2024 NBA Draft Thread

[Mr. Body]

C Williams has 16 turnovers in the last three games and four fouls in each. A lot of offensive fouls. As they enter the meat of the conference schedule, teams have scouted and figured his weaknesses. Not at all a killer, but a concern.

[scott]

My concern with Topic is that he would really seem to work best if we had a Mike Conley (now off the board) type to start for 1.5-2years while he develops. Unless we plan on another season or two of 30-win seasons, doesn't seem like Topic is will be ready to start, unless he is going to have a Luka-like impact.

[spurraider21]

My concern with Topic is that he would really seem to work best if we had a Mike Conley (now off the board) type to start for 1.5-2years while he develops. Unless we plan on another season or two of 30-win seasons, doesn't seem like Topic is will be ready to start, unless he is going to have a Luka-like impact.
Still have Tre under contract next year. hes not a good starter but hes at least competent

[scott]

Still have Tre under contract next year. hes not a good starter but hes at least competent

Yeah, but I think running it back with this roster + Topic is still a recipe for 30 wins at most.

[Ariel]

Still have Tre under contract next year. hes not a good starter but hes at least competent
If we're drafting a PG to be a long term starter eventually (say Topic or Dillingham), I'd still like to sign Tyus Jones in the offseason to be a short term starter and long term quality backup. Tre Jones is probably a good candidate to be included in any trade, and regardless his contract expires after next season, so there's no harm in adding a better PG than him.

[exstatic]

My concern with Topic is that he would really seem to work best if we had a Mike Conley (now off the board) type to start for 1.5-2years while he develops. Unless we plan on another season or two of 30-win seasons, doesn't seem like Topic is will be ready to start, unless he is going to have a Luka-like impact.

Brogdon might be pryable from Portland, if they’d go for the CHI pick for a player who is an ending contract next season. He brings a lot of the same stuff at a younger age. Do an extend and trade, adding maybe 2 years to his deal.

[baseline bum]

My concern with Topic is that he would really seem to work best if we had a Mike Conley (now off the board) type to start for 1.5-2years while he develops. Unless we plan on another season or two of 30-win seasons, doesn't seem like Topic is will be ready to start, unless he is going to have a Luka-like impact.

Could sign Tyus Jones but gotta think he wouldn't sign here just to have the Spurs forced to trade his brother. Could be an option if they draft a forward though, assuming the Toronto pick doesn't convey, since you could slide Tre back to the backup point then.

[Ariel]

Yeah, they all have risks, but I feel pretty good about a number of them - at least those in the range of the Taylor Hendrickses and Jarace Walkers last year.

Cody Williams, just dunno. On the one hand, even in the last few games when his turnovers shot through the roof (he's weak and fairly slow, having to push-off to get anywhere on good defenders) his shooting efficiency has been really high. Like, when he shoots, he often makes. (Except free throws, although that's an issue for almost all these guys.) He has the length to be a good defender, but isn't yet. And then he just doesn't do anything else. Okay assists, few rebounds. I think he got slotted way too high on the back of his brother and will need to move down again.

C Williams has 16 turnovers in the last three games and four fouls in each. A lot of offensive fouls. As they enter the meat of the conference schedule, teams have scouted and figured his weaknesses. Not at all a killer, but a concern.
Might work out in our favour in the end. I have a lot of reservations going with Cody Williams with the Spurs own pick, but if he falls a bit he'd be a reasonable gamble at 7/8/9 with Toronto's pick. Buzelis and Dillingham are other candidates at that range.

[baseline bum]

Brogdon might be pryable from Portland, if they’d go for the CHI pick for a player who is an ending contract next season. He brings a lot of the same stuff at a younger age.

I'm surprised no one traded for him this deadline. Wonder if Portland was asking for the moon or maybe they think Scoot sucks.

[baseline bum]

Might work out in our favour in the end. I have a lot of reservations going with Cody Williams with the Spurs own pick, but if he falls a bit he'd be a reasonable gamble at 7/8/9 with Toronto's pick. Buzelis and Dillingham are other candidates at that range.

Don't really see Memphis out-tanking the Raptors.

[exstatic]

I'm surprised no one traded for him this deadline. Wonder if Portland was asking for the moon or maybe they think Scoot sucks.

They won’t get it this summer for a 31 YO on an ending contract.

[Ariel]

I'm surprised no one traded for him this deadline. Wonder if Portland was asking for the moon or maybe they think Scoot sucks.
Allegedly they were happy with him and asking for a first rounder, which is bizarre because there's plenty of evidence his value was a late first (Boston trade, Clippers failed trade) and that was when he was younger and healthier. But I would be willing to give up the Spurs own 2nd rounder (right now at 33) and maybe another 2nd rounder for Brogdon, if none of the Spurs target are there (I'd take Ajay Mitchell, Kolek, KJ Simpson there).

[Ariel]

Don't really see Memphis out-tanking the Raptors.
They might, but don't have to: if Toronto stays at 6 pre-lottery, their pick has a 54% chance of being 7th or worse (meaning it conveys).

[mo7888]

Way to early, but here is my top 30 so far:

2024 NBA Draft Board
Tier 1:
1. Zaccharie Risacher
2. Alex Sarr
3. Nikola Topic
Tier 2:
4. Matas Buzelis
5. Tidjane Salaun
6. Cody Williams
7. JaKobe Walter
8. Reed Shephard
Tier 3:
9. Robert Dillingham
10. Stephen Castle
11. Isaiah Collier
12. Johnny Furphy
13. Ron Holland
14. Kyle Filipowski
15. Ryan Dunn
16. Tyler Smith
17. Dalton Knecht
Tier 4:
18. Ke'lel Ware
19. Yves Missi
20. Donovan Clingan
21. Zach Edey
22. Bobi Klintman
23. Kyshawn George
24. Pacome Dadiet
25. Trevon Brazile
26. Kevin McCullar
27. Tyrese Proctor
28. Juan Nunez
29. Tyler Kolek
30. Tristan Da Silva

[TD 21]

Since I see the focus with the natural pick being wing, my sense is the most likely scenario at PG is they take a run at whichever of the Hawks PG's they more than likely trade this off season.

If it's Murray and the Craptors 1st conveys with Walter on the board (he fits the Grimes archetype they seem to want and need next to Young), maybe that, the '27 Hawks 1st, possibly the Hornets 1st and Graham?

Failing that, if the Craptors 1st conveys they draft Sheppard and have him play it nominally (less of a stretch than trying to convert Primo) or sign Jones.

[vy65]

Don't really see Memphis out-tanking the Raptors.

https://www.tankathon.com/remaining_schedule_strength

Some interesting things here:

1) Raptors and Nets are separated by only two games and will play each other three more times
2) Nets have the second-easiest schedule from here on out
3) Spurs play Memphis twice, Brooklyn once

Those three games between Brooklyn and Toronto are going to be decisive imo

[TD 21]

^ The Rockets will receive the Nets '24 1st via the Harden trade.

[alfahdlan]

C Williams has 16 turnovers in the last three games and four fouls in each. A lot of offensive fouls. As they enter the meat of the conference schedule, teams have scouted and figured his weaknesses. Not at all a killer, but a concern.

On the other hand, Reed has 17 steals in the last 4 games. If ever UK runs deep in games ahead, we cannot totally disregard these things. Not only is he a sharpshooter but also a ball hawk and makes winning plays.

[spurraider21]

sheppard's defensive production is frankly absurd :lol

derrick white as a senior for colorado averaged 1.8 blocks and 1.4 steals (alongside 18/4/4.4), with shooting splits of roughly 50/40/80
sheppard as a freshman for kentucky is averaging 0.8 blocks and 2.6 steals (alongside 12/4.4/4) with shooting splits of roughly 52/50/80

derrick's last name is white. sheppard is white. the parallels go on

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/ShamsCharania/status/1760001389525152019

[objective]

sheppard's defensive production is frankly absurd :lol

derrick white as a senior for colorado averaged 1.8 blocks and 1.4 steals (alongside 18/4/4.4), with shooting splits of roughly 50/40/80
sheppard as a freshman for kentucky is averaging 0.8 blocks and 2.6 steals (alongside 12/4.4/4) with shooting splits of roughly 52/50/80

derrick's last name is white. sheppard is white. the parallels go on

I don't know, if he keeps his hair short, Sheppard is a little closer to Floresiensis on the cranium scale

Needs to up his brain pan game

[onechance87]

sheppard's defensive production is frankly absurd :lol

derrick white as a senior for colorado averaged 1.8 blocks and 1.4 steals (alongside 18/4/4.4), with shooting splits of roughly 50/40/80
sheppard as a freshman for kentucky is averaging 0.8 blocks and 2.6 steals (alongside 12/4.4/4) with shooting splits of roughly 52/50/80

derrick's last name is white. sheppard is white. the parallels go on

is he a pg tho.....i know he should be better then branham...But would he better running the pg then
tre jones at pg.

[alfahdlan]

During crunch time, Calipari trusts Reed at the point.

[spurraider21]

He seems more Pat Bev/Caruso than a true point. While wemby has flashed true hub/distributor ability, we’re not there yet. Dno if we survive on offense without a more traditional penetrating and passing PG

at the very least Sheppard can replace branham as the bench combo guard

[TD 21]

If Primo, Sochan, Branham, etc. can play "lead guard" in this (motion) offense, there's no reason Sheppard can't. We're not talking about initiating constant p-n-r's here.

If he's the 3 and D, secondary initiator he appears to be, then he opens up all kinds of lineup configurations no matter what archetype their eventual primary initiator is.

Even now, he can pair with any of the other guards in the back court, though ideally he should be the lone small guard so that he can primarily defend PG's.

[Mr. Body]

The issue isn't who can initiate the offense, it's ALWAYS who they guard.

[Dejounte]

We’ve seen glimpses of what amazing defense from a guard (Wesley) can yield for the Wemby-led Spurs and I’m not so sure it’s game-changing enough to want to invest in a guard projected in the top 10 whose greatest strength is his defense. Yeah, he’s a strong shooter. But IMO, this team needs a big boost in shot creation, generated by either the player’s offense or his ability to set others up.

[Slippy]

Way to early, but here is my top 30 so far:

2024 NBA Draft Board
Tier 1:
1. Zaccharie Risacher
2. Alex Sarr
3. Nikola Topic
Tier 2:
4. Matas Buzelis
5. Tidjane Salaun
6. Cody Williams
7. JaKobe Walter
8. Reed Shephard
Tier 3:
9. Robert Dillingham
10. Stephen Castle
11. Isaiah Collier
12. Johnny Furphy
13. Ron Holland
14. Kyle Filipowski
15. Ryan Dunn
16. Tyler Smith
17. Dalton Knecht
Tier 4:
18. Ke'lel Ware
19. Yves Missi
20. Donovan Clingan
21. Zach Edey
22. Bobi Klintman
23. Kyshawn George
24. Pacome Dadiet
25. Trevon Brazile
26. Kevin McCullar
27. Tyrese Proctor
28. Juan Nunez
29. Tyler Kolek
30. Tristan Da Silva

Alexander Sarr since coming back from injury has been dominating for the perth wildcats. Taken it up another level.

Very active on defense thru his mobility and length. . Still gets pushed around a little when it's a bigger body/ base if had to be critical but the man holds his own in general. His rim protection and man on man d is elite. More agile than Wemby, runs like a young Drob up n down the court.

On offense. He more finnesse than power, in the post . Using his lenth and reliable outside shot he a matchup nightmare in the NBL. Very good at prsenting himself for pnr or pnp. Passes very good for a young big. Loves to share the ball and set screens. Comes off the bench, no worries at all


Perth fans love him.

[onechance87]

We’ve seen glimpses of what amazing defense from a guard (Wesley) can yield for the Wemby-led Spurs and I’m not so sure it’s game-changing enough to want to invest in a guard projected in the top 10 whose greatest strength is his defense. Yeah, he’s a strong shooter. But IMO, this team needs a big boost in shot creation, generated by either the player’s offense or his ability to set others up.

and who is that in this draft

[Bruno]

I think Spurs really need a PG that put pressure on defenses with drives and pick&roll. A pick&roll between Wembanyama and a point guard is such an easy and efficient way to start breaking down defenses.
For this reason, I'm really not sold on Sheppard and Castle being good picks for Spurs. To me, there are 3 possible good options at PG for Spurs in this draft: Topic, Dilingham and Collier.

[Dejounte]

and who is that in this draft

What Bruno said.

Making the right pass, playing the right way, being efficient…. These are all normal things to want out of a player.

but if we want anything more than the role players we’ve been getting for a while now, we need to get a player with FEEL, and the cajones to want to try exciting passes no matter how sloppy it is. Or to take the shot when no one else will. I put this attribute really high on my list of players to lookout for because it’s what separates a player from the rest. Glimpses of brilliance come with the price of inefficiency because performing it comes with higher risk. It’s what doesn’t show up on the stat sheet. When you know, you know.

if you had another player outside of Wemby who could break down an offense? It’s over. That’s what Parker did with his ability to score at the rim and breathtaking speed. That’s what Ginobili did with his insane ability to see plays before they happen and his relentless will to make things happen.

Now, if you have both attributes of what I described in the two paragraphs I said above, then that player has an almost sure chance of being a star and there are none in this draft so far.

[alfahdlan]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WFuwO2Ks7ms

Then, that pass by Reed to Thiero at the 1 minute mark, you can call exciting?

[The Truth #6]

I agree with what the team needs but feel that Wright won't deviate from an archetype he is chasing, and will prioritize Cody or Kyshawn, no matter who is still on the board. Being a little sarcastic but not completely.

[Pauleta14]

I'm with Bruno on that we need pick and roll abilities in this team, which we do not presently.

PG / Lead Guard or whatever, we need good ball handling players

[The Truth #6]

Dillingham or Topic, basically. Dill might have the edge that KU is holding him back whereas Topic might be overvalued, sort of an over correction for teams missing on Luka and Sengun.

