Young: sources tell @ExpressNews that Kawhi Leonard wants to be traded from Spurs

[spurraider21]

I know it would dig into pride quite a bit but if pop made public comments about mistakes spurs have made with respect to how they have contributed to the narrative, that would probably go a long way. Make Kawhi look like less of the bad guy. Make the spurs look like they owned up to mistakes. And then you put the Supermax on the table.

Even if Kawhi was unreasonable and a dick through all this, if you go into it with the mentality that with Kawhi, we always have a chance to be special, but we’re never getting semi reasonable value back for him via trade... it’s an option.

[spurraider21]

Does anybody know what Boston offered at the trade deadline? If trade doesn't happen during off-season & relationship isn't repaired, Spurs gotta hope LBJ's patience or lack thereof with that Roster forces Magic to make big moves to aquire Kawhi.
The problem is i don’t think the lakers can offer a good trade even if they wanted to. Ingram kuzma and some late 20’s picks aren’t going to make us a good team. And they’re not even offering that.

[Marcus Bryant]

They've dealt with agent bullshit before, now, and forever. They aren't going to give up a franchise player for 30% of value, especially if the relationship can be restored.

[DPG21920]

I’m literally stunned that teams are doing everything they can to not land a true star. After Pg there had to be a ton of remorse. When they rarely become available and have changed every franchise (Bron, Harden, etc) it’s crazy.

Banking on cores that have already casts serious doubts on ceilings makes it even worse.

[Dverde]

Time for Houston to get someone to counter the boogie signing. Brook Lopez?

[Kuestmaster]

I've come to a point where anger towards Kawhi has turn into sadness (and anger too). Sadness because he's willing to throw away all the love and the embrace the Spurs fans have given him the last 7 years. He went to promising rookie, to an awesome defender, to the heir to Tim Duncan. He was assured a place among the best spurs of all time. Maybe the second best, Timmy is untouchable.

And he's willing to throw that away because his fucking uncle got inside his fragile head and filled it with horseshit Lakers dreams.

Fuck him. I'm 100% sure he'll regret his choice. Ship his ass to LA or wherever and get the best we can as soon as possible. Let's get this cancer off the team and move on. The rebuilding will be hard, but I can't stomach cheering for this piece of shit in my team anymore.

[RD2191]

I’m literally stunned that teams are doing everything they can to not land a true star. After Pg there had to be a ton of remorse. When they rarely become available and have changed every franchise (Bron, Harden, etc) it’s crazy.

Banking on cores that have already casts serious doubts on ceilings makes it even worse.

It really is weird. The offers must also be absolute dog shit or he'd be gone by now.

[Spurs da champs]

The problem is i don’t think the lakers can offer a good trade even if they wanted to. Ingram kuzma and some late 20’s picks aren’t going to make us a good team. And they’re not even offering that.
Spurs are making the playoffs regardless, Pop & RC want Ingram, his potential is off the charts, who knows how he develops under a good coaching staff. Obviously best case scenario is always gonna be Kiwi resigning, but Ingram is only 21 if even that. I'm thinking they're eventually going to trade Ball, we shall see what Lakers get for him. And again, after Oladipos pedestrian year and abysmal playoffs with OKC everybody thought Indiana got fleeced. I'd rather not have Kuzma do to his attitude, but he can get buckets. We can't shit all over this trade before it happens, chances of getting absolute equal or close value to Kawhi is impossible due to his wanting Lakers and only the Lakers.

[Mr. Body]

Spurs are making the playoffs regardless, Pop & RC want Ingram, his potential is off the charts, who knows how he develops under a good coaching staff. Obviously best case scenario is always gonna be Kiwi resigning, but Ingram is only 21 if even that. I'm thinking they're eventually going to trade Ball, we shall see what Lakers get for him. And again, after Oladipos pedestrian year and abysmal playoffs with OKC everybody thought Indiana got fleeced. I'd rather not have Kuzma do to his attitude, but he can get buckets. We can't shit all over this trade before it happens, chances of getting absolute equal or close value to Kawhi is impossible due to his wanting Lakers and only the Lakers.

Stop lying about Ingram.

[r0drig0lac]

Time for Houston to get someone to counter the boogie signing. Brook Lopez?

jeff ayres

[Spurs da champs]

Stop lying about Ingram.

6'11, long ass arms, good offensive game, playmaking steadily getting better, defensive potential similar to KD, what's not to like? Spurs would make him a star.

[RD2191]

6'11, long ass arms, good offensive game, playmaking steadily getting better, defensive potential similar to KD, what's not to like? Spurs would make him a star.

Fuck the Lakers disclaimer and all but Spurs fans really love to overrate their players and underrate everybody else's. If Kawhi is traded for Ingram+ he'd be the 2nd best player on the Spurs. That's not even debatable.

[SpursDynasty85]

Fuck the Lakers disclaimer and all but Spurs fans really love to overrate their players and underrate everybody else's. If Kawhi is traded for Ingram+ he'd be the 2nd best player on the Spurs. That's not even debatable.

I'd still think Rudy Gay is better than Ingram but in 2 years that could be different.

[Spurs da champs]

Fuck the Lakers disclaimer and all but Spurs fans really love to overrate their players and underrate everybody else's. If Kawhi is traded for Ingram+ he'd be the 2nd best player on the Spurs. That's not even debatable.
That's facts, some dumbass called Ingram a "taller Forbes". :lmao

[Marcus Bryant]

It really is weird. The offers must also be absolute dog shit or he'd be gone by now.

It's a one year rental, lots of uncertainty about his health, and given that it appears he held out/quit on a playoff team and his group is casting aspersions about an organization with a good rep, there's a lot that a potential trade partner needs to unpack, or they offer ten cents on the dollar. 'Why am I going to pay more for their headache to become mine?'

[rasuo214]

I’m literally stunned that teams are doing everything they can to not land a true star. After Pg there had to be a ton of remorse. When they rarely become available and have changed every franchise (Bron, Harden, etc) it’s crazy.

Banking on cores that have already casts serious doubts on ceilings makes it even worse.

Big offers like the Spurs are expecting rarely happen.

[SpursDynasty85]

This Kawhi drama has to be the most complicated trade talks ever. You know every side including Kawhi's group playing all sides to manipulate what they want is happening. So many conflicting reports everywhere! Spurs probably have never gotten a straight answer or legit proposal from anyone yet because Kawhi's group is sabotaging everything. Spurs have some leverage here because Kawhi sitting another year for the Spurs looks really bad for him and has to effect his development. I imagine Kawhi's group will start to play ball and accept him going East or tell the Lakers they need to trade for him now or he might actually stay east in a few days once the reality sets in. For now, they are playing dirty.

[Mr. Body]

I'd still think Rudy Gay is better than Ingram but in 2 years that could be different.

Gay is fucking waaaaay better. Ingram looks like lottery-team treadmill trash at this point.

[Marcus Bryant]

This Kawhi drama has to be the most complicated trade talks ever. You know every side including Kawhi's group playing all sides to manipulate what they want is happening. So many conflicting reports everywhere! Spurs probably have never gotten a straight answer or legit proposal from anyone yet because Kawhi's group is sabotaging everything. Spurs have some leverage here because Kawhi sitting another year for the Spurs looks really bad for him and has to effect his development. I imagine Kawhi's group will start to play ball and accept him going East or tell the Lakers they need to trade for him now or he might actually stay east in a few days once the reality sets in. For now, they are playing dirty.

Absolutely no reason for the Spurs to rush at this point. The only thing that's going to improve offers for Leonard is other teams getting comfortable about his health as well as his mentality, as well as see how free agency plays out. Of course while that's happening I'm sure the Spurs will see if the relationship can be restored. Issues resolved and Leonard back committed to playing for your team is the best value you are going to get out of this situation. A better offer come September or October may be 50% of value.

[K...]

The trades would be better if Leonard opened himself up to say that he's through with bull crap. The Lakers aren't shiny when you see them up close. The teams of the future are East. He should accept it, get his contact and shut up with this best fit nonsense.

[RD2191]

That's facts, some dumbass called Ingram a "taller Forbes". :lmao

:lmao

[Marcus Bryant]

But, yes, Kawhi's group is very reactionary and unprofessional. One could imagine a scenario where they approached the Spurs quietly and indicated that Kawhi would eventually want out of SA with Pop nearing retirement, but that they would work with the Spurs to ensure they got good value in return, but that they would want the supermax, or something close. Win-win, basically. Instead taking everything public, attempting to appear hardass has led to this situation where the Spurs can't move him because nobody's offering jack, because you have totally destroyed your client's trade value due to the trade demands and attempting to pressure the Spurs to make a trade now. Even if the Spurs were willing to trade you just lost your client whatever portion of the supermax the Spurs were willing to extend you.

[Pavlov]

Really no reason for the Spurs to accept any offer from the Lakers that doesn't include Ingram, so Magic can pound sand until he comes around. Plenty of time to let other GM fantasize about getting Kawhi if the Spurs choose to weather the inevitable plantation/slavery shitstorm.

[YGWHI]

I still think the Lakers will balk and send over a package that make C/Pop just say it fuck it and ship him out. That Boogie shining stole the shine off of their offseason and they'll panic and put together a package that isn't complete horseshit to the front office.

I honestly think Pop and RC don't want to deal with Uncle Dennis and his agent's bullshit for the next 5 years.

It'll suck but at the end of the day, the Lakers will still put together the best overall package for him in the eyes of PATFO.

