Ukraine

[ChumpDumper]

Why are all these Muslim handled twitter accounts acting like they are on the front lines of Ukraine?

[ChumpDumper]

Time to give peace a chance. This is not looking good. :(

https://twitter.com/GhostofLugansk/status/1569023121096679425

Special Operation bad now.

[hater]

After 6 fucking months of playing with your balls. Fuck8jg Greg Putovich.


Smdh


https://twitter.com/mdfzeh/status/1569035292463759360

[velik_m]

1569044030272454663

[horseshue]

1569044030272454663

Zelensky has grown so much as a leader during this war.

[hater]

"When your enemy is killing its civilians who share ethnicity with you. You start a military operation. But leave your enemy with full internet, power and hot water." - Greggory Putovich

[ChumpDumper]

:lol hater's attempt to turn on Putin isn't working.

[hater]

:lol hater's attempt to turn on Putin isn't working.

Say what? Putin is a great human and top 5 all time peace time leader. But hes soft. He just wears mittens. And ma niga Lavrov is similar or worse.

[ChumpDumper]

Say what? Putin is a great human and top 5 all time peace time leader. But hes soft. He just wears mittens. And ma niga Lavrov is similar or worse.:lmao you think he's not genociding enough

[DMC]

1569044030272454663

Of course Zelensky has food, water, power and gas. It's his countrymen who do not.

[ChumpDumper]

"Churchill never actually fought on the beaches in World War II."

-- derp

[DMC]

It's obviously so much more than that, and comparing it to Afghanistan is really not understanding anything about geopolitics.

It goes beyond just Russia and includes China as well, and will dictate who are going to be the power brokers in this world in the future, which has a direct impact into people, whether the parts care about it right now or not.

And so, as part of the group of people, you have to look at what each side stands for. The western democracies are definitely not perfect, but I'll take them over what Russia or China are politically selling.

You're repeating yourself. The US isn't at war with Russia. The false dichotomy of being under Russian/Chinese control if Russia succeeds or being under Western democratic control if Ukraine pushes Russia back is just a convenient way to pick sides. I get it, but the US isn't in this for any such grandiose purposes. It's about keeping strategic superiority to maintain the wealth for the wealthy interests, first strike capability for nuclear deterrence and allies along Russia's border, where the US can launch sorties. Because Ukraine has behaved basically how the US would dictate they behave, they are a strategic asset. Let's not forget the wrangling done by the current and previous admin with Ukraine.

The US itches for war. We'll get involved with all conflicts where we can gain some strategic or financial advantage, and it's never too late to claim patriotism and the salvation of democracy as a reason. The only difference is the cheering audience, based on the color of the flag flown by the current admin, blue or red.

[DMC]

…yes!

now i hope you not that when making an analogy or comparison, im not literally calling them rapists and rape victims. This has been an issue with you on multiple occasions already

You try too hard for haymaker comments that often miss the mark, and in your loss of balance recovery attempt, you blame your target for moving. A rape analogy is unnecessary to say "someone being attacked will swing anything they can get their hands on, but that doesn't mean it's ok to attack someone with anything you can get your hands on". You went the rape route because you lack basic common fucking sense.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You're repeating yourself. The US isn't at war with Russia. The false dichotomy of being under Russian/Chinese control if Russia succeeds or being under Western democratic control if Ukraine pushes Russia back is just a convenient way to pick sides. I get it, but the US isn't in this for any such grandiose purposes. It's about keeping strategic superiority to maintain the wealth for the wealthy interests, first strike capability for nuclear deterrence and allies along Russia's border, where the US can launch sorties. Because Ukraine has behaved basically how the US would dictate they behave, they are a strategic asset. Let's not forget the wrangling done by the current and previous admin with Ukraine.

The US itches for war. We'll get involved with all conflicts where we can gain some strategic or financial advantage, and it's never too late to claim patriotism and the salvation of democracy as a reason. The only difference is the cheering audience, based on the color of the flag flown by the current admin, blue or red.

They want to join NATO and have publicly said so. Their stated desire is to join the western alliance. Putin wants Ukraine to be a junior partner like the USSR was as he has written about extensively.

Outside of us saying they cannot use are weapons on Russian territory what have we dictated to them? or anyone in the West for that matter.

And there is a military industrial complex with a hugely powerful lobby but your monolithic description is just another case of you needing to dumb things down to "understand" something.

[DMC]

They want to join NATO and have publicly said so. Their stated desire is to join the western alliance. Putin wants Ukraine to be a junior partner like the USSR was as he has written about extensively.

Outside of us saying they cannot use are weapons on Russian territory what have we dictated to them? or anyone in the West for that matter.

And there is a military industrial complex with a hugely powerful lobby but your monolithic description is just another case of you needing to dumb things down to "understand" something.

Again, your opinion is worthless. That doesn't need to be dumbed down you pedantic child.

[ChumpDumper]

You're repeating yourself. The US isn't at war with Russia. The false dichotomy of being under Russian/Chinese control if Russia succeeds or being under Western democratic control if Ukraine pushes Russia back is just a convenient way to pick sides. I get it, but the US isn't in this for any such grandiose purposes. It's about keeping strategic superiority to maintain the wealth for the wealthy interests, first strike capability for nuclear deterrence and allies along Russia's border, where the US can launch sorties. Because Ukraine has behaved basically how the US would dictate they behave, they are a strategic asset. Let's not forget the wrangling done by the current and previous admin with Ukraine.

The US itches for war. We'll get involved with all conflicts where we can gain some strategic or financial advantage, and it's never too late to claim patriotism and the salvation of democracy as a reason. The only difference is the cheering audience, based on the color of the flag flown by the current admin, blue or red.The dichotomy is being under Russian control or not being under Russian control.

It's all the same to you, but not to us.

You pride yourself on not having any actual opinions on anything and trying to hate on people who do.

Tough shit.

Your non-opinion is worthless.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Again, your opinion is worthless. That doesn't need to be dumbed down you pedantic child.

You sure want it to be. You really are not my audience. If you want to let me refute your nonsense and only come back with this then I am fine with the dynamic.

The dichotomy -:lol pedantic child- is shown by objective facts and people can see how you dumbed it down. Characterizing the US as a monolithic personality is really, really dumbing things down.

[DMC]

You sure want it to be. You really are not my audience. If you want to let me refute your nonsense and only come back with this then I am fine with the dynamic.

The dichotomy -:lol pedantic child- is shown by objective facts and people can see how you dumbed it down. Characterizing the US as a monolithic personality is really, really dumbing things down.

Tell me more.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Tell me more.

That's better. The sarcasm gives an impression that you don't care. Too bad you didn't lead with that.

You have abandoned the argument so my work here is done.

[Ef-man]

The dichotomy is being under Russian control or not being under Russian control.

It's all the same to you, but not to us.

You pride yourself on not having any actual opinions on anything and trying to hate on people who do.

Tough shit.

Your non-opinion is worthless.

:cry muh russia's military might is on par with China and US :cry

:lmao :lmao :lmao

[ElNono]

Sad times coming. Looks like TOSB Greg Putovich has decided to finally hit the Ukro power and water plants.

After 6 fucking months of diddling around like a bitch.

NATO when they bombed Serbia, they destroyed the utilities the first fucking day. This motherfucker

Its very sad that Ukranian civilians on East will start suffering. But thats what hapoens when both sides wont negotiate.

https://twitter.com/OrderofAlamut/status/1569018638035828736


Time to give peace a chance. This is not looking good. :(

https://twitter.com/GhostofLugansk/status/1569023121096679425

Terror state doing terror state things

[Spurs Homer]

Too bad Hater and TSA's god is not as popular at home anymore;



https://www.yahoo.com/news/moscow-officials-urge-putin-gtfo-030517069.html

[ElNono]

You're repeating yourself. The US isn't at war with Russia. The false dichotomy of being under Russian/Chinese control if Russia succeeds or being under Western democratic control if Ukraine pushes Russia back is just a convenient way to pick sides. I get it, but the US isn't in this for any such grandiose purposes. It's about keeping strategic superiority to maintain the wealth for the wealthy interests, first strike capability for nuclear deterrence and allies along Russia's border, where the US can launch sorties. Because Ukraine has behaved basically how the US would dictate they behave, they are a strategic asset. Let's not forget the wrangling done by the current and previous admin with Ukraine.

As a member of the West, of course it is. That's why the US along with allies have set up all sorts of sanctions towards Russia and are feeding Ukraine with intel and weapons to defend their country. You can call it a proxy war and it has components that go beyond the military, but it's a war nonetheless.

There's simply a lot at stake here, including the fate of the US dollar as a reserve and trade currency, alignment of powers in the indo-pacific region, the future of our biggest allies in Europe, the future of Taiwan, etc. Russia is also making a claim to be a superpower, which they no longer are. They're just a bigger North Korea these days, both on the political and economic realms. A clear message has to be sent that the days of 20+ years dictators is over, whether they have nuclear weapons or not.


The US itches for war. We'll get involved with all conflicts where we can gain some strategic or financial advantage, and it's never too late to claim patriotism and the salvation of democracy as a reason. The only difference is the cheering audience, based on the color of the flag flown by the current admin, blue or red.

I don't deny the US itches for war, nor claim that the US is a saint. There has been plenty of US wars without a clear goal or strategic objective (Afghanistan and Iraq come to mind in the recent past, and those were fought by both blue and red). But in this particular case, IMO you don't need to be blue or red to figure out who's the aggressor and what they're after. This is why the vast majority of both blue and red congressmen have so far supported this, it's really a no-brainer.

[Spurminator]

Poor hater and DMC.

[DMC]

That's better. The sarcasm gives an impression that you don't care. Too bad you didn't lead with that.

You have abandoned the argument so my work here is done.

How so?

[DMC]

As a member of the West, of course it is. That's why the US along with allies have set up all sorts of sanctions towards Russia and are feeding Ukraine with intel and weapons to defend their country. You can call it a proxy war and it has components that go beyond the military, but it's a war nonetheless.

There's simply a lot at stake here, including the fate of the US dollar as a reserve and trade currency, alignment of powers in the indo-pacific region, the future of our biggest allies in Europe, the future of Taiwan, etc. Russia is also making a claim to be a superpower, which they no longer are. They're just a bigger North Korea these days, both on the political and economic realms. A clear message has to be sent that the days of 20+ years dictators is over, whether they have nuclear weapons or not.


"We do not seek a war between NATO and Russia," wrote the president...

You're taking undue liberties in declaring the US at war with Russia. The US has sanctions against a lot of countries we aren't at war against. Maybe ease off the hyperbole.


I don't deny the US itches for war, nor claim that the US is a saint. There has been plenty of US wars without a clear goal or strategic objective (Afghanistan and Iraq come to mind in the recent past, and those were fought by both blue and red). But in this particular case, IMO you don't need to be blue or red to figure out who's the aggressor and what they're after. This is why the vast majority of both blue and red congressmen have so far supported this, it's really a no-brainer.
Aggressor against a foreign country not part of NATO that the US has no obligation to defend. Maybe we have a strategic and financial set of objectives, but no obligations. This goes right back to my original comment.

[Ef-man]

‎In Kherson, RUS they actually shortened the defense lines so as to be within the range of their own artillery from the eastern bank of the Dnieper. We are talking about the withdrawal of 5-10km towards Kherson. These are the effects of the problem in supplying artillery ammunition.

‎https://twitter.com/wolski_jaros/status/1569037741270204423

[ElNono]

"We do not seek a war between NATO and Russia," wrote the president...

You're taking undue liberties in declaring the US at war with Russia. The US has sanctions against a lot of countries we aren't at war against. Maybe ease off the hyperbole.

Why don't you ask Russia how they feel about western sanctions and weapon deliveries? I think they made themselves pretty clear. Technicalities aside, there's plenty of ways to wage war.


Aggressor against a foreign country not part of NATO that the US has no obligation to defend. Maybe we have a strategic and financial set of objectives, but no obligations. This goes right back to my original comment.

I never made the claim we had an 'obligation'. Ultimately, the proof is the reality that NATO countries are sending intel and billions in weapons and aid, and are effectively waging a proxy war. Again, plenty of US and western interest at play here.

So far NATO has played this masterfully and should thank Putler for bringing in new members and making them look decidedly like the adults in the room, tbh.

[velik_m]

"When your enemy is killing its civilians who share ethnicity with you. You start a military operation. But leave your enemy with full internet, power and hot water." - Greggory Putovich

You don't destroy the basic infrastructure of the land you plan to occupy, because you will need it when you occupy it. Russia attacking it now is an acknowledgment, that they have given up on occupying mainland Ukraine. And Lavrov talking about peace negotiation is a signal they are trying to salvage something from all this at the negotiation table (i bet they are hoping to keep Crimea, as they can then still spin this failed "special operation" into success for domestic use). Reality has started to sink in and they are looking for an off-ramp.

[velik_m]

1569079250246062080

[velik_m]

1569070513909022720

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/PavelUvarovv/status/1569180156291424257

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/MoncefArfa/status/1569171747936604162

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/TrentTelenko/status/1569130564577538048

[DMC]

Why don't you ask Russia how they feel about western sanctions and weapon deliveries? I think they made themselves pretty clear. Technicalities aside, there's plenty of ways to wage war.