[MultiTroll]

Way to early, but here is my top 30 so far:

2024 NBA Draft Board
Tier 1:
1. Zaccharie Risacher
2. Alex Sarr
3. Nikola Topic
Tier 2:
4. Matas Buzelis
5. Tidjane Salaun
6. Cody Williams
7. JaKobe Walter
8. Reed Shephard
Tier 3:
9. Robert Dillingham
10. Stephen Castle
11. Isaiah Collier
12. Johnny Furphy
13. Ron Holland
14. Kyle Filipowski
15. Ryan Dunn
16. Tyler Smith
17. Dalton Knecht
Tier 4:
18. Ke'lel Ware
19. Yves Missi
20. Donovan Clingan
21. Zach Edey
22. Bobi Klintman
23. Kyshawn George
24. Pacome Dadiet
25. Trevon Brazile
26. Kevin McCullar
27. Tyrese Proctor
28. Juan Nunez
29. Tyler Kolek
30. Tristan Da Silva


I think Spurs really need a PG that put pressure on defenses with drives and pick&roll. A pick&roll between Wembanyama and a point guard is such an easy and efficient way to start breaking down defenses.
For this reason, I'm really not sold on Sheppard and Castle being good picks for Spurs. To me, there are 3 possible good options at PG for Spurs in this draft: Topic, Dilingham and Collier.
Are any of these guys can't miss types?
Haliburton, Scoot? (Scoot has really kicked it up a notch after his very unimpressive start.)
Another Haliburton level might be too good to be true but praying dog .jpg.
I mean bona fide NBA starter material.

I have yet to see enough video.

[Mr. Body]

Are any of these guys can't miss types?
Haliburton, Scoot? (Scoot has really kicked it up a notch after his very unimpressive start.)
Another Haliburton level might be too good to be true but praying dog .jpg.
I mean bona fide NBA starter material.

I have yet to see enough video.

I mean, Haliburton has massively overperformed his #12 draft pick, Scoot has struggled significantly after his #3 draft pick. Do you want us to do better than teams with million dollar budgets to do this?

[MultiTroll]

I mean, Haliburton has massively overperformed his #12 draft pick, Scoot has struggled significantly after his #3 draft pick. Do you want us to do better than teams with million dollar budgets to do this?
Yes

[Mr. Body]

Reed Sheppard vs. Tyrese Haliburton

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--tyrese-haliburton

[mo7888]

Are any of these guys can't miss types?
Haliburton, Scoot? (Scoot has really kicked it up a notch after his very unimpressive start.)
Another Haliburton level might be too good to be true but praying dog .jpg.
I mean bona fide NBA starter material.

I have yet to see enough video.

There aren't any 'can't miss' types in this draft. Topic would be the best bet of the PnR Guards. Of the wings that can 'potentially' run the PnR, or at least attack the rim consistently, I'd probably put Matas at the top there.

[MultiTroll]

Reed Sheppard vs. Tyrese Haliburton

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--tyrese-haliburton
Interesting.
Dk if i can get over Sheppards minority status.

[The Truth #6]

Reed is a can't miss role player?

[mo7888]

Reed is a can't miss role player?

Of my top 10, I'd say Risacher and Shephard are pretty close to 'can't' miss as role players. That's probably their floor.

[baseline bum]

There aren't any 'can't miss' types in this draft. Topic would be the best bet of the PnR Guards. Of the wings that can 'potentially' run the PnR, or at least attack the rim consistently, I'd probably put Matas at the top there.

Or defenders could just go under the screen since Topic can't shoot.

[Mr. Body]

Interesting.
Dk if i can get over Sheppards minority status.

If John Calipari can deal with it, so can you.

[MultiTroll]

If John Calipari can deal with it, so can you.
My bar is legit Championships.

KY has done a real U-Turn.

[Frenchfred]

Reed Sheppard vs. Tyrese Haliburton

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--tyrese-haliburton

my main concern is that Haliburton is a 6'5 PG while Sheppard is a 6'3 SG who play some PG. If he can play 100% PG, then he looks interesting. I haven't watched enough of him to see if that can be the case

[Atl Spur]

I think Spurs really need a PG that put pressure on defenses with drives and pick&roll. A pick&roll between Wembanyama and a point guard is such an easy and efficient way to start breaking down defenses.
For this reason, I'm really not sold on Sheppard and Castle being good picks for Spurs. To me, there are 3 possible good options at PG for Spurs in this draft: Topic, Dilingham and Collier.

Collier is my pick

[Atl Spur]

Collier could also play the two I’m thinking.

Grab topic and collier = win

[mo7888]

Or defenders could just go under the screen since Topic can't shoot.

Topic is going to be a better shooter than most think.

[The Truth #6]

Topic looks like Cousy when dribbles.

And it's hard to ignore his great FT percentage, I agree.

[baseline bum]

Collier could also play the two I’m thinking.

Grab topic and collier = win

Nah give me Sheppard with the Toronto pick if it conveys and the Spurs take Topic with their own pick, as I doubt Williams or Buzelis will be there by then.

[Mr. Body]

Collier could also play the two I’m thinking.

Grab topic and collier = win

Collier is very ball dominant. He'd be useless off the ball.

A Topic Collier backcourt would be a feast for opposing guards.

[BatManu20]

1760345052897771669

[The Truth #6]

There will be a challenge separating recency bias in evaluating these young players versus, "oh, wow, someone actually had a good 4 weeks of consistent basketball".

[Mr. Body]

There will be a challenge separating recency bias in evaluating these young players versus, "oh, wow, someone actually had a good 4 weeks of consistent basketball".

Often a problem too of overrating prospects simply because they were wrongly hyped before the season started.

Buzelis will have plenty of opportunities in workouts and combines to suggest what he can do. There's room to move up.

[exstatic]

Or defenders could just go under the screen since Topic can't shoot.

Yeah, there’s this guy who can catch lobs all day, even double covered.

[SOMA Spur]

1760345052897771669

"39% from 3 over his past 10 games" for Buzelis, well sure but a bit deceiving. He had a nice 4/4 game - 10 games ago. In the last 9 games he shooting 27% from 3, in the last 8 games 25% from 3 - on low volume. So let's not kid ourselves that he's some 40% 3 point shooter lately. But I do really like the kid and he's been moving up my board. Showed a little bit of everything at the Rising stars game (admittedly I only caught the first one). Him and Risacher are the perfect size to slot into the starting lineup at the 3, so I'll continue to root for him as he gets more touches with Holland out for the rest of the ignite season. Hopefully he can truly develop a consistent 3 ball.

[RC_Drunkford]

Buzelis is definitely trending up and I can see why. The Rising Stars game helped his draft stock as well.

[Mr. Body]

"39% from 3 over his past 10 games" for Buzelis, well sure but a bit deceiving. He had a nice 4/4 game - 10 games ago. In the last 9 games he shooting 27% from 3, in the last 8 games 25% from 3 - on low volume. So let's not kid ourselves that he's some 40% 3 point shooter lately. But I do really like the kid and he's been moving up my board. Showed a little bit of everything at the Rising stars game (admittedly I only caught the first one). Him and Risacher are the perfect size to slot into the starting lineup at the 3, so I'll continue to root for him as he gets more touches with Holland out for the rest of the ignite season. Hopefully he can truly develop a consistent 3 ball.

Lol, you're right, just checked. He's still garbage from range.

Also, he rebounds well but I'm not sure whether that's Inflated due to the G League. Hard to tell, but Kuminga, Scoot, they all rebound in the league about half of what they did in the Godawful League.

Have no idea how NCAA rebounding stats or Euro stats translate. Like, Cody nor Riz rebound well at all. I've heard the Euro leagues tend to have a slower pace and bigs are probably more valued (no insane rules changes, fewer rebounds to be had).

[Harry Callahan]

He plays with some force on the offensive end and is skilled. Looks pretty good.

[Harry Callahan]

These players are not finished products. Harder to evaluate sometimes. The Wemby's of the world are not available very often - the lesser prospects have holes to their game at 18 to 20 Years Old.

[Atl Spur]

Collier is very ball dominant. He'd be useless off the ball.

A Topic Collier backcourt would be a feast for opposing guards.

They said the same thing about SGA and giddy….. I’d give it a look

[Atl Spur]

Okc continuously selects pgs because there will always be a need for ball handling / passing; good pgs can make avg players look good. This might be that rare case where we can grab two elite pgs in those two areas

[Mr. Body]

They said the same thing about SGA and giddy….. I’d give it a look

Lol wut

[TD 21]

As much as they need primary shot creation, it needs to be someone who's at least a goodish shooter.

Everything changed with Wembanyama. They don't have time to waste X number of years seeing if a top 3-5 pick, who lacks athleticism to begin with, can become the caliber of shooter (moderate volume spot up 3-point shooter won't cut it) needed to be a modern primary initiator fit for a championship contender.

Sheppard almost certainly won't be either, but could still be an elite role player.



Of my top 10, I'd say Risacher and Shephard are pretty close to 'can't' miss as role players. That's probably their floor.

Exactly. That's why they're the two I prefer the Spurs draft most (if they select top 2 and Sarr is on the board, I'd shop the pick) because it's easy to envision them becoming elite role players.

Sheppard, in particular, is hiding in plain sight as a White/Caruso/Melton/Brogdon/Quickley etc. type utility guard, who will be 5 minutes into his career and it'll probably be clear he should have went significantly higher than he'll ultimately go because of the obsession with measurables and the perception of "high floor" equating to lack of upside.


Him and Risacher are the perfect size to slot into the starting lineup

Height wise, but this team desperately needs some girth.

[Atl Spur]

Lol wut

Giddy was considered a ball dominant non shooter coming out but a great playmaker; Not my opinion it’s actually factual.

[Dejounte]

As much as they need primary shot creation, it needs to be someone who's at least a goodish shooter.

Everything changed with Wembanyama. They don't have time to waste X number of years seeing if a top 3-5 pick, who lacks athleticism to begin with, can become the caliber of shooter (moderate volume spot up 3-point shooter won't cut it) needed to be a modern primary initiator fit for a championship contender.

Sheppard almost certainly won't be either, but could still be an elite role player.




Exactly. That's why they're the two I prefer the Spurs draft most (if they select top 2 and Sarr is on the board, I'd shop the pick) because it's easy to envision them becoming elite role players.

Sheppard, in particular, is hiding in plain sight as a White/Caruso/Melton/Brogdon/Quickley etc. type utility guard, who will be 5 minutes into his career and it'll probably be clear he should have went significantly higher than he'll ultimately go because of the obsession with measurables and the perception of "high floor" equating to lack of upside.



Height wise, but this team desperately needs some girth.
Sheppard is also an American White non-center player and those types haven’t been drafted in the top 10 in over a decade unless I’m missing forgetting somebody.

[The Truth #6]

Utah, unable to help themselves, might grab Reed.

[BackHome]

One thing is that people have to be realistic none of these players are close to Wemby when it comes to day 1 starters. I can see maybe the top 3 getting some playing time with the big league and depending how that goes they may stay or be sent down. But for the the vast majority I definitely see most of them spending the whole season in G League

[MultiTroll]

Buzelis is giving me a little stiffy but watched Sheppard tonight vs LSU and not impressed.

[heyheymymy]

Dilly 2pts 1-6 so far midway through the 2nd half

[itzsoweezee]

Dillingham is legit. This guy’s a baller

[heyheymymy]

Dilly pretty much single handedly put his team in a position to win

Sensational last 10 mins where he came alive and looked like the real deal

Concerning play for most of the game but if he can flip a switch like that when the game is on the line it's something you have to look at size issues and all

[Mr. Body]

Dilly 2pts 1-6 so far midway through the 2nd half

This didn't age well.

[MultiTroll]

Unless i am confusing the left handed dribbler on Kentucky.....
Make Dilly dribble with his R and go to his R.

LSU seems dumb as rocks, never did.

Nice last shot by Dilly but if this guy is supposed to be some top 5 pick, i must be missing something.
Granted, 1st game i have seen him.

[Mr. Body]

Unless i am confusing the left handed dribbler on Kentucky.....
Make Dilly dribble with his R and go to his R.

LSU seems dumb as rocks, never did.

Nice last shot by Dilly but if this guy is supposed to be some top 5 pick, i must be missing something.
Granted, 1st game i have seen him.

You don't seem very bright.

[MultiTroll]

You don't seem very bright.
Eh I've pushed your shit in before so you're a gnat on my bumper.

Was watching the game distracted so not too sure on all the names and plays.

[Harry Callahan]

Dillingham could be good for us......
Crazy that the 2 Kentucky guards SAS might acquire high in the draft this year don't even start.

[baseline bum]

If the Spurs get pick #3 it's going to be a hell of a choice between Topic, Williams, Dillingham, and possibly Buzelis.

[heyheymymy]

This didn't age well.

It wasn't an opinion it was reporting Dilly's cold start stat line 3/4 into a game his team ultimately lost so I'd say it aged quite predictably

Granted fluke shot for the LSU win and LSU was like +9 FTs at one point

[Mr. Body]

Eh I've pushed your shit in before so you're a gnat on my bumper.

Was watching the game distracted so not too sure on all the names and plays.

Masturbating to John Collins photos again?

[Mr. Body]

If the Spurs get pick #3 it's going to be a hell of a choice between Topic, Williams, Dillingham, and possibly Buzelis.

Yeah I think those two Americans will get their names in there. This game was pretty major for Dillingham. All those five-star recruits and this 4'8" player had to tote them around like a backpack and almost got them there.

Also shows the issue with Reed. He wasn't anywhere down the stretch and it's Dillingham who has the ball when they're both playing.

[Dejounte]

Rob’s finishes at the rim are crazy impressive.

the way Wemby is glaringly taller than everyone else, Rob is the inverse of that… he’s so glaringly small out there compared to everyone else

[Mr. Body]

Rob’s finishes at the rim are crazy impressive.

the way Wemby is glaringly taller than everyone else, Rob is the inverse of that… he’s so glaringly small out there compared to everyone else


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUEzI9gmK_0

[KobesAchilles]

Dilly is still my pick. Glaring need at SF though and Buz showed some good defense at the 3. Just having an adequate defender on the wing would be an amazing pick up for the Spurs. The dude needs to learn how to shoot fucking 3s though. In a perfect world we get both and call it a day

[alfahdlan]

Yeah I think those two Americans will get their names in there. This game was pretty major for Dillingham. All those five-star recruits and this 4'8" player had to tote them around like a backpack and almost got them there.

Also shows the issue with Reed. He wasn't anywhere down the stretch and it's Dillingham who has the ball when they're both playing.
Reed's responsibility is to make the offense flowing and get the ball to the shooters including Rob. The first half was good. However, DJ Wagner the primary guard did not show up, so when Rob and Reed sub the lead had evaporated with the home crowd at LSU's back and they play catch up the rest of the game. Reed has 70 steals in 26 games. 22 steals in the last 5 games. Rondo watch is still on.

[onechance87]

dilly had zero assist.I would think someone who has speed and can shoot would have more assist.