Not really, after signing LeBron, Lakers seem willing to call it a offseason.

Many reports say that LeBron told LAL they don't need to make big moves this offseason and lose assets, he signed for 4 years and expect the team waits until next years to lure FAs.

That's why you can read that Laker's offers to the Spurs got worse after they got LeBron.

To get LeBron, they wanted to give Ingram for Kawhi, now they don't even want to give Kuzma...

[SpursDynasty85]

But, yes, Kawhi's group is very reactionary and unprofessional. One could imagine a scenario where they approached the Spurs quietly and indicated that Kawhi would eventually want out of SA with Pop nearing retirement, but that they would work with the Spurs to ensure they got good value in return, but that they would want the supermax, or something close. Win-win, basically. Instead taking everything public, attempting to appear hardass has led to this situation where the Spurs can't move him because nobody's offering jack, because you have totally destroyed your client's trade value due to the trade demands and attempting to pressure the Spurs to make a trade now. Even if the Spurs were willing to trade you just lost your client whatever portion of the supermax the Spurs were willing to extend you.

Guarantee Lebron is a big part too. David vs Goliath battle going on.

[Marcus Bryant]

Teams are being asked not only to bid on a 1 year rental of Leonard, but also with the nonsense being leaked are likely asking themselves: is this guy even going to show up to training camp?

Also, if the Spurs weren't offering the supermax at a given point, the obvious question from Leonard's group should be: how do we get there? Again, you should never get relatives involved in your business unless they are good and competent at what they do.

[MoSpur02]

Spurs (Pop) last season told LaMarcus that he would drive him to the airport or whatever when he requested to be traded. Could have been joking somewhat, but I am sure they valued/value LaMarcus pretty high. We're talking about Kawhi Leonard who is a top 3 or 5 player in the league and best two way player so I am sure they value him more than LaMarcus so the bar must be really high as far as what they want in return if you want to trade for Kawhi. My guess is almost all the teams in the league have contacted the Spurs, but almost if not all the teams don't have the players or assets it takes to get him as far as the Spurs are concerned.

[Marcus Bryant]

Spurs (Pop) last season told LaMarcus that he would drive him to the airport or whatever when he requested to be traded. Could have been joking somewhat, but I am sure they valued/value LaMarcus pretty high. We're talking about Kawhi Leonard who is a top 3 or 5 player in the league and best two way player so I am sure they value him more than LaMarcus so the bar must be really high as far as what they want in return if you want to trade for Kawhi. My guess is almost all the teams in the league have contacted the Spurs, but almost if not all the teams don't have the players or assets it takes to get him as far as the Spurs are concerned.

Right. If the Spurs' ask of a "top 20 player" brought no offers that tells you all you need to know about the market assessment of Leonard's value today, as well as of the Spurs' willingness to make a deal.

[Marcus Bryant]

October 18 or whenever the supermax deadline is at this point sets the timeframe. That is a tremendous amount of money to walk away from and perhaps between now and then Uncle Dennis will do the math.

[rjv]

October 18 or whenever the supermax deadline is at this point sets the timeframe. That is a tremendous amount of money to walk away from and perhaps between now and then Uncle Dennis will do the math.

July 16th is also an interesting date because that is the first day that the spurs can actually offer the max.

[Mugen]

October 18 or whenever the supermax deadline is at this point sets the timeframe. That is a tremendous amount of money to walk away from and perhaps between now and then Uncle Dennis will do the math.

They seem to be deadset on the idea that the difference between the Lakers 5yr offer (after being traded there) and the supermax can be made up in endorsements. We're not dealing with a bunch of MENSA members here tbh.

[Marcus Bryant]

July 16th is also an interesting date because that is the first day that the spurs can actually offer the max.

:tu

[YGWHI]

how have the Spurs alienated kawhi's family? they've made no comments about them. the rumors surrounding the spurs were originally that they were completely uninterested in trading leonard, only thing we've heard from pop/rc is their desire to keep kawhi, and then only recently did they entertain offers but even then never seemed close to moving him

thats a load of crap. i'm not saying the spurs should be kissing kawhi's ass or anything, but acting like they've alienated him this summer makes no sense. i think they did so during the season, but not really during this trade demand saga

Well, Ramona said that close sources to RC told her "Kawhi is the same person. The only thing that has changed about him is the people speaking for him, now"

Then DRob said true leaders like LeBron don't hear anyone and made their own decisions...Bruce talked about Kawhi shouldn't hear "other people voices"

It's crystal clear, the Spurs don't like his family/uncle/whoever. And Kawhi won't leave his family behind for the Spurs.

That's why there is no way to repair the relationship.
The Spurs want Kawhi not to hear his uncle/family, they want Kawhi to find other group/agent to negotiate with them, that won't happen. He's a family-first guy, he can't do what the team is asking him...

[exstatic]

They seem to be deadset on the idea that the difference between the Lakers 5yr offer (after being traded there) and the supermax can be made up in endorsements. We're not dealing with a bunch of MENSA members here tbh.

The problem is, as time goes by, and no trade is on the horizon, it becomes a difference of a Laker 4yr/$139M non-Bird FA offer, and the DPE or SuperMax, which is 5yr/$219M. He's not MJ. That money is NEVER coming back.

[Mugen]

The problem is, as time goes by, and no trade is on the horizon, it becomes a difference of a Laker 4yr/$139M non-Bird FA offer, and the DPE or SuperMax, which is 5yr/$219M. He's not MJ. That money is NEVER coming back.

Again, we're not dealing with a rational group here.

[YGWHI]

The problem is, as time goes by, and no trade is on the horizon, it becomes a difference of a Laker 4yr/$139M non-Bird FA offer, and the DPE or SuperMax, which is 5yr/$219M. He's not MJ. That money is NEVER coming back.

But the Spurs denied him the supermax, that's not and won't be an option so why his camp would care about...

PG13 signed with OKC the same deal, $139M 4 years just a few days before and didn't die...I guess Kawhi and his family will survive with that $140M contract.

[lmbebo]

]I think the max is actually $221 million now...

They aren't starving by going to a $139 million contract unless his family spends it all.

[YGWHI]

Again, we're not dealing with a rational group here.
I guess we -the fans- are not that rational if we keep talking about a supermax contract that the Spurs never offered and won't do it...

I hate to agree with Chinook in something but he's right, the Spurs didn't and won't give him that deal.

[ducks]

]I think the max is actually $221 million now...

They aren't starving by going to a $139 million contract unless his family spends it all.

lol only nba client
leonard is the one making his uncle money guaranteed contract

[bklynspursfan]

But the Spurs denied him the supermax, that's not and won't be an option so why his camp would care about...

PG13 signed with OKC the same deal, $139M 4 years just a few days before and didn't die...I guess Kawhi and his family will survive with that $140M contract.

It's hard to offer a guy who has some strange injury the supermax. If he balled out this year, it makes that decision much easier. Even if it was for half a season.

We'll see if anything changes

[BSfromTX]

Is it confirmed that spurs made it clear they would not offer supermax? I mean I wouldnt doubt it, but is it confirmed?

[MoSpur02]

I can't think of any player(s) on a team that are top 20 that the Spurs need or would want depending on contract or whatever that would be a good trade partner for the Spurs. Its slim pickings.

[Spurs4#5]

Is it confirmed that spurs made it clear they would not offer supermax? I mean I wouldnt doubt it, but is it confirmed?
No that’s never been confirmed. It’s all just speculation. In fact I can’t remember reading in all of this thread any concrete information. Just a bunch of conflicting reports and trash media people saying they’re “sources”

[SAGirl]

Pretty much. He was especially bullish on teams not giving up multiple future firsts. It was sort of hilarious, but it was also really sobering to hear him talk about it, because you know his whole career as an executive was defined by trades that life. He didn't even make them of his own volition, but no one even seems to care anymore.

...

Anyway, they also had Jabari on there saying that he agreed with SA holding onto Kawhi and that there is a chance it could work out. I don't know how much of that was him feeling pressured to sound impartial/optimistic for a national audience and how much of it is his honest evaluation of the situation. I'd be all in favor of bringing Leonard back at this point on a good deal and then pivoting toward making moves to fix the roster. But the supermax just can't happen. He's going to have to give, whether it's by opting into that last year before getting DPE money, not getting max raises off the DPE salary or having a lot of the back end of the deal being non-guaranteed. Simply put, SA couldn't make that deal before all this shit started. They damned sure can't now.

It seems to me that the Spurs are still counting on Kawhi to play next season. They still hope to repair the relationship and have not been in a rush to trade him. They expect a huge haul for him and aren't getting it right now (teams are well advised by Billy King to hold off on it bc dude is not just questionable health wise, his commitment is also difficult to ascertain since he doesn't form bonds with anyone outside his group. He may well up and leave after the season rental or simply not be the same player due to injuries). I think if he shows up next season and plays at his MVP level then he will be in a better position to get the deal he feels he deserves from the Spurs or the Spurs will also be in a better position to trade him mid-season bc the bird rights to an MVP are valuable. The desperation from Kawhi's group to get that trade done this summer is suspicious. Maybe his leg will remain balky and there is a risk involved in their part by waiting. Their statement that he is 100% was probably to invite suitors to trade for him.

If he wasn't injured this would have been a lot easier.

[ducks]

did not rc say publicly the supermax was still a possibility

[BillMc]

Is it confirmed that spurs made it clear they would not offer supermax? I mean I wouldnt doubt it, but is it confirmed?