You're being obtuse and dodgy. We aren't at war with Russia and I am not going to pretend your quilt work is the same thing. However you seem to want to use that "we are at war" to make a following point, just know your point relies on a falsehood. Doesn't mean I won't agree with it so I'm not sure why you need to make such a hyperbolic claim.


I never made the claim we had an 'obligation'. Ultimately, the proof is the reality that NATO countries are sending intel and billions in weapons and aid, and are effectively waging a proxy war. Again, plenty of US and western interest at play here.

No, you said we are at war with Russia, that's the ramification of having such responsibility. You didn't need to make the claim, you instead jumped right to the ramification of the unmade claim being made - war. If we are, as you claim, at war, then we must bear some responsibility for Ukraine's success, do we not?

So far NATO has played this masterfully and should thank Putler for bringing in new members and making them look decidedly like the adults in the room, tbh.
Since you've put the US at war with Russia, how can you tell who's the adult? Russia hasn't attacked the US yet you claim we have attacked Russia.

I cannot take you seriously when you're playing such a weak "we are at war with Russia" hand.

[ElNono]

1569070513909022720

Their country isn't in trouble, tbh... the real question is what are they going to do (or what can they do) once they sober up to the fact that they're not the country they were sold they were.

[ElNono]

You're being obtuse and dodgy. We aren't at war with Russia and I am not going to pretend your quilt work is the same thing. However you seem to want to use that "we are at war" to make a following point, just know your point relies on a falsehood. Doesn't mean I won't agree with it so I'm not sure why you need to make such a hyperbolic claim.

How am I obtuse and dodgy? Is the US and Euro allies not arming Ukraine to the teeth, giving them intel, aid, training? How would you describe economic sanctions in the breadth and scope of those applied to Russia and not consider them economic warfare?
Is Russia not cutting gas supplies to Europe (not Ukraine, Europe)? Why?

We both knows what happens to Ukraine if they don't have any of that. I mean, at least back in the 80s the CIA used to do this shit in secret, but this is plain as a day.

The notion that the US would need to fly sorties or put boot on the grounds to 'officially' be at war is silly. Heck, NATO is fortunate that the Ukranians are willing to fight and are not Poland (lmao).


No, you said we are at war with Russia, that's the ramification of having such responsibility. You didn't need to make the claim, you instead jumped right to the ramification of the unmade claim being made - war. If we are, as you claim, at war, then we must bear some responsibility for Ukraine's success, do we not?

No, what I said, and I quote: "As a member of the West, of course it is". It's not just the US, it also includes most of Europe, and some Asian countries like Japan. That's exactly why this conflict has large geopolitical ramifications.
And of course the entire West bear major responsibility for Ukraine extending this to 6+ months so far. Without the West support, this would've been over a long time ago. That, however, is different from having an 'obligation'. The West doesn't owe Ukraine anything, it simply understand what's at stake here, and why Russia must not succeed.


Since you've put the US at war with Russia, how can you tell who's the adult? Russia hasn't attacked the US yet you claim we have attacked Russia.

I cannot take you seriously when you're playing such a weak "we are at war with Russia" hand.

link/quote on the bolded? do you know what a proxy war is? look it up, then we can talk about taking anybody seriously.

[Ef-man]

Citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk are being denied entry into russia. :lol

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1568779221849309186

[horseshue]

https://twitter.com/nexta_tv/status/1569171440796155910

Hater, are you even trying. :lmao

[ElNono]

Citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk are being denied entry into russia. :lol

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1568779221849309186

Looks like the denazification of Ukraine is finally happening :lol

[horseshue]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569225808832757760

DMC, your thoughts? :lol

[horseshue]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569231635979067393

:yield :lmao :lmao :lmao

[DeadlyDynasty]

On our way back from Izium now. If you want to know why the Russians left all that equipment behind in such a hurry, the answer is the road to Balakliya (from Pervomaiskyi) where the initial Kharkiv offenses were launched.

Holy hell what a scorched earth graveyard: MBTs, various IFVs and APCs, and both towed and SP howitzers blown to smithereens all over both sides of the road. They never knew what hit them. The Russians in Izium and other parts weren’t going to take that chance so they fucked off with the quickness.

[Brazil]

On our way back from Izium now. If you want to know why the Russians left all that equipment behind in such a hurry, the answer is the road to Balakliya (from Pervomaiskyi) where the initial Kharkiv offenses were launched.

Holy hell what a scorched earth graveyard: MBTs, various IFVs and APCs, and both towed and SP howitzers blown to smithereens all over both sides of the road. They never knew what hit them. The Russians in Izium and other parts weren’t going to take that chance so they fucked off with the quickness.

stay safe bro

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1569261974692806656

[RandomGuy]

After 6 fucking months of playing with your balls. Fuck8jg Greg Putovich.


Smdh


https://twitter.com/mdfzeh/status/1569035292463759360

1568868280739446786

[RandomGuy]

On our way back from Izium now. If you want to know why the Russians left all that equipment behind in such a hurry, the answer is the road to Balakliya (from Pervomaiskyi) where the initial Kharkiv offenses were launched.

Holy hell what a scorched earth graveyard: MBTs, various IFVs and APCs, and both towed and SP howitzers blown to smithereens all over both sides of the road. They never knew what hit them. The Russians in Izium and other parts weren’t going to take that chance so they fucked off with the quickness.

1569140110402244608

[RandomGuy]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569225808832757760

DMC, your thoughts? :lol

mixed messages, something something, Ukraine sucks, something, i hate chumpdumper bla bla, you misspelled that bla

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1569102985707327488

[RandomGuy]

You don't destroy the basic infrastructure of the land you plan to occupy, because you will need it when you occupy it. Russia attacking it now is an acknowledgment, that they have given up on occupying mainland Ukraine. And Lavrov talking about peace negotiation is a signal they are trying to salvage something from all this at the negotiation table (i bet they are hoping to keep Crimea, as they can then still spin this failed "special operation" into success for domestic use). Reality has started to sink in and they are looking for an off-ramp.

Ain't no off ramp except to leave all of UKR, and that includes Donbas. RUS does not look like they can hold on to anything at this point.

Things are also looking increasingly dangerous for Putin. A lot of the second tier apparatchiks are slowly distancing themselves from the first tier insiders. They are trying to position themselves for what comes after.

[RandomGuy]

Citizens of Luhansk and Donetsk are being denied entry into russia. :lol

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1568779221849309186

Aw. Did someone get exactly what they deserved?

[DeadlyDynasty]

1568868280739446786
We were there yesterday covering Melissa Bell’s team. The news package should be done sometime today/tomorrow

[RandomGuy]

Their country isn't in trouble, tbh... the real question is what are they going to do (or what can they do) once they sober up to the fact that they're not the country they were sold they were.

Their country is in very deep trouble, as soon as their currency reserves run out. They have been burning through them at a very fast clip, and as time goes on and anything mechanical starts breaking, it will get worse.

Once the extractive industries start winding down and contracting, the service industries they support will start contracting as well, and it will get bad.

[RandomGuy]

We were there yesterday covering Melissa Bell’s team. The news package should be done sometime today/tomorrow

Twitter feed or links? Feel free to DM. NAFO in the hizzouse.

[RandomGuy]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1569102985707327488

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FcYsGNtWAAQrTPn?format=jpg&name=small

[RandomGuy]

:lmao

https://twitter.com/LvivTyler/status/1559552114577117185

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[RandomGuy]

Oh yeah the famous Kherson Ukranian counter offensive :lmao

1569338519302148101

Eat a dick, vatnik.

[CosmicCowboy]

wow

[TimDunkem]

Where's hater and thread to spin this into somehow being a win for Russia?

[horseshue]

Where's hater and thread to spin this into somehow being a win for Russia?

Hater is now acting like he knew all the time, that ruzzians will shit their bed.
About thread there is two possibilites, he is dead from covid or someone cut the internet in the old folks home. His last post is from 4 weeks ago.

[TimDunkem]

Hater is now acting like he knew all the time, that ruzzians will shit their bed.
About thread there is two possibilites, he is dead from covid or someone cut the internet in the old folks home. His last post is from 4 weeks ago.
I see thread logged in recently. He's just hiding his shit again I guess. :lol

[ElNono]

Their country is in very deep trouble, as soon as their currency reserves run out. They have been burning through them at a very fast clip, and as time goes on and anything mechanical starts breaking, it will get worse.

Once the extractive industries start winding down and contracting, the service industries they support will start contracting as well, and it will get bad.

That would mean the incumbent regime is in trouble, not the country. Russia is under no risk of getting invaded, for example, and they'll survive as a nation just like they did when the soviet union collapsed.

Of course there will be plenty of pain if that comes to pass, but it's very different from the existential threat Ukraine is facing now, for example.

[hater]

Where's hater and thread to spin this into somehow being a win for Russia?

Im here nig :tu

Already bitched about this terrible outing. They should be blowing out these scrubs by 30 but fucking Greg Putinovich doesnt know what the fuck hes doing with his soft frontline. Instead of pummeling these bitches, he does stupid shit like wait 6 months to turn off the hot water in Ukraine and send condolences about the queen yo brits :lmao fucking TOSB soft as warleader.

Russia should be blowing out these scrubs every damn game.

Now its a playoff series. But Putovich is one more epic loss to me call8ng for his resignation.

Even a Russia led by Medvedev and Kadyrov would fare better :lmao


Got damn scrubs :pctoss

[velik_m]

1569316116786302976

[hater]

As I said. Great human and top 5 peace time leader. But mediocre war general.

https://twitter.com/timand2037/status/1569330765133119488

[velik_m]

That would mean the incumbent regime is in trouble, not the country. Russia is under no risk of getting invaded, for example, and they'll survive as a nation just like they did when the soviet union collapsed.

Of course there will be plenty of pain if that comes to pass, but it's very different from the existential threat Ukraine is facing now, for example.

Russia will survive, Russian Federation on the other hand...? They are plenty of unhappy regions in this "federation" of theirs. This could all end in collapse of Soviet union part 2, this time more bloody.

[velik_m]

Hater level of analysis on fox news

1569321565531115523

[hater]

Hater level of analysis on fox news

1569321565531115523

Says the tool that believes Russia is on verge of collapsing as a Federation :lmao :lmao :lmao

[hater]

On the other hand this is a Great Wartime Leader :wow

:tu

https://twitter.com/snekotron/status/1569114531129094145


:tu

https://twitter.com/Twinklyr/status/1569381278230757379

[ChumpDumper]

Im here nig :tu

Already bitched about this terrible outing. They should be blowing out these scrubs by 30 but fucking Greg Putinovich doesnt know what the fuck hes doing with his soft frontline. Instead of pummeling these bitches, he does stupid shit like wait 6 months to turn off the hot water in Ukraine and send condolences about the queen yo brits :lmao fucking TOSB soft as warleader.

Russia should be blowing out these scrubs every damn game.

Now its a playoff series. But Putovich is one more epic loss to me call8ng for his resignation.

Even a Russia led by Medvedev and Kadyrov would fare better :lmao


Got damn scrubs :pctoss


This is not basketball.

[hater]

"Nein tank for u!"


:lmao

https://twitter.com/OB_Ages/status/1569369310828666881

[TimDunkem]

^And Russia is still getting smoked?

How embarrassing...

[velik_m]

1569334222242070536

[Winehole23]

Definite pucker factor, Putin will be feeling the political heat.


As the war in Ukraine marked 200 days on Sunday and Ukrainian troops reclaimed several key regions of the country, a top Kremlin leader criticised the Russian army and its leadership saying he would speak to President Vladimir Putin about the recent debacle. In a Telegram post, Ramzan Kadyrov, the Kremlin-appointed leader of Chechnya, questioned the Russian army over the recent advances claimed by the Ukrainian forces. According to Kadyrov, Putin might not be aware of the real state of affairshttps://m.republicworld.com/world-news/russia-ukraine-crisis/top-putin-ally-criticises-russias-losses-in-ukraine-calls-out-moscows-mistakes-articleshow.html

[DeadlyDynasty]

Any country where you YouTube their military and it comes up with vids of people doing unarmed combat jumping through flaming hoops in front of their generals, you know it’s going to be fucking wank.

Look what happens when you level the playing field somewhat (still a ways to go with long range weapons)…you end up with a Ukrainian soldier vs a Russian soldier, which is a complete mismatch in the field

[Brazil]

so now according to Hater.. Russia is losing cauz Putin is soft ? :lmao dear fucking god what a tool

[Spurminator]

Im here nig :tu

Already bitched about this terrible outing. They should be blowing out these scrubs by 30 but fucking Greg Putinovich doesnt know what the fuck hes doing with his soft frontline. Instead of pummeling these bitches, he does stupid shit like wait 6 months to turn off the hot water in Ukraine and send condolences about the queen yo brits :lmao fucking TOSB soft as warleader.

Russia should be blowing out these scrubs every damn game.

