doesn't work out, it sounds like they have something that will. I don't expect him on the roster at the beginning of training camp. I think JRich will be traded before the deadline, probably to a contender, but I don't expect anything imminent on that front.

[Chinook]

The Spurs have the "depth" (they're still gonna really suck) to afford losing Poeltl and Richardson. I'd imagine the Spurs are still heavily shopping them, perhaps weighing offers right now, and I doubt they're looking for a player in return. One that they wouldn't immediately waive, that is.

Sure, but both players have salaries small enough that a team might want to stack a pick plus multiple small contracts to acquire. Jakob could be had with three min contracts; Richardson (and McDermott) could with four. Right now, the Spurs couldn't do a four-for-one trade without cutting Edwards or one of the other guys. I don't think this is a critical situation, as very few teams have that many min contracts they want to get rid of. But it's a bit less flexibility that was being saved by having that extra roster spot temporarily vacant.

[JuneJive]

Jakob is back in the US,before that he talked to Austrian media:“yes, i was surprised about the Murray trade. That’s the business. I am happy in SA,as far as I heard from the spurs:they count on me,they want me to stay & are planning the new start with me.“

[mo7888]

Has there been any indication how the Miles Bridges situation is effecting Charlotte's plans heading into the offseason? Have they cooled on wanting to unload GH?

[Dex]

You're right owners talk loudly but mostly cave in. I'm surprised that Nash has done as well as he has for a first time coach. Marks is a lot smarter than people give him him credit for. Tsai would be dumb to get rid of either just to please Durant. No matter how talented he is, Durant is still a crybaby diva in my eyes.

I can't really speak much for Nash....he chose a shitty situation to start his career. He was brought in to be a "yes man" to Durant, then got hit with Kyrie missing half a season and Harden coming in out of shape then demanding a trade. The Nets barely made the playoffs even with Durant.

That said...KD obviously played a part in getting Atkinson fired, then had nothing but praise for the signing of Nash. It's funny how quickly his story has changed.

[tonight...you]

I can't really speak much for Nash....he chose a shitty situation to start his career. He was brought in to be a "yes man" to Durant, then got hit with Kyrie missing half a season and Harden coming in out of shape then demanding a trade. The Nets barely made the playoffs even with Durant.

That said...KD obviously played a part in getting Atkinson fired, then had nothing but praise for the signing of Nash. It's funny how quickly his story has changed.
Nash probably thought he was walking into a Kerr/GSW situation and everything just went sideways.

[spurs10]

Kevin Durant is a great example of what not to do decision making wise apart from his riches. He's no longer the player that makes your team an immediate contender for a 'ship. He's only succeeded when he joined the team that beat him and few were impressed. A great player of course, but bad choices.

[Ice009]

Would it have looked any better for him if he came to the Spurs and teamed up with Kawhi and LA? Apparently the Spurs were his second choice when he was asked about it during his first or second season at GSW (not sure if he was bullshitting or not about that).

[Ocotillo]

https://www.nba.com/spurs/news/spurs-sign-jordan-hall-to-two-way-contract?fbclid=IwAR0mnbvfjn5pVrXdCBGMmcKgLADXsUBT CzPIoZG_snoAF8cm1y4-5FvR1so

SAN ANTONIO (Aug. 11, 2022) – The San Antonio Spurs today announced that they have signed forward Jordan Hall to a two-way contract. Per team policy, terms of the contract were not announced.

[Chinook]

Another locked down roster spot. Signaling they're making the turn into getting ready for camp.

[Dejounte]

Key losses:
Murray (arguably net zero when it comes to wins)
Lonnie (net negative)
Landale (net zero)

Key additions:
Wesley (provides athleticism)
Sochan (provides much needed length and defense in the front court)
Branham (provides ISO scoring)

[slick'81]

Spurs are in deep shit this season

[spurraider21]

Key losses:
Murray (arguably net zero when it comes to wins)
Lonnie (net negative)
Landale (net zero)

Key additions:
Wesley (provides athleticism)
Sochan (provides much needed length and defense in the front court)
Branham (provides ISO scoring)
:lol cope

we're tanking

[Dejounte]

Shit never gets old when folks pay more attention to your take than you do for theirs :lmao

let me have mine and you have yours tbh neither of us or anyone have ever been 100% right so why try to ridicule others? It’s a child’s game…

[poopbox]

Key losses:
Murray (arguably net zero when it comes to wins)
Lonnie (net negative)
Landale (net zero)

Key additions:
Wesley (provides athleticism)
Sochan (provides much needed length and defense in the front court)
Branham (provides ISO scoring)

The only guy one our roster to make an all defensive team and an all star team is a "net zero" :rollin

Primo and Devin can't even get invites to the rookie vs sophomores all star weekend game :rollin

[Vince Carter's ankle]

The only guy one our roster to make an all defensive team and an all star team is a "net zero" :rollin

Primo and Devin can't even get invites to the rookie vs sophomores all star weekend game :rollin
And how are these two points related?