[Mr. Body]

dilly had zero assist.I would think someone who has speed and can shoot would have more assist.

Literally his whole team sucked except for Reaves. He was passing, they weren't hitting.

[baseline bum]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SUEzI9gmK_0

Jesus Christ those socks remind me of Professional Douche going to support Trump at his arraignment in NYC


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ArIOowmUJlo

[baseline bum]

Dilly is still my pick. Glaring need at SF though and Buz showed some good defense at the 3. Just having an adequate defender on the wing would be an amazing pick up for the Spurs. The dude needs to learn how to shoot fucking 3s though. In a perfect world we get both and call it a day

In a perfect world they'd get the #1 pick and trade it for an established SF who can shoot and play D and then Dillingham would make it to #7 and the Spurs would take him with the Toronto pick :lol

[SpursBills]

Dilly was awesome last night. That last and-one was one of the more impressive finishes I've seen for a guy his size. Question for the board: let's say that you had a reasonable chance of getting pre-hip surgery Isaiah Thomas out of Dilly. Both the incredible shotmaking and the limited defense, peaking with 29/6/3 all-star age 27 season. Is that worth a high lottery pick? Because even though he's not Kyrie, I think IT is definitely in the cards as a great shotmaker who's probably not as strong but is taller.

[Dejounte]

Dilly was awesome last night. That last and-one was one of the more impressive finishes I've seen for a guy his size. Question for the board: let's say that you had a reasonable chance of getting pre-hip surgery Isaiah Thomas out of Dilly. Both the incredible shotmaking and the limited defense, peaking with 29/6/3 all-star age 27 season. Is that worth a high lottery pick? Because even though he's not Kyrie, I think IT is definitely in the cards as a great shotmaker who's probably not as strong but is taller.

if the Spurs believe Wemby’s defense can offset Dilly’s likely sub-par defense against real pros… it’s a worthy gamble. I’m cringing at the thought of Jaylen Brown posting him up or other big wings he’ll get matched up against though… this guy will be toyed around like a kid if the ball handler consistently uses their strength to back him down. The Spurs’ game plan will have to be them doubling whoever Dilly is matched up against… leaving the opposing team’s 3pt shooter. Just a big liability unfortunately. All that said, I wouldn’t be opposed to drafting him for the potential on offense.

it’s no wonder the Spurs have been trying to invest in taller point guards to man that position. Versatility is key. It’s part of why I’m high on Collier. Dude is built like a tank and follows the trend of strong point guards who won’t be a liability when matched up against 1-5. We saw how Alondes didn’t let Wemby bully him in the paint. That was because he was strong (and he had smarts).

[CGD]

Dilly is gonna come in at 5’11” with a +0 wingspan at the combine, just watch.

[DrSteffo]

I have Dillinghams autograph but still would prefer Topic. Taller and better, Also Sheppard is a better defender and shooter. This is not an opinion but a fact. In a typical draft I see Dillingham would be a 15th pick or so and Topic maybe 8th but this is not a typical draft.

[Dejounte]

Part of me thinks since Devonte Graham (same stature, a needed 3 pt shooter) can’t sniff any rotation minutes this season because of his defensive liabilities that Dilly isn’t a realistic target for the Spurs.

[The Truth #6]

It's a good question about Devonte. But they're ok with Branham so maybe they are choosing to prioritize their players they drafted, I suppose.

[rankingtear]

Dilly is 175 at best with a 6'2 wingspan and is a bad defender in college. This guy is a plastic bag on the court like Trae. There is no floor with him. Either he is a star or out of the league in 4.

[Ariel]

Dilly is 175 at best with a 6'2 wingspan and is a bad defender in college. This guy is a plastic bag on the court like Trae. There is no floor with him. Either he is a star or out of the league in 4.
His defense is probably irredeemable, but his offense is as good a bet as anyone out there, with his combination of shooting, ball handling, speed, and overall skill, he's got a higher floor than a lot of guys who might end up being a lot of nothing. I'd feel more comfortable using Toronto's pick on him rather than the Spurs' own, but he's probably the best bet for the teams' offensive woes.
Also, I think he can be as good a scorer (or better) than Trae, though not quite the the playmaker, but if he's 60% - 70% of Trae at a rookie scale deal without any additional assets necessary, I'd wait a while before making any costly deal that may ultimately prove not worth it.

[Ariel]

Dilly is gonna come in at 5’11” with a +0 wingspan at the combine, just watch.
He looks to me the same height as Sheppard, so if that's the case, it's bad news x 2. For the record, I think he's closer to 6' - 6'1"

[manufan10]

1760665893925695668

[Big Empty]

1760665893925695668
He looks short with no hops, but looks better than Topic atleast in highlights

[RC_Drunkford]

offensively he's exactly the type of player we would need. His combine measurements will be a huge deal regarding draft position.

[Mr. Body]

Spurs fans be like, we gotta trade everything for Anerfernee Simons and then be like, we can't draft Rob Dillingham.

[SpursBills]

Regarding Dillingham vs Topic, I actually have more confidence that Dillingham is going to become a very good player in the NBA. He eye tests well, he's clearly a great shotmaker, and he's got good passing chops. I think the "small guard" argument really only holds water when you get deep in the playoffs and with 90% of the teams in the league having a small guard as your best offensive player isn't a huge issue. The only time when it's an issue is when you run into a team with 5 guys who can all punish mismatches, have the shooters to punish rotations, and have the length and athleticism to guard you across all 5 positions.

Unfortunately, the two teams in the league who can most effectively do this, OKC and Boston, are the two teams that we have to get through in the playoffs for the next decade (Boston obviously only if we make the finals), and OKC is on the exact same timeline as we are. I think that Dilly as your best offensive player puts a ceiling on your team that can only be appreciated when you're playing elite teams, but that ceiling is very real if you're trying to build a long-term contender. Topic sucks as a defender right now as well and if you played out their careers he might have lower average value than Dilly, but he provides better championship equity if he develops well as a 6'5"-6'6" true offensive engine who can be a force multiplier for your entire team. Your other option is to hope you can get a playmaking shooting wing who can act as a hub, draft Castle, and see if his jump shot comes around.

I realize this reasoning isn't necessarily practical when we're a bottom 5 team in the league just trying to get to 0.500, and I think Dilly will definitely help more than anyone with that. But from a long-term team building standpoint he may not be the clear and obvious choice.

[spurraider21]

1760689427251433822

[scott]

His defense is probably irredeemable, but his offense is as good a bet as anyone out there, with his combination of shooting, ball handling, speed, and overall skill, he's got a higher floor than a lot of guys who might end up being a lot of nothing. I'd feel more comfortable using Toronto's pick on him rather than the Spurs' own, but he's probably the best bet for the teams' offensive woes.
Also, I think he can be as good a scorer (or better) than Trae, though not quite the the playmaker, but if he's 60% - 70% of Trae at a rookie scale deal without any additional assets necessary, I'd wait a while before making any costly deal that may ultimately prove not worth it.

Thanks for bringing up the Trae comparison, I was just about to ask because from the descriptions in this thread, sounds like Dilly will have all the same weaknesses that people dislike about Young.

[scott]

1760665893925695668

I’m in. I understand this is just one half of basketball, but this was far more impressive than any of Topic’s highlight compilations. At least from this video, Dillingham appears to have that Ja-like “it” factor on the offensive end.

I’m still interested in Trae personally, but if that doesn’t materialize, then hopefully this guy is the consolation prize (in a scenario where we landed Trae but kept our picks this year, I wouldn’t take both).

[baseline bum]

Part of me thinks since Devonte Graham (same stature, a needed 3 pt shooter) can’t sniff any rotation minutes this season because of his defensive liabilities that Dilly isn’t a realistic target for the Spurs.

Bran Ham is a worse defender than Graham and was starting

[scott]

1760689427251433822

What range is this guy projected to go? That’s some nifty passing!

[Mr. Body]

Regarding Dillingham vs Topic, I actually have more confidence that Dillingham is going to become a very good player in the NBA. He eye tests well, he's clearly a great shotmaker, and he's got good passing chops. I think the "small guard" argument really only holds water when you get deep in the playoffs and with 90% of the teams in the league having a small guard as your best offensive player isn't a huge issue. The only time when it's an issue is when you run into a team with 5 guys who can all punish mismatches, have the shooters to punish rotations, and have the length and athleticism to guard you across all 5 positions.

Unfortunately, the two teams in the league who can most effectively do this, OKC and Boston, are the two teams that we have to get through in the playoffs for the next decade (Boston obviously only if we make the finals), and OKC is on the exact same timeline as we are. I think that Dilly as your best offensive player puts a ceiling on your team that can only be appreciated when you're playing elite teams, but that ceiling is very real if you're trying to build a long-term contender. Topic sucks as a defender right now as well and if you played out their careers he might have lower average value than Dilly, but he provides better championship equity if he develops well as a 6'5"-6'6" true offensive engine who can be a force multiplier for your entire team. Your other option is to hope you can get a playmaking shooting wing who can act as a hub, draft Castle, and see if his jump shot comes around.

I realize this reasoning isn't necessarily practical when we're a bottom 5 team in the league just trying to get to 0.500, and I think Dilly will definitely help more than anyone with that. But from a long-term team building standpoint he may not be the clear and obvious choice.

We really don't need to worry about Boston. Even if their window is somewhat iffy due to huge contracts and losing key players soon due to age, we're not in a Finals realm. OKC will be a massive rival. To beat them, we will probably have to force them to play our style.

As for Dillingham, at worst I think he'd be a microwave off the bench. Is it spending too much to get that player with a high draft pick? Yes. But he can shoot you into games. Unlike Stephen Jackson, I don't think he'll shoot you out of games. He had a bad first half last night, but wasn't necessarily calling his own shots out of whatever system Calipari runs. What we have seen, though, is that this doesn't affect him. He can light on fire, and this wasn't the first time. In the loss to TAMU, he hit three triples in a row down the stretch to help force overtime.

He's just a player. As for his defense, what I see are three problems:

1. His size and stature. Dude's just small, and not just short. He's going to get posted by big guards and suffer on switches down into the post. There's no way to hide it.

2. His coaching. I've seen him blow switches and not know his assignments, but honestly the whole team was confused even last night, and it's already the end of conference play.

3. His effort. The question is whether he's inattentive, bored, lazy, on defense, waiting to get the ball back in his hands, and I don't think this is the case.

He's already improved the last few games, in my eye, not making the rotational mistakes he was before. His effort is good - he seems to want to be at least a decent defender, but then has attention lapses. Pop won't like those -- where a player zones out and starts watching the action. Rob is also a bit lead-footed, letting players blow by him. He's too quick to let that happen. It may be attention, lack of instinct, lack of learning. He also tightly guards opponents high up near the center line, which isn't necessary.

So... I actually think he has slack in his rope here. There is room for improvement. He played for Donda Academy and then Overtime Elite last year, not exactly coaching havens. That he's calling switches and directing defense (if still ineptly) is a great sign. That he's coming off the bench with no complaint is a great sign. He seems very competitive, but not tunnel visioned, very coachable, but hasn't had a lot of it.

Of the three marks above, I think the coaching can vastly improve. I think he'll buy in. I don't think his stature/size can be changed, although he can get stronger. Doesn't seem to mind contact. The attentiveness, the instincts, the constant effort and awareness, the getting caught flat-footed -- that's the swing to his defense, to me, whether he'll be absolutely awful or whether he'll be pretty okay.

To me, it's a no-brainer that you take him over (what we know of) Topic right now. We need confident, skilled, dangerous players right now, even if they're little forest elves.

[Mr. Body]

What range is this guy projected to go? That’s some nifty passing!

Kolek is widely projected as an early second right now, maybe late first.

[TimmehC]

Yeah Graham is sitting because the team is trying to develop Wesley/Branham. Surprised he didn't ask for a trade tbh. He'sthe only guy not named Tre Jones on this roster who'scapable of running an offense.

[exstatic]

It's a good question about Devonte. But they're ok with Branham so maybe they are choosing to prioritize their players they drafted, I suppose.

Players on rookie contracts are cheaper. Branham is making ~$3M. Devonte is making ~$12.5M.

[exstatic]

Dilly is 175 at best with a 6'2 wingspan and is a bad defender in college. This guy is a plastic bag on the court like Trae. There is no floor with him. Either he is a star or out of the league in 4.

I think his floor is solid 6th man. There’s a strong history of guys who are a bucket, but play no defense in that role.

[exstatic]

Regarding Dillingham vs Topic, I actually have more confidence that Dillingham is going to become a very good player in the NBA. He eye tests well, he's clearly a great shotmaker, and he's got good passing chops. I think the "small guard" argument really only holds water when you get deep in the playoffs and with 90% of the teams in the league having a small guard as your best offensive player isn't a huge issue. The only time when it's an issue is when you run into a team with 5 guys who can all punish mismatches, have the shooters to punish rotations, and have the length and athleticism to guard you across all 5 positions.

Unfortunately, the two teams in the league who can most effectively do this, OKC and Boston, are the two teams that we have to get through in the playoffs for the next decade (Boston obviously only if we make the finals), and OKC is on the exact same timeline as we are. I think that Dilly as your best offensive player puts a ceiling on your team that can only be appreciated when you're playing elite teams, but that ceiling is very real if you're trying to build a long-term contender. Topic sucks as a defender right now as well and if you played out their careers he might have lower average value than Dilly, but he provides better championship equity if he develops well as a 6'5"-6'6" true offensive engine who can be a force multiplier for your entire team. Your other option is to hope you can get a playmaking shooting wing who can act as a hub, draft Castle, and see if his jump shot comes around.

I realize this reasoning isn't necessarily practical when we're a bottom 5 team in the league just trying to get to 0.500, and I think Dilly will definitely help more than anyone with that. But from a long-term team building standpoint he may not be the clear and obvious choice.

Someone rightly pointed out in a video that I watched that it’s much easier to hide a 6’6”” guy on defense than a 6’2” guy.