Now its a playoff series. But Putovich is one more epic loss to me call8ng for his resignation.

Even a Russia led by Medvedev and Kadyrov would fare better :lmao


Got damn scrubs :pctoss


Why are you upset about this?

What is your rooting interest in Russia?

[DMX7]

They should be blowing out these scrubs by 30 but fucking Greg Putinovich doesnt know what the fuck hes doing with his soft frontline.


Bruv, stop comparing Putin to Greg Popovich. Coach Pop won 5 Big League chips. Coach Putin hasn't one anything except a couple Division III titles.

[velik_m]

1569359928694902786

[DMC]

Why are you upset about this?

What is your rooting interest in Russia?

be specific

[DMC]

How am I obtuse and dodgy? Is the US and Euro allies not arming Ukraine to the teeth, giving them intel, aid, training? How would you describe economic sanctions in the breadth and scope of those applied to Russia and not consider them economic warfare?
Is Russia not cutting gas supplies to Europe (not Ukraine, Europe)? Why?

You need the US to be at war with Russia so you can move on to your next point, but the US isn't at war with Russia. "Economic warfare" :lol

I guess we're also at war with China and North Korea.

hater was right all along, WWIII. POTY delivering.


We both knows what happens to Ukraine if they don't have any of that. I mean, at least back in the 80s the CIA used to do this shit in secret, but this is plain as a day.

We both (you and I) know, yet only one of us has said so prior. Otherwise it's crickets from the left here as they pretend Ukraine is running roughshod over Russian forces all by themselves. So no, you cannot both have your "US vs Russia" war and "Ukraine going it alone vs Russia" war. If you ever raise a finger to make similar points when all the twitter semen clouds are flowing about how strong Ukraine is, then maybe I'd give your sudden, convenient capitulation due consideration.


The notion that the US would need to fly sorties or put boot on the grounds to 'officially' be at war is silly. Heck, NATO is fortunate that the Ukranians are willing to fight and are not Poland (lmao).

Since no war was declared by NATO or the US, we are not officially at war. Now you'll talk about how the US never declared war in other regions were we had boots on the ground, so make up your mind. You're not going to turn that turd you laid into a golden egg.


No, what I said, and I quote: "As a member of the West, of course it is". It's not just the US, it also includes most of Europe, and some Asian countries like Japan. That's exactly why this conflict has large geopolitical ramifications.
And of course the entire West bear major responsibility for Ukraine extending this to 6+ months so far. Without the West support, this would've been over a long time ago. That, however, is different from having an 'obligation'. The West doesn't owe Ukraine anything, it simply understand what's at stake here, and why Russia must not succeed.

Without the US and NATO meddling in the 1st place there would not have been a war.


link/quote on the bolded? do you know what a proxy war is? look it up, then we can talk about taking anybody seriously.
I probably called proxy war before you.

Since the US is fighting by proxy, and the war still rages, I'd say I was more accurate than you are admitting.
If we were at war, we'd not need to fight by proxy. Are the economic sanctions by proxy? No. So they do not obviously constitute waging war.

Link? You said we were waging war by proxy. How is that not an attack?

[hater]

southfront:

The offensive operation of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and NATO in the Kharkov region was planned by the US military command. About 200 units of heavy military vehicles and up to 9 thousand soldiers were involved in the offensive. Reportedly, every third soldier operating under the Ukrainian chevron was a citizen of a NATO member state. These forces were 4-5 times superior to the units of the DPR, LPR and Russia defending their positions in the region.

The main goal of the Ukrainian offensive was a flank attack, encirclement and subsequent destruction of the Russian grouping in the area of Balakleya, Kupyansk and Izyum.

The Russian command predicted the attack by large forces of Ukraine and NATO in this direction. It was aware that it would be extremely difficult to contain the enemy’s offensive with the forces that it had. It was also almost impossible to transfer timely sufficient reinforcement without weakening other areas on other front lines.

Assessing the risks, the Russian military decided to leave weakly fortified positions and withdraw troops to new lines and straighten communication lines.

Before the start of the Ukrainian offensive, civilians who agreed to move to the territory of the Russian Federation were evacuated from the threatened settlements.

From September 6 to 11, Russian units were withdrawing in an organized manner under the cover of specially organized units. Using mobile defense tactics, the Russian military destroyed the plan of Kiev and NATO to encircle the Russian grouping.

At the same time, there were obvious mistakes made by the Russian military. The area in front of the forward positions was not mined. Units on the front line de facto had no more than 30 percent of the listed military personnel. The soldiers were not properly provided with anti-tank weapons. There were also failures of the front-line intelligence. As a result, the artillery cover of the withdrawal was ineffective in the first days of the Ukrainian offensive.

Now on September 12, Russian troops have been withdrawn to new positions along the eastern bank of the Oskol River with minimal losses. Meanwhile, both sides confirm that the Ukrainian and NATO units suffered significant losses in manpower.

Almost the entire territory of the Kharkov region came under the control of Kiev with minimal damage to the cities’ infrastructure. Immediately after taking control of the settlements, the Ukrainian military began repressions against the pro-Russian population, violating the Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War. The first cases of the executions were already reported.

Large Russian reserves are being transferred to the battlefields. The strategically important settlement of Krasny Liman has not yet been taken by the Ukrainian military. The fighting continues.

Last night, missile strikes hit the largest electricity facilities in eastern Ukraine. The collapse of the power system affected networks in the Kharkiv, Sumy, Dnipropetrovsk, Zaporozhye, Odessa, Donetsk and Kiev regions. Until now, the power supply has not yet been fully restored.

The armed conflict in eastern Ukraine has finally turned into a state of war between Russia and NATO with unpredictable results for all parties in the conflict.

:wow shits getting real

[ChumpDumper]

southfront:

The offensive operation of the Armed Forces of Ukraine and NATO in the Kharkov region was planned by the US military command. About 200 units of heavy military vehicles and up to 9 thousand soldiers were involved in the offensive. Reportedly, every third soldier operating under the Ukrainian chevron was a citizen of a NATO member state. These forces were 4-5 times superior to the units of the DPR, LPR and Russia defending their positions in the region.

The main goal of the Ukrainian offensive was a flank attack, encirclement and subsequent destruction of the Russian grouping in the area of Balakleya, Kupyansk and Izyum.

The Russian command predicted the attack by large forces of Ukraine and NATO in this direction. It was aware that it would be extremely difficult to contain the enemy’s offensive with the forces that it had. It was also almost impossible to transfer timely sufficient reinforcement without weakening other areas on other front lines.

Assessing the risks, the Russian military decided to leave weakly fortified positions and withdraw troops to new lines and straighten communication lines.

Before the start of the Ukrainian offensive, civilians who agreed to move to the territory of the Russian Federation were evacuated from the threatened settlements.

From September 6 to 11, Russian units were withdrawing in an organized manner under the cover of specially organized units. Using mobile defense tactics, the Russian military destroyed the plan of Kiev and NATO to encircle the Russian grouping.

At the same time, there were obvious mistakes made by the Russian military. The area in front of the forward positions was not mined. Units on the front line de facto had no more than 30 percent of the listed military personnel. The soldiers were not properly provided with anti-tank weapons. There were also failures of the front-line intelligence. As a result, the artillery cover of the withdrawal was ineffective in the first days of the Ukrainian offensive.

Now on September 12, Russian troops have been withdrawn to new positions along the eastern bank of the Oskol River with minimal losses. Meanwhile, both sides confirm that the Ukrainian and NATO units suffered significant losses in manpower.

Almost the entire territory of the Kharkov region came under the control of Kiev with minimal damage to the cities’ infrastructure. Immediately after taking control of the settlements, the Ukrainian military began repressions against the pro-Russian population, violating the Geneva Convention relative to the Protection of Civilian Persons in Time of War. The first cases of the executions were already reported.

Large Russian reserves are being transferred to the battlefields. The strategically important settlement of Krasny Liman has not yet been taken by the Ukrainian military. The fighting continues.

Last night, missile strikes hit the largest electricity facilities in eastern Ukraine. The collapse of the power system affected networks in the Kharkiv, Sumy, Dnipropetrovsk, Zaporozhye, Odessa, Donetsk and Kiev regions. Until now, the power supply has not yet been fully restored.

The armed conflict in eastern Ukraine has finally turned into a state of war between Russia and NATO with unpredictable results for all parties in the conflict.

:wow shits getting real

Who is southfront?

[Winehole23]

Russian TV talking heads trying to cope

1569070513909022720

[boutons_deux]

Why Ukraine’s successful offensive is such bad news for Vladimir Putin

The Ukrainians’ performance has

amplified dissent in Russia,

has strengthened President Biden’s (https://thehill.com/people/biden/)hand in rallying support for the country,

has opened up new opportunities for Kyiv and

is expected to make it harder for Russia to find support from its allies.

“To the extent that there can be any gains made by Ukraine, so much to their credit,

I fear now the retaliation that we could see from Putin in the coming days and weeks could be even more brutal against civilians than we’ve seen already,”

Chechen leader Ramzan Kadyrov, (https://thehill.com/people/ramzan-kadyrov/) a key Putin ally, on Sunday criticized Russia’s military for the retreat.
“They have made mistakes and I think they will draw the necessary conclusions,” Kadyrov said

https://thehill.com/policy/defense/3639413-why-ukraines-successful-offensive-is-such-bad-news-for-vladimir-putin

[boutons_deux]

In retaliation for Ukraine's success

Pootin took out an electricity plant, second biggest in Ukraine, that services 9M people.

[boutons_deux]

Pro-Russian sources react to their stunning defeat ... and it's hilarious (https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/9/11/2122212/-Ukraine-Update-Pro-Russian-sources-react-to-their-stunning-defeat-and-it-s-hilarious)
https://images.dailykos.com/images/1112030/story_image/FcXXZjRWIAAa1tC.jpeg?1662920619

https://www.dailykos.com/stories/2022/9/11/2122212/-Ukraine-Update-Pro-Russian-sources-react-to-their-stunning-defeat-and-it-s-hilarious

[Warlord23]

Hater and Thread: you should tune into Tucker Carlson's nightly comedy show ... The Russians are winning a decisive victory there

[Ef-man]

169 days into a 3-5 day special operation and the idiot Chuncko doubling down on russia's military might being on par with China and US. :lmao :lmao :lmao


Since the US is fighting by proxy, and the war still rages, I'd say I was more accurate than you are admitting.


Well known fact that you would say anything to not accept your well earned “L” and move on.

But here you are, doubling down on your russia’s military might is on par with China and US.

Take your “L” and move on, idiot. :tu



201 days into the 3-5 day special operation (i.e., Putler's land grab 10.3 to avoid calling it war) and Chuncko keeps doubling down on his horrible takes. :lmao :lmao :lmao

[DMC]

201 days into the 3-5 day special operation (i.e., Putler's land grab 10.3 to avoid calling it war) and Chuncko keeps doubling down on his horrible takes. :lmao :lmao :lmao

Half of your side claims the US subbed in. You look pretty stupid about now.

[DMC]

Hater and Thread: you should tune into Tucker Carlson's nightly comedy show ... The Russians are winning a decisive victory there

Against whom, the US or Ukraine?

[ChumpDumper]

:lol derp melting down

[Ef-man]

Half of your side claims the US subbed in. You look pretty stupid about now.

Take your “L,” stop deflecting, and move on Chuncko.

Your statements that russia’s military might is on par with China and US is still not aging well. :lol

[boutons_deux]

Definite pucker factor, Putin will be feeling the political heat.

https://m.republicworld.com/world-news/russia-ukraine-crisis/top-putin-ally-criticises-russias-losses-in-ukraine-calls-out-moscows-mistakes-articleshow.html

IIRC, he made this decision alone and/or with a couple sycophants

The more of the oligarchy and his buddies come out against the war, the more of them will come out, and maybe even TV would tell the Pravda

[DMX7]

:wow

1569317899436978176

[velik_m]

1569273008040333315

[velik_m]

It looks like Turkey is kickstarting their proxy war against Russia in Armenia:


On September 13, at 00:05, units of the Azerbaijani Armed Forces began to fire intensively at the Armenian positions in the direction of Goris, Sotk and Jermuk from artillery and large-caliber firearms, Spokesperson for the Armenian Ministry of Defense Aram Torosyan informs.

UAVs are also employed, the Spokesman says.


https://en.armradio.am/2022/09/13/azerbaijan-firing-intensively-in-the-direction-of-armenians-goris-sotk-and-jermuk-artillery-and-uavs-employed/

:/

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1569338519302148101

[Ef-man]

Russians fucked around and are finding out. :tu

https://twitter.com/JominiW/status/1569506286001070080

[Ef-man]

:lmao

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1569379989107408896

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/JominiW/status/1569506295434342404

[Brazil]

5 days... :lmao

[DMC]

Take your “L,” stop deflecting, and move on Chuncko.

Your statements that russia’s military might is on par with China and US is still not aging well. :lol

Parroting the same stupid line won't save you. Since the US was called in for support and your side claims the US is at war with Russia, then Russia is fighting the US and Ukraine. So Ukraine could not handle Russia, as I said. They didn't stand a snowball's chance in hell.