The rumor was the Spurs wanted to meet and discuss KL"s health and commitment before offering it. But this somehow offended Kawhi and his group, who took it as a last straw and asked for the trade.

[look_at_g_shred]

Fuck it, just give LMA the supermax instead and let kawhi play the last of his contract out

[marinoman]

All-Star shooting guard Jimmy Butler (http://bleacherreport.com/jimmy-butler) reportedly has "no intentions" of signing a contract extension with the Minnesota Timberwolves (http://bleacherreport.com/minnesota-timberwolves), due to issues with his teammates.
A trade partner emerges?

[lmbebo]

It seems to me that the Spurs are still counting on Kawhi to play next season. They still hope to repair the relationship and have not been in a rush to trade him. They expect a huge haul for him and aren't getting it right now (teams are well advised by Billy King to hold off on it bc dude is not just questionable health wise, his commitment is also difficult to ascertain since he doesn't form bonds with anyone outside his group. He may well up and leave after the season rental or simply not be the same player due to injuries). I think if he shows up next season and plays at his MVP level then he will be in a better position to get the deal he feels he deserves from the Spurs or the Spurs will also be in a better position to trade him mid-season bc the bird rights to an MVP are valuable. The desperation from Kawhi's group to get that trade done this summer is suspicious. Maybe his leg will remain balky and there is a risk involved in their part by waiting. Their statement that he is 100% was probably to invite suitors to trade for him.

If he wasn't injured this would have been a lot easier.

If there is that much uncertainty about his health and he wanted out, he should be more agreeable to sign an extension with any time offering to trade for him. Then he's not a 1 year rental ...

[sasaint]

The rumor was the Spurs wanted to meet and discuss KL"s health and commitment before offering it. But this somehow offended Kawhi and his group, who took it as a last straw and asked for the trade.

another last straw...

[Marcus Bryant]

All-Star shooting guard Jimmy Butler (http://bleacherreport.com/jimmy-butler) reportedly has "no intentions" of signing a contract extension with the Minnesota Timberwolves (http://bleacherreport.com/minnesota-timberwolves), due to issues with his teammates.
A trade partner emerges?

Hmmm. What's the success of teams trading their headaches with each other?

[look_at_g_shred]

idk if the wolves would want to trade for a player with the same intent as the one going out. Never know tho.

[sasaint]

All-Star shooting guard Jimmy Butler (http://bleacherreport.com/jimmy-butler) reportedly has "no intentions" of signing a contract extension with the Minnesota Timberwolves (http://bleacherreport.com/minnesota-timberwolves), due to issues with his teammates.
A trade partner emerges?

A lot of ST posters who claim to know more about Butler than I have suggested that he is not Spurs material. I dunno.

[cd98]

Sending Kawhi to NBA Siberia...er the T'Wolves.

[bklynspursfan]

idk if the wolves would want to trade for a player with the same intent as the one going out. Never know tho.

Rumor is, Butler is fed up with KAT (?) If so, it would be getting rid of him to avoid locker room issues, if that's true. Tho RIP to Kawhi's quad playing under Thibs if they got swapped

[YGWHI]

They have been with him in the locker room, in practices, in the gym and on the court for the 9 games he played in. They know he a) can play, b) can help them significantly (he had the highest wp/48 for team over the season!) and c) having been around him for years, can probably tell he's not hurting that much....

This is why Tony and Manu made their comments - it was a last ditch attempt to get KL to man up by shaming him... and it failed.

So quit spinning this as non-communication. It's that KL threw the entire team's season under the bus.

Like Kawhi was the same player we knew in those 9 games, right? Like he looks so well in those games... However, I agree with you that those Parker/Ginobili words weren't simple comments and had other intentions.

[Extra Stout]

Kawhi’s move at this point would be just to show up and play out the last year of his contract, and let the Spurs be the ones to take action if they don’t want him in the locker room or whatever.

He tried to get traded to L.A. this summer, but it didn’t work. So he’ll have to sign a four-year deal in L.A. next summer instead of a five-year, and take the risk.

By the way, his group’s nonchalance about the fifth guaranteed year tells you everything you need to know about any ostensible concern they might have regarding any kind of chronic degenerative condition.

[SAGirl]

If there is that much uncertainty about his health and he wanted out, he should be more agreeable to sign an extension with any time offering to trade for him. Then he's not a 1 year rental ...
true. But this is all about money. I think while he has some leverage he's insisting on the market that he wants. He already will lose a lot of money from leaving the supermax to take what max the team he's traded to can offer him. He's hoping to recoup the loss somewhat with endorsement and other deals. He will also gain popularity playing in LA and other boosts that come from playing for the Lakers, like All Star appearances even if he's 50% for the season bc he's on that team, etc. You know how it goes. So while he has some leverage, he's insisting on the market he wants. He's not going to recoup any losses on the supermax playing in Charlotte for example and he knows it.

[Spurs da champs]

Rumor is, Butler is fed up with KAT (?) If so, it would be getting rid of him to avoid locker room issues, if that's true. Tho RIP to Kawhi's quad playing under Thibs if they got swapped

First it was Wiggins and now KaT? Butler also had issues in Chicago with Rose, Hoidberg, & others. Don't know if he's a cancer or it's just coincidence.

[rascal]

It really is weird. The offers must also be absolute dog shit or he'd be gone by now.

The Spurs were unsure and not entirely committed to trading KL and now that the Lakers have landed LeBron the possibility to get good offers are drying up.
PATFO dragged their feet with their own uncertainty and now are in a worse situation about getting any value back for KL.

[SAGirl]

Kawhi’s move at this point would be just to show up and play out the last year of his contract, and let the Spurs be the ones to take action if they don’t want him in the locker room or whatever.

He tried to get traded to L.A. this summer, but it didn’t work. So he’ll have to sign a four-year deal in L.A. next summer instead of a five-year, and take the risk.

By the way, his group’s nonchalance about the fifth guaranteed year tells you everything you need to know about any ostensible concern they might have regarding any kind of chronic degenerative condition.

Yes. He has to play next season bc his own market as a player also declines if he continues to be injured. Someone, like 20 pages back mentioned that he should feel as offended as Paul Goerge, that the Lakers didn't put a package together for him to get this deal done this season. He's out there saying he wants to play for them and the Lakers are holding on to mediocre players (young and some can get better but it's not a sure thing) and not getting this thing done. They are taking him for granted, just like they did Paul George.

[YGWHI]

did not rc say publicly the supermax was still a possibility
No, he never said this.

[offset formation]

I guess we -the fans- are not that rational if we keep talking about a supermax contract that the Spurs never offered and won't do it...

I hate to agree with Chinook in something but he's right, the Spurs didn't and won't give him that deal.

Why the hesitation in agreeing with Chinook? He's clearly one of the smartest basketball minds on this board, whether you agree with his takes or not.

[offset formation]

No that’s never been confirmed. It’s all just speculation. In fact I can’t remember reading in all of this thread any concrete information. Just a bunch of conflicting reports and trash media people saying they’re “sources”

Jabari, whom you would think has inside sources with Kawhi's camp, has most definitely intimated exactly that he has not been offered the supermax. Take that for what value you place on Jabari's credibility though.

[rjv]

well there is no way leonard has been offered the supermax because the spurs can't offer it until July 16th.

[tholdren]

The Spurs were unsure and not entirely committed to trading KL and now that the Lakers have landed LeBron the possibility to get good offers are drying up.
PATFO dragged their feet with their own uncertainty and now are in a worse situation about getting any value back for KL.

Dumb.

[YGWHI]

It's hard to offer a guy who has some strange injury the supermax. If he balled out this year, it makes that decision much easier. Even if it was for half a season.

We'll see if anything changes

Don't be naive.

It's not about the injury.

The Spurs could have a meeting with his doctors or just ask him to schedule summer workouts with someone Spurs trust...It won't be the first time that a team watch a player works in offseason...

There is no decision to make...Things won't change because the Spurs don't like Kawhi's people, they feel they can't trust them long term. But that people it's his family, he won't leave his fam for any NBA team.

The Spurs will trade Kawhi, tomorrow, next week, before deadline...Again, it's just a matter of time.

[sasaint]

Rumor is, Butler is fed up with KAT (?) If so, it would be getting rid of him to avoid locker room issues, if that's true. Tho RIP to Kawhi's quad playing under Thibs if they got swapped

Makes me wonder how Butler would coexist with Touches.

[offset formation]

Sending Kawhi to NBA Siberia...er the T'Wolves.

Yes, do it RC.

[RD2191]

Apparently Kyrie and Butler want to team up now or in free agency. Kawhi for Butler and then we get Kyrie in free agency? Who says no?? :lobt2:

[FkLA]

Jabari sucks but Uncle Dennis is obviously using him as his mouthpiece. Its why he's coming off so pro-Kawhitter. He's pretty credible when it comes to the Kawhitter camp, imo.

He reported that the rift between the two sides was overblown, that an extension was likely. Then all tell broke loose when PATFO leaked the supermax stuff Woj. Idk if PATFO was being spiteful, if they expected a discount, or if they feared that he would just bolt after a year anyway...but that leak was unnecessary either way. The meeting in NY was going to take place anyway, why not just discuss that there? Obviously, Kawhitter and his group of amateurs share most of the blame but PATFO didn't handle that well, imo.

[bklynspursfan]

Makes me wonder how Butler would coexist with Touches.

At least touches works hard. It was more about the nonchalant attitude of KAT and the other young guys on the team

[YGWHI]

Why the hesitation in agreeing with Chinook? He's clearly one of the smartest basketball minds on this board, whether you agree with his takes or not.