[z0sa]

1760665893925695668

Have no idea the context of the game but it sounded like he had trouble scoring and shot himself back into the game late. That's something only elite players typically do, but -- will he be able to hang with the size and athleticism of NBA guards/wings? And what about his passing? That's the key factor imho. Can he get Wemby easy buckets? Or is Tre Jones still going to be the best passer on this team? We don't need another head down, bull in a china shop type living with low efficiency shots trying to get his own. Last thing we need tbh

[Ariel]

Thanks for bringing up the Trae comparison, I was just about to ask because from the descriptions in this thread, sounds like Dilly will have all the same weaknesses that people dislike about Young.
Oh, definitely, I'm not counting on Dillingham being any better on defense than Trae is (or anywhere other than shooting), my issue basically comes down to cost: anything Trae does I'm measuring against what could be had with a max slot and the assets he'd command (potentially a lot), whereas Dillingham's measuring stick would be the perceived value of any player that could be had at that slot in this class (no guarantees at all). But if you knew in advance you'd get Trae level returns on Dillingham (or anyone), that's a no. 1 pick in this class no questions asked.

[scott]

Oh, definitely, I'm not counting on Dillingham being any better on defense than Trae is (or anywhere other than shooting), my issue basically comes down to cost: anything Trae does I'm measuring against what could be had with a max slot and the assets he'd command (potentially a lot), whereas Dillingham's measuring stick would be the perceived value of any player that could be had at that slot in this class (no guarantees at all). But if you knew in advance you'd get Trae level returns on Dillingham (or anyone), that's a no. 1 pick in this class no questions asked.

For sure, great points! Even if there was only a 10% chance at reaching Trae’s offensive prowess, but the median outcome was a significant above what you are getting from Tre Jones, for example, the cost (both in terms of $ and trade assets like you say) would make that a compelling direction to go. I’m probably still in the Trae camp at this point, but it’s a good argument to be had there.

[Mr. Body]

Have no idea the context of the game but it sounded like he had trouble scoring and shot himself back into the game late. That's something only elite players typically do, but -- will he be able to hang with the size and athleticism of NBA guards/wings? And what about his passing? That's the key factor imho. Can he get Wemby easy buckets? Or is Tre Jones still going to be the best passer on this team? We don't need another head down, bull in a china shop type living with low efficiency shots trying to get his own. Last thing we need tbh

He's my favorite player to watch in college this year, same as Anthony Black was last year. Completely different players, lol.

Hanging -- he's very quick. I'd say his full blast speed is good, but not Parker level, but he's very quick and changes directions rapidly, jitterbug sort of stuff. Ostensibly this could be harnessed into a hounding defense. His height will affect closeouts, rebounding in traffic, slowing down posts, etc. Everywhere. On offense, if he tightens his already good handles, I think he'll be a headache for defenders. His toolbag is already significant at this age.

Passing -- he's a very willing passer. This isn't a guy with tunnel vision only looking for himself. He'll skip the ball across the court, throw lobs, everything, especially on the move. Isn't always exactly on target and maybe whips it too hard at times, or they're difficult passes, but I have no doubts he can play within a system. He's not a freelance chucker and think he can learn when to greenlight himself while mixing in the larger offense. Now... the question is whether he has to deliberate on getting things started, do his dribble moves to get going and whether that will please Pop. His usage is also a touch under 30%. Off the bench, that may be great. But can he downscale and still do well? Like, if he's on the wing and gets the ball during action, can he respond immediately? Or will he have to stick and face down the defender?

[mo7888]

What range is this guy projected to go? That’s some nifty passing!

As Body said, late 1st to early 2nd, but if i were betting on it, I'd bet someone reaches a little bit and takes him in the early 20's. I like Kolek, I just don't like him where we are projected. If for some reason we don't take a PG in the top 10 (maybe trading out or going with bigger wings on both picks) I would have no issue packaging a few 2nd's to trade up into that range and taking him. He's a solid upperclassmen who would contribute day 1. He can run an offense and spread the floor a little bit. A solid second unit manager.

[spurraider21]

Players on rookie contracts are cheaper. Branham is making ~$3M. Devonte is making ~$12.5M.
Despite that branham is more overpaid

[Seventyniner]

What range is this guy projected to go? That’s some nifty passing!

You might like Tankathon's mock draft then:

https://i.ibb.co/WVX4cvS/2024-02-22-mock-draft.jpg

[$pursDynasty]

If available when the Spurs draft would the Spurs draft Sarr if Sarr, Dillingham and Topic are all available? While Sarr might not have Wemby's unicorn upside, would he be the best option on our young roster?

[scott]

You might like Tankathon's mock draft then:

https://i.ibb.co/WVX4cvS/2024-02-22-mock-draft.jpg

Inject it straight into my veins

[Seventyniner]

If available when the Spurs draft would the Spurs draft Sarr if Sarr, Dillingham and Topic are all available? While Sarr might not have Wemby's unicorn upside, would he be the best option on our young roster?

Speaking of Tankathon mock drafts, when the Spurs roll the #1 pick Tankathon has them taking Topic. Every other team takes Sarr. Dillingham isn't taken until #12-14.

They also have the Spurs taking Sheppard as high as #4 if they don't get Topic.

[ginobilized]

Tyler Kolek has so much Stockton to his game, simple, crafty, fundamental passes made at the correct microsecond and on the money.

If he's available with the 2nd round pick, gotta be a consideration.

Here's a hare-brained scheme for you: Draft 3 point guards and let the cream rise to the top! Topic/Dillingham, Collier and Kolek

[mo7888]

If available when the Spurs draft would the Spurs draft Sarr if Sarr, Dillingham and Topic are all available? While Sarr might not have Wemby's unicorn upside, would he be the best option on our young roster?

Topic
Sarr
Dillingham

Is my guess of the order from a Spurs draft board perspective

[rascal]

Topic
Sarr
Dillingham

Is my guess of the order from a Spurs draft board perspective

Most likely Topic will be the Spurs pick. They are desperate for a pg and next year's draft doesn't look deep in pgs.

Doubt the Spurs will consider trading for a starting quality pg so it's going to be Topic.

Spurs will probably even draft Topic with the Number 1 pick but they won't get the first pick again this year. Sarr will go #1 so won't be on the board for the Spurs.

[Mr. Body]

Tyler Kolek has so much Stockton to his game, simple, crafty, fundamental passes made at the correct microsecond and on the money.

If he's available with the 2nd round pick, gotta be a consideration.

Here's a hare-brained scheme for you: Draft 3 point guards and let the cream rise to the top! Topic/Dillingham, Collier and Kolek

Asset/resource management-wise, I might rather have Kolek at 33 than Topic at 2.

Topic may certainly be better, but I don't know if he's a long-term solution with his question marks and using a top pick elsewhere might be better. It alarms me that Topic's highlight packages are just him constantly getting to the basket in his league. I mean, that's cool and all, but that's not going to happen in the NBA. What else does he do? I know he gets assists, but how?

[Ariel]

Asset/resource management-wise, I might rather have Kolek at 33 than Topic at 2.

Topic may certainly be better, but I don't know if he's a long-term solution with his question marks and using a top pick elsewhere might be better. It alarms me that Topic's highlight packages are just him constantly getting to the basket in his league. I mean, that's cool and all, but that's not going to happen in the NBA. What else does he do? I know he gets assists, but how?
Yup, that's my issue as well. I've read people crediting him as a very good playmaker, yet none of his clips lead me to believe that is the case, you don't see many high level reads, he doesn't seem to create much for others, he's explosive and gets to the rim at will and finishes well (even though contact), but other than that there's not a lot of areas where he wows you. Any Luka comparisons are exclusively racially based, they're nothing alike as players

As for 2nd round candidates, how about Ajay Mitchell? 6'4" combo guard, super crafty and resourceful, efficient finisher. Current stats: 19.6 points, 4 assists, 3.9 rebounds, 36% from 3, 85% from the line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8u89nDVYdQ4
I might actually like him better than Topic :loll

[LeBowen]

I really don't like the idea of drafting a point guard unless they're sure he's the real deal.
Would just slow down the timeline even further and every '24 draft prospect looks like a long-term project.

We definitely need good wings more than we need a point guard.
Decent point guards are always available and every good wing is really expensive to trade for.

I think that people are way too hyped on Topic just because Jokic and Doncic are two best players in the league right now.
Remember Hezonja or Musa? Way better and more hyped prospects, didn't make it.
There were also various Benders and Samanics over the years.

If we're drafitng a point guard, he either needs to be a positive defender or potentially elite shooter. Topic is neither and it doesn't look like he'll get there anytime soon.

Meanwhile, Champagnie is probably the worst starter in the entire league.
Keldon needs to be gone this summer before teams realize he's a big net negative.
Jeremy has potential, but can't shoot.

Can't get anywhere near the playoffs without at least two new wings for those SF/PF positions.
Meanwhile, throwing a handful of seconds on Tyus Jones would be a servicable solution for a year or two.

[Russ]

Topic
Sarr
Dillingham

Is my guess of the order from a Spurs draft board perspective

My opinion is:

Topic
Sarr

Then who the heck knows.

[baseline bum]

Topic
Sarr
Dillingham

Is my guess of the order from a Spurs draft board perspective

You don't think they like any of the forwards? Champagnie is terrible and can't imagine they'd be too excited about overpaying say Tobias Harris to come.

[scott]

Yup, that's my issue as well. I've read people crediting him as a very good playmaker, yet none of his clips lead me to believe that is the case, you don't see many high level reads, he doesn't seem to create much for others, he's explosive and gets to the rim at will and finishes well (even though contact), but other than that there's not a lot of areas where he wows you. Any Luka comparisons are exclusively racially based, they're nothing alike as players

As for 2nd round candidates, how about Ajay Mitchell? 6'4" combo guard, super crafty and resourceful, efficient finisher. Current stats: 19.6 points, 4 assists, 3.9 rebounds, 36% from 3, 85% from the line.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8u89nDVYdQ4
I might actually like him better than Topic :loll

I brought up Ajay earlier in the thread and someone responded that they saw him somewhere in the 18-25 range, but it certainly doesn't appear that way based on the mocks. I like this kid.

[mo7888]

You don't think they like any of the forwards? Champagnie is terrible and can't imagine they'd be too excited about overpaying say Tobias Harris to come.

I do think they like the forwards. I was just answering the question that presupposed that these were the only 3 options to be ranked.

[ginobilized]

I brought up Ajay earlier in the thread and someone responded that they saw him somewhere in the 18-25 range, but it certainly doesn't appear that way based on the mocks. I like this kid.

He's got a strong Derrick White vibe, might be better, though.

[The Truth #6]

Inject it straight into my veins

Any help is needed for sure. But on that board, I'm more intrigued by Ajay Mitchell, though still learning about Kolek.

[$pursDynasty]

Not that impressed with Topic at least not yet and Spurs are so talent deficient they can't go drafting by position they need to go BPA, so I hope we can get Sarr.

[baseline bum]

I do think they like the forwards. I was just answering the question that presupposed that these were the only 3 options to be ranked.

Oh ok I see, I thought you were saying that was what you projected the top 3 on the Spurs board to be

[mo7888]

Oh ok I see, I thought you were saying that was what you projected the top 3 on the Spurs board to be

My overall top 3 Spurs board is probably

Risacher
Topic
Not sure on 3 but I'll go Matas or Salaun over Sarr based on fit

[Ariel]

I brought up Ajay earlier in the thread and someone responded that they saw him somewhere in the 18-25 range, but it certainly doesn't appear that way based on the mocks. I like this kid.
Ah, sorry, missed it. May be outside the projected early 2nd range now, I just took a look at Tankathon but it isn't the most reliable source in this sense. But regardless, if the Spurs like Ajay (or someone, ANYONE) they should make it happen. They have plenty of draft capital, they can trade up, down, in, out... no reason not to get their target. OKC realized this and when they feel confident about some prospect they don't take chance: traded 3 firsts to get an extra pick in the '22 draft where they took Jalen Williams, moved from 12 to 10 to make sure no one leapfrogged them for Cason Wallace, etc. Same thing with Houston going after Sengun, Dallas after Luka, etc. If you feel confident, no need to take a chance and wait for your guy to fall into your lap.

[rascal]

Ah, sorry, missed it. May be outside the projected early 2nd range now, I just took a look at Tankathon but it isn't the most reliable source in this sense. But regardless, if the Spurs like Ajay (or someone, ANYONE) they should make it happen. They have plenty of draft capital, they can trade up, down, in, out... no reason not to get their target. OKC realized this and when they feel confident about some prospect they don't take chance: traded 3 firsts to get an extra pick in the '22 draft where they took Jalen Williams, moved from 12 to 10 to make sure no one leapfrogged them for Cason Wallace, etc. Same thing with Houston going after Sengun, Dallas after Luka, etc. If you feel confident, no need to take a chance and wait for your guy to fall into your lap.

Those are assertive front offices, the Spurs are not.

[exstatic]

Asset/resource management-wise, I might rather have Kolek at 33 than Topic at 2.

Topic may certainly be better, but I don't know if he's a long-term solution with his question marks and using a top pick elsewhere might be better. It alarms me that Topic's highlight packages are just him constantly getting to the basket in his league. I mean, that's cool and all, but that's not going to happen in the NBA. What else does he do? I know he gets assists, but how?

You do understand that Europe has half the spacing and twice the physicality of the NBA, right? If he can do it there, he can do it here, easily.

[exstatic]

Ah, sorry, missed it. May be outside the projected early 2nd range now, I just took a look at Tankathon but it isn't the most reliable source in this sense. But regardless, if the Spurs like Ajay (or someone, ANYONE) they should make it happen. They have plenty of draft capital, they can trade up, down, in, out... no reason not to get their target. OKC realized this and when they feel confident about some prospect they don't take chance: traded 3 firsts to get an extra pick in the '22 draft where they took Jalen Williams, moved from 12 to 10 to make sure no one leapfrogged them for Cason Wallace, etc. Same thing with Houston going after Sengun, Dallas after Luka, etc. If you feel confident, no need to take a chance and wait for your guy to fall into your lap.

The problem is, they didn’t trade the 3 picks for JW, they traded them for Ousaman Dieng, who is the only player on OKC that Chip hasn’t been able to teach to shoot.

They also traded #17 to Minnesota for Poku. So, totaling this up, OKC traded 4 FRPs for Ousaman Dieng and Aleksejev Pokusevski. They were also the ones who drafted Sengün and traded him to Houston.

[Ariel]

The problem is, they didn’t trade the 3 picks for JW, they traded them for Ousaman Dieng, who is the only player on OKC that Chip hasn’t been able to teach to shoot.
I wouldn't necessarily assume who was the higher priority by their draft slot, OKC landed two CONSECUTIVE picks and at that point they knew they were getting both JDubb and Dieng. The order used could come down to something as simple as prioritizing relations with Dieng's agent. For context, in the presentation of their '22 rookie class, Presti actually stated that they had been following Dieng for long, and Jalen Williams wasn't someone they had on their plans and surprised them at the combine, so I wouldn't be so sure who would they have gone with had they not landed the second pick.