[horseshue]

Parroting the same stupid line won't save you. Since the US was called in for support and your side claims the US is at war with Russia, then Russia is fighting the US and Ukraine. So Ukraine could not handle Russia, as I said. They didn't stand a snowball's chance in hell.

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569225808832757760

On par with usa and china. :lol
You are just as stupid as hater, and don't know shit about russia or russian army if you think that shitshow is on par with usa or china. Maybe on par with zimbabve at best. You dumb fuck love to look at statistics how many planes tanks and soldiers are there, to determin who is better. In real life less than 10% of those numbers exists in real life, and of those 10%, 95% is soviet made. That means it is 30+ years old.

[DMC]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569225808832757760

On par with usa and china. :lol
You are just as stupid as hater, and don't know shit about russia or russian army if you think that shitshow is on par with usa or china. Maybe on par with zimbabve at best. You dumb fuck love to look at statistics how many planes tanks and soldiers are there, to determin who is better. In real life less than 10% of those numbers exists in real life, and of those 10%, 95% is soviet made. That means it is 30+ years old.

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/as-emergency-nato-summit-begins-zelensky-pleads-for-aid

Russia is such an easy clean that Zelensky had to publicly beg for help.

I'll take stats over your emotional assessment based on the eyeball test, horseshit..

[DMC]

Every notable military website lists Russia as the 2nd most powerful military in the world with China 3rd. You idiots thinking this as an EA Sports game with attributes and sliders are hilarious.

[RandomGuy]

https://twitter.com/JominiW/status/1569506295434342404

They are going to roll up on that flank, and move to retake all of the Donbass region.

[RandomGuy]

Libs watching Ukraine Nazi propaganda on twitter

https://media2.giphy.com/media/CO7xyiUlvkG6Q/giphy.gif?cid=790b7611f54e58750b9df1a3674e93553db6 8e79d9e67e64&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g

"Ukraine Nazi"

That is some seriously hurr dee durr shit. Tell me you can't think for yourself without telling me you can't think for yourself. :lol

[spurraider21]

Every notable military website lists Russia as the 2nd most powerful military in the world with China 3rd. You idiots thinking this as an EA Sports game with attributes and sliders are hilarious.
Turned out they were wrong

[RandomGuy]

Every notable military website lists Russia as the 2nd most powerful military in the world with China 3rd. You idiots thinking this as an EA Sports game with attributes and sliders are hilarious.

The root of your problem is that you are very bad about confirmation bias, and critical thinking.

Your quote "they are the second most powerful army in the world" was about a month into the 3-day war. Anyone who has an evidence based reality should have realized very early that the Russian army sucked ass. It took me roughly 10 days to realize that RUS was going to have a tough time, and by the time you posted it was obvious to anyone paying attention how bad it was.


there is no scenario under which Russia will achieve its goals. Their operations increasingly reek of desperation, and the disorganization of their army will get worse with attrition

I was right.

Add in western weapons, and we have the total defeat of Russia in Ukraine. Ukraine will take an operational pause, rest, refit, and resume. They can re-constitute units, and have trained replacements, who are motivated and well equipped.

Russia cannot do any of that, and desertion will melt their army and add to attritional losses, while Russia struggles internally and politically. Russian political class is already distancing themselves from Putin and his inner circle, sensing the end.

Still think Ukraine is losing? :lol

[RandomGuy]

https://www.pbs.org/newshour/world/as-emergency-nato-summit-begins-zelensky-pleads-for-aid

Russia is such an easy clean that Zelensky had to publicly beg for help.

I'll take stats over your emotional assessment based on the eyeball test, horseshit..

Your emotional assessment was to pile on some hate onto something for the sole reason that people you dislike favored it. And you still double down here. How did that work out for you?

[RandomGuy]

1569683217766031360

[RandomGuy]

Im here nig :tu

Already bitched about this terrible outing. They should be blowing out these scrubs by 30 but fucking Greg Putinovich doesnt know what the fuck hes doing with his soft frontline. Instead of pummeling these bitches, he does stupid shit like wait 6 months to turn off the hot water in Ukraine and send condolences about the queen yo brits :lmao fucking TOSB soft as warleader.

Russia should be blowing out these scrubs every damn game.

Now its a playoff series. But Putovich is one more epic loss to me call8ng for his resignation.

Even a Russia led by Medvedev and Kadyrov would fare better :lmao


Got damn scrubs :pctoss

This U?

1569656219668717568

[RandomGuy]

1567221505775308802

[velik_m]

1569655969814298630

[velik_m]

1569672966505390082

[Ef-man]

Parroting the same stupid line won't save you. Since the US was called in for support and your side claims the US is at war with Russia, then Russia is fighting the US and Ukraine. So Ukraine could not handle Russia, as I said. They didn't stand a snowball's chance in hell.

Live with being wrong. Russia is getting curb stomped by little Ukraine.

You made the statement that russia's military was on par with China and the US; they are clearly not. Your sources were wrong and you were wrong. Take your "L" and move on Chuncko.

All you are doing is embarrassing yourself online, like derp, by trying to create a new narrative to blame anyone/anything but yourself to deflect from russia getting its ass beat down on the big stage.

Your other statement: they do not stand a snowball's chance of defeating russia is also pathetic. Take your "L" and move on Chuncko.

The russians developed a plan to take over their next-door neighbor; they rounded up the resources they thought they needed to win; they determined the time and places to attack for their special operation; and the russians are getting their asses handed to them.

You are a former Air Force lab technician; it is all you are and will ever be. Now go to your cuck shed, take your "L" and move on.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Explosions heard in Kherson. Couple this with the strikes on Melitopol today and this is starting to look tasty

[velik_m]

1569395570212540416

[DMC]

Live with being wrong. Russia is getting curb stomped by little Ukraine.

You made the statement that russia's military was on par with China and the US; they are clearly not. Your sources were wrong and you were wrong. Take your "L" and move on Chuncko.

All you are doing is embarrassing yourself online, like derp, by trying to create a new narrative to blame anyone/anything but yourself to deflect from russia getting its ass beat down on the big stage.

Your other statement: they do not stand a snowball's chance of defeating russia is also pathetic. Take your "L" and move on Chuncko.

The russians developed a plan to take over their next-door neighbor; they rounded up the resources they thought they needed to win; they determined the time and places to attack for their special operation; and the russians are getting their asses handed to them.

You are a former Air Force lab technician; it is all you are and will ever be. Now go to your cuck shed, take your "L" and move on.

tl;dr

[velik_m]

Russia’s budget surplus evaporates as energy revenues shrink
...

The sharp deterioration of Russian state finances comes as its army is being routed in northeastern Ukraine in its biggest military setback since losing the battle for the capital Kyiv in March.

Oil and gas revenues, which make up almost half of the budget revenues received so far this year, were down 18 per cent year-on-year over the January-August period, according to the data.

The EU has also banned imports of Russian coal. An EU ban on shipped Russian crude imports is due to come into effect in December.

Non-oil and gas revenues also fell drastically, by 37 per cent year on year, in January-August, the data showed.

...


https://www.ft.com/content/d9cdc51f-5fe3-4f4a-b0e8-054ef21a2a6e

[DMC]

The root of your problem is that you are very bad about confirmation bias, and critical thinking.

Your quote "they are the second most powerful army in the world" was about a month into the 3-day war. Anyone who has an evidence based reality should have realized very early that the Russian army sucked ass. It took me roughly 10 days to realize that RUS was going to have a tough time, and by the time you posted it was obvious to anyone paying attention how bad it was.



I was right.

Add in western weapons, and we have the total defeat of Russia in Ukraine. Ukraine will take an operational pause, rest, refit, and resume. They can re-constitute units, and have trained replacements, who are motivated and well equipped.

Russia cannot do any of that, and desertion will melt their army and add to attritional losses, while Russia struggles internally and politically. Russian political class is already distancing themselves from Putin and his inner circle, sensing the end.

Still think Ukraine is losing? :lol

:lol

Add in an entire new team and the Sacramento Kings are the best team in the league.

Zelensky begged for help. Begged.

"US is at war with Russia" -El Nono

I never said the US couldn't beat Russia.

[horseshue]

Every notable military website lists Russia as the 2nd most powerful military in the world with China 3rd. You idiots thinking this as an EA Sports game with attributes and sliders are hilarious.

Every notable means mostly american. None of them has ever been in russia, let alone in russian army. Do you know anyone who has served in russian/soviet army. Ask them, do they think like those websites? Russian military ar almighty only against their small neighbors like georgia and in short time. Americans gave ukraine 12 himars, and it was enough to crush russians. Americans have hundreds of them. What do russians have?

[Trill Clinton]

Explosions heard in Kherson. Couple this with the strikes on Melitopol today and this is starting to look tasty


Appreciate the updates. Stay safe out there.

[horseshue]

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1569573476108828678

Second army of the world! On par with usa and china! :rollin :rollin :rollin

[ElNono]

Russia will survive, Russian Federation on the other hand...? They are plenty of unhappy regions in this "federation" of theirs. This could all end in collapse of Soviet union part 2, this time more bloody.

All they want is an end to the current regime. Sure, that can prove bloody. I was just pointing out that the country itself isn't in danger.

[DMC]

Yeah, a single soldier proves your point :lol

More shit posts from the goofy, name swapping twins.

[DMC]

Every notable means mostly american. None of them has ever been in russia, let alone in russian army. Do you know anyone who has served in russian/soviet army. Ask them, do they think like those websites? Russian military ar almighty only against their small neighbors like georgia and in short time. Americans gave ukraine 12 himars, and it was enough to crush russians. Americans have hundreds of them. What do russians have?

:lol ass clown, Russia has nukes.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol derp is taking Russia's L very personally.

[horseshue]

1569655969814298630

Second best army in the world. :lol On par with usa and china! :lol

[spurraider21]

:lol ass clown, Russia has nukes.
and how has those assisted them in any armed conflict to date?

[Isitjustme?]

1569672966505390082

Love the shout-out to America. Feels good mayne

[DMC]

and how has those assisted them in any armed conflict to date?

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2022/2/25/22949351/ukraine-russia-us-troops-no-fly-zone-nuclear-weapons
The logic of mutually assured destruction that defined the Cold War still works, to some degree: Russia’s arsenal makes any direct intervention in Ukraine riskier than any rational American leader could tolerate. In a sense, then, Russia’s nuclear weapons make it less likely that the conflict will kick off World War III.

But in another sense, Russia’s nuclear arsenal also helped create the conditions where Putin’s invasion could happen in the first place.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60499385

The danger of a superpower confrontation
That's the bottom line - Putin's stockpile of nuclear warheads.

Biden doesn't want to spark a "world war" by risking a direct clash between American and Russian troops in Ukraine and he's been open about that.

"It's not like we're dealing with a terrorist organisation," the president told NBC earlier this month. "We're dealing with one of the largest armies in the world. This is a very difficult situation, and things could go crazy quickly."


So I'd say by keeping more powerful nuclear nations at bay.

[ChumpDumper]

But you say the US is not at bay because it -- a powerful nuclear nation -- is helping Ukraine.

Pick a lane.

[spurraider21]

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2022/2/25/22949351/ukraine-russia-us-troops-no-fly-zone-nuclear-weapons
The logic of mutually assured destruction that defined the Cold War still works, to some degree: Russia’s arsenal makes any direct intervention in Ukraine riskier than any rational American leader could tolerate. In a sense, then, Russia’s nuclear weapons make it less likely that the conflict will kick off World War III.

But in another sense, Russia’s nuclear arsenal also helped create the conditions where Putin’s invasion could happen in the first place.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-60499385

The danger of a superpower confrontation
That's the bottom line - Putin's stockpile of nuclear warheads.

Biden doesn't want to spark a "world war" by risking a direct clash between American and Russian troops in Ukraine and he's been open about that.

"It's not like we're dealing with a terrorist organisation," the president told NBC earlier this month. "We're dealing with one of the largest armies in the world. This is a very difficult situation, and things could go crazy quickly."


So I'd say by keeping more powerful nuclear nations at bay.


But you say the US is not at bay because it -- a powerful nuclear nation -- is helping Ukraine.

Pick a lane.
:wow

[Trill Clinton]

1569446918455005188

[Isitjustme?]

1569672363100217347

[ChumpDumper]

1569672363100217347

:lmao happened with a few ST posters too, it seems.

[benefactor]

and how has those assisted them in any armed conflict to date?
Exactly...and they aren't going to use them on the Ukraine.

It's not like the world is giving any sort of huge, advantageous technology to the Ukraine. If Russia is as powerful as some seem to think they are then they should still be able to win fairly easily...but they aren't...because they are using antiquated military tactics. Its like the big strong guy who can't fight worth a shit walking up on a trained boxer who is only 160 lbs.

[DeadlyDynasty]

Exactly...and they aren't going to use them on the Ukraine.