I dont trust him as "analyst".

He said about Kawhi in previous years:

-his defense is overrated

-he won't be a scorer, nor a first option on an elite team

-and his famous "if Parker is having an Indian Summer Kawhi should trot to the corner and wait for.." from 2016 season.

[Spurs da champs]

He said about Kawhi in previous years:

-his defense is overrated

-he won't be a scorer, nor a first option on an elite team

-and his famous "if Parker is having an Indian Summer Kawhi should trot to the corner and wait for.." from 2016 season.
:lmao

[bklynspursfan]

Don't be naive.

It's not about the injury.

The Spurs could have a meeting with his doctors or just ask him to schedule summer workouts with someone Spurs trust...It won't be the first time that a team watch a player works in offseason...

There is no decision to make...Things won't change because the Spurs don't like Kawhi's people, they feel they can't trust them long term. But that people it's his family, he won't leave his fam for any NBA team.

The Spurs will trade Kawhi, tomorrow, next week, before deadline...Again, it's just a matter of time.

Or, his family just wants to be in LA and the Spurs know that. So of course they aren't thrilled with them having Kawhi sit out all year just to leave them high and dry, while they endure the brunt of the questions.

And yea, if Kawhi played last season and tore it up, it's silly to think they wouldn't offer him that

[SpursDynasty85]

Apparently Kyrie and Butler want to team up now or in free agency. Kawhi for Butler and then we get Kyrie in free agency? Who says no?? :lobt2:

Man. That would be the most ideal but I would imagine Wolves think they can do better than a 1 yr lease of Kawhi and his questionable group.

[toki9]

Anyway, they also had Jabari on there saying that he agreed with SA holding onto Kawhi and that there is a chance it could work out. I don't know how much of that was him feeling pressured to sound impartial/optimistic for a national audience and how much of it is his honest evaluation of the situation. I'd be all in favor of bringing Leonard back at this point on a good deal and then pivoting toward making moves to fix the roster. But the supermax just can't happen. He's going to have to give, whether it's by opting into that last year before getting DPE money, not getting max raises off the DPE salary or having a lot of the back end of the deal being non-guaranteed. Simply put, SA couldn't make that deal before all this shit started. They damned sure can't now.

Or maybe it's Kawhi and his group realizing that the Lakers are ready to hang him out dry and so looking for ways to salvage a bad situation...or maybe it's Jabari realizing that he might still have to work in San Antonio next year?

[Spurs da champs]

Thibbs would give Kawhi a real injury, tbh. Kawhi's quad might explode. :lol

[offset formation]

Or maybe it's Kawhi and his group realizing that the Lakers are ready to hang him out dry and so looking for ways to salvage a bad situation...or maybe it's Jabari realizing that he might still have to work in San Antonio next year?

I can't believe he didn't get himself fired with his little stunt a week or so back.

[SpursDynasty85]

Thibbs would give Kawhi a real injury, tbh. Kawhi's quad might explode. :lol

Good point

[YGWHI]

Jabari sucks but Uncle Dennis is obviously using him as his mouthpiece. Its why he's coming off so pro-Kawhitter. He's pretty credible when it comes to the Kawhitter camp, imo.

He reported that the rift between the two sides was overblown, that an extension was likely. Then all tell broke loose when PATFO leaked the supermax stuff Woj. Idk if PATFO was being spiteful, if they expected a discount, or if they feared that he would just bolt after a year anyway...but that leak was unnecessary either way. The meeting in NY was going to take place anyway, why not just discuss that there? Obviously, Kawhitter and his group of amateurs share most of the blame but PATFO didn't handle that well, imo.

Agree on this. There is no need to tell your franchise player in front of everyone..."we won't give you that supermax deal".

[BSfromTX]

well there is no way leonard has been offered the supermax because the spurs can't offer it until July 16th.

There ya go

[SAGirl]

well there is no way leonard has been offered the supermax because the spurs can't offer it until July 16th.
they can however sit down and talk about it don't be this naive.

[offset formation]

they can however sit down and talk about it.

[coachmac87]

Agree on this. There is no need to tell your franchise player in front of everyone..."we won't give you that supermax deal".

That’s not what was said bruh....

But ok spin it how you want?

[ducks]

Jabari sucks but Uncle Dennis is obviously using him as his mouthpiece. Its why he's coming off so pro-Kawhitter. He's pretty credible when it comes to the Kawhitter camp, imo.

He reported that the rift between the two sides was overblown, that an extension was likely. Then all tell broke loose when PATFO leaked the supermax stuff Woj. Idk if PATFO was being spiteful, if they expected a discount, or if they feared that he would just bolt after a year anyway...but that leak was unnecessary either way. The meeting in NY was going to take place anyway, why not just discuss that there? Obviously, Kawhitter and his group of amateurs share most of the blame but PATFO didn't handle that well, imo.oh really

[MoSpur02]

Don't be naive.

It's not about the injury.

The Spurs could have a meeting with his doctors or just ask him to schedule summer workouts with someone Spurs trust...It won't be the first time that a team watch a player works in offseason...

There is no decision to make...Things won't change because the Spurs don't like Kawhi's people, they feel they can't trust them long term. But that people it's his family, he won't leave his fam for any NBA team.

False

The Spurs will trade Kawhi, tomorrow, next week, before deadline...Again, it's just a matter of time.

False about the meeting with his doctors.

[YGWHI]

Or, his family just wants to be in LA and the Spurs know that.

Kawhi played for the Spurs and having his family in LA never was an issue. His fams even bought houses in SA in these years...

Things changed for the Spurs when his family started to have a voice on his decision...Again, it's clear, the Spurs don't like them.

[MoSpur02]

I wouldn't mind Jimmy Butler, but would also want someone else thrown in.

[YGWHI]

False about the meeting with his doctors.

I didn't say they had one...I said there were many options to know if he's healthy this offseason or not.

[YGWHI]

That’s not what was said bruh....

But ok spin it how you want?

That's what Woj said.

[MoSpur02]

Kawhi played for the Spurs and having his family in LA never was an issue. His fams even bought houses in SA in these years...

Things changed for the Spurs when his family started to have a voice on his decision...Again, it's clear, the Spurs don't like them.

Its clear the Spurs don't like his family? LOL. You have proof of this? I am sure they don't like his uncle giving Kawhi bad career advice. Its almost never good to mix family with business.

[BSfromTX]

I didn't say they had one...I said there were many options to know if he's healthy this offseason or not.

HIPPA wouldn’t allow it unless kawhi approves

[MoSpur02]

I didn't say they had one...I said there were many options to know if he's healthy this offseason or not.

I meant that the Spurs would love to meet and get medical info regarding his health, but I have heard they are withholding that info until they get a max offer. Of course you will deny this and spin it, but wutevs.

[RD2191]

Man. That would be the most ideal but I would imagine Wolves think they can do better than a 1 yr lease of Kawhi and his questionable group.

They're in the same boat as the Spurs with Kawhi though. Move him now or lose him for nothing. And he wants to team up with Kyrie so that also narrows the list of trade partners down.

[YGWHI]

I meant that the Spurs would love to meet and get medical info regarding his health, but I have heard they are withholding that info until they get a max offer. Of course you will deny this and spin it, but wutevs.

C'mon...If the Spurs would have told his group "we're gonna supermax you if you have some workouts with..." they would have accepted.

But the supermax WAS NEVER ON THE TABLE. That's what his camp told Jabari that the Spurs never suggested the possibility of that deal.

Of course you will say your "my source"...Well, we read Kawhi's camp news in Jabari tweets.

If you have a "close source to the team" you already know that the Spurs don't want Kawhi on the team, they just keep telling this to the media to have better offers for him.

[MoSpur02]

C'mon...If the Spurs would have told his group "we're gonna supermax you if you have some workouts with..." they would have accepted.

But the supermax WAS NEVER ON THE TABLE. That's what his camp told Jabari that the Spurs never suggested the possibility of that deal.

Of course you will say your "my source"...Well, we read Kawhi's camp news in Jabari tweets.

If you have a "close source to the team" you already know that the Spurs don't want Kawhi on the team, they just keep telling this to the media to have better offers for him.

I didn't say anything about workouts. I was referring to the meeting with his doctors. I know the max hasn't been offered and I completely understand them not offering it. They have questions and I would too if I am committing almost a quarter of a billion dollars to a single player who has health issues and who has caused issues in the locker room and within the organization.

[rjv]

they can however sit down and talk about it don't be this naive.

i guess i missed all the news about how there has been a sit down. and, of course, that's in the realm of possibilities. don't be so presumptive.

[coachmac87]

That's what Woj said.

That the Spurs were not going to offer it?

Or they had to talk out their differences before doing so?

Two different things...

You pretend you know so much...

#SpinCycle

[SAGirl]

i guess i missed all the news about how there has been a sit down. and, of course, that's in the realm of possibilities. don't be so presumptive.
:lol a good amount of the chatter was about a meeting they had prior to the draft and afterwards. I wasn't even paying attention prior to the draft.

[bklynspursfan]

Kawhi played for the Spurs and having his family in LA never was an issue. His fams even bought houses in SA in these years...

Things changed for the Spurs when his family started to have a voice on his decision...Again, it's clear, the Spurs don't like them.

If his decision was to stay with the Spurs for his career (like he said in 2014) then I'm sure they would be fine with it regardless of what he was getting from his family.