Oh, and OKC's shooting has much more to do with having great spacing and ball movement to create easy looks for everyone, than it does with Chip, if he was some sort of genie that could turn a non shooter in to an elite shooter, you'd think Giddey would be the prime candidate, yet he's likely the odd man out as a result of his failure in that area.

[spurraider21]

I wouldn't be opposed to taking Sheppard with the Raptors pick if the board fell a certain way. We definitely could use a combo guard who can hit 3's, compete on defense, and handle spot PG duties, because lord knows Branham is abysmal at all 3 of those, and I don't think we need to sit around and wait for 3-4 seasons for every draft pick to develop before we decide its ok to draft their competition.

Even if we took somebody like Dillingham or Topic with the earlier pick, could make for a nice guard rotation, especially with Tre only being under contract for 1 more year.

Could have some really interesting diversity of talents in the backcourt if you had, say, Dillingham and Wesley as the primary point guards, both being blazingly fast off the dribble and therefore assets in transition offense, with Wesley being the better defender and Dillingham being the offensive generator, with Sheppard backing up Vassell, or even playing alongside them in lineups with say, Wesley-Sheppard-Vassell, etc. Can really get creative there.

Obviously wing is still important, but if preferred targets like Williams/Buzelis are off the board when we make our selection w the Raptors pick, can still build something intriguing and then just go sign a FA like Tobias.

If the board doesnt work out in a way where we take a PG in the lottery, would really really like them to be aggressive and trade back up with the mountain of SRPs we have just to grab somebody. I don't want to be in a position where we basically have no choice but to re-sign Tre due to a lack of options.

[BacktoBasics]

I don’t know much about Sarr but it sounds like he’s another Andre Drummond. Not sure if that’s good or bad.

[Mr. Body]

You do understand that Europe has half the spacing and twice the physicality of the NBA, right? If he can do it there, he can do it here, easily.

What do you think I said?

[itzsoweezee]

I really don't like the idea of drafting a point guard unless they're sure he's the real deal.
Would just slow down the timeline even further and every '24 draft prospect looks like a long-term project.

We definitely need good wings more than we need a point guard.
Decent point guards are always available and every good wing is really expensive to trade for.

I think that people are way too hyped on Topic just because Jokic and Doncic are two best players in the league right now.
Remember Hezonja or Musa? Way better and more hyped prospects, didn't make it.
There were also various Benders and Samanics over the years.

If we're drafitng a point guard, he either needs to be a positive defender or potentially elite shooter. Topic is neither and it doesn't look like he'll get there anytime soon.

Meanwhile, Champagnie is probably the worst starter in the entire league.
Keldon needs to be gone this summer before teams realize he's a big net negative.
Jeremy has potential, but can't shoot.

Can't get anywhere near the playoffs without at least two new wings for those SF/PF positions.
Meanwhile, throwing a handful of seconds on Tyus Jones would be a servicable solution for a year or two.

I agree with everything you said. Point guard is the biggest crapshoot in the draft. I’d rather the Spurs spend assets on a proven pg than draft some teenager who will have no idea what he’s doing for his first three years in the league.

[objective]

Ah, sorry, missed it. May be outside the projected early 2nd range now, I just took a look at Tankathon but it isn't the most reliable source in this sense. But regardless, if the Spurs like Ajay (or someone, ANYONE) they should make it happen. They have plenty of draft capital, they can trade up, down, in, out... no reason not to get their target. OKC realized this and when they feel confident about some prospect they don't take chance: traded 3 firsts to get an extra pick in the '22 draft where they took Jalen Williams, moved from 12 to 10 to make sure no one leapfrogged them for Cason Wallace, etc. Same thing with Houston going after Sengun, Dallas after Luka, etc. If you feel confident, no need to take a chance and wait for your guy to fall into your lap.


The problem is, they didn’t trade the 3 picks for JW, they traded them for Ousaman Dieng, who is the only player on OKC that Chip hasn’t been able to teach to shoot.

They also traded #17 to Minnesota for Poku. So, totaling this up, OKC traded 4 FRPs for Ousaman Dieng and Aleksejev Pokusevski. They were also the ones who drafted Sengün and traded him to Houston.

Fwiw, re: OKC and Dieng v JW, Windhorst once said on a podcast that JW was the higher target but they knew they could get him for sure at 12. He also basically said that the reason for 12 and not 11 was just in case some sort of snag blew up the trade unexpectedly, they still had their priority player locked up at 12 and had enough Intel that no one was going to get him before that

[BackHome]

I agree with everything you said. Point guard is the biggest crapshoot in the draft. I’d rather the Spurs spend assets on a proven pg than draft some teenager who will have no idea what he’s doing for his first three years in the league.

To be honest every player in this particular draft is going to be a crapshoot

[exstatic]

I wouldn't necessarily assume who was the higher priority by their draft slot, OKC landed two CONSECUTIVE picks and at that point they knew they were getting both JDubb and Dieng. The order used could come down to something as simple as prioritizing relations with Dieng's agent. For context, in the presentation of their '22 rookie class, Presti actually stated that they had been following Dieng for long, and Jalen Williams wasn't someone they had on their plans and surprised them at the combine, so I wouldn't be so sure who would they have gone with had they not landed the second pick.

Oh, and OKC's shooting has much more to do with having great spacing and ball movement to create easy looks for everyone, than it does with Chip, if he was some sort of genie that could turn a non shooter in to an elite shooter, you'd think Giddey would be the prime candidate, yet he's likely the odd man out as a result of his failure in that area.

OKCs pick was the next one after NY. They traded the picks, had NY select Dieng,then selected JW. I’d say that speaks to their priority. Oh, and they wasted 3 FRPs on the next Poku.

[ambchang]

It following college ball heavily but from the highlights and such dillingham reminds me of Ben Gordan a lot.

[Ariel]

Fwiw, re: OKC and Dieng v JW, Windhorst once said on a podcast that JW was the higher target but they knew they could get him for sure at 12. He also basically said that the reason for 12 and not 11 was just in case some sort of snag blew up the trade unexpectedly, they still had their priority player locked up at 12 and had enough Intel that no one was going to get him before that
Love when these inner workings (little as they may be) leak out and give us an insight into what's going on. Thanks.

[Dejounte]

DeAaron Fox being a poor 3 pt shooter in college is the reason why you don’t skip over poor shooting prospects. Players who start off as strong shooters usually lack major components in their game whilst poor shooters who are good at every other part of their game and only need to work on their shooting. While a mighty tall hill to climb, once they’re up there they usually become one of the best players in the game. DeAaron is the most complete PG in the NBA. I’m jealous of the Kings for having him. A two way player with few to no holes in his game… just amazing.

[rascal]

DeAaron Fox being a poor 3 pt shooter in college is the reason why you don’t skip over poor shooting prospects. Players who start off as strong shooters usually lack major components in their game whilst poor shooters who are good at every other part of their game and only need to work on their shooting. While a mighty tall hill to climb, once they’re up there they usually become one of the best players in the game. DeAaron is the most complete PG in the NBA. I’m jealous of the Kings for having him. A two way player with few to no holes in his game… just amazing.

Then you like Castle.

[alfahdlan]

DeAaron Fox being a poor 3 pt shooter in college is the reason why you don’t skip over poor shooting prospects. Players who start off as strong shooters usually lack major components in their game whilst poor shooters who are good at every other part of their game and only need to work on their shooting. While a mighty tall hill to climb, once they’re up there they usually become one of the best players in the game. DeAaron is the most complete PG in the NBA. I’m jealous of the Kings for having him. A two way player with few to no holes in his game… just amazing.

https://tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--de-aaron-fox

[RobinsontoDuncan]

Then you like Castle.


Castle looks like a potential gem.

[Dejounte]

https://tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--de-aaron-fox

Those two players aren’t close to being similar. Fox having the higher usage shows he’s familiar with carrying a team’s offensive load.

[alfahdlan]

Those two players aren’t close to being similar. Fox having the higher usage shows he’s familiar with carrying a team’s offensive load.

Then, this one:

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--lonzo-ball

Ginobili started with same usage during his rookie season.

[Dejounte]

Then, this one:

https://www.tankathon.com/players/compare?players=reed-sheppard--lonzo-ball

I mean, sure? But Lonzo if far from the PG I dream of when I’m thinking of a championship caliber star.

[SpursBills]

Came across this really well written piece on reddit yesterday which raises some interesting points regarding upside.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1ax7hk7/in_the_modern_era_it_may_be_time_to_rethink_what/

It reminded me of one of my favorite draft pieces I've seen in the past:

https://deanondraft.com/2023/02/01/the-downside-of-upside/

Both are definitely worth a read if you have the time.

[exstatic]

Came across this really well written piece on reddit yesterday which raises some interesting points regarding upside.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1ax7hk7/in_the_modern_era_it_may_be_time_to_rethink_what/

It reminded me of one of my favorite draft pieces I've seen in the past:

https://deanondraft.com/2023/02/01/the-downside-of-upside/

Both are definitely worth a read if you have the time.

I would disagree with one thing. It’s not upside that being overrated, it’s physicality, so called run and jump athleticism. Almost all of the so-called surprises KNEW HOW TO PLAY BASKETBALL AT A HIGH LEVEL. They got to the NBA and continued to get better. NBA teams need to stop drafting deer.

The guy who’s going to be overlooked this year, who everyone will be surprised at in 2-3 years is Topic, who profiles like Jokic, Doncic, and Sengün: not athletic enough, below the rim player. He should be top 5, but 1-3 teams will draft athletes instead of basketball players, so he’ll probably drop to the 6-10 area.

[SpursBills]

I would disagree with one thing. It’s not upside that being overrated, it’s physicality, so called run and jump athleticism. Almost all of the so-called surprises KNEW HOW TO PLAY BASKETBALL AT A HIGH LEVEL. They got to the NBA and continued to get better. NBA teams need to stop drafting deer.

The guy who’s going to be overlooked this year, who everyone will be surprised at in 2-3 years is Topic, who profiles like Jokic, Doncic, and Sengün: not athletic enough, below the rim player. He should be top 5, but 1-3 teams will draft athletes instead of basketball players, so he’ll probably drop to the 6-10 area.

I guess the spurs personally have a great example of the "basketball iq vs run and jump athleticism" argument -

On the one hand, you have Kyle Anderson - enormous length, high bball iq, least athletic player I've ever seen
On the other hand, you have Lonnie Walker IV - positionally small, elite run and jump athlete, struggles with bball iq

We can discuss regarding which if these guys has had the better career with regards to impact on winning. My personal preference is Anderson, whose career and team success has been highly correlated to the success of his jumper by season.

I guess the way I see it is that run and jump athleticism is more of a force multiplier when it's above a requisite baseline. Like all successful NBA players need some baseline level of athleticism. Above that you're looking at primarily coordination and processing speed, with length and lateral agility being almost but not quite as important.

++ Processing speed with average run and jump athleticism: Jokic, Doncic, Trae Young (?)
++ Run and jump athleticism with average processing speed: Anthony Edwards, Zach Lavine
++ Processing speed with ++ run and jump athleticism: LeBron

Who knows, this is all theory crafting anyway but just the way I see it

[The Truth #6]

Attitude and motivation are so crucial. For example, Sengun plays like an animal looking to dominate. Walker unfortunately was often avoiding getting involved at all, avoiding contact to ridiculous extremes.

[stnick2261]

I guess the spurs personally have a great example of the "basketball iq vs run and jump athleticism" argument -

On the one hand, you have Kyle Anderson - enormous length, high bball iq, least athletic player I've ever seen
On the other hand, you have Lonnie Walker IV - positionally small, elite run and jump athlete, struggles with bball iq

We can discuss regarding which if these guys has had the better career with regards to impact on winning. My personal preference is Anderson, whose career and team success has been highly correlated to the success of his jumper by season.

I guess the way I see it is that run and jump athleticism is more of a force multiplier when it's above a requisite baseline. Like all successful NBA players need some baseline level of athleticism. Above that you're looking at primarily coordination and processing speed, with length and lateral agility being almost but not quite as important.

++ Processing speed with average run and jump athleticism: Jokic, Doncic, Trae Young (?)
++ Run and jump athleticism with average processing speed: Anthony Edwards, Zach Lavine
++ Processing speed with ++ run and jump athleticism: LeBron

Who knows, this is all theory crafting anyway but just the way I see it

This is why I'm excited to see Topic come back and begin play. As I understand, he has ++processing speed and I think that's what we need in a facilitator. We obviously won't know for sure for a couple more weeks, but I'm ready to see some games of him soon.

[rjv]

This is why I'm excited to see Topic come back and begin play. As I understand, he has ++processing speed and I think that's what we need in a facilitator. We obviously won't know for sure for a couple more weeks, but I'm ready to see some games of him soon.

the injury was a bummer because i was looking forward to seeing topic's level of play in the euro league. i'm hoping to see him back on the court soon.

[alfahdlan]

I guess the spurs personally have a great example of the "basketball iq vs run and jump athleticism" argument -

On the one hand, you have Kyle Anderson - enormous length, high bball iq, least athletic player I've ever seen
On the other hand, you have Lonnie Walker IV - positionally small, elite run and jump athlete, struggles with bball iq

We can discuss regarding which if these guys has had the better career with regards to impact on winning. My personal preference is Anderson, whose career and team success has been highly correlated to the success of his jumper by season.

I guess the way I see it is that run and jump athleticism is more of a force multiplier when it's above a requisite baseline. Like all successful NBA players need some baseline level of athleticism. Above that you're looking at primarily coordination and processing speed, with length and lateral agility being almost but not quite as important.

++ Processing speed with average run and jump athleticism: Jokic, Doncic, Trae Young (?)
++ Run and jump athleticism with average processing speed: Anthony Edwards, Zach Lavine
++ Processing speed with ++ run and jump athleticism: LeBron

Who knows, this is all theory crafting anyway but just the way I see it

Processing speed of these young talents are on display here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bVxHXSMcgmY

[TD 21]

With the way Pop seems to be hammering home the lack of shooting more than ever this season, I get the sense they've finally reached the breaking point with investing significant assets in players who can't shoot.

Clearly, Risacher stands out as their obvious target but they probably have to get top 2 to land him. Out of teams with a decent chance to end up top 2, only the Wizards and maybe Craptors strike me as potential Topic teams.

Failing that and based on current rankings, there's probably a good chance we see a perceived "reach".