It's not like the world is giving any sort of huge, advantageous technology to the Ukraine. If Russia is as powerful as some seem to think they are then they should still be able to win fairly easily...but they aren't...because they are using antiquated military tactics. Its like the big strong guy who can't fight worth a shit walking up on a trained boxer who is only 160 lbs.
This is the whole idea I think most of us are having trouble understanding, and what some of the back and forth in this thread is really centered on. Yes, Ukraine left to its own devices would likely not be able to stand up to Russia for very long, but even before the HIMARS and howitzers rolled in Russia was still doing asinine shit in the field, like that embarrassing traffic jam to Kyiv that ended in disaster with them having to vacate Kyiv, Chernihiv and Sumy regions completely.

How can a country so rich in military resources put absolutely no premium on strategy and tactics? They do the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen from a supposed superpower, and have remarkably atrocious discipline when faced with any adversity in the field.

They’re a walking disaster and an embarrassment to military doctrine.

[Winehole23]

This is the whole idea I think most of us are having trouble understanding, and what some of the back and forth in this thread is really centered on. Yes, Ukraine left to its own devices would likely not be able to stand up to Russia for very long, but even before the HIMARS and howitzers rolled in Russia was still doing asinine shit in the field, like that embarrassing traffic jam to Kyiv that ended in disaster with them having to vacate Kyiv, Chernihiv and Sumy regions completely.

How can a country so rich in military resources put absolutely no premium on strategy and tactics? They do the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen from a supposed superpower, and have remarkably atrocious discipline when faced with any adversity in the field.

They’re a walking disaster and an embarrassment to military doctrine."BUT ALL THE MILITARY MAGAZINES RANK RUSSIA 2nd IN THE WORLD"

Q.E.D.

(suggesting magazine rankings are predictive of war outcomes is like insisting on the primacy of AP rankings over actual football games. it also overlooks the the dismal war record of the world's most powerful military over the last 60 years.)

[ElNono]

You need the US to be at war with Russia so you can move on to your next point, but the US isn't at war with Russia. "Economic warfare" :lol

I guess we're also at war with China and North Korea.

hater was right all along, WWIII. POTY delivering.

I don't need anything, I don't gain anything with anybody's war.. I'm simply looking at what's going on. If the west wouldn't be fighting a clear proxy war with Russia, then I wouldn't be stating that the west is at war with Russia. It's pretty simple, really. China or North Korea haven't invaded anybody, though in the North Korean case (as well as Iran), you can certainly submit we're waging an economic war with them. I don't think anybody that sees what's going on would bat an eye on that claim.


We both (you and I) know, yet only one of us has said so prior. Otherwise it's crickets from the left here as they pretend Ukraine is running roughshod over Russian forces all by themselves. So no, you cannot both have your "US vs Russia" war and "Ukraine going it alone vs Russia" war. If you ever raise a finger to make similar points when all the twitter semen clouds are flowing about how strong Ukraine is, then maybe I'd give your sudden, convenient capitulation due consideration.

Nah, I actually called early on, and you can go look this up in this very thread, that you're going to find CIA operatives captured by Russia over there. My line of thinking back then was this was going to be another 80's Afghanistan proxy war, but instead devolved into something much more explicit.
I can quote myself on that, let me know if you can't find it.


Since no war was declared by NATO or the US, we are not officially at war. Now you'll talk about how the US never declared war in other regions were we had boots on the ground, so make up your mind. You're not going to turn that turd you laid into a golden egg.

This is exactly why I said "technicalities aside", since I knew exactly this is where you were going. Yet, all parties involved have been pretty clear on what's at stake here, and actions on both sides speak pretty loudly on what's going on.


Without the US and NATO meddling in the 1st place there would not have been a war.

This is a bold, unsupported claim. Let's not forget that Russia was the first to meddle there, and their original claim was that they wanted to 'de-nazify' Ukraine. Not sure how the West fits into that (then again, nobody believes a word of what Russia claims).


I probably called proxy war before you.

I mean, this is the earliest from me:


Fully expecting "former CIA" Manuel Lopez, born in Arizona, to get caught by Russians fighting for Ukraine.


If we were at war, we'd not need to fight by proxy. Are the economic sanctions by proxy? No. So they do not obviously constitute waging war.

Link? You said we were waging war by proxy. How is that not an attack?

A proxy war is still a war. Economic sanctions are indeed one way to wage war as well, the end goal being choking the purse that pays for the military conflict. Again, this isn't very complicated at all. It's no different than Russia weaponizing their gas supply to Europe.

As far as attack, Ukraine didn't attack Russia (the opposite happened), yet Ukraine is in a war with Russia now. Do you understand how a country can find itself at war without attacking first?

[spurraider21]

the US hasnt had a declaration of war since WW2... is that really the technicality derp wants to hang his hat on? :lol

[ElNono]

It looks like Turkey is kickstarting their proxy war against Russia in Armenia:

https://en.armradio.am/2022/09/13/azerbaijan-firing-intensively-in-the-direction-of-armenians-goris-sotk-and-jermuk-artillery-and-uavs-employed/

:/

Fucking Erdopig needs to pick a lane. Worst EU member by a wide margin.

[spurraider21]

Fucking Erdopig needs to pick a lane. Worst EU member by a wide margin.
armenia has basically allowed itself to be a vassal state of russia, unfortunately

not a coincidence that azerbaijan re-started this conflict now that russia is reeling in ukraine

[ElNono]

This is the whole idea I think most of us are having trouble understanding, and what some of the back and forth in this thread is really centered on. Yes, Ukraine left to its own devices would likely not be able to stand up to Russia for very long, but even before the HIMARS and howitzers rolled in Russia was still doing asinine shit in the field, like that embarrassing traffic jam to Kyiv that ended in disaster with them having to vacate Kyiv, Chernihiv and Sumy regions completely.

How can a country so rich in military resources put absolutely no premium on strategy and tactics? They do the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen from a supposed superpower, and have remarkably atrocious discipline when faced with any adversity in the field.

They’re a walking disaster and an embarrassment to military doctrine.

There's also the morale factor. Some of them didn't even know they were being sent to Ukraine and to war. Early on they sent conscripts. Most of these soldiers didn't even know what they were fighting for.

[ElNono]

armenia has basically allowed itself to be a vassal state of russia, unfortunately

not a coincidence that azerbaijan re-started this conflict now that russia is reeling in ukraine

I understand the tactics, but ultimately this comes from Trukey wanting to take over the area. It's just a bad look for the EU and NATO, seeing Turkey is a NATO country.

[horseshue]

Fucking Erdopig needs to pick a lane. Worst EU member by a wide margin.

Erdogan is not in EU.

[spurraider21]

Erdogan is not in EU.
probably never would be. EU has basically required them to own up to the armenian genocide, something they continue to deny

[Ef-man]

:lol derp is taking Russia's L very personally.

As if anyone expected to gain great military insights from the former Air Force lab technician. :lol

[DMC]

I don't need anything, I don't gain anything with anybody's war.. I'm simply looking at what's going on. If the west wouldn't be fighting a clear proxy war with Russia, then I wouldn't be stating that the west is at war with Russia. It's pretty simple, really. China or North Korea haven't invaded anybody, though in the North Korean case (as well as Iran), you can certainly submit we're waging an economic war with them. I don't think anybody that sees what's going on would bat an eye on that claim.

Your claim depends on Russia being at war with the US. That's why I said "you need" it. I said as much. Pretty sure you don't need that in your personal life :lol

Let's not move the goalpost from "at war" to "proxy war". The US and Russia have long been toe to toe as proxies in conflict, doesn't mean they were at war.

It doesn't matter who has or has not invaded in this case. Those were not caveats you offered to economic sanctions equating to being at war. These are you conditions, I am just working through the maze you're building. You invoked the term "officially", of course I am going to refer to it.


Nah, I actually called early on, and you can go look this up in this very thread, that you're going to find CIA operatives captured by Russia over there. My line of thinking back then was this was going to be another 80's Afghanistan proxy war, but instead devolved into something much more explicit.
I can quote myself on that, let me know if you can't find it.

I trust you, no need for references. Either way. I understood we were involved via proxy as always, but we are no more at war with Russia now than we were in Afghanistan or Vietnam. Russia and the US have played the military need game with their respective populations for decades, and they justify military funding this way but they avoid killing the golden goose (the opposition) because they need a constant enemy they never have to actually engage.


This is exactly why I said "technicalities aside", since I knew exactly this is where you were going. Yet, all parties involved have been pretty clear on what's at stake here, and actions on both sides speak pretty loudly on what's going on.

Still doesn't equate to being at war.


This is a bold, unsupported claim. Let's not forget that Russia was the first to meddle there, and their original claim was that they wanted to 'de-nazify' Ukraine. Not sure how the West fits into that (then again, nobody believes a word of what Russia claims).

Not nearly as bold as saying the US and Russia are at war even after the POTUS said the opposite. I think it's fairly obvious that the encroachment of NATO and the consideration of allowing Ukraine into NATO while having so many American interests basically infesting Ukraine played a role in fueling the conflict. You can disagree and demand proof but that's a double standard since you don't have proof the US is at war with Russia but you want in on a subjective backdoor condition of "same basic thing".


I mean, this is the earliest from me:

I don't get how your quote has anything to do with the US being at war with Russia. Plenty mercs act as insurgents if the money is right (or they can get a good selfie all dressed in tacticool gear).


A proxy war is still a war. Economic sanctions are indeed one way to wage war as well, the end goal being choking the purse that pays for the military conflict. Again, this isn't very complicated at all. It's no different than Russia weaponizing their gas supply to Europe.

We can agree the US is acting as a proxy, however you omitted the term "proxy" and just said the US is at war. This is what I disagreed with. You cannot just ignore the proxy aspect, unless you want to really marginalize the importance of being at war. The US has served as a proxy for many wars, but we don't talk about winning or lose these. If Ukraine makes concessions, did the US lose the war?

But I still want to use your claim of Russia being at war with the US to counter other claims that Ukraine can beat Russia as these are conflicting claims.


As far as attack, Ukraine didn't attack Russia (the opposite happened), yet Ukraine is in a war with Russia now. Do you understand how a country can find itself at war without attacking first?
But you said we are waging war. You equated economic sanctions with waging war. If what you say is true, then we have attacked Russia by waging war against them yet they did not do that to us. So then who is the adult in the room?

[DMC]

the US hasnt had a declaration of war since WW2... is that really the technicality derp wants to hang his hat on? :lol



Since no war was declared by NATO or the US, we are not officially at war. Now you'll talk about how the US never declared war in other regions where we had boots on the ground, so make up your mind. You're not going to turn that turd you laid into a golden egg.


Philo once again swinging wildly looking for a like without even knowing what he's swinging at :lol

gotheem again

Hey, at least you suckered Chumpy :lol

[Brazil]

This is the whole idea I think most of us are having trouble understanding, and what some of the back and forth in this thread is really centered on. Yes, Ukraine left to its own devices would likely not be able to stand up to Russia for very long, but even before the HIMARS and howitzers rolled in Russia was still doing asinine shit in the field, like that embarrassing traffic jam to Kyiv that ended in disaster with them having to vacate Kyiv, Chernihiv and Sumy regions completely.

How can a country so rich in military resources put absolutely no premium on strategy and tactics? They do the dumbest shit I’ve ever seen from a supposed superpower, and have remarkably atrocious discipline when faced with any adversity in the field.

They’re a walking disaster and an embarrassment to military doctrine.

Ukraine with 0 help during the first weeks and months was holding up against Russian invasion. Ukraine defended Kiev with near 0 support from NATO.
Russia has been incapable to dominate the air space of Ukraine and it is not like NATO sent hundreds of modern jets.

Without help Ukraine would struggle to keep up long term for obvious reasons but this country is huge and people are defending their home against an invasion.

On the other hand, Russian capability has been severely overestimated, their jets are shit, their navy is shit, most of their tanks are outdated and most importantly as you said their strategy has been to put it mildly weak. As for each and every dictator Putin has been lied by his generals about Russian military capability.

[ChumpDumper]

Philo once again swinging wildly looking for a like without even knowing what he's swinging at :lol

gotheem again

Hey, at least you suckered Chumpy :lol:lol your whole argument about Ukraine's beating the shit out of your Russia is US assistance in the waging of war.

Is the US assisting Ukraine in this war or not?

You're going to have to decide how you're wrong, and you're going to be the only one who is wrong.

[Brazil]

Putin has been a disaster for Russia tbh...

Russia was once the future economical powerhouse and today is the weakest link of the BRIC.

Just to give an example of what I'm talking about. When Renault announced the merger with Nissan under Carlos Ghosn, both companies divide the market, Renault for Europe and Nissan for Asia. On top of it it has been decided Renault will develop Russia and Nissan China. It was more than 20 years ago, at the time the split seemed quite fair with a lot of analysts saying that Renault has been favored with Russia on the short term... which is, in retrospect, hilarious.

To put things into perspective, in 2000 China produced 0,6 m vehicles and Russia 1,0 m. in 2019 China produced 25,7 m vehicles and Russia 1,7 m :lmao

Putin took the power in 2000

and this is the dude that Hater and all those fuckers are praising everyday in this thread... :lmao

[DMC]

Exactly...and they aren't going to use them on the Ukraine.