The problem was when they stopped communicating with Pop/Spurs and left them out the loop with what was happening this year. All year they (Pop/Players) deflected answers and what not for him and his group. He did one disingenuous interview and that was it.

[Spurs4#5]

Jabari, whom you would think has inside sources with Kawhi's camp, has most definitely intimated exactly that he has not been offered the supermax. Take that for what value you place on Jabari's credibility though.

Yeah that’s still a media source though. I tend to not trust the media so much since most of them just try and make speculation fact. Especially one who is severely one sided as Jabari young.

[rjv]

:lol a good amount of the chatter was about a meeting they had prior to the draft and afterwards. I wasn't even paying attention prior to the draft.

no one knows what was said at the meeting. if you want to equate "chatter" to the spurs told kawhi they have no intention of ever offering him the super max then so be it. but i haven't read one article from anyone that indicated this. what jabari and other reporters are saying is that it hasn't been offered. this could mean that the spurs didn't mention it but that't not the same as the spurs saying we won't ever offer it. now, if July 16 comes and goes and more time passes without an offer then it would be easier to infer they may have no intention to do so at all.

[SAGirl]

1007684258822008833
How can Leonard and his camp have shown interest in a supermax deal to the Spurs if they hadn't talked about it at some point?

The contract may not be before him to be signed, but these parties have discussed the contract probably at more than once this past season.

[sasaint]

At least touches works hard. It was more about the nonchalant attitude of KAT and the other young guys on the team

I liked Butler as a player with Chicago, but kinda lost track of him. Some suggested he had an attitude problem. But if he wants to work hard with other guys who are dedicated, then he could probably coexist with LMA and Pop.

[apalisoc_9]

Done deal. Just close this thread.

[TXstbobcat]

Sending Kawhi to NBA Siberia...er the T'Wolves.

let Leonard and his uncle spend a miserable winter in Minneapolis before he goes to LA.

[rjv]

1007684258822008833
How can Leonard and his camp have shown interest in a supermax deal to the Spurs if they hadn't talked about it at some point?

The contract may not be before him to be signed, but these parties have discussed the contract probably at more than once this past season.

again, that does not mean the spurs indicated that it would not be offered.

[gambit1990]

I liked Butler as a player with Chicago, but kinda lost track of him. Some suggested he had an attitude problem.

[Spurs9]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yd7fre2l

[Pavlov]

Done deal. Just close this thread.What is the deal?

[RD2191]

Done deal. Just close this thread.

What's a done deal?

[DAF86]

1007684258822008833
How can Leonard and his camp have shown interest in a supermax deal to the Spurs if they hadn't talked about it at some point?

The contract may not be before him to be signed, but these parties have discussed the contract probably at more than once this past season.

Comments like these are what makes me believe the rumour that Kawhi has a chronic injury is real. I have a feeling that if Spurs offered the Supermax, Kawhi's camp would accept in a second.

[marinoman]

1007684258822008833
How can Leonard and his camp have shown interest in a supermax deal to the Spurs if they hadn't talked about it at some point?

The contract may not be before him to be signed, but these parties have discussed the contract probably at more than once this past season.
Supermax is 221 million now btw, it went up a few days ago

[DPG21920]

But the Spurs denied him the supermax, that's not and won't be an option so why his camp would care about...

PG13 signed with OKC the same deal, $139M 4 years just a few days before and didn't die...I guess Kawhi and his family will survive with that $140M contract.

Wrong. PG did that deal with OKC because it gave him security of something goes wrong but also he can mega cash in again if it doesn’t.

Without bird rights that is not an option for Kawhi.

[spurraider21]

Supermax is 221 million now btw, it went up a few days ago
Now it’s a mega super max

[RD2191]

Have or had shown interest? That's an important distinction.

[SpursforSix]

What's a done deal?

Probably the Parker and Manu extensions. With Leonard gone next year, there will be plenty of money for everyone. Even Mills and Gasol.

[spurraider21]

Comments like these are what makes me believe the rumour that Kawhi has a chronic injury is real. I have a feeling that if Spurs offered the Supermax, Kawhi's camp would accept in a second.
If this was all a maneuver for the supermax then embellishing an injury was an awful play, especially given his history

[ducks]

leonard might not have said anything to pop directly his uncle leaked stuff


la has alot of pressure for a title now with james there
with sa there is no pressure for a title everything thinks it will be gs,lakers,boston,sixers and rockets

[DAF86]

If this was all a maneuver for the supermax then embellishing an injury was an awful play, especially given his history

That's the thing though, if this is the case, it means there was no embellishing.

[marinoman]

http://www.espn.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=yd7fre2l
And a first, btw am i reading that right? Butler gives us alot more wins but Leonard gives them alot more losses

[RD2191]

Probably the Parker and Manu extensions. With Leonard gone next year, there will be plenty of money for everyone. Even Mills and Gasol.

:pctoss

[offset formation]

1007684258822008833
How can Leonard and his camp have shown interest in a supermax deal to the Spurs if they hadn't talked about it at some point?

The contract may not be before him to be signed, but these parties have discussed the contract probably at more than once this past season.

This directly conflicts with the statement from S.A.S. that Kawhi sat down and told Pop to his face that he wanted out and he wanted to be in LA.

These two people are ostensibly fucking colleagues at ESPN. So which story is it that ESPN the network is reporting precisely? Either he told "the Spurs," which presumably can be considered telling Pop, or he didn't.

Come on ESPN, get your shit together. You are so fucking discombobulated that one arm doesn't have a clue what the other is doing. Pathetic.

[Marcus Bryant]

Here's Uncle Dennis' master plan. No, it's not about forcing the trade, though if it did happen I'm sure there would be no complaints.

Think more basic. Kawhi couldn't get a massive shoe deal because why? Market? Come on. He couldn't get a deal because nobody was talking about Kawhi Leonard. This is America. The only bad news is no news, if you're a celebrity.

Uncle Dennis: Hold my beer...https://trends.google.com/trends/explore?date=all&geo=US&q=kawhi%20leonard

[ducks]

This directly conflicts with the statement from S.A.S. that Kawhi sat down and told Pop to his face that he wanted out and he wanted to be in LA.

These two people are ostensibly fucking colleagues at ESPN. So which story is it that ESPN the network is reporting precisely? Either he told "the Spurs," which presumably can be considered telling Pop, or he didn't.

Come on ESPN, get your shit together. You are so fucking discombobulated that one arm doesn't have a clue what the other is doing. Pathetic.uncle is changing story

[TXstbobcat]

What is the deal?

He has no fucking clue. He says that every day in this thread wth a different team and is wrong every time.

[Ice009]

Done deal. Just close this thread.

Done deal he's staying or done deal he's going????????

[BSfromTX]

Comments like these are what makes me believe the rumour that Kawhi has a chronic injury is real. I have a feeling that if Spurs offered the Supermax, Kawhi's camp would accept in a second.


Leonards camp would have to be incredibly stupid not to. He would be stupid not to sign for 200M.

Seriously, I have yet to see just how much more money he can make in endorsements in LA and just how guaranteed that is.

[SAGirl]

Comments like these are what makes me believe the rumour that Kawhi has a chronic injury is real. I have a feeling that if Spurs offered the Supermax, Kawhi's camp would accept in a second.

I definitely believe, and have said so since the very beginning, that the injury is at the forefront in this. Had he not gotten injured and he played at an MVP level, things would have been a lot easier. He would be worth a huge deal and the Spurs had to pay it or trade him. His trade market would have been strong. But just look at the season he had. He missed 73 games, missed the playoffs, missed training camp. disagreements over a mystery injury.

At one point, he got upset that he was even questioned about his injury. He asked: why else would he not play if it wasn't for the injury? The assumption that he was malingering upset him.

http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23366667/inside-tension-kawhi-leonard-spurs


On the night of March 21, as Leonard walked through the corridors of the AT&T Center after the Spurs beat the Washington Wizards (http://www.espn.com/nba/team/_/name/wsh/washington-wizards), ESPN asked him if the simplest explanation to this situation -- that he was hurt and genuinely didn't feel like he could play yet -- was actually the truest answer.
Leonard nodded, then said, "I mean, why else would I not be playing?" "People are just looking for spin," Leonard continued. "I haven't been here long. I've been here six years. The Spurs have been here way longer than that. People are gonna go with that take first."
Finally, a small peek into the window of his thoughts. But before Leonard could expound on it, a Spurs communications staffer -- who ostensibly could not hear what Leonard was saying but saw he was talking to a reporter -- abruptly ended the conversation.

[Spurs da champs]

He has no fucking clue. He says that every day in this thread wth a different team and is wrong every time.

He's entertaining tho. :lol

[Marcus Bryant]

This directly conflicts with the statement from S.A.S. that Kawhi sat down and told Pop to his face that he wanted out and he wanted to be in LA.

These two people are ostensibly fucking colleagues at ESPN. So which story is it that ESPN the network is reporting precisely? Either he told "the Spurs," which presumably can be considered telling Pop, or he didn't.

Come on ESPN, get your shit together. You are so fucking discombobulated that one arm doesn't have a clue what the other is doing. Pathetic.


There's no filter. You have to assume that these 'journalists' are merely parroting whatever they're told. What Smith passed along about Leonard threatening to hold out next year was provided to him at the moment when the Lakers thought they could force the Spurs into a trade. The Spurs passed and now what? Oh, he holds out? They were already being offered dogshit. Oh wait, now the latest seems to be hints that the group is open to talking with the Spurs... Can't wait to see GM Bron do another midseason line change.