[Allan Rowe vs Wade]

dejounte was easily our best player but let's not pretend he was a *real* all star

[heyheymymy]

Wasn't DJ a technicality all star anyway? Injury replacement for Draymond Green

[rankingtear]

Wasn't DJ a technicality all star anyway? Injury replacement for Draymond Green

Deserved it more than Wiggins.

[mo7888]

Jazz and Knicks have re-entered DM trade discussions

Shams

[KingKev]

Deserved it more than Wiggins.

Wiggins didn’t deserve to start but deserved to be in the AS Game.

Also, he was easily the 3rd best player in the NBA Finals and has already surpassed Kawhi in scoring. He is a top 10 2 way NBA player. Better than every person on our roster.

[The Truth #6]

Wiggins didn’t deserve to start but deserved to be in the AS Game.

Also, he was easily the 3rd best player in the NBA Finals and has already surpassed Kawhi in scoring. He is a top 10 2 way NBA player. Better than every person on our roster.

Wiseman and Wiggins would have been interesting if the rumors were true and it all came together, et cetera et cetera…

[KingKev]

Wiseman and Wiggins would have been interesting if the rumors were true and it all came together, et cetera et cetera…

Big man, I whole heartedly agree. Wiseman is going to surprise ppl this year and Wiggins is a legit two way wing.

The Warriors are absolutely stacked. Wiggins, Poole, Kuminga, Wiseman, Looney and Moody just need to let Klay/Steph/Dray get into the playoffs healthy and in rhythm.

[KingKev]

Wiggins didn’t deserve to start but deserved to be in the AS Game.

Also, he was easily the 3rd best player in the NBA Finals and has already surpassed Kawhi in scoring. He is a top 10 2 way NBA player. Better than every person on our roster.

https://bleacherreport.com/videos/247943-cuban-talks-facing-the-warriors

[mo7888]

Looks like we signed Alize Johnson for $2M

[exstatic]

Wiggins didn’t deserve to start but deserved to be in the AS Game.

Also, he was easily the 3rd best player in the NBA Finals and has already surpassed Kawhi in scoring. He is a top 10 2 way NBA player. Better than every person on our roster.

Wiggins is like Dray, buoyed to All Stardom because of Steph and Klay. Those two are the very definition of shooting gravity, and average players thrive around them, when they fail or founder elsewhere.

[KingKev]

Wiggins is like Dray, buoyed to All Stardom because of Steph and Klay. Those two are the very definition of shooting gravity, and average players thrive around them, when they fail or founder elsewhere.

Steph makes offense easier on everyone no doubt. Wiggins has barely played with Klay and the Klay he has played with is average at best. You are just a hater.

Regardless, he is a borderline ELITE wing defender at this stage in the game. Nobody helps him accomplish that; just himself. He gaurds the opposing teams best wing EVERY night.

[spurraider21]

same people who thought he got robbed not being named an allstar outright now saying he wasnt technically a real all star since he's no longer a spur :lol

[KingKev]

same people who thought he got robbed not being named an allstar outright now saying he wasnt technically a real all star since he's no longer a spur :lol

Preach

[exstatic]

Steph makes offense easier on everyone no doubt. Wiggins has barely played with Klay and the Klay he has played with is average at best. You are just a hater.

Regardless, he is a borderline ELITE wing defender at this stage in the game. Nobody helps him accomplish that; just himself. He gaurds the opposing teams best wing EVERY night.

Oh yeah, he’s always been elite defensively. I just don’t think he suddenly learned to shoot better after 5 1/2 years in Minnesota, he just suddenly had a shit ton more good open looks. His major problem is that he was never going to be a franchise player, yet he was drafted #1 overall, and overpaid most of his careeer.

[KingKev]

[QUOTE=exstatic;10798678]Oh yeah, he’s always been elite defensively. I just don’t think he suddenly learned to shoot better after 5 1/2 years in Minnesota, he just suddenly had a shit ton more good open looks. His major problem is that he was never going to be a franchise player, yet he was drafted #1 overall, and overpaid most of his career.[l/QUOTE]

Rebounds the ball well also and can play the four as he is quite physical when he needs to be. That max contract he was given in Minny, well despite the naysayers he has grown into. He probably gets another 4yr/120mm deal next off season. If DDR is looked at as a 2nd/3rd option Wiggins should be looked at that also.