It's not like the world is giving any sort of huge, advantageous technology to the Ukraine. If Russia is as powerful as some seem to think they are then they should still be able to win fairly easily...but they aren't...because they are using antiquated military tactics. Its like the big strong guy who can't fight worth a shit walking up on a trained boxer who is only 160 lbs.

The US was in Afghanistan for 20 years, didn't beat anyone there. For intents and purposes, Russia is still occupying parts of Ukraine, not the other way around. Nukes just ensures others with bigger clubs don't get involved. Russian strategy being shit doesn't mean they don't have the 2nd most powerful military in the world, or that Ukraine stands even an outside chance of beating them head to head. All these caveats and cherry picked tweets and narratives saying otherwise are dishonest at best. Without outside help Ukraine doesn't stand a chance. It's common sense.

[Ef-man]

Chuncko keeps polishing the turd he laid in hope of turning it into a golden egg, classic. :lmao

[ChumpDumper]

derp insists we're not helping Ukraine, then says Ukraine wouldn't be making any gains without our help.

[Isitjustme?]

The US was in Afghanistan for 20 years, didn't beat anyone there. For intents and purposes, Russia is still occupying parts of Ukraine, not the other way around. Nukes just ensures others with bigger clubs don't get involved. Russian strategy being shit doesn't mean they don't have the 2nd most powerful military in the world, or that Ukraine stands even an outside chance of beating them head to head. All these caveats and cherry picked tweets and narratives saying otherwise are dishonest at best. Without outside help Ukraine doesn't stand a chance. It's common sense.

1569392150638460931

[DMC]

1569392150638460931

Surely a win for the US.

[DMC]

Chuncko keeps polishing the turd he laid in hope of turning it into a golden egg, classic. :lmao

Cookie cutter, low effort retort from another mimic twin.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol derp caught his own tail

[ChumpDumper]

.

[pgardn]

DMC still trying to equate Russia and their invasion into Ukraine with US misadventures.

sorry this is a very different conflict in a very different time frame
you have perfected the art of arguing without having an argument.

[Winehole23]

Posting to create plausible deniablity for own takes. Very plausible. Sometimes goes full Marcus Aurelius, pretending to have none, in impeccable philosophical repose.

[benefactor]

Nukes just ensures others with bigger clubs don't get involved.

But here's the US, fully and openly involved with no fucks given. Russia's nukes are irrelevant. The US has has already proven that. They aren't nuking anyone.


Russian strategy being shit doesn't mean they don't have the 2nd most powerful military in the world, or that Ukraine stands even an outside chance of beating them head to head.

But it means exactly what I said...being a big, strong military superpower doesn't mean shit if you don't know how to fight. The US had all the might in the world but still lost in Vietnam and had to tuck tail and head home. On paper the US should have walked through Vietnam with minimal effort...just like on paper Russia should do the same. But just like the US, Russia will have to eventually cut their losses and retreat. If they haven't taken the country yet they aren't going to. They are just delaying the inevitable.

[ElNono]

Your claim depends on Russia being at war with the US. That's why I said "you need" it. I said as much. Pretty sure you don't need that in your personal life :lol

Let's not move the goalpost from "at war" to "proxy war". The US and Russia have long been toe to toe as proxies in conflict, doesn't mean they were at war.

It doesn't matter who has or has not invaded in this case. Those were not caveats you offered to economic sanctions equating to being at war. These are you conditions, I am just working through the maze you're building. You invoked the term "officially", of course I am going to refer to it.

What part of proxy war is not clear? It's a type of warfare.

prox·y war
/ˈpräksē wô(ə)r/

a war instigated by a major power which does not itself become involved.
"the end of the Cold War brought an end to many of the proxy wars through which the two sides struggled to exert their influence"

Russia is at war with the West, they've made that plenty clear. The West has responded in kind. The fact that the West isn't directly involved in hostilities doesn't make it any less of a war.


I trust you, no need for references. Either way. I understood we were involved via proxy as always, but we are no more at war with Russia now than we were in Afghanistan or Vietnam. Russia and the US have played the military need game with their respective populations for decades, and they justify military funding this way but they avoid killing the golden goose (the opposition) because they need a constant enemy they never have to actually engage.

Still doesn't equate to being at war.

Well, I disagree. Afghanistan back in the 80s when Russia was the aggressor was another proxy war fought by the US. The big difference then was that the stakes where nowhere near as high as they are now (didn't happen in NATO's backyard, China wasn't a player, there were two well defined superpowers, etc).


Not nearly as bold as saying the US and Russia are at war even after the POTUS said the opposite. I think it's fairly obvious that the encroachment of NATO and the consideration of allowing Ukraine into NATO while having so many American interests basically infesting Ukraine played a role in fueling the conflict. You can disagree and demand proof but that's a double standard since you don't have proof the US is at war with Russia but you want in on a subjective backdoor condition of "same basic thing".

POTUS said NATO wasn't at war with Russia, not the US (you quoted him). POTUS is also the pushing the military aid packages to Ukraine, approved by Congress nonetheless.

And to round up about your bold claim, this conflict dates back to pre-2014, when Putler's installed puppet (Yanukovych) was kicked out and had to flee. So if we're going to talk about meddling in Ukraine, Russia was always at the forefront of that.


I don't get how your quote has anything to do with the US being at war with Russia. Plenty mercs act as insurgents if the money is right (or they can get a good selfie all dressed in tacticool gear).

It was a joke to the fact that the CIA conducted these proxy wars all the time during the Cold War. I don't even know if Russia invaded by the time I made that post, but the connotation clearly was that the US was going to be involved (the joke being former CIA in quotes).


We can agree the US is acting as a proxy, however you omitted the term "proxy" and just said the US is at war. This is what I disagreed with. You cannot just ignore the proxy aspect, unless you want to really marginalize the importance of being at war. The US has served as a proxy for many wars, but we don't talk about winning or lose these. If Ukraine makes concessions, did the US lose the war?

If we're going to agree, let's call things by their name. It's not just a proxy, it's waging a proxy war. Not just the US, but the entire West. The difference for the US is that it didn't used to be overt about this stuff, but it is now. I suppose the end of the Cold War changed that.
And if Russia succeeds, it's going to be very difficult for the West to spin they didn't lose this conflict. Plus all the other knockoff effects like reinvigorating China and North Korea. This is exactly why the West can't afford to lose this.


But I still want to use your claim of Russia being at war with the US to counter other claims that Ukraine can beat Russia as these are conflicting claims.

My claim was that Russia can't be allowed to win this, thus the "Whatever it takes", which spurred this conversation. Russia attacked an European country, the West decided (this time) to push back. The aggressor here was Russia, period. You could argue they tested the waters with Crimea and noticed nothing was going on, so they decided to go for the whole enchilada.


But you said we are waging war. You equated economic sanctions with waging war. If what you say is true, then we have attacked Russia by waging war against them yet they did not do that to us. So then who is the adult in the room?

We're waging a war in many areas: economic, military, energy, etc. The war wasn't started by the West, it was started by Russia when it invaded Ukraine.

[Ef-man]

Cookie cutter, low effort retort from another mimic twin.

Keep polishing that turd. :lol

[RandomGuy]

1569672966505390082

Saw that. More Russians need to be treated this way, everywhere.

[CosmicCowboy]

Russia is still an incredibly rich country with natural resources. A crazy "what if". What if China sensed weakness and moved on Russia after they had exhausted their military in Ukraine. I know its far fetched but Germany and Russia were buddies in WWII until they weren't. Would we just sit back and watch it instead of taking sides?

[FuzzyLumpkins]

You guys trying to hold a narcissistic nihilist to account is entertaining. He literally does the same shit over and again to deflect and obfuscate while you actually try to be reasonable.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

Russia is still an incredibly rich country with natural resources. A crazy "what if". What if China sensed weakness and moved on Russia after they had exhausted their military in Ukraine. I know its far fetched but Germany and Russia were buddies in WWII until they weren't. Would we just sit back and watch it instead of taking sides?

Rich in natural resources to exploit but in terms of production beyond extraction and currency worthwhile on the world market they are not "rich."

[RandomGuy]

Russian strategy being shit doesn't mean they don't have the 2nd most powerful military in the world.

I think RUS has fully slipped into a distant fourth of fifth at this point. They have some number of functioning nukes left, a destroyed army, a depleted air force, and a navy that can't deploy against a country with no navy, with an economy that is rapidly deteriorating.

[Isitjustme?]

Surely a win for the US.

Finally, we agree. Thanks for rooting for the US and The West here finally

[FuzzyLumpkins]

I think RUS has fully slipped into a distant fourth of fifth at this point. They have some number of functioning nukes left, a destroyed army, a depleted air force, and a navy that can't deploy against a country with no navy, with an economy that is rapidly deteriorating.

China would be 2 obviously but who do you have past that?

[RandomGuy]

1569679269802180608

[RandomGuy]

Russia is still an incredibly [poor, corrupt] country with [lots of] natural resources. A crazy "what if". What if China sensed weakness and moved on Russia after they had exhausted their military in Ukraine. I know its far fetched but Germany and Russia were buddies in WWII until they weren't. Would we just sit back and watch it instead of taking sides?

FIFY

You would be surprised how rare flushing toilets are in many parts of country.

[DMC]

Finally, we agree. Thanks for rooting for the US and The West here finally

The thread is about Ukraine. Let's keep it honest.

[ElNono]

http://bunow.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/06/steph-curry-drops-chris-paul-gif.gif

It's the 4th quarter and Chris Putler choking per the usual bads...

[DMC]

What part of proxy war is not clear? It's a type of warfare.

prox·y war
/ˈpräksē wô(ə)r/

a war instigated by a major power which does not itself become involved.
"the end of the Cold War brought an end to many of the proxy wars through which the two sides struggled to exert their influence"

Russia is at war with the West, they've made that plenty clear. The West has responded in kind. The fact that the West isn't directly involved in hostilities doesn't make it any less of a war.

Not involved = not at war. Else what are they "not involved" in? War. Exactly.


Well, I disagree. Afghanistan back in the 80s when Russia was the aggressor was another proxy war fought by the US. The big difference then was that the stakes where nowhere near as high as they are now (didn't happen in NATO's backyard, China wasn't a player, there were two well defined superpowers, etc).

You're just revising history to try to be right. You'll jump through a lot of hoops here in an attempt to pull something from this, but your definition in the 1st paragraph clearly states "does not itself become involved".


POTUS said NATO wasn't at war with Russia, not the US (you quoted him). POTUS is also the pushing the military aid packages to Ukraine, approved by Congress nonetheless.

How else do you see "not involved". It seems you're the one who isn't clear about a definition you posted.


And to round up about your bold claim, this conflict dates back to pre-2014, when Putler's installed puppet (Yanukovych) was kicked out and had to flee. So if we're going to talk about meddling in Ukraine, Russia was always at the forefront of that.

Doesn't detract from what I said.


It was a joke to the fact that the CIA conducted these proxy wars all the time during the Cold War. I don't even know if Russia invaded by the time I made that post, but the connotation clearly was that the US was going to be involved (the joke being former CIA in quotes).

The CIA does this all over the globe but this sounds a bit like a conspiracy theory. Either way, you've attempted to neuter war to the point where war can be any sideways look across the room, just so you can continue to insist the US is at war with Russia.


If we're going to agree, let's call things by their name. It's not just a proxy, it's waging a proxy war. Not just the US, but the entire West. The difference for the US is that it didn't used to be overt about this stuff, but it is now. I suppose the end of the Cold War changed that.
And if Russia succeeds, it's going to be very difficult for the West to spin they didn't lose this conflict. Plus all the other knockoff effects like reinvigorating China and North Korea. This is exactly why the West can't afford to lose this.

I am not the one who left off "proxy". Again, I accept the definition you provided in the 1st paragraph of your response. It clearly states "not involved" so you have to settle "involved in what?" It would obviously be "not involved in the war it instigated" ergo not at war. Could the president of the US be tried and convicted of war crimes during this war in Ukraine, as a proxy? If not, why not?


My claim was that Russia can't be allowed to win this, thus the "Whatever it takes", which spurred this conversation. Russia attacked an European country, the West decided (this time) to push back. The aggressor here was Russia, period. You could argue they tested the waters with Crimea and noticed nothing was going on, so they decided to go for the whole enchilada.

Which is your desired outcome. Russia's desired outcome is that they cannot lose this. In both cases "whatever it takes" makes sense to the one with the desired outcome as their main goal. It doesn't mean I agree with one and disagree with the other. I think Russia is 100% wrong, however when looking at motive I think it's important to consider both sides have a desired outcome. We just provide onlooker value judgement. Not saying that's wrong, but it does skew the conversation to homer takes and squashes any dialogue to the contrary of the chorus here.

Also, Crimea was annexed, not invaded. Maybe a technicality but AFAIK only six deaths during this annexation. The US didn't do shit because we didn't have strategic interest. Suddenly we care.