[apalisoc_9]

He has no fucking clue. He says that every day in this thread wth a different team and is wrong every time.

Lies. Show proof. Never did this.

[Dverde]

When is the deadline for signing the supermax deal? I imagine the Spurs only need to talk with him and he complete workout/exams to get the supermax offer. I still believe Kawhi just wants out and his amateur management has made the situation worse. They underestimated the Spurs front office stubbornness

[Pavlov]

Lies. Show proof. Never did this.
So what's the done deal?

[gambit1990]

He has no fucking clue. He says that every day in this thread wth a different team and is wrong every time.
exactly :lol

anyone thinking he actually knew what he was talking about :lol

[sasaint]

Leonards camp would have to be incredibly stupid not to. He would be stupid not to sign for 200M.

Seriously, I have yet to see just how much more money he can make in endorsements in LA and just how guaranteed that is.

I contend he stands to make more dough in SA. In LA, he would not have an organization in cahoots with the media to shield him from exposure that he obviously loathes.

Greta Garbo of the NBA.

[DPG21920]

If we believe Jabari is a mouthpiece for Kawhi then Jabari said Kawhi wood resign with PHI. So how does PHI not jump?!!

[SpursDynasty85]

Kawhi played for the Spurs and having his family in LA never was an issue. His fams even bought houses in SA in these years...

Things changed for the Spurs when his family started to have a voice on his decision...Again, it's clear, the Spurs don't like them.

Family is good but when your uncle is dabbling in real estate ventures making millions in one year then hires a sketchy immature young agent whose father is a real estate mogul and communication starts to break down because of a super max contract 2 years before his free agency... something smells fishy.

[DAF86]

If we believe Jabari is a mouthpiece for Kawhi then Jabari said Kawhi wood resign with PHI. So how does PHI not jump?!!

They don't want to give up Fultz, and Fultz is the absolutely least Spurs would ask for.

[K...]

So what's the done deal?

The done deal is that he's going to post every other day about a deal (clippers) and one day he'll be right.

[Marcus Bryant]

Leonards camp would have to be incredibly stupid not to. He would be stupid not to sign for 200M.

Seriously, I have yet to see just how much more money he can make in endorsements in LA and just how guaranteed that is.


What's stupid is that Leonard's reps are simply reactionary. I'm sure the Spurs' position is that we need to see him back on the court, recovered and committed before we make that kind of financial commitment.

'Well fuck you, we want a trade, we will only sign with the Lakers in '19, we'll holdout.' So instead of negotiating and working towards $220 mil it's an immediate reaction of 'we're so mad you insulted his family that we're going to force you into a trade for nothing and we are going to leave $100 mil on the table.'

[DPG21920]

They don't want to give up Fultz, and Fultz is the absolutely least Spurs would ask for.

I know I’m asking wtf are they doing? If Kawhi will just entertain signing then how can you not offer Fultz?

[Spur|n|Austin]

Lies. Show proof. Never did this.

People have better things to do then go scouring ST for examples of your BS. General consensus here speaks for itself, you're full of shit.

[DAF86]

I know I’m asking wtf are they doing? If Kawhi will just entertain signing then how can you not offer Fultz?

Maybe a combination of not trully believing that and questions about his health. No matter what happened with Fultz last season, we still have to remember that he's a year removed from being the 1st overall pick.

[tonight...you]

People have better things to do then go scouring ST for examples of your BS. General consensus here speaks for itself, you're full of shit.
Lol... true.

[spurschamps99030507]

the sixers have no chance against the celtics, it's ridiculous not to try trade when you already have simmons..... and fultz comes from the bench.


I don't understand how the celtics don't intend a trade with Kirye Irving when next year he is a free agent and he is likely to go to the knicks

[bklynspursfan]

Maybe a combination of not trully believing that and questions about his health.

Well their doc would have lots of info on his health seeing as he was being treated by a doc who is connected with Philly.

[Marcus Bryant]

Family is good but when your uncle is dabbling in real estate ventures making millions in one year then hires a sketchy immature young agent whose father is a real estate mogul and communication starts to break down because of a super max contract 2 years before his free agency... something smells fishy.

Winner. Both want to build an agency, Leonard is their major client. The timeline starts to make a lot of sense when you look at when they declined the Jordan shoe deal. The Spurs also probably started off with an offer for some portion of the supermax. Was it $175 mil? Understanding the injury dispute in this context is the way to look at it. Maybe there's something more there, but it looks like that's what it is, a ruse used to obscure the underlying conflict.

[offset formation]

Lies. Show proof. Never did this.

:lmao:lmao:lmao

Amazing.

[DPG21920]

Maybe a combination of not trully believing that and questions about his health. No matter what happened with Fultz last season, we still have to remember that he's a year removed from being the 1st overall pick.

So. Even if he reached his potential he would not be as good as Kawhi

[RD2191]

Man, Kawhi's uncle really is fucking him over.

[offset formation]

What's stupid is that Leonard's reps are simply reactionary. I'm sure the Spurs' position is that we need to see him back on the court, recovered and committed before we make that kind of financial commitment.

'Well fuck you, we want a trade, we will only sign with the Lakers in '19, we'll holdout.' So instead of negotiating and working towards $220 mil it's an immediate reaction of 'we're so mad you insulted his family that we're going to force you into a trade for nothing and we are going to leave $100 mil on the table.'

Yep.

[Marcus Bryant]

So. Even if he reached his potential he would not be as good as Kawhi

Play the long game. The 90 day window to offer the supermax begins in a couple weeks. Now that the attempted ambush to force the Spurs into trading him to the Lakers has failed, the real fun begins.

[toki9]

I know I’m asking wtf are they doing? If Kawhi will just entertain signing then how can you not offer Fultz?

Maybe Brett and Pop went out drinking together and Brett heard how Pop really felt about Kawhi and Uncle Dennis...and so doesn't want to touch that hot mess with a 10-foot pole?

[Marcus Bryant]

Man, Kawhi's uncle really is fucking him over.

It's hard not to reach that conclusion.

[tonight...you]

Play the long game. The 90 day window to offer the supermax begins in a couple weeks. Now that the attempted ambush to force the Spurs into trading him to the Lakers has failed, the real fun begins.
LIKE

[MoSpur02]

Something might be brewing with Boston.

[offset formation]

Winner. Both want to build an agency, Leonard is their major client. The timeline starts to make a lot of sense when you look at when they declined the Jordan shoe deal. The Spurs also probably started off with an offer for some portion of the supermax. Was it $175 mil? Understanding the injury dispute in this context is the way to look at it. Maybe there's something more there, but it looks like that's what it is, a ruse used to obscure the underlying conflict.

And it explains the tension between PATFO and Kawhi's group. PATFO wants to try and talk some sense into this fool, away from those two asshats, about what is going on and his reps won't let him. Understandably so.

[DAF86]

So. Even if he reached his potential he would not be as good as Kawhi

But a Fultz reaching his potential is a whole lot better than a Kawhi that bolts after one season or that can't play because is injured.

If the Sixers were absolutely sure that Kawhi is healthy, and will sign with them, I'm sure they would offer Fultz in a heartbeat.

[TekXX]

I think Kawhi needs to grow a set of balls and tell his uncle to go fuck himself and call pop today and agree to be evaluated and work towards the supermax

Am i asking to much?

[Marcus Bryant]

And remember...


https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51lQOgGYDNL._SX331_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

[Vic Petro]

Maybe a combination of not trully believing that and questions about his health. No matter what happened with Fultz last season, we still have to remember that he's a year removed from being the 1st overall pick.

Questions about health exist on both sides. Dultz had shoulder surgery and had a case of the damn yips which I’ve never heard of in basketball.

”No matter what happened with Kawhi last season, we still have to remember that he’s a year removed from being the 2nd or 3rd best player in the league.”

[offset formation]

I think Kawhi needs to grow a set of balls and tell his uncle to go fuck himself and call pop today and agree to be evaluated and work towards the supermax

Am i asking to much?

Psychiatrically?

[John B]

Comments like these are what makes me believe the rumour that Kawhi has a chronic injury is real. I have a feeling that if Spurs offered the Supermax, Kawhi's camp would accept in a second.
My take is that Spurs is asking a home discount to bring better talent. KL camp doesn’t want a part of it so all this drama to boost the offer or would bolt to LA, his home, etc. I think Pops conceded but to convince the Holts need to see him play. Otherwise Spurs would’ve traded him before draft night to Philly. I think we get Kawhi back on max contract. With healthy KL, I think we have a shot if we can get another scorer, Crawford? Isiah?

[TekXX]

And remember...


https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/51lQOgGYDNL._SX331_BO1,204,203,200_.jpg

Money makes life so bitter/sweet.

[Spurs da champs]

My take is that Spurs is asking a home discount to bring better talent. KL camp doesn’t want a part of it so all this drama to boost the offer or would bolt to LA, his home, etc. I think Pops conceded but to convince the Holts need to see him play. Otherwise Spurs would’ve traded him before draft night to Philly. I think we get Kawhi back on max contract. With healthy KL, I think we have a shot if we can get another scorer, Crawford? Isiah?

Spurs contend immediately with a healthy, engaged Kawhi.

[Vic Petro]

I don’t think Kawhi believes he has a career ending injury because if he did he’d take the max from whoever was willing to offer it, not just LA.

[TekXX]

I don’t think Kawhi believes he has a career ending injury because if he did he’d take the max from whoever was willing to offer it, not just LA.