[Russ]

With the way Pop seems to be hammering home the lack of shooting more than ever this season, I get the sense they've finally reached the breaking point with investing significant assets in players who can't shoot.

Clearly, Risacher stands out as their obvious target but they probably have to get top 2 to land him. Out of teams with a decent chance to end up top 2, only the Wizards and maybe Craptors strike me as potential Topic teams.

Failing that and based on current rankings, there's probably a good chance we see a perceived "reach".

Man, it's a conundrum.

You need shooting.

But do you use a 1-4 pick on shooting?

[ace3g]

https://twitter.com/FRABasketball/status/1761291568307150960

[couchman]

Came across this really well written piece on reddit yesterday which raises some interesting points regarding upside.

https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/1ax7hk7/in_the_modern_era_it_may_be_time_to_rethink_what/

It reminded me of one of my favorite draft pieces I've seen in the past:

https://deanondraft.com/2023/02/01/the-downside-of-upside/

Both are definitely worth a read if you have the time.

Thank you! I was about to write a post this week about how “ceiling” and “floor” conversations had gone way off course and these articles summarize it well. The NBA has become less an “athletic” game and more about skills. A 19 year old athletic freak who has failed to develop skills does not have more upside than a solid 19 year old athlete who has already shown the ability to develop skills. You look at numerous recent drafts and the players who turn into stars are often guys who were seen as “high floor and low ceiling.”

Part of how you can measure a players ability to add skills is shooting, but I would also point to basketball IQ.
Players who can help you win even when they are having an off night shooting.
Stats like Assist rate and turnover rate and steals rate and charges drawn point to someone with the mental ability to contribute to a championship team. Do they show situational awareness of the clock and other key game situations? Are the opportunistic to create easy points or create easy turnovers etc?

When I look at the draft class, few players exhibit these traits more than Sheppard.
I like Topic as well and would take him above Sheppard, but Reed would be an awesome get with the Raptors pick.

In this upcoming draft I think Sheppard is underrated.

[CGD]

I guess the spurs personally have a great example of the "basketball iq vs run and jump athleticism" argument -

On the one hand, you have Kyle Anderson - enormous length, high bball iq, least athletic player I've ever seen
On the other hand, you have Lonnie Walker IV - positionally small, elite run and jump athlete, struggles with bball iq

We can discuss regarding which if these guys has had the better career with regards to impact on winning. My personal preference is Anderson, whose career and team success has been highly correlated to the success of his jumper by season.

I guess the way I see it is that run and jump athleticism is more of a force multiplier when it's above a requisite baseline. Like all successful NBA players need some baseline level of athleticism. Above that you're looking at primarily coordination and processing speed, with length and lateral agility being almost but not quite as important.

++ Processing speed with average run and jump athleticism: Jokic, Doncic, Trae Young (?)
++ Run and jump athleticism with average processing speed: Anthony Edwards, Zach Lavine
++ Processing speed with ++ run and jump athleticism: LeBron

Who knows, this is all theory crafting anyway but just the way I see it

Much of this is situational based on where they’re picking, so it’s hard to glean a lot. We forget the spurs were picking in the late 20s for such a long time, that we were almost too excited when we got a pick in the high teens. Historically most of those are trash, which to me speaks a lot about what the spurs were able to do with the likes of Anderson, CoJo, White, DJ, Keldon.

[SpursBills]

Thank you! I was about to write a post this week about how “ceiling” and “floor” conversations had gone way off course and these articles summarize it well. The NBA has become less an “athletic” game and more about skills. A 19 year old athletic freak who has failed to develop skills does not have more upside than a solid 19 year old athlete who has already shown the ability to develop skills. You look at numerous recent drafts and the players who turn into stars are often guys who were seen as “high floor and low ceiling.”

Part of how you can measure a players ability to add skills is shooting, but I would also point to basketball IQ.
Players who can help you win even when they are having an off night shooting.
Stats like Assist rate and turnover rate and steals rate and charges drawn point to someone with the mental ability to contribute to a championship team. Do they show situational awareness of the clock and other key game situations? Are the opportunistic to create easy points or create easy turnovers etc?

When I look at the draft class, few players exhibit these traits more than Sheppard.
I like Topic as well and would take him above Sheppard, but Reed would be an awesome get with the Raptors pick.

In this upcoming draft I think Sheppard is underrated.

Yes, for as much of a proponent of processing speed as I have, I still don't want to understate the importance of athleticism. I do think that prioritizing athleticism over bball IQ works situationally. Athleticism, specifically run and jump athleticism, takes more priority the fewer players you are playing against. If basketball was played as a 3 on 3 or 1 on 1 I'd prioritize that over bball IQ all day long. With the 90s to 2000s playstyle with illegal defense rules and when hand checking was allowed, I'd bank on athleticism all day long too. But with switch heavy and pass-heavy offenses now, athleticism matters less than it used to.

That being said, one of the instances where I'd prioritize athleticism heavily is if I were looking for an iso scorer / iso defender. The kind of guy every great team needs, shot clock winding down, broken play, need a bucket at the end of the game, basically what I envision Vassell being in the future. On the defensive end, a guy who can lock down an opposing team's best scorer one on one. A great example of this is Jaylen Brown for the Celtics, who came in with great measurements and athleticism but has continued to struggle with decision making and his team defense. He serves a valuable role for the Celtics as their tough shot maker who's predominantly a play finisher and for that role specifically I'd really be looking at hyper athletic guys over guys with fast processing speed. Ultimately athleticism is great for advantage creation, but if you don't have the processing speed to know what to do once you've created that advantage it doesn't do you much good in the modern game unless you're a designated play finisher.

[scott]

Just ran a Tankathon Sim where we ended up with #6 and #7 and didn't hate it, but mostly because of who was on the board (it had us taking Dilly and Walter, though Matas was on the board and went 8th - so that's what I would have done. Dilly + Matas would be great).

But it got me thinking, who are the real threats to take Dilly ahead of #7? Detroit won't take PG, neither will CHA. Likewise, Portland is out and Memphis is almost certainly not taking PG unless they decide to blow it up and move Morant (of which there is no indication they will). That leaves only WAS. Maybe they take Dilly, but that will leave Topic. But mostly likely they take Topic and leave Dilly for us. Other teams behind us in the lottery: Houston (via BKY), nope; ATL, nope; OKC via HOU can't jump us as it would go back to HOU; UTA if they jumped into top 4 is a possibility; CHI or NOP are possibilities I suppose.

I feel pretty good about Dilly being there with the TOR pick, freeing us to take our top wing with our natural pick.

[Mr. Body]

Just ran a Tankathon Sim where we ended up with #6 and #7 and didn't hate it, but mostly because of who was on the board (it had us taking Dilly and Walter, though Matas was on the board and went 8th - so that's what I would have done. Dilly + Matas would be great).

But it got me thinking, who are the real threats to take Dilly ahead of #7? Detroit won't take PG, neither will CHA. Likewise, Portland is out and Memphis is almost certainly not taking PG unless they decide to blow it up and move Morant (of which there is no indication they will). That leaves only WAS. Maybe they take Dilly, but that will leave Topic. But mostly likely they take Topic and leave Dilly for us. Other teams behind us in the lottery: Houston (via BKY), nope; ATL, nope; OKC via HOU can't jump us as it would go back to HOU; UTA if they jumped into top 4 is a possibility; CHI or NOP are possibilities I suppose.

I feel pretty good about Dilly being there with the TOR pick, freeing us to take our top wing with our natural pick.

I've expressed being totally okay, even better, with dropping with out pick (but wanting the Toronto pick, too), to clear out of the expensive rookie salaries. Depends on how the team values Risacher and Topic. It's hard to get a bead on them for me. I think #6 and #7 would be great. We're (probably) getting some of the same tiers of players.

Good points on Dillingham. I can see Memphis take him, although it doesn't seem to be a player type they favor and would likely go with a spot-up wing. The Wizards are more likely. They need everything, although a Topic makes more sense. The fellow bad teams already have a lot of guards, as you say. I think question marks will keep Dillingham lower and I still wonder if Sheppard will go before him. I might mention that OKC has enough assets that they can go get any player they want in this draft (if they desired).

I doubt the Spurs will go for Dillingham, though. Maybe, like, if they really value Risacher, get the Toronto pick, and take a swing.

[Mr. Body]

Two players that may crash into the lottery and possibly top 10 are Tyler Smith and Johnny Furphy, who's been discussed. Smith is a sweet-shooting big man for Ignite who has drawn at least faint comparisons to a younger LaMarcus Aldridge. Furphy is probably better than Gradey Dick who also came out of Kansas last year.

An older point guard prospect who might be picked late first, early second, is Devin Carter of Providence. Good shooter, collects a crazy 8.3 rebounds a game, although his assist numbers aren't too high.

[onechance87]

Two players that may crash into the lottery and possibly top 10 are Tyler Smith and Johnny Furphy, who's been discussed. Smith is a sweet-shooting big man for Ignite who has drawn at least faint comparisons to a younger LaMarcus Aldridge. Furphy is probably better than Gradey Dick who also came out of Kansas last year.

An older point guard prospect who might be picked late first, early second, is Devin Carter of Providence. Good shooter, collects a crazy 8.3 rebounds a game, although his assist numbers aren't too high.

is murphy a good defender

[exstatic]

is murphy a good defender

It’s Furphy. That wasn’t a typo.

[rascal]

Just ran a Tankathon Sim where we ended up with #6 and #7 and didn't hate it, but mostly because of who was on the board (it had us taking Dilly and Walter, though Matas was on the board and went 8th - so that's what I would have done. Dilly + Matas would be great).

But it got me thinking, who are the real threats to take Dilly ahead of #7? Detroit won't take PG, neither will CHA. Likewise, Portland is out and Memphis is almost certainly not taking PG unless they decide to blow it up and move Morant (of which there is no indication they will). That leaves only WAS. Maybe they take Dilly, but that will leave Topic. But mostly likely they take Topic and leave Dilly for us. Other teams behind us in the lottery: Houston (via BKY), nope; ATL, nope; OKC via HOU can't jump us as it would go back to HOU; UTA if they jumped into top 4 is a possibility; CHI or NOP are possibilities I suppose.

I feel pretty good about Dilly being there with the TOR pick, freeing us to take our top wing with our natural pick.

Spurs will likely take Topic wherever they pick if he is available.

Topic(3) and Castle(7) will be nice. Get a wing next year as there will be better wing options next year and fewer pg options. Can't say any of the wing options this year are sure things or are the best player available as compared to the pgs.

Castle can play at times at either the 1 or 2, while Vassell stays at the 2 and Topic stays at the 1, primary ball handler.

And the Spurs can have a three guard rotation with Topic, Castle and Vassell.

Only question is both Topic and Castle need improvements with their perimeter shooting but if they get their 3 pt % numbers up some that will be a solid three guard rotation.

[mo7888]

Spurs will likely take Topic wherever they pick if he is available.

Topic(3) and Castle(7) will be nice. Get a wing next year as there will be better wing options next year and fewer pg options. Can't say any of the wing options this year are sure things or are the best player available as compared to the pgs.

Castle can play at times at either the 1 or 2, while Vassell stays at the 2 and Topic stays at the 1, primary ball handler.

And the Spurs can have a three guard rotation with Topic, Castle and Vassell.

Only question is both Topic and Castle need improvements with their perimeter shooting but if they get their 3 pt % numbers up some that will be a solid three guard rotation.

If i were taking two guards that high I'd go Topic and JaKobe. If Topic was off the board one of Castle/ Shephard/ Dilly, depending on who's there..

[Mr. Body]

is murphy a good defender

He's not bad. Needs seasoning and work, but he has good lateral quickness and a good team defender. I don't think he'll be a sieve. He also crashes the boards, which is important.

[Mr. Body]

Really doubt the Spurs take two non-shooters in Topic and Castle. As questionable as the Serbian is, Castle looks pretty awful as a shooter. If they take two guards, which I doubt, the other would probably be Sheppard.

[SpursBills]

Spurs will likely take Topic wherever they pick if he is available.

Topic(3) and Castle(7) will be nice. Get a wing next year as there will be better wing options next year and fewer pg options. Can't say any of the wing options this year are sure things or are the best player available as compared to the pgs.

Castle can play at times at either the 1 or 2, while Vassell stays at the 2 and Topic stays at the 1, primary ball handler.

And the Spurs can have a three guard rotation with Topic, Castle and Vassell.

Only question is both Topic and Castle need improvements with their perimeter shooting but if they get their 3 pt % numbers up some that will be a solid three guard rotation.

I actually like this idea only if the spurs don't see a future with Wesley. If they see Wesley as someone who's worth developing moving forward as an athletic POA defender with some size and a questionable jump shot, then Castle that high is a little bit too redundant I think.

[spurraider21]

Spurs will likely take Topic wherever they pick if he is available.

Topic(3) and Castle(7) will be nice. Get a wing next year as there will be better wing options next year and fewer pg options. Can't say any of the wing options this year are sure things or are the best player available as compared to the pgs.

Castle can play at times at either the 1 or 2, while Vassell stays at the 2 and Topic stays at the 1, primary ball handler.

And the Spurs can have a three guard rotation with Topic, Castle and Vassell.

Only question is both Topic and Castle need improvements with their perimeter shooting but if they get their 3 pt % numbers up some that will be a solid three guard rotation.
No shot the spurs use both picks without one of them being a plus shooter. Castle would pair better with a pg like Dillinghan or even a “pg” like Sheppard than Topic anyway. Topic and castle would synergize poorly since their strengths and weaknesses overlap quit a bit and don’t really complement one another

[CGD]

All the Trae/Murray smoke suggests the spurs have some level of appetite to trade for their PG of the future. Even if that weren’t the case, it would be a poor use of two top 8 picks to come away with two guards, even in this draft. Take the best available SF first, then the best available PG second.

[spurraider21]

Other than Vassell at SG and obviously Wemby at the 5 I’m not letting anybody on the spurs dictate what is a “need” lol. Wesley, Sochan, Tre, keldon, etc. they don’t factor into the equation at all to me.

[TD 21]

Man, it's a conundrum.

You need shooting.

But do you use a 1-4 pick on shooting?

Not really.

Absolutely. Not the defensive liability, catch and shoot specialist type (McDermott, Forbes, etc.) of course.


Just ran a Tankathon Sim where we ended up with #6 and #7 and didn't hate it, but mostly because of who was on the board (it had us taking Dilly and Walter, though Matas was on the board and went 8th - so that's what I would have done. Dilly + Matas would be great).