We're waging a war in many areas: economic, military, energy, etc. The war wasn't started by the West, it was started by Russia when it invaded Ukraine.
This is you again trying to diminish the concept of war to just a disagreement. We may have enacted sanctions, maybe we have withheld energy, these are alternatives to war. They aren't war itself. Ukraine isn't part of NATO, not part of the US and the US has no responsibility to intervene. So to say Russia started it, you need to clarify who they started it with, and if they really started it with the US, why aren't we bombing the shit out of them?

I think everyone knows the answer to that.

[DMC]

China would be 2 obviously but who do you have past that?

He's got nobody. These are emotional arguments devoid of reason.

[FuzzyLumpkins]

He's got nobody. These are emotional arguments devoid of reason.

Talk about not caring what someone's opinion is. . . .

Even if he doesn't you are still wrong.

[ElNono]

Not involved = not at war. Else what are they "not involved" in? War. Exactly.

The point of me posting the definition was to make clear it's a war, by definition. Your new swerve is also invalid, by "involved" it means involved directly in the hostilities. ie:

A proxy war is an armed conflict between two states or non-state actors, one or both of which act at the instigation or on behalf of other parties that are not directly involved in the hostilities. In order for a conflict to be considered a proxy war, there must be a direct, long-term relationship between external actors and the belligerents involved. The aforementioned relationship usually takes the form of funding, military training, arms, or other forms of material assistance which assist a belligerent party in sustaining its war effort.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proxy_war

Ukranians are killing Ruskies with weapons, intel and training from the West, which happens openly. I don't know how much more clear this needs to be.


You're just revising history to try to be right. You'll jump through a lot of hoops here in an attempt to pull something from this, but your definition in the 1st paragraph clearly states "does not itself become involved".

This isn't about me or what I'm trying to do, I know exactly what I'm saying. If you dispute that the Afghanistan war in the 80s when Russia invaded didn't include a proxy war with the US, then state so, then proceed to look up Operation Cyclone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone)


How else do you see "not involved". It seems you're the one who isn't clear about a definition you posted.

Looks like the only one having problem understanding what a proxy war is you, not me. First it wasn't a war. Now that we moved past that, you hang your hat on "not involved", where you are wrong again. Let's see once we move past that what's the next part you don't understand. Don't worry, I'm patient.


Doesn't detract from what I said.

Of course it does, you claimed this war wouldn't have happened without the US and NATO meddling in Ukraine, and that's A) a claim you didn't back up, and B) if there was any meddling, it was after Russia that started with it in the first place.


The CIA does this all over the globe but this sounds a bit like a conspiracy theory. Either way, you've attempted to neuter war to the point where war can be any sideways look across the room, just so you can continue to insist the US is at war with Russia.

It's fairly well documented, see link above. Nicaragua in the 80s as well. Like I said, if there's anything surprising in this conflict, is that it's now in the open.

And I didn't neuter anything. War is waged in a multitude of ways. It's not just armed conflict. Cyberattacks are, for example, another way war is constantly waged as well nowadays.


I am not the one who left off "proxy". Again, I accept the definition you provided in the 1st paragraph of your response. It clearly states "not involved" so you have to settle "involved in what?" It would obviously be "not involved in the war it instigated" ergo not at war. Could the president of the US be tried and convicted of war crimes during this war in Ukraine, as a proxy? If not, why not?

Then you're accepting that a proxy war is just another war, and "proxy" is just indicative of the type of war being waged. And it's "obviously" none of that. It simply means they're not shooting the guns, period. They obviously bear some responsibility when they openly provide those guns, training, intel, etc for the war.

The reason the POTUS couldn't be convicted of war crimes has nothing to do with proxy wars. It couldn't happen in a direct war either, and this is because the US never recognized the ICC:

There is a legal body specifically set up to prosecute cases of genocide, war crimes and other serious international crimes. It's the International Criminal Court, or ICC.
But here's the rub. The U.S. does not recognize the jurisdiction of this legal body.

https://www.npr.org/2022/04/16/1093212495/the-u-s-does-not-recognize-the-jurisdiction-of-the-international-criminal-court


Which is your desired outcome. Russia's desired outcome is that they cannot lose this. In both cases "whatever it takes" makes sense to the one with the desired outcome as their main goal. It doesn't mean I agree with one and disagree with the other. I think Russia is 100% wrong, however when looking at motive I think it's important to consider both sides have a desired outcome. We just provide onlooker value judgement. Not saying that's wrong, but it does skew the conversation to homer takes and squashes any dialogue to the contrary of the chorus here.

Also, Crimea was annexed, not invaded. Maybe a technicality but AFAIK only six deaths during this annexation. The US didn't do shit because we didn't have strategic interest. Suddenly we care.

I looked at both sides. One side got invaded by a an autocrat with 20+ years in power, who changed his country's constitution for unlimited elections, rules with a criminal iron fist, and hates democracy. It was really a no brainer.

Crimea wasn't bordering any NATO countries, and Crimea itself had much more value to Russia than it did to Europe (due largely to Sevastopol). That said, I do think the West complete inaction there was wrong, tbh.


This is you again trying to diminish the concept of war to just a disagreement. We may have enacted sanctions, maybe we have withheld energy, these are alternatives to war. They aren't war itself. Ukraine isn't part of NATO, not part of the US and the US has no responsibility to intervene. So to say Russia started it, you need to clarify who they started it with, and if they really started it with the US, why aren't we bombing the shit out of them?

I think everyone knows the answer to that.

Economic warfare is not even new. In the past, blockades or ravaging the crops of enemies was a typical way to wage economic warfare, for example. Nowadays it's simply a different form in a more complex world. When the US deprives Iran from selling it's oil, it's waging economic war. It's asymmetric, because Iran really doesn't have ways to fight back, but that doesn't mean it isn't war and it doesn't diminish the word one iota. Just ask Iran or North Korea what they think about the sanctions.

[Isitjustme?]

The thread is about Ukraine. Let's keep it honest.

oh, not even pretending to root for The West, then. Sad tbh.

[Ef-man]

Poster "B" has that same issue in this thread. :lol

https://twitter.com/visegrad24/status/1569728235977560066

[horseshue]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569936445200076800

DD, is that you? :bobo

[DeadlyDynasty]

https://twitter.com/TpyxaNews/status/1569936445200076800

DD, is that you? :bobo
:lol

[DeadlyDynasty]

Zelenskiy in Izium today. That’s a leader.

Where’s Putin hiding?

[DeadlyDynasty]

From 3-5 days, to this...
1569994755383398400

[Brazil]

From 3-5 days, to this...
1569994755383398400

:lmao Hater

[velik_m]

1569870269191229440

[Leetonidas]

:lol Team Russia looking dumber by the day

[DMC]

oh, not even pretending to root for The West, then. Sad tbh.

The "West" isn't at war. I root for Ukraine over Russia, but can discuss it objectively unlike you.

[ChumpDumper]

:lmao derp tries to join our winning side six months too late.

[ChumpDumper]

TSA, Dale, Snacks and Darrin are MIA from this thread if not the forum. hater and DMC are trying to switch sides....Pretty much all that's left is for Tucker to tell Qhris to say he was for Ukrainian independence all along.

[Ef-man]

:lmao derp tries to join our winning side six months too late.

Must be his Air Force lab technician critical thinking skills kicking in. :lmao :lmao :lmao

[Splits]

1570054832731348992

[DMC]

:wow

Russia’s arsenal makes any direct intervention in Ukraine riskier than any rational American leader could tolerate.

The answer was right there in my response.

gotheem again

[DMC]

The point of me posting the definition was to make clear it's a war, by definition. Your new swerve is also invalid, by "involved" it means involved directly in the hostilities. ie:

A proxy war is an armed conflict between two states or non-state actors, one or both of which act at the instigation or on behalf of other parties that are not directly involved in the hostilities. In order for a conflict to be considered a proxy war, there must be a direct, long-term relationship between external actors and the belligerents involved. The aforementioned relationship usually takes the form of funding, military training, arms, or other forms of material assistance which assist a belligerent party in sustaining its war effort.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proxy_war

Ukranians are killing Ruskies with weapons, intel and training from the West, which happens openly. I don't know how much more clear this needs to be.

So you found another explanation you liked better than the one you offered before. Involved but not involved. You just changed "war" to "hostilities".

We aren't going to agree on this so we should move on. Although I agree the US is providing funding and material, I don't agree the US is at war with Russia.


This isn't about me or what I'm trying to do, I know exactly what I'm saying. If you dispute that the Afghanistan war in the 80s when Russia invaded didn't include a proxy war with the US, then state so, then proceed to look up Operation Cyclone (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone)

I don't consider "proxy war" equal to "war". I defer to the "not involved" aspect of the definition you provided prior. I never even hinted that the US wasn't involved by proxy, only that Russia and the US were not at war with each other. I do think the term "proxy" is being misused here, however I've used it myself in this way.


Looks like the only one having problem understanding what a proxy war is you, not me. First it wasn't a war. Now that we moved past that, you hang your hat on "not involved", where you are wrong again. Let's see once we move past that what's the next part you don't understand. Don't worry, I'm patient.

Not involved in the war. I think you know this already. You provided the definition. I merely accepted it.


Of course it does, you claimed this war wouldn't have happened without the US and NATO meddling in Ukraine, and that's A) a claim you didn't back up, and B) if there was any meddling, it was after Russia that started with it in the first place.

Never said anything of the sort.

I said this: "played a role in fueling the conflict"

So if you keep feeling the need to misrepresent my statements, maybe you need to win something here. Just say so, I am not pot committed.

Regardless, you haven't shown how Russia did anything to the US or NATO. Still waiting to see how "they started it" with the US.



It's fairly well documented, see link above. Nicaragua in the 80s as well. Like I said, if there's anything surprising in this conflict, is that it's now in the open.

And I didn't neuter anything. War is waged in a multitude of ways. It's not just armed conflict. Cyberattacks are, for example, another way war is constantly waged as well nowadays.

Let's go to Wiki, a source you used earlier:

War:

War is an intense armed conflict[a] between states, governments, societies, or paramilitary groups such as mercenaries, insurgents, and militias. It is generally characterized by extreme violence, destruction, and mortality, using regular or irregular military forces. Warfare refers to the common activities and characteristics of types of war, or of wars in general.[2] Total war is warfare that is not restricted to purely legitimate military targets, and can result in massive civilian or other non-combatant suffering and casualties.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War#Definition

Next let's go to the actual dictionary...

war
/wôr/
Learn to pronounce
noun
a state of armed conflict between different nations or states or different groups within a nation or state.
"Japan declared war on Germany"

I simply don't accept your customized definitions. I do accept your meaning though, and we agree the US is acting by proxy. Ukraine is the proxy. I just don't agree that the US is at war with Russia. I believe the proxy aspect exists to avoid that very thing. So I am not willing to loosely accept that the war exists between the two regardless. As soon as Russia pulls out of Ukraine, the US will likely relax or simply stop the sanctions. There will be no long standing concessions by Russia like existed in Japan after WWII. Any patching of relationships will need to be between Ukraine and Russia. The US will operate status quo, still spying on Russia and being spied upon by Russia.


Then you're accepting that a proxy war is just another war, and "proxy" is just indicative of the type of war being waged. And it's "obviously" none of that. It simply means they're not shooting the guns, period. They obviously bear some responsibility when they openly provide those guns, training, intel, etc for the war.

No I don't accept that at all.


The reason the POTUS couldn't be convicted of war crimes has nothing to do with proxy wars. It couldn't happen in a direct war either, and this is because the US never recognized the ICC:

There is a legal body specifically set up to prosecute cases of genocide, war crimes and other serious international crimes. It's the International Criminal Court, or ICC.
But here's the rub. The U.S. does not recognize the jurisdiction of this legal body.

https://www.npr.org/2022/04/16/1093212495/the-u-s-does-not-recognize-the-jurisdiction-of-the-international-criminal-court


There are other agencies who could prosecute for war crimes and US military members have been prosecuted for these. If the POTUS could not be, it's because he isn't at war. He doesn't make executive decisions about the battlefield tactics, and AFAIK neither does the Pentagon.

But this is all about the fact I disagree with your claim that Russia and the US are at war. I'll let that rest since we won't find common ground there.


I looked at both sides. One side got invaded by a an autocrat with 20+ years in power, who changed his country's constitution for unlimited elections, rules with a criminal iron fist, and hates democracy. It was really a no brainer.

Crimea wasn't bordering any NATO countries, and Crimea itself had much more value to Russia than it did to Europe (due largely to Sevastopol). That said, I do think the West complete inaction there was wrong, tbh.

What action should Russia take if the US were at civil war due to a decision by the federal government to either annex a territory or prevent secession? Why does the US have any responsibility to act as world police, outside of self interest, and can't the self interest aspect be a slippery slope where hypothetically the US is now meddling relentlessly again?