I don't think anyone thinks he has a career ending injury, career curtailing maybe

[BatManu20]

1014200264298024960

[SAGirl]

What's stupid is that Leonard's reps are simply reactionary. I'm sure the Spurs' position is that we need to see him back on the court, recovered and committed before we make that kind of financial commitment.

'Well fuck you, we want a trade, we will only sign with the Lakers in '19, we'll holdout.' So instead of negotiating and working towards $220 mil it's an immediate reaction of 'we're so mad you insulted his family that we're going to force you into a trade for nothing and we are going to leave $100 mil on the table.'
Exactly.

[FkLA]

1014200264298024960

So basically motherfuckers want him but only if it's for a bag of peanuts.

[BatManu20]

1014142969115365376

[tonight...you]

So basically motherfuckers want him but only if it's for a bag of peanuts.
I hope he and his group are paying attention to how much the League wants him. Not much...

[MoSpur02]

1014200264298024960

Call their bluff. You can't expect one of the best players in the league on both sides of the city and not give up Tatum, Brown, or at least one of them.

[Marcus Bryant]

1014200264298024960

Heh. Conventional wisdom is that he'll be dealt, maybe not to the Lakers. For both parties the path to the best outcome, which is Kawhi getting much more guaranteed $ than he can anywhere else and the Spurs getting real value back for Kawhi (which comes from of course him being on a long-term deal and healthy) or perhaps, getting Kawhi back playing in a Spurs uniform, lies in them reconciling and working together. It'll take some time for things to cool down, but they have the summer.

One thinks perhaps in time that guys like Ainge and Brown will be kicking themselves for not doing what it took to get a deal done.

[TekXX]

Spurs just need to hang up the phone when these nonsense trade proposals come in

[offset formation]

I hope he and his group are paying attention to how much the League wants him. Not much...

Emphasis on his group

[Marcus Bryant]

Call their bluff. You can't expect one of the best players in the league on both sides of the city and not give up Tatum, Brown, or at least one of them.

Hmmm. F their bluff. They had their chance. Not even including Fultz? Jaylen Brown? Good luck with the B league championship.

[Mugen]

If the offers are complete shit then there is absolutely no reason for the Spurs to not just hold him for next season.

If Pop and RC f'n cave... :lol

[SAGirl]

I know I’m asking wtf are they doing? If Kawhi will just entertain signing then how can you not offer Fultz?


Maybe a combination of not trully believing that and questions about his health. No matter what happened with Fultz last season, we still have to remember that he's a year removed from being the 1st overall pick.


Well their doc would have lots of info on his health seeing as he was being treated by a doc who is connected with Philly.
Raises a question about his health again. Do the Sixers want to the be the team that took on Tiago Splitter part 2, the forward edition, in exchange for some rotation players and a prospect that maybe/maybe flourishes under Pop?

[Marcus Bryant]

1014200264298024960

This tweet could become famous if things are worked out, for all the wrong reasons for those teams' GMs.

[Mugen]

Damn, if you're Kawhi right now and see all these reports about how teams aren't even willing to give up guys like fucking Brandon Ingram and Fultz for you, what are you thinking?

Like have some pride as a professional athlete :lol

[BatManu20]

1014191639638822913

[TekXX]

If the offers are complete shit then there is absolutely no reason for the Spurs to not just hold him for next season.

If Pop and RC f'n cave... :lol

They haven't caved yet, see no reason to believe they'll take some shitty offer now. I'll say the first team to get serious and hand over a decent player will probably get the trade.

[RD2191]

1014200264298024960

So then they really don't want him :lol

[RD2191]

Damn, if you're Kawhi right now and see all these reports about how teams aren't even willing to give up guys like fucking Brandon Ingram and Fultz for you, what are you thinking?

Like have some pride as a professional athlete :lol

Tbh. Shit is pathetic.

[MoSpur02]

I see Danny Ainge or Jerry West being the ones more likely to make a trade if one is made.

[Dverde]

1014142969115365376

They are getting desperate. They don’t won’t Kawhi to have to show up for Spurs camp.

[Marcus Bryant]

Damn, if you're Kawhi right now and see all these reports about how teams aren't even willing to give up guys like fucking Brandon Ingram and Fultz for you, what are you thinking?

Like have some pride as a professional athlete :lol

:tu Yeah, "holdout"? He needs to get on a court asap.

Then again, when you demand a trade, say you're only going to sign with one team when you're a free agent, threaten to holdout, and appear to have held out on your current team while under contract, this is your value.

[DAF86]

1014142969115365376

This is huge. Carter is basically Kawhi's camp spokesman.

[DAF86]

1014191639638822913

I might consider Kawhi for Butler straight up.

[SAGirl]

Play the long game. The 90 day window to offer the supermax begins in a couple weeks. Now that the attempted ambush to force the Spurs into trading him to the Lakers has failed, the real fun begins.

I suppose you mean the fun where he has to show he can play, that the injury really is 100% healed and he's ready to go full throttle all season... that is what is worth a huge deal.

[BatManu20]

1014202987105996800

[Marcus Bryant]

1014202987105996800

We have $3.

[MoSpur02]

If he is 100% healthy as they have state and is committed to the Spurs organization, I see the Spurs reluctanly offering the max.

I think Pop and R.C are tired of his BS and have almost given up on the relationship.

[SAGirl]

Questions about health exist on both sides. Dultz had shoulder surgery and had a case of the damn yips which I’ve never heard of in basketball.

”No matter what happened with Kawhi last season, we still have to remember that he’s a year removed from being the 2nd or 3rd best player in the league.”

agree that Fultz has issues which is why I prefer to wait this out and see what is up with Kawhi, but from the 76ers perspective, Fultz is under team control 3 more seasons in a reasonable deal should he pan out, after that he's a RFA. Kawhi can bolt in a year... he can also be injured for a good part of the one single year he spends with them. He's not cheap, he eats their cap. Are you getting the Kawhi from 2 or 3 seasons ago, or the one from last year, or something in between. Sometimes the devil you know is better than the devil you don't know.

[MoSpur02]

I want Tyreke Evans

[MoSpur02]

Tyreke Evans as free agent signing that is

[look_at_g_shred]

I thought Tyreke signed with the pacers?

[RD2191]

I want Tyreke Evans

Ha. Gay.

[DPG21920]

Kawhi can help the Spurs help him. Put pressure on La

[Ocotillo]

Good thing Lakers threw all that money at one year placeholders waiting for Leonard, with Butler saying he wants out they could have gone after him instead of KL.

[marinoman]

Scared GMs don’t make good GMs

[pad300]

And a first, btw am i reading that right? Butler gives us alot more wins but Leonard gives them alot more losses

The calculation is weighted with minutes played last season...

[Baam]

So. Even if he reached his potential he would not be as good as Kawhi

Hm if he fullfills his potential that means he's Harden so that's a MVP level player.

I don't see that with Brown and Tatum, only Ingram and Fultz can get to that level imo.

[Extra Stout]

This is huge. Carter is basically Kawhi's camp spokesman.
So amateurish, though. It’s as though they think R.C. Buford doesn’t get ESPN.
To the Spurs: Trade me now to the Lakers, or I’ll sign in L.A. as a FA in 2019 anyway!
To the Lakers: Trade for me now from the Spurs, or I might re-sign in S.A. in 2019 like PG13 in OKC!

Can’t Uncle Dennis find a better agent for Kawhi? Such as any random third-grader?

[SAGirl]

Call their bluff. You can't expect one of the best players in the league on both sides of the city and not give up Tatum, Brown, or at least one of them.

He's just at his absolute lowest value of his career because he was injury riddled last season and couldn't do anything to dispel that... Remember his urge to try to come back and play in March? He backed off after his own push to return to play bc he couldn't endure it physically. Why else would he hold out back then, he said it himself in that March 21 statement I quoted.

[Marcus Bryant]

Kawhi can help the Spurs help him. Put pressure on La

There's a lot of pressure already. That's why they're not going to be able to maintain that cap flexibility in '19. Plus now, with no Kawhi and with the perception they fucked up with Cousins, we're starting to see...

https://www.si.com/nba/2018/07/03/lebron-james-lakers-nba-free-agency-demarcus-cousins-warriors

[Dverde]

Surprised Bucks have no interest. They got Coach Bud, East is wide open....Middleton, Brogden, and a 1st round pick seems better than other trade offers I’ve seen out there.

[FkLA]

1014191639638822913

What's the story on this anyways? What's his issue with KAT?

[Marcus Bryant]

Surprised Bucks have no interest. They got Coach Bud, East is wide open....Middleton, Brogden, and a 1st round pick seems better than other trade offers I’ve seen out there.

The whole damn 'B' Conference, now with LeBron gone. A case can be made that landing Kawhi makes any of these teams the favorite to win it or vaults them into serious contender status.

Boston
Philly
Washington
Toronto
Milwaukee

[HarlemHeat37]

What's the story on this anyways? What's his issue with KAT?

Hates both Towns and Wiggins due to their poor work ethic and lack of defense, reportedly..

I could definitely see that, I wouldn't want either on my team, but Butler does seem like kind of a cancerous personality:lol

[FkLA]

Surprised Bucks have no interest. They got Coach Bud, East is wide open....Middleton, Brogden, and a 1st round pick seems better than other trade offers I’ve seen out there.

:lol

Milwaukee and Minnesota (Minneapolis) are two of the few places that are less of a destination for stars than SA. It's a guaranteed 1 year rental for them.