But it got me thinking, who are the real threats to take Dilly ahead of #7? Detroit won't take PG, neither will CHA. Likewise, Portland is out and Memphis is almost certainly not taking PG unless they decide to blow it up and move Morant (of which there is no indication they will). That leaves only WAS. Maybe they take Dilly, but that will leave Topic. But mostly likely they take Topic and leave Dilly for us. Other teams behind us in the lottery: Houston (via BKY), nope; ATL, nope; OKC via HOU can't jump us as it would go back to HOU; UTA if they jumped into top 4 is a possibility; CHI or NOP are possibilities I suppose.

I feel pretty good about Dilly being there with the TOR pick, freeing us to take our top wing with our natural pick.

Wrong. Teams like the Pistons and Hornets, who have wing and big guard sized primary initiators could theoretically select Dillingham and if he becomes starting caliber, cross match while playing him as the secondary creator on offense.

The Rockets are another possibility, if they view Thompson as their primary initiator of the future.

Of course, it'll all be moot since Dillingham is the antithesis of what the Spurs have been looking for in a "lead" guard.

[rascal]

I actually like this idea only if the spurs don't see a future with Wesley. If they see Wesley as someone who's worth developing moving forward as an athletic POA defender with some size and a questionable jump shot, then Castle that high is a little bit too redundant I think.

I don't see Wesley as a solid option as a pg moving forward. Castle can play either the 1 or 2. Of course depending on his shooting improving then he will be great but Topic also needs to improve shooting.

Next year projects to be even weaker for pgs in the draft and good luck thinking the Spurs are going to trade enough of their draft assets for an all star level pg or sign one in fa.

Next year is deeper in SF and SG and the Spurs will probably end up with one better than what they will get this year.

The SF/Sg crop this year aren't any better than the PGs(so there is no clear best player available strategy) with all players having questions about them.

Look at the draft as a two year process of building the team. PGs this year and SF/SG next year unless they land at number 1 this year where you go big and take Sarr.

[scott]

1761500535599870298

Stupid.

[heyheymymy]

Caitlin Clark got clipped by a court storming student/fan too

Shit is getting out of hand

[heyheymymy]

here for the Dilly show

not sure how it all shakes out but I am a personal fan of Dilly and enjoy watching him play. Just a thrilling exciting player

[Mr. Body]

Kyshawn George for Miami remains pretty interesting. He's the dude from Switzerland whose dad was an American player. He's old for a freshman and not quite there. Not sure he'd come out this year, but Miami isn't exactly great this year and I think someone will get him in the draft. I would strongly consider promising him if he'd actually wait until our #33. I think he gets grabbed in the late first. Multi-skilled wing, creation ability, good shooter, just not all there to be a lottery pick yet.

[rascal]

No shot the spurs use both picks without one of them being a plus shooter. Castle would pair better with a pg like Dillinghan or even a “pg” like Sheppard than Topic anyway. Topic and castle would synergize poorly since their strengths and weaknesses overlap quit a bit and don’t really complement one another

Dillingham is not a good pg prospect more a sg also not wanting a small guard on the team. I'm looking for a 3 guard interchangeable rotation with Castle playing at times the 1 or 2 with Vassell and/or Topic.

Topic and Castle would be excellent on the break. Castle will make up for Topic's deficiencies on defense. Draft a shooter at SF next year. It's not a complete team fix in one season, it's a two year process at minimum.

The Spurs will have several options to get a player with star potential at SF in next year's draft. Early mock drafts have next year's draft stacked with SFs. Have to look at building the team through the draft as a minimum a two year process. PGs this year

[Mr. Body]

Kentucky's Ivisic might also come out this year. No sense in sticking with a rocky program in Kentucky. He might also go late first early second.

[Mr. Body]

here for the Dilly show

not sure how it all shakes out but I am a personal fan of Dilly and enjoy watching him play. Just a thrilling exciting player

He's fun to watch to be sure. Definitely a point and clearly can move the ball and looks to do so.

[Mr. Body]

Dillingham gets more assists per-36 than Isaiah Collier, Stephon Castle, and Reed Sheppard, by the way.

[SpursBills]

Dillingham is not a good pg prospect more a sg also not wanting a small guard on the team. I'm looking for a 3 guard interchangeable rotation with Castle playing at times the 1 or 2 with Vassell and/or Topic.

Topic and Castle would be excellent on the break. Castle will make up for Topic's deficiencies on defense. Draft a shooter at SF next year. It's not a complete team fix in one season, it's a two year process at minimum.

The Spurs will have several options to get a player with star potential at SF in next year's draft. Early mock drafts have next year's draft stacked with SFs. Have to look at building the team through the draft as a minimum a two year process. PGs this year

Dillingham is absolutely a pg prospect if you watch him if you just want to look at numbers compare his assist rate to the other guys on his team. I get the small guard argument but calling him a sg prospect is just incorrect tbh. Otherwise I agree with the rebuild being a 2 year process but it depends on various peoples' (including Wemby's) appetites for having a giant hole in the lineup for another year.

[TD 21]

The notion of selecting both Topic and Castle is ludicrous given their inability to shoot and how big of an issue that's been long term for this team.

George fits the Spurs stereotype, but as of now would be considered a significant perceived reach. Sure, that didn't stop them with Primo, but it was also a late lottery pick.

[Mr. Body]

The notion of selecting both Topic and Castle is ludicrous given their inability to shoot and how big of an issue that's been long term for this team.

George fits the Spurs stereotype, but as of now would be considered a significant perceived reach. Sure, that didn't stop them with Primo, but it was also a late lottery pick.

rascal never knows what he's talking about. He picks one player every draft and fixates on them. I don't think he ever watches any games.

As for George, I said with the #33 pick or try to move up a little. He's not a lottery pick at this point, although we've seen questionable picks in the lottery or nearby (Jett Howard, Jalen Hood-Schifino).

[heyheymymy]

what's the story on Antonio Reeves? He's a senior and productive. Don't really hear much discussion on him or maybe I'm missing the conversation.

[CGD]

Topic should be getting back to form soon, right?

[baseline bum]

Just ran a Tankathon Sim where we ended up with #6 and #7 and didn't hate it, but mostly because of who was on the board (it had us taking Dilly and Walter, though Matas was on the board and went 8th - so that's what I would have done. Dilly + Matas would be great).

But it got me thinking, who are the real threats to take Dilly ahead of #7? Detroit won't take PG, neither will CHA. Likewise, Portland is out and Memphis is almost certainly not taking PG unless they decide to blow it up and move Morant (of which there is no indication they will). That leaves only WAS. Maybe they take Dilly, but that will leave Topic. But mostly likely they take Topic and leave Dilly for us. Other teams behind us in the lottery: Houston (via BKY), nope; ATL, nope; OKC via HOU can't jump us as it would go back to HOU; UTA if they jumped into top 4 is a possibility; CHI or NOP are possibilities I suppose.

I feel pretty good about Dilly being there with the TOR pick, freeing us to take our top wing with our natural pick.

You're looking at it wrong. Some of those teams are going to take best player available, especially when there is no Brandon Miller level talent to take for fit.

[Mr. Body]

You're looking at it wrong. Some of those teams are going to take best player available, especially when there is no Brandon Miller level talent to take for fit.

Who, among Sarr, Risacher, Topic and adding Holland and Dillingham, is "the best player available"? Which one is obviously best?

[baseline bum]

Who, among Sarr, Risacher, Topic and adding Holland and Dillingham, is "the best player available"? Which one is obviously best?

Personally I'd say Sarr. Gotta think there will be teams with a PG who will still think Dillingham is better than Williams, Walters, Buzelis, Holland, Sheppard, etc if the Spurs fall in the lottery.

[heyheymymy]

damn Edwards is doing everything today

[Russ]

Who, among Sarr, Risacher, Topic and adding Holland and Dillingham, is "the best player available"? Which one is obviously best?

Topic and then Sarr.

[Mr. Body]

No, none of those are 'obviously the best.' There is no player or players who stick out above the others. Unlikely the worst teams pick 'the best player available' when there isn't one. A team like Detroit isn't going to pick a guard when they have a slew of guards and need shooting. This is a draft where the tiers don't break down the usual way.

[alfahdlan]

UK is leading tonight partly because of defense: 11 steals atm. They shut the high octane offense of bama.

[SpursBills]

Another solid performance for my boy Collin Murray-Boyles with a 12/5 outing playing a crucial role in South Carolina's turnaround from 11-20 to a top 20 ranking after this game. Doesn't turn 19 until the draft, averaging 9/5 on almost 60% shooting. Guards out to the perimeter, solid passing, strong base, and did this a couple weeks ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taXVCKFGr_Y

Yes, that's an end of game help side clean block on a 7'5" center.

I don't see him top 60 on any of the major draft boards because he doesn't shoot 3s and only shoots 64% FT, but he's long, athletic, young, plays good defense, rebounds like crazy, and has good feel. I'm looking for this guy to play a vital role as a rotation big forward in the future - basically like a better Memphis Brandon Clarke or Draymond Green-lite. A guy who can bully 5 out teams on the boards while still guarding out to the perimeter. Get on the ground floor while you still can.

[alfahdlan]

Reed, 26 steals in the last 6 games. 74 in 27 games. Rondo's record in UK might be in jeopardy.

[onechance87]

reed and dilly with good games...Both would be big upgrades over tre and branham

[TD 21]

A team like Detroit isn't going to pick a guard when they have a slew of guards and need shooting.

Probably not. But it's possible they think they can sign Bridges, Harris, etc. in free agency to fill the gaping hole at PF and/or are so high on a guard that they feel they can't pass.

At that point, they could either shop Ivey for a PF or just wait and sort out the guard situation later.





Another solid performance for my boy Collin Murray-Boyles with a 12/5 outing playing a crucial role in South Carolina's turnaround from 11-20 to a top 20 ranking after this game. Doesn't turn 19 until the draft, averaging 9/5 on almost 60% shooting. Guards out to the perimeter, solid passing, strong base, and did this a couple weeks ago:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=taXVCKFGr_Y

Yes, that's an end of game help side clean block on a 7'5" center.

I don't see him top 60 on any of the major draft boards because he doesn't shoot 3s and only shoots 64% FT, but he's long, athletic, young, plays good defense, rebounds like crazy, and has good feel. I'm looking for this guy to play a vital role as a rotation big forward in the future - basically like a better Memphis Brandon Clarke or Draymond Green-lite. A guy who can bully 5 out teams on the boards while still guarding out to the perimeter. Get on the ground floor while you still can.

2024 NBA Mock Draft: Latest Full 2-Round Projections | News, Scores, Highlights, Stats, and Rumors | Bleacher Report (https://bleacherreport.com/articles/10109994-2024-nba-mock-draft-latest-full-2-round-projections)

[Mr. Body]

Probably not. But it's possible they think they can sign Bridges, Harris, etc. in free agency to fill the gaping hole at PF and/or are so high on a guard that they feel they can't pass.

At that point, they could either shop Ivey for a PF or just wait and sort out the guard situation later.

I guess we can make up a lot of scenarios.

[TD 21]

I guess we can make up a lot of scenarios.

They're not promising enough to pass up best perceived player for fit.

Their roster is more balanced post trade deadline.

They're rumored interested in Bridges and Harris and have +max cap space.

2024 cap space landscape: The outlook for each NBA team | HoopsHype (https://hoopshype.com/lists/2024-cap-space-landscape-the-outlook-for-each-nba-team/)

[scott]

You're looking at it wrong. Some of those teams are going to take best player available, especially when there is no Brandon Miller level talent to take for fit.

I agree with this, but I don't think Dillingham stands out so far above the others that those teams will want to add him to a glut of guards. But I might be (and frankly, am probably) wrong.

[Mr. Body]

'Best player available' widely means consensus. Like, what a dude like Jay Bilas will say during draft coverage. Teams will have their own rankings.

There are no "best players available" at the top of this draft because none of them shine above the others. Simply saying that you like one above another doesn't make it some universally accepted fact. Sure, Detroit could do something wild like trade Jaden Ivey if they like Dillingham, but, well, I don't think anyone on earth expects that to actually happen.

Like any team, they'll have their tiers and rank guys within that tier. But it will be extremely unusual for Detroit to pick another guard with a high pick when it's not clear that player will be better than the several who they already have. No one is falling in love with any of these guys. The 'always pick best player available' is one of those received wisdom things that isn't always the case. It's always modified by context and circumstance.

[Ariel]

Probably not. But it's possible they think they can sign Bridges, Harris, etc. in free agency to fill the gaping hole at PF and/or are so high on a guard that they feel they can't pass.

At that point, they could either shop Ivey for a PF or just wait and sort out the guard situation later.
Troy Weaver's job hangs in the balance, I'd be SHOCKED if he takes another PG with Cade, Ivey and Sasser already on the roster. Besides, he likes bigger, more athletic players... I don't see Dillingham being his cup of tea. IMO there are 2 clear candidates for Dillingham: Washington (the worse their pick, the more likely they'd take him) and Toronto (mainly out of need, more so than Masai's true preference). I think there's a pretty high chance he's there for the taking if Toronto's pick conveys.

[scott]

Every team's post-draft press conference will tell you that they took the best player available :lol

[Mr. Body]

Your point overall is being missed and it's that Dillingham, and Sheppard I'd add, might not rise above the level of need and perceived value to most of these teams.

[baseline bum]

I agree with this, but I don't think Dillingham stands out so far above the others that those teams will want to add him to a glut of guards. But I might be (and frankly, am probably) wrong.

Dual PG lineups aren't unheard of. The Spurs wanted to pair Kidd next to Tony in 03. Rozier started a lot of games next to Lamelo. Before we knew Paul was washed up he was starting next to Curry in Golden State. I just don't see anyone passing up a guy they think could be an allstar just because they have Ja Morant, Scoot Henderson, Lamelo Ball, etc on their roster. Imagine Sacramento passing on Haliburton just because they already had a great PG in Fox. Hell if the Spurs have the #1 pick and keep it I want Sarr despite the poor fit. Luckily Sarr's well known enough that the Spurs could probably trade the pick and get a great vet if they luck into #1.

[baseline bum]

Your point overall is being missed and it's that Dillingham, and Sheppard I'd add, might not rise above the level of need and perceived value to most of these teams.

I think it's very conceivable that Dillingham could be viewed as the third best player in the draft by some teams. Or fourth best by a lot of teams. I'd be pretty surprised if he lasted to #7.