Economic warfare is not even new. In the past, blockades or ravaging the crops of enemies was a typical way to wage economic warfare, for example. Nowadays it's simply a different form in a more complex world. When the US deprives Iran from selling it's oil, it's waging economic war. It's asymmetric, because Iran really doesn't have ways to fight back, but that doesn't mean it isn't war and it doesn't diminish the word one iota. Just ask Iran or North Korea what they think about the sanctions.
This is why a superpower is called a superpower. I don't think economic coercion is the same as war. I think it's to help stave off war. I won't accept war is used to avoid war. I won't accept political pressure and diplomacy are political warfare.

[DeadlyDynasty]

They just hit the pumping station and dam near Kryvyi Rih with six cruise missiles. They are attempting to flood the region along the Inhulets River to slow down the offensive.

Flooding already happening, thousands without water as of a few minutes ago

[spurraider21]

Russia’s arsenal makes any direct intervention in Ukraine riskier than any rational American leader could tolerate.

The answer was right there in my response.

gotheem again
dont think the US would even want to intervene directly. we saw how popular our direct military interventions have been in recent decades. and if ukraine has all the med they need to get the job done, then let them

[velik_m]

https://i.imgur.com/oU7vs65.jpg

[Ef-man]

They just hit the pumping station and dam near Kryvyi Rih with six cruise missiles. They are attempting to flood the region along the Inhulets River to slow down the offensive.

Flooding already happening, thousands without water as of a few minutes ago

https://twitter.com/nickreeves9876/status/1570095106656542721

It will be up to helicopters and/or watercraft to resupply Ukrainian troops until damn repaired.

Wonder if Joe “Fucking HIMARS” Biden provided Ukrainians with US military hovercraft?

[DMC]

dont think the US would even want to intervene directly. we saw how popular our direct military interventions have been in recent decades. and if ukraine has all the med they need to get the job done, then let them

That was the point.

[spurraider21]

That was the point.
irrespective of nukes, if that wasnt clear considering i raised our interventions in recent decades in countries that did not have nuclear deterrents

[DeadlyDynasty]

Kyselivka abandoned by Russians and Ukrainians have moved in. Even closer to Kherson now. Any RF troops on the W side of the Dnieper are basically plant food at this point. It’s just a matter of when

[DeadlyDynasty]

20km from edge of Kherson and even closer to airfield a major Russian base. Possibly a condense of RF to get main defensive line inside “cross Dnieper” artillery range. Either way, if you’re RF out east of Kherson enclave you’re feeling very exposed, assuming this news is confirmed.

[DMC]

irrespective of nukes, if that wasnt clear considering i raised our interventions in recent decades in countries that did not have nuclear deterrents

You asked what good were the nukes in this war. I told you.

[spurraider21]

You asked what good were the nukes in this war. I told you.
and im saying nukes are not the reason the US has not directly intervened

[DMC]

and im saying nukes are not the reason the US has not directly intervened

That's your opinion.

[spurraider21]

That's your opinion.
and its your opinion that they are

so ok

[velik_m]

1569911994433560582

[DMX7]

Russia's latest withdrawals were gestures of goodwill. :lol

[Ef-man]

Rats are bailing and China is ordering putler to stay in cuckshed! :lmao

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1570162192317837312

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1570167658989101057

[DMC]

Russia's latest withdrawals were gestures of goodwill. :lol

I still expect Putin to claim victory soon and bail, like I said months ago. He will say they have achieved their goal of the peace keeping actions and dealt a harsh blow to the Nazis of Ukraine. That will be a face saving move.

[DMC]

and its your opinion that they are

so ok
My opinion is based on consensus. Yours, who knows.

[DMX7]

Rats are bailing and China is ordering putler to stay in cuckshed! :lmao

https://twitter.com/igorsushko/status/1570162192317837312


CSTO has always been pretty irrelevant. Armenia apparently is leaving as well.

[spurraider21]

CSTO has always been pretty irrelevant. Armenia apparently is leaving as well.
would be news to me. they've invoked the CSTO who is already sending some small "monitoring" force to assess the current levels of hostility

[Isitjustme?]

The "West" isn't at war. I root for Ukraine over Russia, but can discuss it objectively unlike you.
Good thing I was subjective then considering your takes here

[velik_m]

EU executive to recommend cutting billions for Hungary - sources

BRUSSELS, Sept 14 (Reuters) - The European Union executive will recommend suspending billions of euros earmarked for Hungary over corruption woes, two officials told Reuters on Wednesday, in what would be the first such move against Prime Minister Viktor Orban.

The head of the executive, European Commission President Ursula von der Leyen said in her annual policy speech to the European Parliament on Wednesday she would freeze funding for members damaging democracy, and singled out corruption.

"We must fight for our democracies... I would like to focus on corruption," she said, without naming Hungary specifically.

But her executive was expected to recommend on Sunday the suspension of up to 70% of 22.5 billion euros ($22.44 billion)worth of cohesion funds earmarked for Hungary from the EU's 2021-27 budget, according to the EU officials. Neither specified the exact sum in question.

...

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/eu-chief-vows-halt-funding-democracy-offenders-2022-09-14/

[ChumpDumper]

I still expect Putin to claim victory soon and bail, like I said months ago. He will say they have achieved their goal of the peace keeping actions and dealt a harsh blow to the Nazis of Ukraine. That will be a face saving move.

This is your face saving move tbh.

[Ef-man]

This is your face saving move tbh.

True, Chuncko’s “I called it” move to bail and save face.

Unfortunately, no one is buying the turd they laid, no matter how hard they polish it.

.

[koriwhat]

fuck ukraine and russia

[Isitjustme?]

fuck ukraine and russia
You don't have to post you know.

[koriwhat]

You don't have to post you know.

Neither do you. As well, you don't have to reply to me either fuck face. :tu

[horseshue]

fuck ukraine and russia

Fuck you.

[Isitjustme?]

daboom1

1569841491081576449

[spurraider21]

fuck ukraine and russiaLol unprovoked outburst of rage

[Winehole23]

is this winning?

1570362525232799752

[hater]

WTF???

I go on my quarterly trip to Medellin expecting to come back to Zelensky drving into Moscow and nothing has changed since last week??? :lmao

I knew this Ukro "offensive" was mostly hot air.

Sadly looks like Putovich is still playing our soft bigs 9f Rasho and Oberto and letting Helensky and co survive smdh

[hater]

Got damns


Hearing Ukro offensives last week cost Ukraine about 10,000 casualties. (Dead and injured) :wow


What a costly PR campaign :lol

[pgardn]

This is so pitiful...

From ISW:

Wagner Group financier Yevgeny Prigozhin is being established as the face of the Russian “special military operation” in Ukraine. Prigozhin gave a recruitment speech on September 14 announcing that Russian prisoners have been participating in the war since July 1 when they were instrumental in seizing the Vuhlehirska Thermal Power Plant.[1] A Russian milblogger noted that Prigozhin is introducing a “Stalinist” method that allows the Kremlin to avoid ordering a general mobilization that could ignite social tensions in Russian society


What could go wrong?

The number of swastika tattoos on Russian soldiers has now risen by 25%
It will be an interesting Russian Nazi count as the Russian dead pile up.
ANd just a passing question: Is it still the goal of the special operation to kill the leader of Ukraine? Or just Nazis? Or just saving the Russian language? Im having a difficult time remembering what the official reason for invading is/was. It changes hourly.

[ChumpDumper]

:lol Colombia is another country that conveniently has NO INTERNET AT ALL according to a buttburt ST poster

[pgardn]

Russia is still an incredibly rich country with natural resources. A crazy "what if". What if China sensed weakness and moved on Russia after they had exhausted their military in Ukraine. I know its far fetched but Germany and Russia were buddies in WWII until they weren't. Would we just sit back and watch it instead of taking sides?

Imo this is more of "war" for ideals from the Chinese point of view right now.
They very strongly believe that democracies are inefficient and messy and dictators are the only way to go.
When it becomes dictator v. dictator then the above would not be unthinkable.
I think there is hope from their pov as they see other countries embracing dictatorial type moves. Im sure they were ecstatic when Trump declared himself the winner in 2022 and actually still has a significant number of people who want him as our dictator ruler.

[DMC]

Good thing I was subjective then considering your takes here

You're a bastion of intellect and profound utterings.

[Splits]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdZ3VdXl-Lc

Few things that should be noted. I start to engage my designated house as its shown to have anti-tank positioned in it. my objective was to supress the structure as our other trucks suppressed theirs targets until we were right up to the village to conduct our mission. During the mission brief there was expected to have btrs or bmps in the village. when I shouted for ammo my guy panicked and thought there was a btr/bmp and that's why he handed me the at4. yeeted that into my designated house. out of the 3 houses we engaged mine was the one you see me put the most hated into. when I was given the 2nd at4 I started to take small arms fire from my house. I stopped that really quick with a round into the structure.When I was able to reload the m2 at 2:45 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LdZ3VdXl-Lc&t=165s) I engaged a soldier with an RPG before he had time to engage myself or the other hmmwv. that's why you see that rocket get fired into the air. I then turn my attention back to my designated house and make sure who ever still is in there especially the window I took contact from regrets getting up that morning.

[Ef-man]

WTF???

I go on my quarterly trip to Medellin expecting to come back to Zelensky drving into Moscow and nothing has changed since last week??? :lmao

I knew this Ukro "offensive" was mostly hot air.

Sadly looks like Putovich is still playing our soft bigs 9f Rasho and Oberto and letting Helensky and co survive smdh

Shithole country Colombian president doing shithole country Colombian president things, par. :lol

Colombia’s leader said he wouldn’t back Venezuela’s dictator, but that’s just what Petro is doing.

Colombia’s new leftist government claims it is normalizing ties with Venezuela only for humanitarian and economic reasons. But leaders’ latest comments show it’s going far beyond that. In fact, Colombia is lending political support for Venezuela’s regime, helping to legitimize one of the world’s worst dictatorships.

https://www.lapatilla.com/2022/09/15/colombias-leader-said-he-wouldnt-back-venezuelas-dictator-but-thats-just-what-petro-is-doing

[Isitjustme?]

https://i.imgur.com/45BQl5B.jpg

[DeadlyDynasty]

:lmao

[velik_m]

1570426432471592960

[hater]

Got damns


Hearing Ukro offensives last week cost Ukraine about 10,000 casualties. (Dead and injured) :wow


What a costly PR campaign :lol

Scratch that :(


It looks like Ukraine lost 12k men (dead) and had 25k injured in both "offenses" :wow

Dear God :(


trePeF5q3X4

[ChumpDumper]

Scratch that :(


It looks like Ukraine lost 12k men (dead) and had 25k injured in both "offenses" :wow

Dear God :(


trePeF5q3X4

What are the actual sources for these numbers, hater?

[hater]

What are the actual sources for these numbers, hater?

I literally posted the link chimp.

Brian Berletic

[ChumpDumper]

I literally posted the link chimp.

Brian Berletic

Who is Brian Berletic and where did he get his numbers?

[Ef-man]

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1570038075031695366

[Ef-man]

tee hee

https://twitter.com/ChuckPfarrer/status/1569683217766031360

[Ef-man]

The excuse parade has started.

https://twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1570132830457589760

[hater]

The excuse parade has started.

https://twitter.com/TheStudyofWar/status/1570132830457589760

:lmao

Our Board Members
General Jack Keane (US Army, Retired), Chairman, Institute for the Study of War; President, GSI, LLC

Dr. Kimberly Kagan, Founder & President, Institute for the Study of War

The Honorable Kelly Craft, Former US Ambassador to UN and Canada

Dr. William Kristol, Director, Defending Democracy Together

The Honorable Joseph I. Lieberman, Senior Council, Kasowitz Benson Torres & Friedman, LLP

Kevin Mandia, Chief Executive Officer & Board Director, Mandiant

Jack D. McCarthy, Jr., Senior Managing Director & Founder, A&M Capital

Bruce Mosler, Chairman, Global Brokerage, Cushman & Wakefield, Inc.

General David H. Petraeus (US Army, Retired), Member, KKR & Chairman, KKR Global Institute

Dr. Warren Phillips, Lead Director, CACI International

Colonel William Roberti (US Army, Retired), Managing Director, Alvarez & Marsal

[daboom1]

daboom1

1569841491081576449

Don't @ me faggot.

[ChumpDumper]

:lmao

Our Board Members
General Jack Keane (US Army, Retired), Chairman, Institute for the Study of War; President, GSI, LLC

Dr. Kimberly Kagan, Founder & President, Institute for the Study of War

The Honorable Kelly Craft, Former US Ambassador to UN and Canada

Dr. William Kristol, Director, Defending Democracy Together

The Honorable Joseph I. Lieberman, Senior Council, Kasowitz Benson Torres & Friedman, LLP

Kevin Mandia, Chief Executive Officer & Board Director, Mandiant

Jack D. McCarthy, Jr., Senior Managing Director & Founder, A&M Capital

Bruce Mosler, Chairman, Global Brokerage, Cushman & Wakefield, Inc.

General David H. Petraeus (US Army, Retired), Member, KKR & Chairman, KKR Global Institute

Dr. Warren Phillips, Lead Director, CACI International

Colonel William Roberti (US Army, Retired), Managing Director, Alvarez & Marsal

Who is Brian Berletic and where did he get his numbers?