[daslicer]

What's the story on this anyways? What's his issue with KAT?

It's political to some degree. Butler and Thibs are close while KAT hates Thibs. So Butler is pretty much backing his coach a guy who he feels he has loyalty towards since Thibs helped develop him in Chicago. I have also heard Butler hates how KAT is lazy on defense.

[BatManu20]

Jimmy to LA or BOS trade rumors heating up. That wouldn't move the needle though. Good luck with that.

1014195747338768391

[SAGirl]

1014191639638822913

:lol don't tell me. He all of a sudden wants the Lakers too?
Should that rumor come to pass one has to question Magic's tampering big time tbh

[Marcus Bryant]

So amateurish, though. It’s as though they think R.C. Buford doesn’t get ESPN.
To the Spurs: Trade me now to the Lakers, or I’ll sign in L.A. as a FA in 2019 anyway!
To the Lakers: Trade for me now from the Spurs, or I might re-sign in S.A. in 2019 like PG13 in OKC!

Can’t Uncle Dennis find a better agent for Kawhi? Such as any random third-grader?

:tu

What'll be amusing is when the Lakers offer Ingram and RC still says no.

Pop, RC, the Holts better be ready though, in this day and age, when all else fails, it gets personal...

[Marcus Bryant]

Jimmy to LA trade rumors heating up. That wouldn't move the needle though. Good luck with that.

1014195747338768391

Maybe not but the Lakers need names now. Looking at the pile of odds and ends they've picked up after LeBron in free agency, that's what they're going for.

[tonight...you]

Surprised Bucks have no interest. They got Coach Bud, East is wide open....Middleton, Brogden, and a 1st round pick seems better than other trade offers I’ve seen out there.
I'm not. Pop probably spits the troof to him and he no want.

[lmbebo]

I see Danny Ainge or Jerry West being the ones more likely to make a trade if one is made.

Danny Ainge has a history of being a dealer... but guy's cheap. He'll show interest, kick the tires, etc He'll make crap offers to see if people bite. He doesn't make great trades if you want real value back. he had no problems trading Jae Crowder and IT. Another young pick doesn't help him as much these days now that he has a core of players to build around (Tatum, Brown, Rozier, Smart? (TBD), Kyrie? Horford, Hayward, etc).

[FkLA]

Hates both Towns and Wiggins due to their poor work ethic and lack of defense, reportedly..

I could definitely see that, I wouldn't want either on my team, but Butler does seem like kind of a cancerous personality:lol


It's political to some degree. Butler and Thibs are close while KAT hates Thibs. So Butler is pretty much backing his coach a guy who he feels he has loyalty towards since Thibs helped develop him in Chicago. I have also heard Butler hates how KAT is lazy on defense.

He's right tbf but yeah you're not attracting anything better to Minny. Shouldve probably just bit his lip or went about a different way, tbh.

[Baam]

Need to wait I guess. If Kawhi gets restless then he has to commit to Philly so they're comfy enough to trade Fultz.

[Spurs da champs]

Fultz sucks.

[DJR210]

Somebody needs to tamper w/ Magic's AIDS pills

[toki9]

What's the story on this anyways? What's his issue with KAT?

He probably thinks KAT doesn't work hard enough...not crazy about Butler...he can be pretty obnoxious in the lockerroom and he also had a meniscus tear earlier this year, from which he rushed back...so who knows what kind of long term ramification that has.

[HarlemHeat37]

Need to wait I guess. If Kawhi gets restless then he has to commit to Philly so they're comfy enough to trade Fultz.

That's what I think, as well..there's no way Kawhi is sitting an entire season again, but I can't see him going back to the Spurs, either..

I assume that his group will play the slave master card against Pop, but if that doesn't work, I expect leaks about Kawhi being open to joining other teams and extending..whether those teams believe it is questionable, though..

[SAGirl]

Tyreke Evans as free agent signing that is
He went to Indiana on a one year 12 mill deal. Spurs have no cap.

Of course they could have dumped some contracts to create it but you know ....

[r0drig0lac]

Rumor is, Butler is fed up with KAT (?) If so, it would be getting rid of him to avoid locker room issues, if that's true. Tho RIP to Kawhi's quad playing under Thibs if they got swapped

win-win situation tbh

[RD2191]

Kawhi's group really are fucking stupid. Had they not put out that he'd only re-sign with the Lakers he'd of been gone by now. All his group had to say is that Kawhi would be open to signing elsewhere and he'd be gone. Adamant not to step foot in SA? In the words of DJ Khaled, congratulations, you played yourself.

[Mugen]

This is huge. Carter is basically Kawhi's camp spokesman.

Since when?


I might consider Kawhi for Butler straight up.

Unless he commits to an extension beforehand, no thanks.

[Spur|n|Austin]

Somebody needs to tamper w/ Magic's AIDS pills

lol tbh

[toki9]

It's political to some degree. Butler and Thibs are close while KAT hates Thibs. So Butler is pretty much backing his coach a guy who he feels he has loyalty towards since Thibs helped develop him in Chicago. I have also heard Butler hates how KAT is lazy on defense.

Remember Butler getting upset with Hoiberg because Hoiberg's practices weren't intense enough (like under Thibs)? He's a guy who thinks he's the toughest, hardest worker in the room...but now with a repaired meniscus and probably other body parts deteriorating.

[DAF86]

Since when?

Since forever, the people that used to manage Carter manage Kawhi now, or something along those lines. Carter has been constantly sending the messages that Kawhi's camp wants to send.

[Marcus Bryant]

Come next trade deadline, as of now the Spurs will have ~$24 mil in expirings. Should be useful.

Green $10 mil
Gay $10 mil
Ginobili $2.5 mil
Paul $1.4 mil

[Hoops Czar]

What's the story on this anyways? What's his issue with KAT?
His problem with KAT is he wants to play with Lebron in LA. That's what ring chasers do.

[toki9]

Since when?

Mitch Frankel (Kawhi's "agent") was Carter's agent when he played. And Carter's brother was the one who worked with Kawhi on his rehab in NYC.

[CitizenDwayne]

So I hear Irving, Tatum and Brown are untouchable, but what about Hayward? Don’t really know much about his game; would he be a decent fit, assuming he comes back fully recovered from injuries?

[toki9]

So I hear Irving, Tatum and Brown are untouchable, but what about Hayward? Don’t really know much about his game; would he be a decent fit, assuming he comes back fully recovered from injuries?

Didn't he recently have a second surgery to correct some issues with the first surgery?

[RD2191]

So I hear Irving, Tatum and Brown are untouchable, but what about Hayward? Don’t really know much about his game; would he be a decent fit, assuming he comes back fully recovered from injuries?

Permaban

[daslicer]

Kawhi's group really are fucking stupid. Had they not put out that he'd only re-sign with the Lakers he'd of been gone by now. All his group had to say is that Kawhi would be open to signing elsewhere and he'd be gone. Adamant not to step foot in SA? In the words of DJ Khaled, congratulations, you played yourself.

They limited his options. They are obsessed with endorsements so any top 10 market should have been good enough for them. Goes to show you how stupid they are. Playing for a legendary organization such as the Celtics,Sixers will get you endorsements. Hell they could have floated rumors about Kawhi wanting to play for the Knicks or Nets. NYC is ripe for a superstar talent and the market is even better then LA. They are clearly a stupid bunch of people.

[Baam]

Kawhi is cornered now. Either sit 2 years of your prime or bring us a great deal.

Gonna be hilarious when Magic doesn't answer's uncle Dennis' phone because LeBron likes Lonzo and Kuzma and he has to beg Philly after all.

[FvckMavs]

So I hear Irving, Tatum and Brown are untouchable, but what about Hayward? Don’t really know much about his game; would he be a decent fit, assuming he comes back fully recovered from injuries?

You don't want to touch Hayward's 100m/3yrs contract with a 10-foot pole, and he will never be the same again after that injury.

[Marcus Bryant]

Kawhi's group really are fucking stupid. Had they not put out that he'd only re-sign with the Lakers he'd of been gone by now. All his group had to say is that Kawhi would be open to signing elsewhere and he'd be gone. Adamant not to step foot in SA? In the words of DJ Khaled, congratulations, you played yourself.

True, assuming no red flags with his 'injury' that's a straightforward major negative. The holdout threat was dumb, which is of course why they got Smith to say it.

Is he truly that miserable in SA? If so it would've gotten long before this year. All reports I've seen is that he spends all day in San Diego in the summer in the gym anyways. We all understand the allure of home, but still.

[Marcus Bryant]

Mitch Frankel (Kawhi's "agent") was Carter's agent when he played. And Carter's brother was the one who worked with Kawhi on his rehab in NYC.

2+2...

[Spurs da champs]

Sixers are trying to get Wilson Chandler (Per Shams) does this help them in trade for Kawhi?

[CitizenDwayne]

You don't want to touch Hayward's 100m/3yrs contract with a 10-foot pole, and he will never be the same again after that injury.

I understand the contract’s shit, but I don’t really understand keeping Leonard if he hates being in SA that badly. Seems like that would be horrendous PR and create a cancerous environment. I’ll take an overpaid player over a guy who openly shits on his own team

[Mugen]

1014241081867800576

interested in who they send out, if it's just Bayless and a pick that might signal a Kawhi trade tbh....

[Ron Swanson]

Cross Philly off the list.

[Mr. Body]

Sixers are trying to get Wilson Chandler (Per Shams) does this help them in trade for Kawhi?

No, the opposite.