[TD 21]

Troy Weaver's job hangs in the balance, I'd be SHOCKED if he takes another PG with Cade, Ivey and Sasser already on the roster. Besides, he likes bigger, more athletic players... I don't see Dillingham being his cup of tea. IMO there are 2 clear candidates for Dillingham: Washington (the worse their pick, the more likely they'd take him) and Toronto (mainly out of need, more so than Masai's true preference). I think there's a pretty high chance he's there for the taking if Toronto's pick conveys.

I said it's unlikely, but shouldn't be ruled out and again, Cunningham is a wing defensively and Ivey and Sasser are combo guards.

I doubt the Craptors would because it's unlikely they'd invest another significant asset in a small guard.

[CGD]

I think it's very conceivable that Dillingham could be viewed as the third best player in the draft by some teams. Or fourth best by a lot of teams. I'd be pretty surprised if he lasted to #7.

Maybe those picking in the late draft or late teens once they factor is who they think will be left by the time they pick?

The only team in the projected bottom 7 right now who needs a PG as much as the Spurs is Washington, and they aren’t passing on Sarr, Tooic, Rasacher, Matas, Williams, or Walter in order to take Dillingham. He’ll absolutely be there at 7 or 8 if the Spurs are picking then.

[rascal]

Who, among Sarr, Risacher, Topic and adding Holland and Dillingham, is "the best player available"? Which one is obviously best?

Sarr

[mystargtr34]

Pistons: Need a floor spacing big wing the most. In order of likelihood i can see them taking Risacher, Cody Williams. Less likely but possible is Sarr but then you’d have a serious lack of shooting in the projected starting lineup of Duren, Ausar, Ivey, Cade. If they pick Sarr they could move on from Ivey and play Ausar at the 2 and a shooter like Fontecchio at the 3 with Sarr and Duren.

Wizards: Their only ++ assets are Kuzma, Avdija, Coulibaly which covers them at 2/3/4 theoretically speaking. So I think the 1 and 5 spots are their priority. Topić or Sarr are most likely for them. If they really like one of the wings like Risacher or Williams maybe they pick them but I think Sarr or Topić is the pick here.

Spurs: Need a PG and a big wing. Topić, Risacher are most likely here. Sarr is a possibility but then you have to move Sochan to the 3 and need shooting at the 1 next to Devin and Wemby. Cody Williams is a possibility if they really like him even as high as number 3 but I think it’s unlikely. Can’t see the Spurs taking anyone outside of these 4 guys in the top 3. Maybe Buzelis if they really like him. Same situation as Sarr would need shooting at the 1 next to Wemby, Devin, Jeremy.

Hornets: Can go multiple ways as they have some versatility with Miller and Bridges. They won’t take a 5, could see them taking a 1 like Shepard or Dillingham since LaMelo is a 6’7 guard who can theoretically guard the 2. I can see them taking a 2 like JaKobe Walter, or a big wing like Cody Williams, Buzelis, Ron Holland.

Portland: Going to assume they need a big wing. Although they suck everywhere. Let’s assume Scoot and Shaedon are their ‘future’ :lol. I can see them taking anyone of Williams, Buzelis, Holland. Maybe JaKobe at the 2 if they have soured on Shaedon.

Memphis: Very similar to Portland they need a big wing. Williams, Buzelis, Holland are the picks here. One of these will be available assuming Sarr, Topić, Risacher go 1-2-3. Really can’t see Memphis taking a guard with Morant and Bane already there. I’d be shocked if they took Dillingham, Shepard or Walter. Maybe Salaun is a dark horse here.

Spurs: Would be gold if the Spurs could get this pick. Because I think Dillingham, Shepard will be available here. Both would be great fits at the 1. Shooting problem gets somewhat solved. If the Spurs take Topić with their first pick, then they could take a swing on a Salaun here or maybe Buzelis or Hollland if they slip through 4-6.

Based on current draft order my mock is:

1. Detroit: Risacher
2. Wizards: Sarr
3. Spurs: Topić
4. Hornets: Williams
5. Blazers: Buzelis
6: Memphis: Holland
7: Spurs: Walter/Dillingham/Shepard/Salaun

Sarr does seem like the best prospect but it’s close. Maybe Pistons pick him then Wizards take Topić and Spurs get Risacher.

[mo7888]

https://theathletic.com/5268787/2024/02/20/nba-mock-draft-updates-rankings-teams/

[The Truth #6]

Players that seem like Brian Wight types.

Cody Williams
Risacher
Sarr
Kyshawn George
Tiddy Salaune (sic)

Topic and Dilly don't strike me as Wright types based on my highly subjective, uhh, formula and analysis.

[mystargtr34]

My ideal draft would be Risacher/Williams or maybe Sarr with the first pick then with the #7 pick Dillingham or Sheppard or maybe even Topic if he drops.

Topic could be good but if you take him with the first pick then you don't have as many options with the 7 pick to take a wing who can shoot (Risacher, Williams will be off the board).

I am open to taking Sarr with the first pick and pairing him next to Wemby but you will badly need shooting at the 1 (Dillingham or Shepard) and maybe even at the 3 spot which means you have to move Sochan to the bench.

Wemby
Sarr
Sochan
Vassell
Dillingham/Sheppard

You may be able to get away with 2 non-shooters.

[Ariel]

My ideal draft would be Risacher/Williams or maybe Sarr with the first pick then with the #7 pick Dillingham or Sheppard or maybe even Topic if he drops.

Topic could be good but if you take him with the first pick then you don't have as many options with the 7 pick to take a wing who can shoot (Risacher, Williams will be off the board).

I am open to taking Sarr with the first pick and pairing him next to Wemby but you will badly need shooting at the 1 (Dillingham or Shepard) and maybe even at the 3 spot which means you have to move Sochan to the bench.

Wemby
Sarr
Sochan
Vassell
Dillingham/Sheppard

You may be able to get away with 2 non-shooters.
I also like Sarr, but I don't see all three of Wemby / Sarr / Sochan together, his most likely role initially would be backup C (non Wemby minutes) or replacing Sochan. All three of them on the court at the same time would make life very difficult for each other. Risacher would make a more natural fit.

[rascal]

I am open to taking Sarr with the first pick and pairing him next to Wemby but you will badly need shooting at the 1 (Dillingham or Shepard) and maybe even at the 3 spot which means you have to move Sochan to the bench.

Wemby
Sarr
Sochan
Vassell
Dillingham/Sheppard

You may be able to get away with 2 non-shooters.

This is at least a two year draft build. You aren't going to address all the Spurs needs in one draft. You look ahead to what the lottery looks like next year and it's projected top heavy in SFs so you address that next year.

You take Sarr if available and if not go pg.

[Ariel]

This is at least a two year draft build. You aren't going to address all the Spurs needs in one draft. You look ahead to what the lottery looks like next year and it's projected top heavy in SFs so you address that next year.

You take Sarr if available and if not go pg.
You can't predict what the '25 board will look like a year and a half in advance, you have to take what you think is best now and figure out the rest later, whether via draft, trade, or free agency.

[rascal]

I also like Sarr, but I don't see all three of Wemby / Sarr / Sochan together, his most likely role initially would be backup C (non Wemby minutes) or replacing Sochan. All three of them on the court at the same time would make life very difficult for each other. Risacher would make a more natural fit.

Move Sochan to the bench or trade Sochan for a player who can shoot. Why the idea that Sochan is untradeable and having to play all three at the same time.

[mo7888]

It may not be this draft, but Josh Hubbard is one to watch in the future. He's short, but explosive... Really impressive against LSU tonight..

[TD 21]

I don't get the absolutes some are speaking in when it comes to fit on these teams. They're the worst teams in the league. In many cases, the biggest needs is talent period and they can sort the rest out later.

If their best young building block isn't overly malleable, they probably won't pick a similar archetype that's regarded as a similar or worse prospect. After that, all bets are off.

Only the Spurs and Grizzlies should heavily factor in fit because the former has a projected MVP caliber prospect and the latter have an All-NBA player and goodish team when healthy.

[Mr. Body]

Nobody is talking absolute fit.

[baseline bum]

Move Sochan to the bench or trade Sochan for a player who can shoot. Why the idea that Sochan is untradeable and having to play all three at the same time.

Sochan's untradeable because he wouldn't get you shit in return.

[baseline bum]

Maybe those picking in the late draft or late teens once they factor is who they think will be left by the time they pick?

The only team in the projected bottom 7 right now who needs a PG as much as the Spurs is Washington, and they aren’t passing on Sarr, Tooic, Rasacher, Matas, Williams, or Walter in order to take Dillingham. He’ll absolutely be there at 7 or 8 if the Spurs are picking then.

Did Sacramento need a PG when they picked Haliburton? Most of the time teams will take the player they think is most talented. If you end up with two stars at the same position that's a good problem to have and you trade one for a star that's a better fit like they did for Sabonis.

[Mr. Body]

Sochan's untradeable because he wouldn't get you shit in return.

Lol, a lot of teams would love Sochan. Man is this site pathetic.

[baseline bum]

Lol, a lot of teams would love Sochan. Man is this site pathetic.

What do you think the Spurs would get for Sochan in trade?

[rascal]

Not much more than a role player bench player or young project who hasn't hit yet.

[freetiago]

Sochan+Johnson+salary filler+ 3-4 FRPs for Trae Young. Maybe they’re fooled by his decent games against them. Then just need wings+ some front court depth

[Ocotillo]

I concede I don't keep up with the incoming class and watch games or video on the prospects so my opinion on who is good or not is pretty worthless. I do enjoy the back and forth between you guys about this guy or that guy so I feel slightly more up to speed than I would be without the board.

Having said that and with Sarr being mentioned as having a good chance of being the top pick in the draft, I went back and looked into why Houston who selected Ralph Sampson in 1983 took Dream the following year.

Sampson came in at 7'4" and was solid with a double/double in points/rebounds and something like 2.5 blocks. Houston continued to suck and ended up with the top pick the next draft. (Remind you of our situation?)

Hakeem was drafted and it was determined his skill set was better served in the post and Sampson was moved to power forward. In the article I was reading, Sampson expressed a preference for playing multiple positions and was happy with the new role and both he and Olajuwon thrived. They formed what was considered the first twin towers.

That was a much different era of the NBA than we have today but the similarity between Houston then and the Spurs now are interesting. Would Sarr be able to come in and be the center and Wemby do as Sampson did and move to power forward and it work in todays NBA?

One footnote, the Rockets did improve when Olajuwon was added but struggled when point guard John Lucas had to serve a suspension for substance abuse. Which brings us back to the how the team really needs a point guard.

[rascal]

Sochan+Johnson+salary filler+ 3-4 FRPs for Trae Young. Maybe they’re fooled by his decent games against them. Then just need wings+ some front court depth

Sochan alone, what is the trade value? Adding FRPs changes the overall value and doubt the Spurs are trading those picks. Pop has made it clear to be patient and they are building through the draft.

[Dejounte]

I concede I don't keep up with the incoming class and watch games or video on the prospects so my opinion on who is good or not is pretty worthless. I do enjoy the back and forth between you guys about this guy or that guy so I feel slightly more up to speed than I would be without the board.

Having said that and with Sarr being mentioned as having a good chance of being the top pick in the draft, I went back and looked into why Houston who selected Ralph Sampson in 1983 took Dream the following year.

Sampson came in at 7'4" and was solid with a double/double in points/rebounds and something like 2.5 blocks. Houston continued to suck and ended up with the top pick the next draft. (Remind you of our situation?)

Hakeem was drafted and it was determined his skill set was better served in the post and Sampson was moved to power forward. In the article I was reading, Sampson expressed a preference for playing multiple positions and was happy with the new role and both he and Olajuwon thrived. They formed what was considered the first twin towers.

That was a much different era of the NBA than we have today but the similarity between Houston then and the Spurs now are interesting. Would Sarr be able to come in and be the center and Wemby do as Sampson did and move to power forward and it work in todays NBA?

One footnote, the Rockets did improve when Olajuwon was added but struggled when point guard John Lucas had to serve a suspension for substance abuse. Which brings us back to the how the team really needs a point guard.

Nope, and that’s what other posters don’t get. Wemby can’t defend the perimeter full time because of fatigue and lack of agility. We’ve seen this show already and he was being abused by smaller players who would blow by him. Conversely, Sarr can’t play PF for the same reason— neither of these guys are able to defend the perimeter full time. If there were more teams playing two bigs like the Twolves, then sure there would be no problem. But most teams play a tweener (SF/PF) at that position nowadays and thrive off being able to shoot 3’s and drive to the hoop with speed. Playing either player at PF is a fast ticket to injury or retirement.

[rascal]

Nope, and that’s what other posters don’t get. Wemby can’t defend the perimeter full time because of fatigue and lack of agility. We’ve seen this show already and he was being abused by smaller players who would blow by him. Conversely, Sarr can’t play PF for the same reason— neither of these guys are able to defend the perimeter full time. If there were more teams playing two bigs like the Twolves, then sure there would be no problem. But most teams play a tweener (SF/PF) at that position nowadays and thrive off being able to shoot 3’s and drive to the hoop with speed. Playing either player at PF is a fast ticket to injury or retirement.

Both could defend PFs. Why would Wemby be more fatigue than other players in his prime?

[Dejounte]

Both could defend PFs. Why would Wemby be more fatigue than other players in his prime?

No, they can’t. Defending PF’s mean they’re liable to being switched on SF’s too, you know that right? Sochan is constantly switched on smaller players. Like I said, there’s no need to fantasize about this when there’s actual proof that Wemby is not suited to being a PF.

Wemby is everyone’s superhero— I get it. But this is like all the Wemby worship pre-draft when everyone thought he’d do it all and be like Luka and bring up the ball every time. The guy is limited in some aspects, and that’s OK. That’s why you build around who he is, and not obtain a player who would push him out of a position where he’s optimized most.

[Dejounte]

Why have Wemby worry about trying to keep up with smaller players on the perimeter when he can continue feasting on blocking shots in the paint with his supernatural blocking skills (and break records while he’s at it)? It makes absolutely no sense.

[rascal]

Why have Wemby worry about trying to keep up with smaller players on the perimeter when he can continue feasting on blocking shots in the paint with his supernatural blocking skills (and break records while he’s at it)? It makes absolutely no sense.

Who said it has to be Wemby chasing smaller players. Sarr is fast and quick on his feet and would be excellent at PF.

Spurs have already made two low post defenders a successful team build.