[rankingtear]

Wiggins didn’t deserve to start but deserved to be in the AS Game.

Also, he was easily the 3rd best player in the NBA Finals and has already surpassed Kawhi in scoring. He is a top 10 2 way NBA player. Better than every person on our roster.

He wouldn't have made it as a reserve for sure.

[tonight...you]

[QUOTE=exstatic;10798678]Oh yeah, he’s always been elite defensively. I just don’t think he suddenly learned to shoot better after 5 1/2 years in Minnesota, he just suddenly had a shit ton more good open looks. His major problem is that he was never going to be a franchise player, yet he was drafted #1 overall, and overpaid most of his career.[l/QUOTE]

Rebounds the ball well also and can play the four as he is quite physical when he needs to be. That max contract he was given in Minny, well despite the naysayers he has grown into. He probably gets another 4yr/120mm deal next off season. If DDR is looked at as a 2nd/3rd option Wiggins should be looked at that also.
I'd love Wiggins on our team.
He'd be such a balance and the best player, pairing with Sochan, but I guess we're tanking now so...

[exstatic]

I'd love Wiggins on our team.
He'd be such a balance and the best player, pairing with Sochan, but I guess we're tanking now so...

Yeah, we’re not adding veteran players who raise the floor.

[Ice009]

Wiseman and Wiggins would have been interesting if the rumors were true and it all came together, et cetera et cetera…

In hindsight, if that kind of offer was ever on the table, the Spurs should have taken it and ran.

[KingKev]

In hindsight, if that kind of offer was ever on the table, the Spurs should have taken it and ran.

Not sure it was ever actually on the table but even at the time if you were engaged in the NBA you knew that was a great deal for the Spurs.

[bluebellmaniac]

Yeah, we’re not adding veteran players who raise the floor.

Ideally, we'd want a player who is recovering from an injury (like knee surgery) and wouldn't be a factor this season, but would be ready next season. Last year would have been nice to trade Poodle for Wiseman, the incentive being they'd have a higher likelihood of ringing. They rang anyway, but would have been nice.

[exstatic]

Ideally, we'd want a player who is recovering from an injury (like knee surgery) and wouldn't be a factor this season, but would be ready next season. Last year would have been nice to trade Poodle for Wiseman, the incentive being they'd have a higher likelihood of ringing. They rang anyway, but would have been nice.

Saric wouldn't be bad, if his knee is OK. If he's healthy, we could flip him at the deadline, too.

[Kevin]

Saric wouldn't be bad, if his knee is OK. If he's healthy, we could flip him at the deadline, too.

Suns should rehab Saric's value and look to give him away at the deadline rather than attaching assets. They have until the trade deadline to get under the tax.

Also Lebron just signed a two year extension with the Lakers. I remember reading that the Lakers would trade away two future firsts for Kyrie without a LeBron extension. Gotta wonder if talks aren't about to start up again.

[KingKev]

Suns should rehab Saric's value and look to give him away at the deadline rather than attaching assets. They have until the trade deadline to get under the tax.

Also Lebron just signed a two year extension with the Lakers. I remember reading that the Lakers would trade away two future firsts for Kyrie without a LeBron extension. Gotta wonder if talks aren't about to start up again.

This is much more likely. If he can play at a high level you just keep him and front the bill. He looked good in the bubble before he went down.

[exstatic]

Suns should rehab Saric's value and look to give him away at the deadline rather than attaching assets. They have until the trade deadline to get under the tax.

Also Lebron just signed a two year extension with the Lakers. I remember reading that the Lakers would trade away two future firsts for Kyrie without a LeBron extension. Gotta wonder if talks aren't about to start up again.

They still have to find a team with the cap room, and that shit ain’t free. The teams that will want him at the deadline for the stretch run will all be contenders with no cap room.

[Kevin]

They still have to find a team with the cap room, and that shit ain’t free. The teams that will want him at the deadline for the stretch run will all be contenders with no cap room.

Eh I still think the mostly likely scenario is Saric returning to form and the Suns keeping him for the season tax implications be damned.

They probably dump Torrey Craig at the deadline who's making 5.1 million this season. By the time the deadline rolls around most of his contract will be paid off with roughly two million left on his deal. It shouldn't cost much more than a second round pick to dump him.

Suns don't hurt their win now window by dumping a good role player in Saric while still reducing the tax bill without attaching significant assets.

[slick'81]

same people who thought he got robbed not being named an allstar outright now saying he wasnt technically a real all star since he's no longer a spur :lol

I remember the love affair when he made the team. Now hes an evil a-hole who didn't really help the team at all. Guess the truth lies somewhere in the middle.